DamianWarS

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I just started this topic on my Bible Blog with a view to comparing the various beliefs.... one of the biggest problems I find when people start constructing explanations of passages is that anyone can have a go at it.... and there can be as many 'interpretations' as there are people !

Therefore I have to adopt the LITERAL approach (where possible)..... I am absolutely convinced that the Bible is written to be understood by average humans.... it is counterproductive to suppose that God would communicate in such an obscure way that we would have to 'invent' an interpretation to make a passage agree with our 'conceived storyline'.

The evidence suggests that God talks to humans in plain language so as to ensure both understanding and compliance...... it is us, people, who would want to construct alternative interpretations.... so we could either justify ourselves for non-compliance or at least excuse ourselves for misinterpretation and/or lack of understanding the instructions.

Starting with a literal reading of the text (and only interpreting obvious non-literal parts to fit with the literal parts) has to be the 'proper' approach..... the approach that God expects.... otherwise the Bible has NO 'authority' at all ..... and we can make Bible say whatever we want..... and it's quite obvious to me that many groups of people have done that and are quite happy about it too.

Stephen's Bible Insights

I agree as well but are you sure you know what you've stepped into? If you take the most natural and literal meanings of the text the Holy Spirit still operates as he does in the book of Acts complete with healings, prophecies and tongues. Not all are willing to accept this and cite highly cryptic verses to sweep these manifestations of the Holy Spirit under the first century rug.
 
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Oldmantook

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Then I noticed that many had to ignore certain passages to make their doctrine work.
We have "the nations" and "wrath" and "the time of the judgment of the dead" in Revelation 11:18.
I had never seen anybody really deal with this text. I now know why.
It causes real problems for the premill doctrine.
Could you please elaborate more on why Rev 11:18 causes problems for premill. Thanks
 
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That is a rather dogmatic statement to make .... how can you be so dogon dogmatic ? ..... at best, a human might conclude that 'based on their study of the Bible and their system of prophetic interpretation
Yes. Of course I mean to precede every statement with this kind of disclaimer.
 
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Tayla

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I would merely like to suggest at this point that many Biblical scholars endowed with equal wisdom and understanding have done extensive research and come to completely different conclusions.
Yes. That is my point exactly. Even the experts can't agree at all. This must be explained.
 
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Myychael

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I just started this topic on my Bible Blog with a view to comparing the various beliefs.... one of the biggest problems I find when people start constructing explanations of passages is that anyone can have a go at it.... and there can be as many 'interpretations' as there are people !

Therefore I have to adopt the LITERAL approach (where possible)..... I am absolutely convinced that the Bible is written to be understood by average humans.... it is counterproductive to suppose that God would communicate in such an obscure way that we would have to 'invent' an interpretation to make a passage agree with our 'conceived storyline'.

The evidence suggests that God talks to humans in plain language so as to ensure both understanding and compliance...... it is us, people, who would want to construct alternative interpretations.... so we could either justify ourselves for non-compliance or at least excuse ourselves for misinterpretation and/or lack of understanding the instructions.

Starting with a literal reading of the text (and only interpreting obvious non-literal parts to fit with the literal parts) has to be the 'proper' approach..... the approach that God expects.... otherwise the Bible has NO 'authority' at all ..... and we can make Bible say whatever we want..... and it's quite obvious to me that many groups of people have done that and are quite happy about it too.

Stephen's Bible Insights
 
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Kevin T.

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This is a denial of fundamental Christian doctrine.

What does the Bible say abut itself? The most significant and absolute of these is in the recorded words of our Lord Jesus himself, when He said, “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.” (Matthew 5:17-18) To understand this, we need to know what the jot and the tittle were. These were the two smallest marks used in Hebrew writing. From this, we understand that our Lord was saying that even the tiniest detail of everything written in the Bible was both true and important.

Again Jesus said, “Do not think that I shall accuse you to the Father; there is one who accuses you – Moses, in whom you trust. For if you believed Moses, you would believe Me; for he wrote about Me. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe My words?” (John 5:45-47) Here, our Lord made it very plain that a belief of what Moses said was critical to believing in himself.

