Make Politics Boring Again

[rambot]

Imagine if:
*you could wake up and the news talked about anything else
*your president didn't do something you couldn't comprehend OR you didn't have to justify to people who disagree with you
*there wasn't an "investigation" into someone connected in ANY way to the oval office
*a president's twitter account didn't say something weird
*your president didn't do something confounding
*the press wasn't absolutely blowing up because of it
*people from other countries didn't really care too much about average americans
*There were, less say, 40% less comments, posts, tweets, whathaveyou that are not related to conspiratorial who-ha
*your president was so boring, all he did was his job

American politics, both at the political level and the civilian level of discussion feels (as an outsider) just incredibly angry, toxic and frustrated. IT was not AWESOME 4 years ago, but it is so much worse now. It makes 100% sense that this president would be the one to wake those sleeping giants. Trump supporters are tired of all the vitriole he receives. His critics are tired of his terrible behaviours being ignored or brushed as nothing, or celebrated.

I bet it would be real treat for more than a few Americans if things down there just dialed back from, say a 9.8...down to a 7.5 or 8.


Do you think America can ever get back to that again?

 

[Strathos]

Probably not.

 

[Tanj]

Well, he made America Grate Again, so there is that.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Well, he made America Grate Again, so there is that.

Cheese indeed.

 

[KCfromNC]

This was one of the things I saw in the debate. There was a stark contrast between someone who has actual thoughts and plans vs. the incumbent just making stuff up as he went along.

 

[Albion]

Do you think America can ever get back to that again?

No.

At least not for a long time.

Why do I say that? Because it's worked so well for the obstructionists who vowed to overthrow the elected government and, while not succeeding at that, did have a lot of success in hamstringing the people who have been trying to run the ordinary and necessary business of the country.

Even if they sweep the November elections, there will still remain the next stage to work on--the creation of a one-party government that will secure that victory for decades to come.

 

[rambot]

No.

At least not for a long time.

Why do I say that? Because it's worked so well for the obstructionists who vowed to overthrow the elected government and, while not succeeding at that, did have a lot of success in hamstringing the people who have been trying to run the ordinary and necessary business of the country.

Even if they sweep the November elections, there will still remain the next stage to work on--the creation of a one-party government that will secure that victory for decades to come.

It is not rational to blame only one party on what we are seeing. I made an EXPLICIT effort to reach out and sympathize with Trump supporter's frustrations.

It's not surprising but disappointing that the same couldn't be offerred back.

 

[Albion]

It is not rational to blame only one party on what we are seeing.

I disagree. We may blame them both when it comes to certain things, but not when it concerns the issue your post dealt with.

I made an EXPLICIT effort to reach out and sympathize with Trump supporter's frustrations.

It's not surprising but disappointing that the same couldn't be offerred back.

There really wasn't much to offer back when one side has deliberately and unashamedly done everything within its ability to turn the country upside down during the last four years and their adversaries have not been part of that campaign.

Beyond that, the list in your post (the OP) consisted mainly of denunciations of the President. Not entirely, but mainly. There was no balance and no "explicit effort to reach out and sympathize with Trump supporters" there.

 

[Yttrium]

Ah.

I remember the days when not a single mention of POTUS went by in the news for weeks at a time.

Trump manages to say or do or tweet something newsworthy every single day, and not in a good way. He certainly makes things exciting, in pretty much the same way a train wreck makes things exciting.

No.

At least not for a long time.

Why do I say that? Because it's worked so well for the obstructionists who vowed to overthrow the elected government and, while not succeeding at that, did have a lot of success in hamstringing the people who have been trying to run the ordinary and necessary business of the country.

Even if they sweep the November elections, there will still remain the next stage to work on--the creation of a one-party government that will secure that victory for decades to come.

Darn those obstructionists who are trying to overthrow the government and create a one-party government. If I ever meet any of them, I'll give them an earful. I don't know of any, but if you say they're out there somewhere, then they must be. I mean, you're not the type to create a demonized straw man, are you? Surely not.

 

[Albion]

Darn those obstructionists who are trying to overthrow the government and create a one-party government.

The future of democracy and freedom in your country is sort of a joke, then?

 

[driewerf]

The future of democracy and freedom in your country is sort of a joke, then?

No, and that's why Trump needs to be removed from office.

