My church just changed their stance on homosexuals. What do I do?

AphroditeGoneAwry

Well-Known Member
Dec 2, 2012
517
173
Montana
Visit site
✟9,083.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
I agree...right up to the emphasized part. No pastor/priest/clergy is able to FORGIVE any sin. The scriptures tell us quite clearly that only Christ can forgive - a minister may be able to help lead a person down a rightful path, may be able to help guide their walk, even be quite important in leading to Christ Himself - but they CANNOT forgive any sin at all.

Of course I mean forgive sins in God's name. I consider that is obvious.

I believe in Priestly authority. Often it might not be needed, as God has the ability to do anything with anyone at any time; but if one finds a certain sin recurring, or feels unable to move past a problem or event, then it probably means he isn't going about reconciliation and redemption in the proper way.
 
Upvote 0

Deacon Don

Regular Member
Oct 25, 2013
307
18
✟15,497.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
... But it's the born that way change that bothers me...
Since God wouldn't create something and say you can't be that
particular thing the church is wrong. You need to voice your
concern to the pastor(s) then look for another church.
 
Upvote 0

Doctor Strangelove

Senior Member
Oct 5, 2012
1,097
55
United States
✟16,773.00
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
The gay issue is incidental - it is useful to make people feel guilty over "tolerance" and to get them to compromise over a moral issue. The prize is, to justify compromising on a moral issue, people find to be consistent they have to adjust their theology just a bit to the world. So little by little, doctrine becomes nothing as churches compromise on one issue after another. Then you have churches that have a religious form but no substance. They might vaguely proclaim Jesus as some sort of teacher or other, but that is all. Finally, the "church" becomes just a political advocacy group paid for by special interests.
 
Upvote 0

Sam VanHouten

Newbie
Sep 10, 2013
33
2
Bloomington, Indiana
✟15,163.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
Find a new church. This current one has been forever lost to grave apostasy.

Jesus, my Lord and Savior, I pray in reparation to thy most Sacred Heart, that this church may see the true light and submit to the most holy and absolute Mind of Christ, His holy temple and the true way of man's love, Amen.

God bless you all in the name of Christ.
 
Upvote 0
Nov 23, 2013
5
0
✟7,615.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Single
We can't change them. Only God can change them.

Anyways this whole universe is going to burn when the real Jesus Christ comes.

The bottom is the true gospel that comes with true power!

After God gave me the Holy Spirit, I found proof that TV, movies, video games and computer games are all sins, except Christian stuff that don’t have sins like sermons. I found out that in them there is stealing, adultery, fornication which is sex before marriage, revenge, jealousy, pride, using God's name in vain as a curse word, they are all idols (breaks 2nd Commandment) because most people can’t live without them and they love them more than God and more. Just read the 10 commandments for a list. But if you are one of God’s elects and God gives you the Holy Spirit, the Holy Spirit is the permanent cure to boredom but it is only given to God’s elects who suffer the most in this world since they were physically born. Ex: Me I have a learning disability, was bullied most of my life, never experienced love from family and friends, judged by my family in everything I did (Before I was saved and after I was saved), never fitted in-no matter how hard I tried (The reason is because I am one of God’s elects, which I didn’t know before I was saved), have been in depression, no purpose in life, no hope, have hit rock bottom in my life, been hated by the world for no reason since I was physically born (John 15:18-19) and much more.

Now I will be preaching about how to receive the Holy Spirit and be 100% going to Heaven.
First, it's only by the grace of God that he gives you faith in Jesus Christ in order to give up your sins. It’s only by the grace of God that he leads you to pray to him to destroy all your evil desires of watching TV. When you pray to God to destroy all your evil desires of watching TV, Satan will intervene and extremely tempt you in watching the TV. But if it's God's will and if you are one of God’s elects, you will overcome it and God will destroy all your evil desires of watching TV. After God has destroyed all your evil desires of watching TV and if you are one of God’s elects, you receive the joy of the Holy Spirit for about 40 minutes. After the joy wears off, all existence of boredom no longer exists and you no longer burn out (psychology) anymore. That is when you have received the Holy Spirit.
Then it's by the grace of God that he forgives you of your sins, as you confess and repent of your sins throughout your life which is called sanctification. But you can watch Christian stuff that don't have sins (Like sermons) because that helps you grow more mature as a Christian spiritually.