This last passage is particularly important in our day, because many people want to say they are Christians, but reject the creation account in the beginning of Genesis. But that account is both a part of “the law,” as Jesus referred to it, and is in one of the five books written by Moses. So both of these statements made by our Lord himself, make it very clear that an absolute belief in these things is a critical part of even being a Christian.

Again, Jesus said “It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.” (Luke 4:4) So Jesus clearly stressed the written Bible as both absolutely accurate in all of its finest details, and critically import to both our beliefs and our lives.

But there is more. For the Apostle Peter wrote that “no prophecy of Scripture is of any private interpretation, for prophecy never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit.” (2 Peter 1:20-21) Then later he also wrote of the epistles of Paul, “as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.” (2 Peter 3:15-16)

So now, in addition to the words of our Lord himself, we have the words of the one Apostle that many consider the most authoritative of them all, clearly stating of all prophecy in the Bible, that it “never came by the will of man, but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit,” and that the writings of Paul were also “Scriptures,” like those of the Old Testament. And he also clearly stated that people who “twist” these Scriptures do it “to their own destruction.”

In this short summary, I have only covered the high points of what the Bible says about itself. But a computer search of the entire Bible showed the following wording to be found in the Bible, as rendered in the NKJV version:

“Thus says the Lord” is found 420 times.
“The Lord spoke” is found 138 times.
“The Lord says” is found 10 times.
“The word of the Lord” is found 262 times. And four of these times add the word “God” to the end, making it “The word of the Lord God.”
“The words of the Lord” is found 19 times.
“The word of God” is found 45 times.
“The words of God” is found 6 times.
“God spoke” is found 12 times.
“God says” is found 6 times.
“The Spirit says” is found 7 times.
“The Spirit said” is found twice.
And finally, “Says the Spirit,” “The word of the Holy One,” and “The words of the Holy One” are each found once.

So “Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.” (Proverbs 30:5-6)

For “I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.” (Revelation 22:18-19) We are thus severely warned against any and all attempts to change or modify anything that our God has told us.

So in conclusion, we need to remember the exhortation Paul gave Timothy. “But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them, and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work.” (2 Timothy 3:14-17)

This is what the Bible says about itself.

When Jesus used the word "Scripture", did He refer to the Old Testament only or the modern Bible that we're using now which consist of Old and New Testament (which wasn't existed yet)?

When Apostle Paul used the word "Scripture", did he refer to the Old Testament only or the modern Bible which included his own words?

Respectfully,
Kevin T.
 
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Kevin T.

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No it isn't.


Fixed that for ya.



You talking about the words that Moses wrote? Notice that Moses was a man.



Once again, Moses was a man. As I said, it's a book written by men.



Er, no. Jesus said that we shall live by "every word of God", not "every word of the Bible". Do you really not understand the difference?



So the prophecies came as men were moved by the Holy Spirit. No argument there. And Paul spoke according to the wisdom given to him. Again, no argument there. Still doesn't say that the Bible was written by God.



Ya. So tell me again, where does it say that the Bible was written by God?






Ya, lots of quotes of the words of God. No argument there. Still don't see where it says the the Bible was written by God.



Ya, every word of God is pure. So tell me again, where does it say that the Bible was written by God?



We are warned against changing any of the prophecy of the book of Revelation, that's true. And remember, prophecy came through men inspired by God. Once again proving that the Bible was written by men. Some of it was inspired by God, yes. Some of it quotes the word of God, yes. Some of it was prophecy directly from God, of course. But it was still written by men.

If it had been written by God it would've been perfect, but as we all know there are many errors and contradictions in the Bible. Mostly insignificant, but errors nonetheless. God would not have made those errors. The Bible was written by men.
And yet, the Bible we read today includes words that were not in the original manuscripts. Couldn't God have prevented that from happening? Of course he could've, but he didn't.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that the Bible is perfect and that all translations are perfect. Even comparing the two most common English versions, KJV and NIV, we can find many differences in meanings. So which one is perfect? Neither.

