My family is threatening to disown me if I get married to my fiance

[Sparagmos]

"There will come a time where they can not endure sound doctrine and with itching ears they will seek what they want to hear". Sure give the OP what he wants to hear and send him straight to Hell. Good job guys.

I don’t think anyone here is doing that. We are sharing our honest opinions on the matter.

 

[Sparagmos]

Well, it appears to me that your reason for coming onto a Christian forum is to get some advice either on how to convince your Christian parents to see things your way or to try to understand their point of view. First, I will say that you more than likely will not get support from Christians on this forum to help convince your parents to compromise their Christian values. I can't help you with that. But what I can do is help you understand the biblical reasons why your parents feel so strongly about their position so you can really understand what exactly you are asking from them. Only then can you fully grasp why they are so resistant. First, from a scientific perspective, there is absolutely no evidence that your fiancé is a anything more than a male who thinks he is a female. Your parents do not see your fiancé as a female, so they probably see you no differently than simply being gay with a cross dressing boy who thinks he is a girl. I know this is a hard pill to swallow. But more than likely, this is what your parents believe is the truth and the truth don't care about your feelings or "self identification".

Now from a Christian standpoint, you have to read Romans 1:18-32 to really understand why your parents are upset. Pay particular attention to v.32 to see what Christians believe about people who condone and encourage your behavior and decisions. Of course you are not a believer so I cannot expect you to be held to a Christian standard. But you cannot expect for your parents to compromise on their standards for anyone to include their own son. Sorry. That is all I have for now.

So you believe parents should disown children for being gay or other things they consider a sin? How does that help the situation?

 

[Sparagmos]

The only issue with your story is that your hubby doesn't have a vagina. As a father, its one thing to not like a boy because he comes across as a punk with tattoos. But it is completely a whole different issue if the girl your son is dating has a penis!

Is his dad going to be seeing her naked or having sex with her? Goodness...

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Hi everybody,

I grew up in a fairly strict Christian family. Around the age of 19, I started to doubt the religion I had been raised in, & now consider myself agnostic. This in itself caused a lot of problems with my parents, however, they have sort of accepted it, probably because they are hoping I will change my mind again later in life & return to Christianity.

At the age of 21, I met my current fiance, who I am very much in love with, & we are going to get married in 6 months time. When my family 1st met my fiance about 2 years ago, they had no problems with her & seemed very happy that we were together. They also seemed happy when we announced our engagement 6 months ago. My fiance is also from a Christian family, so I think they were relieved about that.

So whats changed? Well, my fiance was born with male genitals, but from an early age, she thinks as early as 4 years old, she started behaving & identifying as a girl. She is on hormone treatment, & as female as any other female I know, & I have never seen her as anything but female. 2 months ago we decided that we should tell my parents about her transition, as they had no idea before. Now my parents are convinced if I marry this girl I will be going straight to hell. They have said that they won't attend our wedding, & if I marry her they will disown me.

My fiance is very upset about this, & I don't know what to do. She thinks we should call off the wedding until my parents accept it, but I don't know if they ever will, & I don't think my parents should dictate who I marry.

My fiances own parents are Christian, but they accepted many years ago the reality that their son is now their daughter, & they are happy for our marriage.

Just looking for advice from the perspective of other Christians I guess.

So, what's the question, specifically?

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

If God doesn't like transgender persons then he shouldn't allow persons with male genitals to be born with female brains.

The 'conditional love' bit I thoroughly agree with. Its one of the reasons I stopped believing in the Christian god. It seems that god places too many conditions on his love to me. If its wrong for our parents to love like that, then its wrong for god to as well.

So you believe parents should disown children for being gay or other things they consider a sin? How does that help the situation?

No, I shouldn't expect Christian's to be pressured to condone sin and compromise their Christian values in order to make their children happy. I probably wouldn't go as far as disowning my kids. I would always love them. I could never condone the marriage, I wouldn't be at the marriage. I would never see them actually married in the eyes of God. They would forever be living in a life of sin.

 

[(° ͡ ͜ ͡ʖ ͡ °) (ᵔᴥᵔʋ)]

Is his dad going to be seeing her naked or having sex with her? Goodness...