Just so you know Jesus had to endure the punishment for God’s elects sins which is Hell-Hellfire, which is extreme love and mercy. Read the bottom of what Jesus had to endure in Hell.
Lazarus and the rich man Luke 16:19-31
Extreme Dehydration, rich man begs for a drop of water.
Luke 16:24
King James Version (KJV)
24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
A place of outer darkness Matthew 8:12
A place of no rest Revelation 14:11
A place of blackness and darkness forever Jude 13
A place where people are tormented with fire and brimstone Revelation 14:10
Extreme pain since you are in everlasting fire.

If Jesus didn’t die on the cross and endure Hell which is the punishment for sin, God would still be just in sending us all to Hell because we are all guilty of our sins. Remember TV, movies, video games and computer games are all sins, except Christian stuff that don’t have sins like sermons. Just read the 10 commandments for a list. But God was willing to have some mercy, which we don’t deserve because we are all guilty of our sins. At least God was willing to have at least some mercy, better than no mercy at all.

Isaiah 1:9
King James Version (KJV)

9 Except the Lord of hosts had left unto us a very small remnant (God’s elects), we should have been as Sodom, and we should have been like unto Gomorrah.

Romans 9:29
King James Version (KJV)

29 And as Esaias said before, Except the Lord of Sabaoth had left us a seed (God’s elects), we had been as Sodoma, and been made like unto Gomorrha.

If God didn’t chose anybody to be saved, God would still be just in sending us all to the lake of fire which we all deserve because we are all guilty of our sins. Be thankful that God was willing to have some undeserved mercy, which is better than no mercy at all.

It would help if someone can translate all of this into different languages like Spanish, Russian, French and more. Than I can spread the gospel on different social medias to people that speak these languages.

P.S don’t try to justify your sins or make excuses for your sins or find loopholes in the bible.

That’s about it.
 
Upvote 0

Niffer

So...that just happened.
Aug 1, 2008
3,105
384
37
Ontario
✟20,246.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Conservatives
I would probably have to leave that church, sadly.
However, I have always adopted a wiggle-room policy.
What does the man behind the pulpit preach?
The Anglican church has officially accepted homosexuality, however that doesn't mean every Anglican priest has.

Find out what your, specific church leader will be teaching.
If he is going to teach and marry homosexuals, then sadly, you may need to find yourself a new home. :(

Peace,
~ Niffer
 
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,138
33,258
✟583,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
I would probably have to leave that church, sadly.
However, I have always adopted a wiggle-room policy.
What does the man behind the pulpit preach?
The Anglican church has officially accepted homosexuality, however that doesn't mean every Anglican priest has.
To be precise, the Anglican Church of Canada has "officially accepted homosexuality." The majority of the Anglican churches of the world have not. Maybe this is unimportant to the OP, but anyone in the inquirer's situation certainly has options.
 
Upvote 0
E

EarlyChristianresearcher

Guest
Dear Forum,
I am a new member of this forum and am very troubled right now.
I am a very conservative old fashioned person, but I am in my 30's I am married and have three children.

I feel like the world has liberalized before my very eyes the last 15 years. I feel that as the older generation dies off we are left with a very liberal accepting younger generation. I belong to a church that had an extremely strong stance on homosexuals. They are still very against Gay marriage, and homosexual sexual relations. But they used to teach that gay people were not born that way, but that it is a perversion or sinful behavior, much like a sex addiction, or a pedophile, or married spouse that cheats on his wife 30 times.