"I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.
John 16:12‭-‬15 ESV
 
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LastSeven

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"I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.
John 16:12‭-‬15 ESV
?? I'm not sure how that pertains to what I said.
 
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Marilyn C

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I just started this topic on my Bible Blog with a view to comparing the various beliefs.... one of the biggest problems I find when people start constructing explanations of passages is that anyone can have a go at it.... and there can be as many 'interpretations' as there are people !

Therefore I have to adopt the LITERAL approach (where possible)..... I am absolutely convinced that the Bible is written to be understood by average humans.... it is counterproductive to suppose that God would communicate in such an obscure way that we would have to 'invent' an interpretation to make a passage agree with our 'conceived storyline'.

The evidence suggests that God talks to humans in plain language so as to ensure both understanding and compliance...... it is us, people, who would want to construct alternative interpretations.... so we could either justify ourselves for non-compliance or at least excuse ourselves for misinterpretation and/or lack of understanding the instructions.

Starting with a literal reading of the text (and only interpreting obvious non-literal parts to fit with the literal parts) has to be the 'proper' approach..... the approach that God expects.... otherwise the Bible has NO 'authority' at all ..... and we can make Bible say whatever we want..... and it's quite obvious to me that many groups of people have done that and are quite happy about it too.

Stephen's Bible Insights

Hi Stephen,

Pleased to meet you and I had a look at your blog. Interested to read more of what you say, bro.

Now my thoughts as to why there are so many different interpretations is that we are coming from the `whole counsel of God` through the Apostle Paul, (Acts 20: 27) through the `savage wolves` era (v. 29) and on now in the `tossed to and fro stage`(Eph. 4: 14).

However as Kevin has said, it is the Holy Spirit who has led us thus far and He will continue to lead us into all the truth concerning Christ`s character and His Purposes.

We in this day and age are so blessed to have the main doctrines of truth come across the whole Body of Christ. Yes there is error, and that means we need to study and have discernment.

So, personally I see the main stumbling block for people reading God`s word is that they put themselves front and centre. Christ is the centre of God`s word and it behoves us to humble ourselves and see what His purposes are for whom He speaks to -

1. The Nations.
2. Israel.
3. The Body of Christ.

If we have Christ as our focus and what he is doing with those groups, then God`s word becomes very clear.

regards, Marilyn.
 
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Truth7t7

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Hi Stephen,

Pleased to meet you and I had a look at your blog. Interested to read more of what you say, bro.

Now my thoughts as to why there are so many different interpretations is that we are coming from the `whole counsel of God` through the Apostle Paul, (Acts 20: 27) through the `savage wolves` era (v. 29) and on now in the `tossed to and fro stage`(Eph. 4: 14).

However as Kevin has said, it is the Holy Spirit who has led us thus far and He will continue to lead us into all the truth concerning Christ`s character and His Purposes.

We in this day and age are so blessed to have the main doctrines of truth come across the whole Body of Christ. Yes there is error, and that means we need to study and have discernment.

So, personally I see the main stumbling block for people reading God`s word is that they put themselves front and centre. Christ is the centre of God`s word and it behoves us to humble ourselves and see what His purposes are for whom He speaks to -

1. The Nations.
2. Israel.
3. The Body of Christ.

If we have Christ as our focus and what he is doing with those groups, then God`s word becomes very clear.

regards, Marilyn.
Nations represent the unsaved world.

Israel represents in Romans 9:6-8 The Church.

The body of Christ represents the Church.
 
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Stephen Mendes

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Hi Marilyn,

Thanks for your personal note to me and your interest in what I have to say.

In response to 'many others on this thread'

The idea that the Church replaces Israel .... and that all the promises made to Israel may now be 'appropriated' by Christians.... is a fundamental error or great proportions.... and will lead to many distortions of other passages.

I can assure you that persons who read the entire Bible without such 'preconceived ideas already implanted in their minds' come to no such conclusion.

