Missing link was a lie

[LifeToTheFullest!]

Quotes like that remind me of how science used to be.

Those quotes aren't unscientific -- they are simply outdated?

Remember Tombaugh's Folly?

You guys seem to forget your own legacies.

Not that it matters to you, but Hovind made that claim circa 1995, not 1235.

 

[AV1611VET]

Not that it matters to you, but Hovind made that claim circa 1995, not 1235.

Ya -- so?

He is only behind the times -- that's all.

What if I happen to believe Pluto is still a planet -- or Thalidomide is still a wonder drug for pregnant mothers, or the Challenger was 'go' for liftoff, or the earth is flat?

Would I have had scientific support at one time?

I'm not the one who studied Thalidomide in a laboratory, then okayed it for pharmaceutical use.

I'm just an ignorant, scientifically-challenged plebeian.

If I'm wrong with my science, what were the scientists themselves?

Or was it okay for them to be wrong, but not us?

 

[LifeToTheFullest!]

Ya -- so?

He is only behind the times -- that's all.

What if I happen to believe Pluto is still a planet -- or Thalidomide is still a wonder drug for pregnant mothers, or the Challenger was 'go' for liftoff, or the earth is flat?

Would I have had scientific support at one time?

You're free to evaluate and filter information however you want AV. I trust that you will make the right decision when it really comes down to it.

 

[AV1611VET]

You're free to evaluate and filter information however you want AV. I trust that you will make the right decision when it really comes down to it.

Like Christa McAuliffe did?

 

[LifeToTheFullest!]

Like Christa McAuliffe did?

Like everybody does.

 

[sandwiches]

Like Christa McAuliffe did?

I'm curious to see how she ties in with the quoted post. You always have some crazy convoluted associations, so this should be pretty entertaining and, ultimately, irrelevant.

 

[LifeToTheFullest!]

I'm curious to see how she ties in with the quoted post. You always have some crazy convoluted associations, so this should be pretty entertaining and, ultimately, irrelevant.

Which, it should be noted, is a popular tactic taken by creationists.

 

[Split Rock]

Quotes like that remind me of how science used to be.

Those quotes aren't unscientific -- they are simply outdated?

Remember Tombaugh's Folly?

You guys seem to forget your own legacies.

Did Tombaugh discover Pluto or not? Tell us where the "folly" is. Or are we simply to assume that you and dad represent the folly?

 

[Split Rock]

Ya -- so?

He is only behind the times -- that's all.

What if I happen to believe Pluto is still a planet -- or Thalidomide is still a wonder drug for pregnant mothers, or the Challenger was 'go' for liftoff, or the earth is flat?

Would I have had scientific support at one time?

I'm not the one who studied Thalidomide in a laboratory, then okayed it for pharmaceutical use.

I'm just an ignorant, scientifically-challenged plebeian.

If I'm wrong with my science, what were the scientists themselves?

Or was it okay for them to be wrong, but not us?

So we scientists are responsible for all of that, yes? I guess that means you will take responsibility for all the hunting, burning, hanging and torture of "witches" through out the history of Europe. How about the Spandish Inquisition? The Crusades? The persecution of the Jews for "killing Jesus?" How about for every pedophile priest who sexually assaulted a child? Fair is fair, right? Or is this just more Special Pleading.....

 

[AV1611VET]

Fair is fair, right?

Okay -- those are fair questions.

Let me put it this way -- but before I do -- let me remind you once again that I am just not a fundamental Baptist, I am an independent Baptist. That means that we do not have anything to do with what some other church did in the past, present, or future -- including other independent Baptist churches. Another poster here, a geologist, had a real problem with that and tried hard to link me to some of the things Luther said and did in the past, and I refused to have any part in any of it. There is no guilt-by-association with us; and he eventually lost a lot of, if not all, respect for me. What can I say?

However, to answer your questions, I will not take responsibility in the hunting, burning and torturing of witches, etc., as those things were done in spite of the Bible, not in respect to It.

Any church on earth can saddle-up and go riding off to liberate Jerusalem from the gentiles, despite what Jesus said about Jerusalem being a melting pot until He personally liberates it Himself -- but just because it was done by order of some church, doesn't mean it was done per order of the Scriptures.

 

[biggles53]

He came to set the prisoners free.

He condoned slavery....

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. " (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

"Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them." (1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT)

"The servant will be severely punished, for though he knew his duty, he refused to do it. "But people who are not aware that they are doing wrong will be punished only lightly. Much is required from those to whom much is given, and much more is required from those to whom much more is given." (Luke 12:47-48 NLT)

He forbade divorce. Parents ought to lead their kids away from damnation, and into eternal life. If they don't, why, I also recommend that they be overruled. So??

He advocated the breakup of family relationships for those who would 'follow' him...

“Don’t imagine that I came to bring peace on earth! No, rather a sword lf you love your father, mother, sister, brother, more than me, you are not worthy of being mine." Matthew 10:34

Where? I recall he raised children from the dead, and healed them, and loved them.

He advocates disobedient children being put to death!....

“He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.” Matthew 15:4-7


We no longer value these kinds of 'moral outlook'...we have moved on, we have built a moral code which more accurately represents what humans think about themselves and one another....and it (for the most part) works!

The 'guidance' given by your scriptures is irelevant. It is what it is....the understandings of a group of superstitious, fearful people who had little or no idea of the world that surrounded them, reflecting the values of their day......it was man-made, just as our current value system is.

 

[AV1611VET]

He condoned slavery....