My church came under fire for donating resources and man hours to pass Proposition 8 in California. I was proud of this accomplishment, and felt it was a great thing. I guess there was an overwhelming backlash from gays and their liberal friends. As well as liberal members within the congregation.

Recently my church announced that they apologize for their anti gay stance, and have changed official doctrine to recognize that homosexuals are born that way. And that as long as homosexuals refrain from sexual relations, they can hold many church positions and have full fellowship. This has probably always been policy, and I understand that we can't block people from worshiping that want to. But it's the born that way change that bothers me. I find it hard to believe that someone could act like one of those crazy flaming homosexuals, because they are born that way. Are people born as pedophiles then? Are the people with the strange fetishes born that way as well? What about the situations where a young boy is molested, and then becomes gay later in life? Surely he was not born that way? Or the battered angry wife, that divorces her husband and moves in with a woman and becomes a lesbian? Surely she was not born that way, but has turned her back on traditional relationships, because of her bad experience, and experiments.

My church also produced an instructional video where several gay people were interviewed, and their mannerisms were disgusting to me, and they even mentioned how fulfilling their gay relationships were.

I shelter my young kids very much. They do not watch movies with any intimate scenes, don't go on the internet except for kids sites, and then under supervision, and we don't let them play at other kids houses unless we really know the family well. I am concerned about them seeing the flamboyant behavior of a homosexual person. And personally I don't want to see it either. I am sick of their agenda. I want it the way it was 20+ years ago before they were emboldened. I don't think that gays that get married and adopt kids are families.

I feel like my church is jumping the bandwagon now, because they know that this lifestyle is going to be completely acceptable in another 20 years across the board, and that people that voice opinions like my own then will be looked at like racists are now. Like crackpots. Both me and my wife have a lot of time in this church. My wife doesn’t care about this as much as I do. But I am very bothered. Not attending church or changing denominations is not an option because it would cause a lot of strife in my marriage.

Sorry that this post is so long.

Any advice?


Those who hide behind, "I was born that way" excuse for being gay, just don't want to accept the fact that the sum of all their choices from when they were an innocent baby, eventually made them that way.

Was the bank robber born a bank robber?:cool:
Was the adulterer born an adulterer?:kiss:
Was the serial killer born a serial killer? :mad:

I wonder how well this would go in the court:
"Your honor, you can't send me to prison or make me pay that fine, I was born a drug dealer!":holy:

"Watch your thoughts, they become words,
Watch your words, they become actions,
Watch your actions, they become habits,
Watch your habits, they become your character,
Watch your character, they become your destiny."
(Attributed to Frank Outlaw).
 
Upvote 0

Begat

IN*P
Jan 18, 2014
45
4
North West England
✟7,702.00
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Single
I understand this must be a great time of uncertainty for you. Might it be helpful to investigate whether the reasons for this change were political, or as a result of some scientific lead? My stance is that we're called to embrace truth, and that although a lot of science is riddled with political interest, I just don't think the Bible necessarily tells us whether it's possible or impossible that some people are born with a 100% inclination towards homosexuality. So I'd not be afraid to take the lead from science on that one, because that doesn't change God's Word in any way. I'm limited as to what I can write in this forum, as although I mean love for all people, public feeling is so strong in Britain that it is getting to be pretty unacceptable to talk about LGBT in a way that does not appear to critical onlookers to wholeheartedly affirm the movement and all of its statements and aims.