Well, where else is the male woman going to put it other than in his son's ...... I am not going to take it any further than that.

 

[step_by_step]

I'm so ashamed to see so many Christians promoting this just to spare feelings or whatever. Try and justify it whatever way you like but this is still wrong. You can either speak the truth to this person or go right on by without making a reply. But how dare you tell them that this is in any way right?

To the OP I will say that it is not as simple as "two people loving each other". The world would have you believe that but it isn't true. You are going to do what you are going to do and no one here can stop you. But ultimately, marrying this person would be wrong. I would not disown my children if they chose this path but you can be certain that I would not support it whatsoever, as your parents have done. If your fiancé wants to wait for your parents to come around, then you may be waiting for forever. Your parents are likely not going to back down on their convictions. As they shouldn't.

 

[Sparagmos]

Well, where else is the male woman going to put it other than in his son's ...... I am not going to take it any further than that.

The dad will never have to see or hear about their sex life. And it’s none of his business.

 

[step_by_step]

I dont like the replies so far. You're being a tad insensitive to a person who just came to these forums asking for advice. Regardless if its true or not it is his decision ultimately to follow Christ or not. We cannot force that opinion on him. Now to the OP. I am completely against homosexuality or men who become women or women who become men ...etc because I think that it violates what God created us all to be. Humans were created to be attracted to the opposite sex and to be the sex they were created as. It is sin that makes us want to be another sex or to have attractions to the same sex.

But I still think you guys should get married anyway. Why? Because you guys clearly love each other and why not enjoy the life that you're going to have without Christ? Think about it. If I was going to reject Christ for my entire life I would want to commit as much sin as possible. So yeah... If you guys want to get married go ahead. Enjoy the rest of your lives together and you guys have MY full support.

In no way am I trying to be rude when I say this, but this is the most outrageous reply I have seen on this forum so far. How on earth can you justify telling a lost person to just live it up and sin all they can before they die?? Is it not our duty as Christians on earth to minister to the lost? I literally cannot imagine telling this to someone. Whether or not OP believes in Hell is completely irrelevant. There are so many people out there who once didn't believe in God or Satan whatsoever and yet God reached them anyway. What if someone had instead told them to live it up and just revel in their sin?

No. Our job as Christians, as followers of Christ, is to not condone sin but instead speak the truth. This is not the truth.

 

[com7fy8]

My dad is one of these 'old white males' who seems stuck in the past & very stubborn, & my mum just seems to go along with what he says.

So, you agree that a human can be wrong and not know the difference????

By the way . . . welcome to Christian Forums

 

[com7fy8]

I grew up in a fairly strict Christian family. Around the age of 19, I started to doubt the religion I had been raised in, & now consider myself agnostic.

I understand that "agnostic" means you are not sure if there is God or not. I'll check an Internet source > it seems there are variations of the definition.

I once was told that an agnostic believes there is God but the person is not sure if God is personal with humans.

If you please to consider what is in the Bible, I think I can show that the God of Biblical Christianity is personal with each of His children.

For one example, in our basic calling as Christians, we are directed to obey how our Heavenly Father personally rules us in His own peace >

"And let the peace of God rule in your hearts, to which also you were called in one body; and be thankful." (Colossians 3:15)

This is very personal of God, to personally effect our character with His almighty peace and personally guide us in His own peace which has us functioning in His own all-loving love.

Also, we have Romans 5:5 >

"Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us." (Romans 5:5)

So, God does personally share His own love with us > He does not only talk to us from a distance. But in our "hearts", God so personally and intimately shares with us; this is so very personal, right in our "hearts".

So, in case you are an agnostic who knows the Bible, this is what you are not sure about > if there really is our Heavenly Father who is so personal with every one of His children.

Also, Hebrews 12:4-11 guarantees how our Father personally corrects every person who is a child of God.

So . . . have your parents been making an ongoing point of making sure you know about this? > God loves you and so He desires to personally rule you in His own peace; God personally shares His own love in the Holy Spirit with us; and God personally corrects His children > so, as Hebrews 12:4-11 guarantees, we share with God in His own holiness and we enjoy and benefit from having His love's "peaceable fruit of righteousness" in us?

