Many Christian Denominations promote "all TEN" not "Just Ellen White"

[SabbathBlessings]

No that would be incorrect. The reason I debate these threads is to present the evidence for others so that they don't make the same mistake. The apostles established the churches for a reason. It wasn’t their idea, it was God’s.

Yes and what did Jesus tell them? Matthew 28:20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.

Please show me where Jesus told them to disobey the commandment of God and make a new holy day of worship. Jesus told them to obey all things Jesus commanded, not new things. That's why you can't find in scripture where we are told the first day is a new holy day. That's why the first day will not be the day of worship in the Heaven or New Earth Isaiah 66:23. You seem to want to disregard the commandments of God and teachings of Jesus to hold on to a tradition that is not backed up by scripture? Something Jesus warned us about. Matthew 15:3-9

 

[SabbathBlessings]

But Paul mentioned those separately from the Sabbath Day, right?

“Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:16-17‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

It is addressed in post #57. There are two sabbaths in the bible. There is no mention of food or drink in the 4th commandment. We see the Sabbath as God's chosen day of worship forever Isaiah 66:23. Col 2:14-17 refers to an ordinance not a commandment and is referring the the Sabbath(s) feast days that is about food and drink and is an ordinance in the Law of Moses. I would not recommend using this verse to try to wipe out a commandment of God. God's will is the same for us in heaven as it is on the earth.

Which day is God's holy day? Please provide scripture..

 

[BNR32FAN]

God's laws written in the heart and mind which of course includes the 4th commandment. Jer. 31:33, Hebrews 8:10. Jesus and the disciples keeping the Sabbath as our example. And right in Hebrews says there remains the Sabbath keeping for the people of God.
"He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: 'And God rested on the seventh day from all His works.' There remains therefore a rest ["keeping of a sabbath," margin] for the people of God. For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His" (Hebrews 4:4, 9, 10).

We see the future application of this as well Isaiah 66:23

Hope this helps. God bless

Should’ve started with verse 3 instead of verse 4. Then you might’ve understood what He meant by rest. Honestly I think you strategically omitted verse 3 that was specifically about entering into His rest.

“For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said, “As I swore in My wrath, They shall not enter My rest,” although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:3‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

His rest has nothing to do with the Saturday Sabbath. It’s a reference to resting from works.

“For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:10‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Should’ve started with verse 3 instead of verse 4. Then you might’ve understood what He meant by rest. Honestly I think you strategically omitted verse 3 that was specifically about entering into His rest.

“For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said, “As I swore in My wrath, They shall not enter My rest,” although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:3‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

His rest has nothing to do with the Saturday Sabbath. It’s a reference to resting from works.

“For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4:10‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

There are two rests being referred to. I was referring to the Sabbath keeping rest which is why I quoted it. The other rest that is referred to is the rest we receive in Christ when we keep the Sabbath commandment.

This is the rest we receive in Christ when we obey:

Hebrews 4:2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said:
“So I swore in My wrath,
‘They shall not enter My rest,’ ”
although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

This is the seventh day Sabbath rest:
Hebrews 4:4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”

Why did the Israelites not receive Christs rest?

Ezekiel 20:13 Yet the house of Israel rebelled against Me in the wilderness; they did not walk in My statutes; they despised My judgments, ‘which, if a man does, he shall live by them’; and they greatly defiled My Sabbaths.

Hebrews 4:6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience,

Hebrews 4:9 There remains therefore a rest (Sabbath keeping) for the people of God.

We do not receive the blessing God gives by disobeying. If we want to receive the rest in Christ we should not make the same mistake the Israelites made by profaning God's holy Sabbath day.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Please show me where Jesus told them to disobey the commandment of God and make a new holy day of worship.

Please show me where Jesus said we no longer need to observe the Passover that God said must be observed for all generations. Please show me where He said we no longer need to be circumcised. Please show me where He said we are saved by grace which is one of the biggest messages in the NT. And yet Jesus never once mentioned it.