The best I can do is recommend you a book by a pastor of one of the most conservative evangelical congregations in the Church of England, St Ebbe's Church. This used to be my church when I moved into that area of the country as a student - although I've moved back home up North now I've graduated. He himself has unwanted and exclusive same-sex attraction, and admitted this implicitly in the 4th preface of his book 'Battles Christians Face', and later talked about it in an interview in 'Evangelicals Now', entitled 'A Battle I Face'. This article ended up being quoted in various places throughout the web, and although our left-wing press gloated about whether the church would turn against him (perish the thought that we would turn on our pastor!) and said that his admission signalled the defeat of the conservative evangelical lobby on the LGTB 'debate' (which is not really allowed to be a debate anymore), other Christians in the same position as him have considered his words a great source of support and an immense triumph of courage. In the relevant chapter of his book he talks about the nature of homosexuality, which he prefers to call 'same-sex attraction', and about how the church should help people who struggle in this way. This guy advocates celibacy, purity in singleness and prayer for change as the only Biblical option for people who face the same permanent and unwanted struggles as him, and apparently appropriates Christ's description of 'eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake' as a description of the estate of one with permanent same-sex attraction who chooses to remain single in today's world. He was my pastor once, when I lived in that part of the country - but I was only a student there, and have since moved back up North. According to my Facebook feed, he has recently preached another sermon series on marriage, in which he claims, as he always has done in my memory (and has even been a guest speaker for a church camp that focused on the subject), that the God-given institution of marriage can only be between one man and one woman as it was in Genesis. Here's an incomplete link to his interview in 'Evangelicals Now' here (I haven't posted enough posts yet to be able supply proper links):

http: // ww w. e-n.org.uk/p-6028-A-battle-I-face.htm
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: jennimatts
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
E

EarlyChristianresearcher

Guest
I also think that the whole gay movement is part of a bigger picture. As an investigative reporter, blog writer, & radio producer. I've done some research into different angles of this whole issue which I would like to present from different perspectives.

The rivalry between God’s Order and Satan’s Order is a battle that goes way back into ancient times. In the ancient Prophet Enoch literature and other ancient documents. The devil glorifies himself and rejoices with his followers in their works. In his Order, it is the reversal of all things. His “vicious order” with its covenants, counterfeit marriages, and the false oaths & the foreswearing of the false teaching of the fallen angels soon "fills all the earth with blood and wickedness as the cries of the slain ascend to the gates of heaven, their groaning comes up & cannot depart because of the crimes being committed upon all the face of the earth.” Dr. Huge Nibley, Enoch The Prophet, p. 7—13.

ALL CHURCHES HAVE BEEN INFILTRATED BY NOW, BY THOSE WITH THEIR OWN HIDDEN AGENDAS, CONSPIRATORIAL IN NATURE!

James Burnham notes that communist have infiltrated every aspect of society, including churches.1

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: 1859, Charles W. Penrose, who later became an apostle in 1904, prophesied in a sermon the following warning about what would happen in the last days, he said “the passions of human nature will be put to the vilest uses [and] new diseases will silently eat their ghastly way through the ranks of the wicked".2

1919, communists planned to: “Corrupt the young; get them away from religion. Get them interested in sex. Make them superficial. Destroy their ruggedness.”3

1947, Communist in Melbourne, Australia, talked of plans they'd do:
A. Use additives and special formulas, by changing plants and animals. [Ed. note: i.e. chemicals, hormones, genetically engineered seed (GMO), etc]. So that the diet of the people leaves them submissive and easily controlled.
B. Drug Addictions. (See: Arnaud de Bochgrave, Disinformation in the Media, (talk tape: National Center for Constitutional Studies).
C. Music, melodic dissonance.
D. Control the Churches. "We know all about your church. We control every church in the world, except yours, [The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints], and we will infiltrate that.”

"...we control all the churches except The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.' He said, 'we have them in our control' and he said that when we have political and economic control of the world, we will then be able to establish our total spiritual program." Secrets of the Melbourne Man, by Marion Albert Law, on Latter-Day Conservative.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: May 1949, President J. Reuben Clark, Jr., warned that "the ravening wolves are amongst us from our own membership and they, more than any others, are clothed in sheep's clothing, because they wear the habiliments of the Priesthood.... We should be careful of them."4

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: October 4, 1969, during the Saturday morning session of General Conference, the Apostle, Ezra Taft Benson warned that one of communists’ targets are churches. After infiltrating them, they seek to spread their propaganda.5

OTHER CHURCHES TARGETED!