No human can love you like this, but humans with God can love you by telling you this, about God.

So, it is wise not to put too many emotional eggs into one basket of love with some one or a few humans.

Jesus says, clearly, "if you love those who love you, what reward have you?" in Matthew 5:46.

And you agree that humans can be very wrong, I think you are saying by not agreeing with your parents. Well, one of the main ways a human can be wrong is to mainly or even only love a certain person who he or she can use for that he or she wants.

There are people who love the ones they use for the pleasure they treasure. Their preference is not really sexual, since sex is an act for reproducing. And their activities are incapable of reproduction, but they provide very intense and nice feeling pleasure. So, their preference is not really for how to reproduce, but how to use another person to get the pleasure they prefer.

And plenty of heterosexuals, I am sure, have been functioning in love which is really for the pleasure they want to feel, not really loving each other in love which has us all-loving the way Jesus wants.

So, I don't know if your parents are genuinely all-loving or not and if they submit to how God personally rules us in His peace, all through each day, and if they have brought you up by being an example of this. And I do not know if they have brought you up with good example of how the Bible commands us to relate in love >

"without complaining and disputing" (in Philippians 2:13-16).

"with all lowliness and gentleness, with longsuffering, bearing with one another in love," (Ephesians 4:2)

"submitting to one another in the fear of God." (Ephesians 5:21)

"Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice. And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you." (Ephesians 4:31-32)

In case you are not sure about this, or you think this is not good enough for you, yes you are capable of fooling your own self and not even knowing it. And you need to forgive anyone who has not been doing what they can to help you know and love this way.

And I myself need plenty of correction about this; so I do not have much time to spend pointing my finger at you. The Bible says that if I am a child of God, I get judged "first".

I have offered you a few basics about how the Bible says to love, and therefore how God's love in us has us relating in love. God Himself does this in us, all He means by His word.

God bless you

 

[RDKirk]

I can't return to something I don't believe in & that makes absolutely no sense to me. Nor would it change the way the way I feel about my fiance.

Why are you asking Christians about something you're doing as an unbeliever in Christ?

You are obeying your own master. If your master is not Christ, then Christians can't say anything about what you do. It's none of our business.

What business is it of mine to judge outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. -- 1 Corinthians 5

 

[com7fy8]

At the age of 21, I met my current fiance, who I am very much in love with, & we are going to get married in 6 months time. When my family 1st met my fiance about 2 years ago, they had no problems with her & seemed very happy that we were together.

You have said you have dated women before this person. You possibly learned to be attracted to a certain sort of appearance > how a woman of your culture tones her voice and behaves.

I think, by now, that you have seen how a professional actor can have you experience him or her to be whoever the actor is pretending to be. Women can play the role they decide they are supposed to play. But how much does any woman keep a few items from view? A number of us have fallen in love with acting.

But this is not what gives a woman her real identity. Either we are children of God or of Satan. This is what our real identity is. Identity is not really made up of how we prefer to get pleasure, or which gender of person we choose to use.

If we live in God's love, love does not have us using any person, never mind only or mainly use someone we hope to marry.

Oh, and you claim your parents could not tell the difference and they were ok with this person.

How do you know what they really were thinking?

What really were they experiencing about this person; what were they going through in prayer about you two? Did they tell you what they really were feeling and thinking before they were told about this person's physical structure?

In case they knew you were agnostic while dating - - if they are Biblically Christian people and not merely church culture copy-cat people, they were praying for you to be saved and trust in Jesus who died for all of us. And we know how all of us who were born in sin were therefore born wrong, by the way. All of us need how only Jesus can save us and change us into how God has us loving any and all people; "and you will find rest for your souls," Jesus says in Matthew 11:28-30.

Our real identity is not male or female, then. In God's love we become able to relate and care in the best way of how both a father and a mother care for children > you might consider 1 Thessalonians 2:4-12 . . . how Paul and Silvanus and Timothy related with the Thessalonians, as family. In God's love, they related in the best of how both a father and a mother can cherish and care for their children.