God has..... present tense... a purpose for Israel..... and will YET be GLORIFIED in them (future events)..... why ?

Men (man).... the human race.... have free will and can do what they wish..... but when God makes unconditional statements about 'how it is going to go down'.... you can be sure.... it will go down that way (no matter how impossible or improbable that may appear)

The failure of men does not nullify the purposes of God... God will ultimately be glorified by men (mortal men) and on this Earth.... the remnant Jews will eventually fulfill the function that God has for them to do.

Really to argue otherwise ..... makes the purposes of God subject to the 'whims of man'.... sorry folks.... the Sovereign God and His eternal purposes..... who has stated that He will not share His Glory..... and that every knee will bow and every tongue confess to Him... who sent Jonah back to Nineveh (in spite of his 'free will' and rebellion)..... this awesome God is fully able to do what He said.... no matter what people say or how they get on.

At the end of the day.... dear readers.... all human rebellion does is spoil the blessed peace and quality of life that would have come about had spontaneous obedience ensued.

People just don't get it.... that their pride and arrogance and self-will and rebellion only hurts THEM and maybe the rest of humanity (depending on how much influence they have on human affairs)

The Great God "who of the stones can raise up children unto Abraham" is neither surprised or alarmed by what 'men... man... anybody' may do.

I would even venture to suggest that much of these attempts to transfer Jewish promises to 'the Church' are simply manifested antisemitism.

Many Christians just cannot see how God could elevate a 'group of people' who reject and nationally hate Jesus Christ ..... when they themselves, believe they are ever so righteous and beloved of God..... so naturally they are eager to transfer all Jewish 'benefits' to themselves.

Sadly lots of Christians have a very inadequate view of GOD..... they have molded the transcendent, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent and eternal GOD into a 'more manageable image' which accords with their beliefs, desires and capacity to understand Him and His actions.

Please don't let this be you.... dear reader..... because God reveals Himself to the contrite and the humble....
cry to Him to bring about these qualities in you through the Holy Spirit and He will do it.

Believe me humans cannot make themselves humble and contrite..... in fact these divine qualities are rejected by almost everybody on the planet.... they are not even desired among Christians.... yet in God's eyes they are important and if you are serious about knowing God..... well I have said enough..... Goodbye and God Bless
 
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BABerean2

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The Great God "who of the stones can raise up children unto Abraham" is neither surprised or alarmed by what 'men... man... anybody' may do.

I would even venture to suggest that much of these attempts to transfer Jewish promises to 'the Church' are simply manifested antisemitism.

Many Christians just cannot see how God could elevate a 'group of people' who reject and nationally hate Jesus Christ ..... when they themselves, believe they are ever so righteous and beloved of God..... so naturally they are eager to transfer all Jewish 'benefits' to themselves.

What did John the Baptist tell his own people?

Mat 3:9 And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.


The most antisemitic thing we can do is to not share the Gospel with a race of people, because we think their time of salvation comes in the future.
Meanwhile thousands die each year without Christ.



.
 
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Davy

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....
In response to 'many others on this thread'

The idea that the Church replaces Israel .... and that all the promises made to Israel may now be 'appropriated' by Christians.... is a fundamental error or great proportions.... and will lead to many distortions of other passages.

Nor should Jews, whether orthodox or believing, think that they only are the receivers of God's promises He made long ago involving The Gospel. The Biblical fact is that God's Birthright promises in final fell upon Ephraim (1 Chron.5), and Ephraim was prophesied to become "a multitude of nations" (Gen.48). Clearly that "multitude of nations" is not referring to the lands of Israel with that single nation.

I can assure you that persons who read the entire Bible without such 'preconceived ideas already implanted in their minds' come to no such conclusion.

The actual preconceived notion is with what I find in this post that kind of suggests that God's promises didn't fall upon the Christian Church once the Jews in Jerusalem rejected Christ Jesus. Just because it did... happen doesn't mean Judah lost all the promises God gave them. But truly, they did lose many of those promises by rebelling against The Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Yet God promised He would always leave one tribe in Jerusalem for the sake of His servant David, and for Jerusalem (1 Kings 11). That is what today's nation of Israel in the middleast is about, and it will not include the returning ten tribes of Israel being joined with Judah until Jesus returns (Ezek.37).