Alan Stang warned that John Foster Dulles, Secretary of State 1953 to 1959, “was a leader in the Communist scheme to infiltrate the clergy and to use religion; in the Communist scheme to revoke our Bill of Rights and substitute the phony Soviet “constitution;” and . . . to deliver China to Mao Tse-tung and Cuba to Castro.6

October 10, 1981, Saturday, California, from my journal: I talked to a man about our age 19—21 years old, who was from Nicaragua, a country in Central America. He talked about how that the communist took over. He said that at first there was a dictatorship and them propaganda leaked in. In a matter of time this secret world wide combination ate at the heart of the government and a communistic leader was cleverly put into place. The man I talked with was a Catholic, and he said that the priests were pressured and the communists started to crush the religious foundation and turned the people away from religion. They started teaching an anti-Christ, anti-God propaganda in the churches and the priests would not be permitted to dwell on god and thus they destroyed the believes, or tried to. Then came war and misery as the street fighting and riots turned into intense combat. Bombings, murders and destruction. He said he got out and wants to join the army here in America to fight against communism.

1958, W. Cleon Skousen, The Naked Communist, he warned that one of the many communist goals and “The Future Task” back then was to: “Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting inappropriate contentography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio and TV.” Another goal was to: “Present homo-sexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural, healthy.”7

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: The Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, during the April 1980 conference, prophesied about a vision of the future which they had. In it he said that they saw that “...adulterers and homosexuals and murderers scarcely seek to hide their abominations from our view.”8

Some of The Goals of Communism

24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press.


25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting inappropriate contentography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.


26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."


27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."


28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."


In 1968, a born-again Christian writer, John A. Stormer notes how that the communists were circulating and promoting filthy books, dirty movies, profanity, smut, inappropriate contentographic materials, and homosexuality & lesbianism, etc. They were doing this in order to bring down Americas’ morals.9


The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints: During the Vietnam war, (late 1960s, early 1970s?), the apostle Ezra Taft Benson, said, during a Brigham Young University Devotional that the communist have said that: “We are going to destroy the moral character of a generation of young Americans.” In so doing this, he says that the communists believe that Americans will have nothing to really defend themselves against them.10

February, 1983, defectors from the Cuban DGI = (Dirección General de Inteligencia—Cuban intelligence), testified in a federal court in Miami, Florida that they heard Cuba’s communist leader Fidel Castro himself say that: “We must flood the United States with drugs because that will add to the decay and decomposition of that capitalist society.”11

Notes:

1- James Burnham, The Web of Subversion, Underground Networks In The U.S. Government, (Boston; Los Angeles: Western Islands, The Americanist Library, 1965; John Day edition, 1954, American Opinion edition, 1965), pp. 13, 63, 82—83, 146, 164, & 172. A ex-communist, Paul Crouch is mentioned. Is he the same Crouch said to be a preacher?


2- Charles W. Penrose, 1859, Millennial Star, 21:582, cited by Hoyt W. Brewster Jr. Behold I Come Quickley, The Last Days And Beyond, (Salt Lake City, Utah: Deseret Book Company, 1994), p. 43.

3- John A. Stormer, The Death of a Nation, (Florissant, Missouri: Liberty Bell Press, 1968), p. 67, note 1 on p. 178: The American Legion Magazine, November, 1954, p. 6. Citing from a communist 1919 publication Rules For Bringing About Revolution.


4- President J. Reuben Clark, Jr., The Improvement Era, May 1949, p. 268, cited by Ezra Taft Benson of the Council of the Twelve Apostles, Conference Report, October 1967. Jerreld L. Newquist, Prophets, Principles And National Survival.

5- The Apostle, Ezra Taft Benson, The Improvement Era, December 1969, vol. 72, #12, pp. 69—73, see especially p. 70. General Conference, Saturday morning session, October 4, 1969, Godless Forces Threaten Us.