 

[RDKirk]

Also another thing I disagree with is Christian parents who disown their children because they don't follow Christ or because they marry the wrong person. Parents should be encouraging their children and should be happy for them no matter what. We may not AGREE with the particular sin that they are dealing with but we don't have to. Our jobs as parents is to just support it while voicing our opinions.

Disowning blood kinfolk is kind of a basic thing for Christians. Jesus said that repeatedly.

 

[Kenny'sID]

So you believe parents should disown children for being gay or other things they consider a sin? How does that help the situation?

It may make them think twice? I would have thought the answer to that was pretty obvious.

 

[StrivingFollower]

I can't help but see this as a mental disorder. I have a delusional disorder, and let me tell you you can be fooled into anything. Perception is everything. In life we try to learn what are the best qualities of people(mostly people of our gender), and we try to learn them the best we can. If you have a disorder that wrecks your self esteem and uses your low point to teach you that you must find comfort in female traits, destructive things happen. Pay attention to her, if you can see no emotional imbalances, really see that, then maybe she's successfully transitioned. But I've seen many of these transgendered people, and a lot of them seem highly histrionic.

They have out of control behavior and they aggressively seek attention. But people excuse these behaviors just because they feel so sorry for them. They don't act like women, they act like stereotypical women a lot of the time and that's because gender roles have become so exaggerated in their minds. The brain is such a highly advanced organ, I really don't think a man can genuinely have a female brain.. I don't think nature can possibly get that mixed up. Especially since we know some of our thought processes come from other parts of the body too, or are influenced by them.

 

[whereloveandmercymeet]

We already invited both parents to dinner to meet one another. My parents politely listened, but i dont think it swayed their opinion.

You have to face that it may not be possible. Without trying to get too personal, if your fiancé still has any male parts this may be swaying part of their thinking too.

The harder part is actually going through with the marriage if it will affect your relationship with them. Not so much with them, because I’d say (as a parent myself) that parents should know better and always love their children even if they don’t like their choices. (I can think of a few times my father expressly told me he wasn’t happy with something I was doing but he still loved me and would always be there). The bigger issue is your fiancé. If she feels responsible for damaging the relationship (whether or not it’s actually her fault) it’s likely to affect your relationship with her. For that reason she might be right in delaying marriage to try and give your parents time to come around a bit.

And as an aside, Gods love comes with no conditions at all. If it did, I highly doubt anyone on this planet would be worthy of it.

 

[Albion]

It looks like you have a choice to make, Theo--it's either your intended or your family (and potentially also many other people you two might deal with socially or professionally).

It is unlikely that any maneuvering or the passage of time can solve this impasse. You could of course put off marriage and start dating other people while not calling it quits with your fiancée. That would buy you time during which the picture might clear up in some way, but I suspect that you would consider this to be faithless on your part and it likewise would probably not change the basic attitudes of the other people.

 

[Sparagmos]

It may make them think twice? I would have thought the answer to that was pretty obvious.

Not obvious to me at all. I’m not aware of a situation where parents disowned a kid and the kid came around to their way of thinking. My mother disowned me when I was 20 because I moved in with my boyfriend. It only made me less desirous of getting her approval. It certainly didn’t change my mind and think premarital sex was a sin. Plus, that is usually an empty threat. It’s just dishonest and manipulative. When your children become adults they are going to choose their own path and ending the relationship over a disagreement about morality is petty and serves no purpose.

 

[PloverWing]

I agree with whereloveandmercymeet that your fiancee's parents are probably your best resource here. Your parents may never change their minds; still, her parents have thought through this, have had years to think through this, and they may have some insights to offer your parents.

I can see a couple of reasons you might delay the wedding a bit: 1) It gives your parents a little time to adjust. Maybe they won't boycott the wedding if they've had time to calm down. Even if they never approve of your marriage, they might at least be able to accept the choice you've made. 2) You said your fiancee is on hormone treatment. If she's still in the midst of a physical gender transition, I think I'd recommend waiting until she's completed whatever transitional steps she's planning before marrying, just to make sure that you and she are still comfortable with yourselves and each other. (I'd have the same advice for anyone about to undergo a major change.)