 

[BNR32FAN]

The other rest that is referred to is the rest we receive in Christ when we keep the Sabbath commandment.

You mean when we believe. That’s what the author said in verse 3. Not when we keep the Sabbath. For we who have believed enter into that rest, not for we who have kept the Sabbath commandment enter into that rest.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

You mean when we believe. That’s what the author said in verse 3. Not when we keep the Sabbath. For we who have believed enter into that rest, not for we who have kept the Sabbath commandment enter into that rest.

The example this text used why the Iserlites did not enter into Christ rest was that they disobeyed. When we believe do we obey or disobey?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Please show me where Jesus said we no longer need to observe the Passover that God said must be observed for all generations. Please show me where He said we no longer need to be circumcised. Please show me where He said we are saved by grace which is one of the biggest messages in the NT. And yet Jesus never once mentioned it.

Are you trying to make a case why we can disobey a commandment of God? This is not the approach I would take but we have free will.

 

[BobRyan]

Please show me where Jesus said we no longer need to observe the Passover that God said must be observed for all generations. .

1 Cor 5 "Christ our Passover has been slain"
Heb 7 "a change in Law regarding the priesthood" takes Place at the cross.
Heb 8:4 "If He (Christ) were on Earth He would not be a priest at all"
Heb 10:4-11 "He takes AWAY the first (animal sacrifice and offerings) to establish the second (the sacrifice of Christ once for all)"

 

[BobRyan]

Please show me where He said we no longer need to be circumcised. .

There was never a mandate in OT or NT that gentiles must be circumcised, that was an "invention" of the Christian Jews in the NT - even the non-Christian Jews did not have that rule.

 

[BobRyan]

Please show me where He said we are saved by grace which is one of the biggest messages in the NT. And yet Jesus never once mentioned it.

Heb 11
5 By faith Enoch was taken away so that he did not see death, “and was not found, because God had taken him”; for before he was taken he had this testimony, that he pleased God. 6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

7 By faith Noah, being divinely warned of things not yet seen, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark for the saving of his household, by which he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness which is according to faith.

8 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them, embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 14 For those who say such things declare plainly that they seek a homeland. 15 And truly if they had called to mind that country from which they had come out, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 But now they desire a better, that is, a heavenly country. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them.


The Faith of Moses
23 By faith Moses, when he was born, was hidden three months by his parents, because they saw he was a beautiful child; and they were not afraid of the king’s command.

24 By faith Moses, when he became of age, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh’s daughter, 25 choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God than to enjoy the passing pleasures of sin, 26 esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt; for he looked to the reward.


The Gospel includes the teaching that we are "saved BY FAITH through Grace" Eph 2:8 - and "The GOSPEL was preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8

 

[BobRyan]

But Paul mentioned those separately from the Sabbath Day, right?

“Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.”
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2:16-17‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Lev 23 annual Sabbath days were shadow types "given in animal sacrifice" pointing forward to Christ "Christ our Passover has been sacrificed" 1 Cor 5. By contrast the weekly Sabbath was given in Gen 2:1-3 when it was "sanctified" - 'made holy' set apart for holy use as Exodus 20:11 points out. A memorial of creation - a past event.

 

[BNR32FAN]

The example this text used why the Iserlites did not enter into Christ rest was that they disobeyed. When we believe do we obey or disobey?

Their unbelief was their disobedience. That’s why He said those who believe enter into His rest, because they are not being disobedient by not believing.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Their unbelief was their disobedience. That’s why He said those who believe enter into His rest, because they are not being disobedient by not believing.

Ezekiel 20:13 Yet the house of Israel rebelled against Me in the wilderness; they did not walk in My statutes; they despised My judgments, ‘which, if a man does, he shall live by them’; and they greatly defiled My Sabbaths.

Hebrews 4:6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience,

This seems pretty clear to me. If you believe do you obey or disobey what God tells us? When God says Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy, do we believe Him?

