Poll - Once Saved Always Saved

[Rick Otto]

I was saved once. Still am...

 

[CShephard53]

I was saved once. Still am...

You're in heaven?!?!?!?!

 

[Ben johnson]

IF ALREADY SAVED.... WHY DOES HE HAVE TO TELL HIM NOT TO DO THESE THINGS....

BECAUSE HE CAN

I agree with you --- because he CAN.

Our disagreement, is that I perceive if he DOES these things, then he is no longer saved.

2Pe 1:5 Now for this very reason also, applying all diligence, in your faith supply moral excellence, and in {your} moral excellence, knowledge,
2Pe 1:6 and in {your} knowledge, self-control, and in {your} self-control, perseverance, and in {your} perseverance, godliness,
2Pe 1:7 and in {your} godliness, brotherly kindness, and in {your} brotherly kindness, love.
2Pe 1:8 For if these {qualities} are yours and are increasing, they render you neither useless nor unfruitful in the true knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Pe 1:9 For he who lacks these {qualities} is blind {or} short-sighted, having forgotten {his} purification from his former sins.
2Pe 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble;
2Pe 1:11 for in this way the entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ will be abundantly supplied to you.
2Pe 1:12 Therefore, I will always be ready to remind you of these things, even though you {already} know {them,} and have been established in the truth which is present with {you.}

Here is another reminder, full of warnings that "if you do NOT be diligent about your calling and election, if these godly traits are NOT yours, then the gates of Heaven will not be provided to you".

Ungodliness and "forgotten former purification from sins", is an absolute possibility; and bars us from the gates of Heaven.

See how all the Scriptures harmonize?

 

[Ben johnson]

Our security further rests on the death and the prayers of Jesus Christ. He has redeemed us (Ephesians 1:7) and removed the wrath of God from us (Romans 3:25) so that we may be justified (Romans 5:1), forgiven (Colossians 2:13), and sanctified (1 Corinthians 1:2).

I've shown here that "sanctification" and "blamelessness" and even "forgiveness" rests on our faith, on our abiding-in-Christ. It is as Rom1:17 says, "The righteousness of God is revealed from beginning faith to ending faith --- the just shall live by faith."

By the regenerating work of the Holy Spirit, we have received eternal life (Titus 3:5).

Do you accept that "regeneration", comes from the received-by-belief Spirit? Titus uses "ekcheo" (poured), which is the same word as in Acts10:43-47; "poured/gifted/fell-upon/RECEIVED", and 11:17 says "AFTER belief"...

When we trusted Christ, the Holy Spirit began an eternal indwelling ministry in us (John 14:17). Also He was the seal placed on us by the Father to guarantee our future inheritance (Ephesians 4:30).

The seal, is after belief --- Eph1:13.

And He baptized us into union with Christ and into the body of believers (1 Corinthians 12:13).

All founds upon belief, my friend; if belief is our choice, then all founded upon belief can become forfeit.

Can a saved person ever be lost?


"For a believer to lose his salvation would demand a reversal and an undoing of all the preceding works of the Father, Son, and Spirit.

Is that not exactly what happened to the man in Heb10:26? He once was sanctified by Jesus' blood; but by "continuing sinning willfully after having received knowledge (epignosis) of the truth", Jesus' sacrifice no longer availed him. He "trampled Jesus, scorned the blood that SANCTIFIED him, and insulted the Spirit".

The key issue in the discussion of the believer's security concerns the issue of who does the saving. If man is responsible for securing his salvation, then he can be lost; if God secures the person's salvation, then the person is forever secure." [4]

The question becomes simply, "Is man active in his salvation, or is he fully passive?"

"He who hears My words and ACTS upon them, is like a wise man who...
...but he who hears My words and DOES NOT ACT upon them, is like a foolish man who..." Matt7:24-27

Man is active, not passive.

"What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us?"
-Romans 8:31; cf. vv. 32-39

But we're required to be diligent, aren't we?

OSAS!!!! Now and Forever!

I pray that you grow ever closer to Him, and more Spirit-filled; if you do, then your position of "OSAS", will not matter at all. For you will find yourself in the clouds with Him when He returns, and I look forward to fellowshipping with you and Him, there.

...the only time the issue matters, is when it hinders our fellowship with God, causing us to drift away from Him.

 

[forgivenWretch]

I pray brother that you will quit disagreeing with God's Word...and trying to dispute it with your outrageous opinions, and the attempts of using scripture to refute scripture, and that your judgment of others will cease.

I know without a doubt that I will spend eternity with God in heaven, weather I die this instant, tomorrow, next week, next year, whenever.

Those who doubt God, more than likely do not know God. John 3:16 says it all. Go ahead dispute His Word again...you do not have to answer to me, but to HIM!

 

[Rick Otto]

You're in heaven?!?!?!?!

That's right.
Try to remain calm about, tho. I don't like to attract a lot of negative attention.