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. " (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)

Use a real Bible:

Col 3:22 Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God:

 

[biggles53]

Use a real Bible:

Col 3:22 Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God:

What...!!?? You're going to hide behind one of the umpteen translations of translations of translations of revisions of the damn thing, just so you can weasel "servant" out of "slave"...???

How intellectually dishonest and how weak....!!

 

[biggles53]

Okay -- those are fair questions.

Let me put it this way -- but before I do -- let me remind you once again that I am just not a fundamental Baptist, I am an independent Baptist. That means that we do not have anything to do with what some other church did in the past, present, or future -- including other independent Baptist churches. Another poster here, a geologist, had a real problem with that and tried hard to link me to some of the things Luther said and did in the past, and I refused to have any part in any of it. There is no guilt-by-association with us; and he eventually lost a lot of, if not all, respect for me. What can I say?

However, to answer your questions, I will not take responsibility in the hunting, burning and torturing of witches, etc., as those things were done in spite of the Bible, not in respect to It.

Any church on earth can saddle-up and go riding off to liberate Jerusalem from the gentiles, despite what Jesus said about Jerusalem being a melting pot until He personally liberates it Himself -- but just because it was done by order of some church, doesn't mean it was done per order of the Scriptures.

see bold.

Oh really....!?? What part of "Thou shall not suffer a witch to live" (Exodus 22:18) do you not understand as being "in respect" of the Bible...????

 

[AV1611VET]

Oh really....!?? What part of "Thou shall not suffer a witch to live" (Exodus 22:18) do you not understand as being "in respect" of the Bible...????

What part of Dispensation Theology (or even Covenant Theology) do you not understand?

I'll tell you what: you produce me an Old Testament witch, and then we'll talk -- how's that?

Ro 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

 

[biggles53]

What part of Dispensation Theology (or even Covenant Theology) do you not understand?

I'll tell you what: you produce me an Old Testament witch, and then we'll talk -- how's that?

Ro 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

So, your god commanded the killing of 'creatures' that didn't exist....???

And, Augustine and Aquinas didn't seem to share your doubts.......!

 

[AV1611VET]

So, your god commanded the killing of 'creatures' that didn't exist....???

There's nothing like a non-theologian debating a theologian is there?

(Unless it's a non-scientician trying to debate a scientician.)

 

[Split Rock]

Okay -- those are fair questions.

Let me put it this way -- but before I do -- let me remind you once again that I am just not a fundamental Baptist, I am an independent Baptist. That means that we do not have anything to do with what some other church did in the past, present, or future -- including other independent Baptist churches. Another poster here, a geologist, had a real problem with that and tried hard to link me to some of the things Luther said and did in the past, and I refused to have any part in any of it. There is no guilt-by-association with us; and he eventually lost a lot of, if not all, respect for me. What can I say?

However, to answer your questions, I will not take responsibility in the hunting, burning and torturing of witches, etc., as those things were done in spite of the Bible, not in respect to It.

Any church on earth can saddle-up and go riding off to liberate Jerusalem from the gentiles, despite what Jesus said about Jerusalem being a melting pot until He personally liberates it Himself -- but just because it was done by order of some church, doesn't mean it was done per order of the Scriptures.

That's fine, AVET. But should I take responsibility for a descision a bureaucrat made, or a design flaw an engineer came up with? How about what a medical doctor prescribed a patient? Or what definitions an astronomer used in categorizing a celestial body? If you want me to take responsibility for all that, than you can take responsibility for witch hunting and all the rest since they were all done in the name of your god. Understand now?

 

[dad]

So, to summarize:
There's evil conspiracies in science.
Demons are seducing our children.
Education is bad.
Technology is unnecessary. (LOLinterwebz)
Missionaries will save this country.
Homosexuality is bad.
Abortion is murder.

Nothing to see here but the usual talking points of fundies.


PS. You forgot that Obama is a Kenyan Muslim.

No, I think ignorance is to blame for the most part, not conspiracy. Of all the things they are ignorant of, demonic influence is included. Education today is largely bad, but it sure is not our salvation! Missionaries will not save your country no. Too late for that. Sodomy and child murder are bad yes. You need to be told that??

 

[dad]

Strange then, the the syptomatic liars are the professional creationists...

How would you know? One first would need to know the truth, for contrast.

Don't you glorify yourself and a book written by men over God, dad? Afterall, the Bible is inerrant and your interpretation of it is also inerrant. Sounds like gods to me...

Nope.

You know, one of these days you are just going to have to lead by example. Let's see you give up all that "damned" technology created by "education of the damned." That island cave is waiting for you dad... if you have the courage of your convictions, that is....

One need not crawl up a crack or cave just because one has no stomach for evil teachings. Really. But for Christians in a so called former Christian country, I almost wonder if some action might be in order. Some form of separation.

I wonder if there was a document something like this, written of course by smarter people, if it would wake some up?

(rough sketch draft)

' We the people of this United States, and the state of [enter state here] do solemnly declare that it is our unalienable right, given by God, to bring up our children in the nurture and trust of God. It is also our express wish that we be free to worship God, in our lives and public life. We declare that the state of [...] is a state where the God of our fathers is a welcome and vibrant part of our lives. Many of our citizens shed their blood in honor of God, to reserve the right for our people to be free to include God in our lives and the lives of our children.

If these rights are threatened directly, in the judgment of of the people of this state, and it's duly elected government, we agree to declare succession from these United States within 48 hours. '


I wonder if 2 or 3, or 10 states signed something like this, whether Christians might flock to those places? Better no country that one gone to the devil, I say!

If I lived there, I would move to such a state. But, hey, we all have our humble little opinion, I suppose.

I guess many are too busy playing church?