6 - Alan Stang, The Actor, THE TRUE STORY OF JOHN FOSTER DULLES, SECRETARY OF STATE 1953 TO 1959, (Boston; Los Angeles: Western Islands, 1968), p. 1.

7- W. Cleon Skousen, The Naked Communist, (Salt Lake City, Utah: The Ensign Publishing Company, 1958, 1960, & 1961), p. 261, The Future Task #s 25 & 26.

8- The Apostle, Bruce R. McConkie, April 1980 General Conference address. The Coming Tests and Trials and Glory, see: Ensign, May 1980, vol. 10, #5, pp. 71—73, see especially p. 73.

9- John A. Stormer, The Death of a Nation, (Florissant, Missouri: Liberty Bell Press, 1968), pp. 9, 13—14, 17—18, 23, 67—89, see especially p. 67, note 1 on p. 178: The American Legion Magazine, November, 1954, p. 6.

10- Ezra Taft Benson, Vietnam— Victory Or Surrender, (Provo, Utah: Brigham Young University/Electronic Media Department), tape #K1389, side A.

11- Arnaud de Bochgrave, Disinformation in the Media, (talk tape: National Center for Constitutional Studies).
 
Upvote 0

PeaceByJesus

Unworthy servant for the Worthy Lord + Savior
Feb 20, 2013
2,775
2,095
USA
Visit site
✟83,561.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
But it's the born that way change that bothers me. I find it hard to believe that someone could act like one of those crazy flaming homosexuals, because they are born that way.

In the sense that we are born with a sin nature with its proclivity to sin, basically yes: "The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies." (Psalms 58:3) But we can still choose to sin, as the first murderer could, (Gn. 4:7) and when those in Rm. 1:21,22, "knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools."

Thus we have a choice to yield to sin, and how much, but can reach a point where we cannot stop, but by God's salvific grace. And as idolatry is the mother of sins, thus faith and worship in Christ is the opposite.

As for what to do in a clear case as this, that is simple:

"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?" "And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?" "And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people." (2 Corinthians 6:14-16)







 
Upvote 0
May 16, 2014
152
3
63
Visit site
✟15,313.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Dear Forum,
I am a new member of this forum and am very troubled right now.
I am a very conservative old fashioned person, but I am in my 30's I am married and have three children.

I feel like the world has liberalized before my very eyes the last 15 years. I feel that as the older generation dies off we are left with a very liberal accepting younger generation. I belong to a church that had an extremely strong stance on homosexuals. They are still very against Gay marriage, and homosexual sexual relations. But they used to teach that gay people were not born that way, but that it is a perversion or sinful behavior, much like a sex addiction, or a pedophile, or married spouse that cheats on his wife 30 times.

My church came under fire for donating resources and man hours to pass Proposition 8 in California. I was proud of this accomplishment, and felt it was a great thing. I guess there was an overwhelming backlash from gays and their liberal friends. As well as liberal members within the congregation.

Recently my church announced that they apologize for their anti gay stance, and have changed official doctrine to recognize that homosexuals are born that way. And that as long as homosexuals refrain from sexual relations, they can hold many church positions and have full fellowship. This has probably always been policy, and I understand that we can't block people from worshiping that want to. But it's the born that way change that bothers me. I find it hard to believe that someone could act like one of those crazy flaming homosexuals, because they are born that way. Are people born as pedophiles then? Are the people with the strange fetishes born that way as well? What about the situations where a young boy is molested, and then becomes gay later in life? Surely he was not born that way? Or the battered angry wife, that divorces her husband and moves in with a woman and becomes a lesbian? Surely she was not born that way, but has turned her back on traditional relationships, because of her bad experience, and experiments.

My church also produced an instructional video where several gay people were interviewed, and their mannerisms were disgusting to me, and they even mentioned how fulfilling their gay relationships were.