 

[BNR32FAN]

Are you trying to make a case why we can disobey a commandment of God? This is not the approach I would take but we have free will.

No I just made a point that Jesus didn’t specifically mention everything we believe today about the gospel, nor about the Sabbath. You asked me to show you where He said that we no longer have to keep the Sabbath. I showed you where Paul said we don’t have to keep it so it really doesn’t matter if Jesus said we don’t have to if Paul said we don’t.

 

[BNR32FAN]

1 Cor 5 "Christ our Passover has been slain"
Heb 7 "a change in Law regarding the priesthood" takes Place at the cross.
Heb 8:4 "If He (Christ) were on Earth He would not be a priest at all"
Heb 10:4-11 "He takes AWAY the first (animal sacrifice and offerings) to establish the second (the sacrifice of Christ once for all)"

Yes I absolutely agree but my point was that Jesus Himself didn’t mention every doctrine in Christianity. Jesus didn’t tell us that we no longer need to observe the Passover, Paul did. Just like Jesus didn’t tell us that we don’t have to observe the Sabbath but Paul did.

 

[BNR32FAN]

There was never a mandate in OT or NT that gentiles must be circumcised, that was an "invention" of the Christian Jews in the NT - even the non-Christian Jews did not have that rule.

God’s commandment to Abraham said that any foreigners living among them must also be circumcised.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

No I just made a point that Jesus didn’t specifically mention everything we believe today about the gospel, nor about the Sabbath. You asked me to show you where He said that we no longer have to keep the Sabbath. I showed you where Paul said we don’t have to keep it so it really doesn’t matter if Jesus said we don’t have to if Paul said we don’t.

I’m sorry I don’t see the point. I don’t think the one commandment God said to Remember is the one commandment God wants us to forget- the holy day of the Lord thy God that will continue forever as promised Exodus 31:16 for eternity Isaiah 66:23

I must have missed that quote where Paul deleted the 4th commandment. Paul tells us what matters is keeping the commandments of God 1 Cor 7:19 and Paul also preached on the Sabbath as his custom and the custom of Jesus Luke 4:16

I don’t see in scripture where God blessed any other day aside from the seventh day. In the Bible it is the only day God claims as His holy day from the beginning before sin Genesis 2:1-3 to eternity after sin Isaiah 66:23 and everywhere in between. God changes not.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Heb 11
5 By faith Enoch was taken away so that he did not see death, “and was not found, because God had taken him”; for before he was taken he had this testimony, that he pleased God. 6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

7 By faith Noah, being divinely warned of things not yet seen, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark for the saving of his household, by which he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness which is according to faith.

8 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out

13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them, embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 14 For those who say such things declare plainly that they seek a homeland. 15 And truly if they had called to mind that country from which they had come out, they would have had opportunity to return. 16 But now they desire a better, that is, a heavenly country. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for He has prepared a city for them.


The Faith of Moses
23 By faith Moses, when he was born, was hidden three months by his parents, because they saw he was a beautiful child; and they were not afraid of the king’s command.

24 By faith Moses, when he became of age, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh’s daughter, 25 choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God than to enjoy the passing pleasures of sin, 26 esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt; for he looked to the reward.


The Gospel includes the teaching that we are "saved BY FAITH through Grace" Eph 2:8 - and "The GOSPEL was preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8

My point was that Jesus never mentioned this. I know it is mentioned in the epistles.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Ezekiel 20:13 Yet the house of Israel rebelled against Me in the wilderness; they did not walk in My statutes; they despised My judgments, ‘which, if a man does, he shall live by them’; and they greatly defiled My Sabbaths.

Hebrews 4:6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience,

This seems pretty clear to me. If you believe do you obey or disobey what God tells us? When God says Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy, do we believe Him?

Their disobedience included lack of faith, lack of compassion, and idolatry as well. The Israelites were disobedient in more ways than one.