 

[forgivenWretch]

That's right.
Try to remain calm about, tho. I don't like to attract a lot of negative attention.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Ben Johnson

Explain romans 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

already saved yet not walking the walk ...gal 5:25 still living in the flesh but saved romans 13:12-14

Ahhhh, my friend --- I owe you an apology also. I fully intended to answer this; was gonna this morning, but the blasted computer was struggling to load for more than an HOUR; nothing I tried to post went through.

Let's discuss Rom13, citing verses 11-14: "And this do (list of commandments), knowing the time, that it is already the hour for you to awaken from sleep; for now salvation is nearer to us than when we believed. The night is almost gone, and the day is at hand. Let us therefore lay aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light. Let us behave properly as in the day, not in carousing and drunkenness, not in sexual promiscuity, not in strife and jealousy. But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh in regard to its lusts."

You and I disagree on some things; specifically, that a man cannot be "saved" while walking in sin (drunken, carousing, fornicating, etcetera). We've discussed 1Cor6:9-11; and Eph5:5-6. And Gal5:19-21, and 1Jn3:5-10. Each of these passages states that "those who DO these things will not inherit the kingdom of God". We can discuss any or all of those again if you wish...

So --- when this passage equates "asleep" with "walking in darkness", and "engaging in carousing/drunkenness/sexual-immorality/strife/jealousy", the only thing "awaken from sleep" can possibly mean, is "turn to God and salvation".

This of course is furthered when he says "put on Christ". So, "awaken", is the same as "put on Christ". It's fully salvational.

He says "make no provision for the flesh" --- this connects directly to Rom8:12 --- which says "We are under obligation not to walk after the flesh --- if you DO you must DIE; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the flesh you will LIVE".

Clearly, "salvation", the consequence of "walking in the Spirit and by His power crucifying the flesh" or "pursuing fleshly lusts", are eternal life or not.

OK, now let's discuss Gal5:25 --- "I say walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh. For the flesh sets its desire against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you wish. But if you rae led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law. Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, which I have forewarned you that those who practice these things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kiindness, goodness, self-control; against these things there is no law. Now those who belong to Christ have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit. Let us not become boastful, challenging one another, envying one another." Verses16-25 [end of chapter])

This fits perfectly with what we just discussed in Romans; he who belongs to Christ has CRUCIFIED the flesh and walks not after flesh but by the Spirit. He who walks after the flesh, shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

In Rom6 Paul states "we are slaves; EITHER to righteousness (and God), OR to sin". So it's a choice --- whether to walk after the flesh and its sinful lusts (be "asleep", iow NOT SAVED), or to rest in Him and allow the power of the Spirit to strengthen us against sin.

Make sense?

IF ALREADY SAVED.... WHY DOES HE HAVE TO TELL HIM NOT TO DO THESE THINGS....

BECAUSE HE CAN

I agree with you --- because he CAN.

Our disagreement, is that I perceive if he DOES these things, then he is no longer saved.

2Pe 1:5 Now for this very reason also, applying all diligence, in your faith supply moral excellence, and in {your} moral excellence, knowledge,
2Pe 1:6 and in {your} knowledge, self-control, and in {your} self-control, perseverance, and in {your} perseverance, godliness,
2Pe 1:7 and in {your} godliness, brotherly kindness, and in {your} brotherly kindness, love.
2Pe 1:8 For if these {qualities} are yours and are increasing, they render you neither useless nor unfruitful in the true knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Pe 1:9 For he who lacks these {qualities} is blind {or} short-sighted, having forgotten {his} purification from his former sins.
2Pe 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble;
2Pe 1:11 for in this way the entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ will be abundantly supplied to you.
2Pe 1:12 Therefore, I will always be ready to remind you of these things, even though you {already} know {them,} and have been established in the truth which is present with {you.}

Here is another reminder, full of warnings that "if you do NOT be diligent about your calling and election, if these godly traits are NOT yours, then the gates of Heaven will not be provided to you".

Ungodliness and "forgotten former purification from sins", is an absolute possibility; and bars us from the gates of Heaven.

See how all the Scriptures harmonize?

Let stay on topic with Romans 13:11-14 where they are told to walk like in gal 5:25 because in both cases they are saved in living in the spirit but not walking in the spirit.

thus they are exhorting them to live righteously and quit there walking in the flesh which could lead to physical death like in 1 cor 11:30-32

By the way explain romans 4:5 how and ungodly man become saved ...


God's work .... john 1:13, 6:28-29 , not mans mk 10:26-27

 

[squint]

That's right.
Try to remain calm about, tho. I don't like to attract a lot of negative attention.

Eph. 2:

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)
6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus

Looks past tense to me... You've been "had."

 

[CShephard53]

I pray brother that you will quit disagreeing with God's Word...and trying to dispute it with your outrageous opinions, and the attempts of using scripture to refute scripture, and that your judgment of others will cease.