I shelter my young kids very much. They do not watch movies with any intimate scenes, don't go on the internet except for kids sites, and then under supervision, and we don't let them play at other kids houses unless we really know the family well. I am concerned about them seeing the flamboyant behavior of a homosexual person. And personally I don't want to see it either. I am sick of their agenda. I want it the way it was 20+ years ago before they were emboldened. I don't think that gays that get married and adopt kids are families.

I feel like my church is jumping the bandwagon now, because they know that this lifestyle is going to be completely acceptable in another 20 years across the board, and that people that voice opinions like my own then will be looked at like racists are now. Like crackpots. Both me and my wife have a lot of time in this church. My wife doesn’t care about this as much as I do. But I am very bothered. Not attending church or changing denominations is not an option because it would cause a lot of strife in my marriage.

Sorry that this post is so long.

Any advice?

Sounds like your church makes a much bigger issue of homosexuality than any Church I've been to.
 
Upvote 0

NorrinRadd

Xian, Biblicist, Fideist, Pneumatic, Antinomian
Sep 2, 2007
5,571
595
Wayne Township, PA, USA
✟8,652.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Well...this is where the problem lies then. If these men do not speak for you or many of your friends in the congregation...time to rally them together. You can do this by petition, phone calls, letters and other means to get them to listen to you and your friends who all donated money to stop the legislation.

Remind them that they are SERVANT leaders. Not bosses by fiat. And unilaterally they have made this decision that is going to upset a whopping portion of their congregation and that if they can't get it straight and soon that you and your friends are going to get a new hierarchy which will reflect the desires of the congregation of being more Godly. Romans is very clear on the subject and if the church wants a policy that is in direct defiance of that scripture then all of you will want a new church. And that one way or the other...this is wrong and you all are going back to the original.

FTR, this may not be possible. Many independent churches have a governing board comprising the pastor and a few close associates. The congregation cannot "get a new hierarchy" except by leaving and joining another church or starting a new one.
 
Upvote 0

NorrinRadd

Xian, Biblicist, Fideist, Pneumatic, Antinomian
Sep 2, 2007
5,571
595
Wayne Township, PA, USA
✟8,652.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Heh. It's funny people are still "answering," when the initiator has posted a grand total of TWO posts on all of CF, both in this thread, both over 16 months ago. I wonder what happened? Did he drag his wife and kids to another church against their wills? Did she refuse to leave, causing him to shake the dust off his feet against her? Did he stay to sow strife among the brethren and cause a church split? Did he learn the church really did not change because of outside pressure, but because, right or wrong, the leadership came to a different understanding? Inquiring minds...
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

nitrox314

Sinner saved by Grace
Jun 23, 2008
20
4
USA
✟15,268.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
FTR, this may not be possible. Many independent churches have a governing board comprising the pastor and a few close associates. The congregation cannot "get a new hierarchy" except by leaving and joining another church or starting a new one.
That's exactly how my church started. It split on ideological differences and is now one of the largest in Albuquerque. The issue you will need to deal with is that you need enough people to band together to separate successfully. This includes pastors...
 
Upvote 0

Pastor Don

Newbie
Jun 26, 2014
33
10
Indianapolis
✟8,009.00
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Married
We often forget that we are all of us broken. We may have been created in perfection in the beginning, but over several thousand generations we have done a fairly thorough job of shattering that perfection to its smallest dysfunctional parts. It is for this reason that I can say that I have no doubt that homosexuality can be given to a fetus in the same manner that alcoholism or drug addiction has found its way to a child. This is spiritual warfare folks. If given even the smallest opportunity, the devil will exploit it to its fullest in order to ruin not only the individuals life but his/her soul and as many souls that he can bring down in the process. That is the cost of this warfare.