God has..... present tense... a purpose for Israel..... and will YET be GLORIFIED in them (future events)..... why ?

Men (man).... the human race.... have free will and can do what they wish..... but when God makes unconditional statements about 'how it is going to go down'.... you can be sure.... it will go down that way (no matter how impossible or improbable that may appear)

Amen to that.

The failure of men does not nullify the purposes of God... God will ultimately be glorified by men (mortal men) and on this Earth.... the remnant Jews will eventually fulfill the function that God has for them to do.

But let's not leave out the scattered ten tribes of the northern kingdom of Israel that never returned to the holy land as a people, and are still scattered today, yet do not call theirselves by the title of Jew. (The title of Jew the Jewish historian Josephus said is the title the small remnant returning from the 70 years Babylon captivity took, and all in the land of Judah took that title also. It never applied to all... the tribes of Israel, but only to the kingdom of Judah in the south which were made up of the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, Levi, and some small remnants of the ten tribes which left the north and sided with Judah. These things are confirmed by Bible history and Bible prophecy involving the eventual return of the ten tribes when Jesus comes.

Apostle Paul in Romans 9, when speaking to Gentile Romans, even quoted from the Book of Hosea involving the return of Ephraim and the ten tribes...

Hos 1:10-11
10 Yet the number of the children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered; and it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, 'Ye are not My people', there it shall be said unto them, 'Ye are the sons of the living God.'


11 Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

KJV


Paul quoted that passage from Hosea about the children of Israel to Gentile Roman Christians...


Rom 9:25-26
25 As He saith also in Osee, "I will call them My people, which were not My people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, 'Ye are not My people'; there shall they be called the children of the living God."
KJV



When Apostle Paul quoted that Hosea passage to Christian Romans, that made the return of Ephraim (ten tribes) a link to The Gospel and Christian Church involving God's promises. It's because like Paul also taught, there is no difference between Jew and Gentile in Christ's future Kingdom (Romans 10:12).
 
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LastSeven

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"... When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth... "
Again, you're being vague. Rather than just quoting scripture, can you explain in your own words what you're trying to say in regards to my point above? I can't even tell if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing.
 
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Truth7t7

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I would even venture to suggest that much of these attempts to transfer Jewish promises to 'the Church' are simply manifested antisemitism.

Many Christians just cannot see how God could elevate a 'group of people' who reject and nationally hate Jesus Christ ..... when they themselves, believe they are ever so righteous and beloved of God..... so naturally they are eager to transfer all Jewish 'benefits' to themselves.

Sadly lots of Christians have a very inadequate view of GOD..... they have molded the transcendent, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent and eternal GOD into a 'more manageable image' which accords with their beliefs, desires and capacity to understand Him and His actions.

Please don't let this be you.... dear reader..... because God reveals Himself to the contrite and the humble....
cry to Him to bring about these qualities in you through the Holy Spirit and He will do it.

Believe me humans cannot make themselves humble and contrite..... in fact these divine qualities are rejected by almost everybody on the planet.... they are not even desired among Christians.... yet in God's eyes they are important and if you are serious about knowing God..... well I have said enough..... Goodbye and God Bless
You "Claim/Suggest" bible believing Christians are "Antisemitic" if they don't see things your way?

The Church is the Israel of God, Children Of The Promised Seed, Romans 9:6-8

The remnant Jew will be "Added To This Church" through faith in Jesus Christ and become the Israel of God also. Romans 11

Nothing "Antisemitic" about God's truth.

The Church received a Messiah who walked in Jewish Flesh, Apostles Who Were All Jews, How Could You "Claim/Suggest" These Bible Believers Are "Antisemitic"?

"The Church" has inherited the covenants, promises, and blessings through faith in Jesus Christ, and is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed.