I know without a doubt that I will spend eternity with God in heaven, weather I die this instant, tomorrow, next week, next year, whenever.

Those who doubt God, more than likely do not know God. John 3:16 says it all. Go ahead dispute His Word again...you do not have to answer to me, but to HIM!

Your constant admonitions that we're disobeying God and doubting God are NOT helping your argument. They make you look like a fool. Try to argue and show WHY you think it's against God's word and God...

 

[CShephard53]

That's right.
Try to remain calm about, tho. I don't like to attract a lot of negative attention.

At least we can find some humor in all of this...

 

[forgivenWretch]

I am blessed with 4 personalities! God the father, Christ Jesus the son, and the Holy Spirit, and God said "I will never leave nor forsake you, and my own.

It is so sad that so many do not know this peace, and mock the Almighty!

 

[squint]

There is not one single example in scripture where a "believer" LOST their salvation unto eternal damnation...

It's made up to keep the flock a fleecing...by hirelings who kneed the dough...

 

[NoDoubt]

I pray brother that you will quit disagreeing with God's Word...and trying to dispute it with your outrageous opinions, and the attempts of using scripture to refute scripture, and that your judgment of others will cease.

I know without a doubt that I will spend eternity with God in heaven, weather I die this instant, tomorrow, next week, next year, whenever.

Those who doubt God, more than likely do not know God. John 3:16 says it all. Go ahead dispute His Word again...you do not have to answer to me, but to HIM!

Hey I know I'm saved too because I trust God and I trust in His promise. Jesus said that He saved me. I'm far from perfect. I'm a sinner but I know He told me I just have to trust Him with my salvation and hold on to Him.

I don't have to beat myself up over it. He told me He forgave me up on the cross when he said it was finished.

That's all He asks and expects. Plain and simple.

 

[forgivenWretch]

There is not one single example in scripture where a "believer" LOST their salvation unto eternal damnation...

It's made up to keep the flock a fleecing...by hirelings who kneed the dough...

What a pity! Don't squint and maybe you might be able to see the truth.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

I agree with you --- because he CAN.

Our disagreement, is that I perceive if he DOES these things, then he is no longer saved.

2Pe 1:5 Now for this very reason also, applying all diligence, in your faith supply moral excellence, and in {your} moral excellence, knowledge,
2Pe 1:6 and in {your} knowledge, self-control, and in {your} self-control, perseverance, and in {your} perseverance, godliness,
2Pe 1:7 and in {your} godliness, brotherly kindness, and in {your} brotherly kindness, love.
2Pe 1:8 For if these {qualities} are yours and are increasing, they render you neither useless nor unfruitful in the true knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Pe 1:9 For he who lacks these {qualities} is blind {or} short-sighted, having forgotten {his} purification from his former sins.
2Pe 1:10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble;
2Pe 1:11 for in this way the entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ will be abundantly supplied to you.
2Pe 1:12 Therefore, I will always be ready to remind you of these things, even though you {already} know {them,} and have been established in the truth which is present with {you.}

Here is another reminder, full of warnings that "if you do NOT be diligent about your calling and election, if these godly traits are NOT yours, then the gates of Heaven will not be provided to you".

Ungodliness and "forgotten former purification from sins", is an absolute possibility; and bars us from the gates of Heaven.

See how all the Scriptures harmonize?

heb 10:17 and their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. 18 Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.

romans 4:8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not count sin.

 

[forgivenWretch]

I really do not care for "What if" questions but just for the fun of it..

"What if" the colors of the OP's poll, were to denote Heaven and Hell?
Of course, Heaven as blue, and Hell as red. I am so proud that I am not in the majority.

 

[NoDoubt]

I really do not care for "What if" questions but just for the fun of it..

"What if" the colors of the OP's poll, were to denote Heaven and Hell?
Of course, Heaven as blue, and Hell as red. I am so proud that I am not in the majority.

So am I!!!

 

[CShephard53]

I am blessed with 4 personalities! God the father, Christ Jesus the son, and the Holy Spirit, and God said "I will never leave nor forsake you, and my own.

It is so sad that so many do not know this peace, and mock the Almighty!

Again with accusations of mockery and doubt? Do us a favor. Be quiet unless you have a coherent argument.

 

[squint]

What a pity! Don't squint and maybe you might be able to see the truth.

I have no doubt that believers fall back as complete captives while in this present life. Just having to deal with all the confusions that are presented in "christianity" would be enough to send most running rightfully out the door...

That is no cause to thrust your fellow (former) believers in the back...by condemning them to hell, particularly since there are NO EXAMPLES in scripture of that happening to ANY believer, so squint that...and see if you can find ANY SUCH PRESENTATION...There simply is NO SUCH THING...

No soldier in war shoots his wounded commrades...

We are never told to condemn captives of sin, nor did Jesus.

Romans 13:10
Love worketh no ill to his neighbour