There is another issue and that is one base on our own perspectives. If we are truly going to be Christ-like in our relationships, then we cannot continue to look at lepers of our society and say 'unclean'... We MUST and I say this with passion, we must look through the same eyes as Christ on this matter. If we reject people based on the sins they commit, we are might as well reject ourselves for forgiveness only works when we can forgive. Secondly, though we feel strongly about this particular sin, judgments are not up to us. This is left to God and God only. If we wish to judge then we will also be judged on the sin we commit in our lifetime. Saying that, I do not believe that we should speak untruths about homosexuality. What we do need to do is allow people to receive God's Words in a manner that will either convict them or not based on how open they to hearing the Holy Spirit in their lives.

Finally, to be the city on the hill, the light and salt unto this world, we have to think about the bigger picture which is the Great Commission. Our job is to spread the Good News. A person that hears the Good News then has to decide whether or not they want to submit to God by repenting of their sinful nature and trusting in Jesus as their Savior. This seems easy, but rebellion often happens in the repenting part as we soon discover that there are parts of our life we do not want to give up but God convicts us of by letting us know that this part of our life is not compatible with Him. The choice always is ours to make and the rewards are awesome. It takes courage and support from all those around to work through the harder transformations. This is where we as churches should look to spend time and energy.
 
Upvote 0

Albion

Facilitator
Dec 8, 2004
111,138
33,258
✟583,842.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
We often forget that we are all of us broken. We may have been created in perfection in the beginning, but over several thousand generations we have done a fairly thorough job of shattering that perfection to its smallest dysfunctional parts. It is for this reason that I can say that I have no doubt that homosexuality can be given to a fetus in the same manner that alcoholism or drug addiction has found its way to a child. This is spiritual warfare folks. If given even the smallest opportunity, the devil will exploit it to its fullest in order to ruin not only the individuals life but his/her soul and as many souls that he can bring down in the process. That is the cost of this warfare.

There is another issue and that is one base on our own perspectives. If we are truly going to be Christ-like in our relationships, then we cannot continue to look at lepers of our society and say 'unclean'...
No, but we are not to proclaim leprosy to be healthy or "celebrate" sin. THAT's where the battle lines are drawn, not on being unloving towards minorities, judging in the place of God, or any of the other propaganda that is constantly being thrown against the church.

If we reject people based on the sins they commit, we are might as well reject ourselves for forgiveness only works when we can forgive.
If you are speaking of literally barring the church doors to homosexual persons, I'd agree with you that that's wrong. But I don't know of any church that does this, so it can't be the problem that's attracting all the attention. Something deep down makes me think that you have something else in mind, though.

Finally, to be the city on the hill, the light and salt unto this world, we have to think about the bigger picture which is the Great Commission. Our job is to spread the Good News. A person that hears the Good News then has to decide whether or not they want to submit to God by repenting of their sinful nature and trusting in Jesus as their Savior. This seems easy, but rebellion often happens in the repenting part as we soon discover that there are parts of our life we do not want to give up but God convicts us of by letting us know that this part of our life is not compatible with Him. The choice always is ours to make and the rewards are awesome. It takes courage and support from all those around to work through the harder transformations. This is where we as churches should look to spend time and energy.
But if we do, we're going to called bigots, unloving, and judgmental. :doh:
 
Upvote 0
May 28, 2014
1,039
781
36
Greeneville
Visit site
✟44,101.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
You know my church is Independent Baptist. We tend to be more fundamental/conservative than most churches. We only sing traditional hymns and we are KJV-Onlyist.

We do believe that being gay and lesbian are sins and that God did not create us that way.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
May 28, 2014
1,039
781
36
Greeneville
Visit site
✟44,101.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
But if we do, we're going to called bigots, unloving, and judgmental. :doh:

Why are you so afraid of being called names? Let them call us names, it doesn't hurt me. And that is so you know that they call us names simply because they can do nothing else, it's sad.

All their actions are reduced to null, so they become angry and hateful and they call us names because they can do nothing else. It's really pitiful.

Besides, it's them who has the problem, not you.

You should just tell yourself these things.
 
Upvote 0