Jesus Christ Is The Lord

Truth7t7
 
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Marilyn C

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"The Church" has inherited the covenants and blessings through faith in Jesus Christ, and is the Israel of God, children of the promised seed.

Hi bro,

Sounds like you think God had to go to plan B because His first plan didn`t work?????

Marilyn.
 
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Marilyn C

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Hi Marilyn,

Thanks for your personal note to me and your interest in what I have to say.

In response to 'many others on this thread'

The idea that the Church replaces Israel .... and that all the promises made to Israel may now be 'appropriated' by Christians.... is a fundamental error or great proportions.... and will lead to many distortions of other passages.

I can assure you that persons who read the entire Bible without such 'preconceived ideas already implanted in their minds' come to no such conclusion.

God has..... present tense... a purpose for Israel..... and will YET be GLORIFIED in them (future events)..... why ?

Men (man).... the human race.... have free will and can do what they wish..... but when God makes unconditional statements about 'how it is going to go down'.... you can be sure.... it will go down that way (no matter how impossible or improbable that may appear)

The failure of men does not nullify the purposes of God... God will ultimately be glorified by men (mortal men) and on this Earth.... the remnant Jews will eventually fulfill the function that God has for them to do.

Really to argue otherwise ..... makes the purposes of God subject to the 'whims of man'.... sorry folks.... the Sovereign God and His eternal purposes..... who has stated that He will not share His Glory..... and that every knee will bow and every tongue confess to Him... who sent Jonah back to Nineveh (in spite of his 'free will' and rebellion)..... this awesome God is fully able to do what He said.... no matter what people say or how they get on.

At the end of the day.... dear readers.... all human rebellion does is spoil the blessed peace and quality of life that would have come about had spontaneous obedience ensued.

People just don't get it.... that their pride and arrogance and self-will and rebellion only hurts THEM and maybe the rest of humanity (depending on how much influence they have on human affairs)

The Great God "who of the stones can raise up children unto Abraham" is neither surprised or alarmed by what 'men... man... anybody' may do.

I would even venture to suggest that much of these attempts to transfer Jewish promises to 'the Church' are simply manifested antisemitism.

Many Christians just cannot see how God could elevate a 'group of people' who reject and nationally hate Jesus Christ ..... when they themselves, believe they are ever so righteous and beloved of God..... so naturally they are eager to transfer all Jewish 'benefits' to themselves.

Sadly lots of Christians have a very inadequate view of GOD..... they have molded the transcendent, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent and eternal GOD into a 'more manageable image' which accords with their beliefs, desires and capacity to understand Him and His actions.

Please don't let this be you.... dear reader..... because God reveals Himself to the contrite and the humble....
cry to Him to bring about these qualities in you through the Holy Spirit and He will do it.

Believe me humans cannot make themselves humble and contrite..... in fact these divine qualities are rejected by almost everybody on the planet.... they are not even desired among Christians.... yet in God's eyes they are important and if you are serious about knowing God..... well I have said enough..... Goodbye and God Bless

Hi Stephen,

Great truths there bro. Well said, and look forward to more of your writings in your blogs.

regards, Marilyn.
 
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LastSeven

Amil
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I would even venture to suggest that much of these attempts to transfer Jewish promises to 'the Church' are simply manifested antisemitism.
That is such a load of bull and an insult too. I'm so sick and tired of people claiming "anti-semitism" just because some of us see a different message in scripture than you do. Your stance is anti-Christ to begin with since you seem to believe the Jews don't need Christ, that they're saved on the basis of their lineage alone, which is anti-scriptural and then on top of that you accuse us of anti-semitism? You have some nerve.
 
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I would even venture to suggest that much of these attempts to transfer Jewish promises to 'the Church' are simply manifested antisemitism.
Here is what one particularly notable Individual in Scripture had to say about some Semites:

John 8
39 They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.
41 Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do.



He is also the Heir of all of the promises, Jewish and otherwise; is the Head of His Church, Abraham's seed; and shares His promises with it:

2 Corinthians 1
20 For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.

Hebrews 1
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Galatians 3
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.
 
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