• he has called the press "the enemy of the people many times
• he has promised/threatened to open up libel laws to go after the press, the NYT and the WaPo by name: https://www.politico.com/blogs/on-media/2016/02/donald-trump-libel-laws-2198667

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1037302649199177728

• he is calling his followers to intimidate voters who come vote in person, while sowing doubt about vote by mail. (
• Made coments that at leastcould be a threat for violence if Clinton had won the election:"If Hillary Clinton gets elected, I think she's going to decimate the Second Amendment, if not abolish it, " he said. "And she'll do that through judges, through the justices of the Supreme Court. But the Second Amendment people have tremendous power because they are so united."

Trump: 'Second Amendment people' could stop Clinton

• Trump:I'm urging my supporters to go into the polls and watch very carefully. Because that's what has to happen. I am urging them to do it. As you know, today, there was a big problem. In Philadelphia they went in to watch. They were called poll watchers -- a very safe, very nice thing. They were thrown out. They weren't allowed to watch. You know why? Because bad things happen in Philadelphia, bad things. And I -- I am urging -- I am urging my people. I hope it's going to be a fair election. If it's a fair election...

Donald Trump's worst moment of the 1st debate (that you probably missed) - CNNPolitics

And then, there is of course the "Stand back and stand by"
So indeed, you democracy is in danger.

 

[Albion]

No, and that's why Trump needs to be removed from office.

I still favor free elections and Constitutional government.

 

[driewerf]

I still favor free elections and Constitutional government.

And Trump is a threat to all that.

 

[rambot]

I disagree. We may blame them both when it comes to certain things, but not when it concerns the issue your post dealt with.

You may disagree but you provide a poor argument.

There really wasn't much to offer back when one side has deliberately and unashamedly done everything within its ability to turn the country upside down during the last four years and their adversaries have not been part of that campaign.

This argument is conflating "Trump=America". That is not healthy, nor a correct way to view your leadership.

You may be frustrated that only several people were jailed due to the Mueller report. But it's crazy that you aren't up in arms by the fact that several people were jailed due to the outcomes of the Mueller report. And that is NOTHING but your point of view. Those people broke laws and you are excusing them.
What kind of world is that?

Trump's critics have not done anything to "turn the country upside down"; They are critiquing Trump and showing the world what he does. But AGAIN....conflating Trump with "the country.

Sometimes they are shining a light on what he does. Sometimes we roll our eyes at the childish nonsense he participates in. That seems to be a serious problem for some people. I don't know what to say about that. Republicans and right wingers freaked out over Obama's tan suit. Democrats and left wingers freaked out about trump saying he grabs women by the genitals. I guess it's a matter of priority, isn't it?

Beyond that, the list in your post (the OP) consisted mainly of denunciations of the President. Not entirely, but mainly. There was no balance and no "explicit effort to reach out and sympathize with Trump supporters" there.

First...what you call "denunciations" are actually "described behaviours". And there is the ultimate problem. I'm not willing to excuse ANY human from some of the things I've seen Trump do. His supporters are willing to do that.

Second, I never claimed nor would I feel able to be "balanced" in terms of what it would take to make American politics more boring. Tell me, short of "the left shutting up and stop complaining when Trump breaks laws" what you think left leaners would need to do to make politics more boring in the US.

I don't think that my list is exhaustive...feel free to add to it.

Here's what I said that was at LEAST bipartisan
*your president didn't do something you couldn't comprehend OR you didn't have to justify to people who disagree with you
*the press wasn't absolutely blowing up because of it
*you could wake up and the news talked about anything else
"Trump supporters are tired of all the vitriole he receives."

Specific to the bolded parts: Do you, as a supporter of Trump, NOT get frustrated by what I said here?

 

[rambot]

The future of democracy and freedom in your country is sort of a joke, then?

Well, it's certainly more important than ensuring Trump's ego remains unbruised.

 

[rambot]

No, and that's why Trump needs to be removed from office.

• he has called the press "the enemy of the people many times
• he has promised/threatened to open up libel laws to go after the press, the NYT and the WaPo by name: https://www.politico.com/blogs/on-media/2016/02/donald-trump-libel-laws-2198667

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1037302649199177728

• he is calling his followers to intimidate voters who come vote in person, while sowing doubt about vote by mail. (
• Made coments that at leastcould be a threat for violence if Clinton had won the election:"If Hillary Clinton gets elected, I think she's going to decimate the Second Amendment, if not abolish it, " he said. "And she'll do that through judges, through the justices of the Supreme Court. But the Second Amendment people have tremendous power because they are so united."

Trump: 'Second Amendment people' could stop Clinton

• Trump:I'm urging my supporters to go into the polls and watch very carefully. Because that's what has to happen. I am urging them to do it. As you know, today, there was a big problem. In Philadelphia they went in to watch. They were called poll watchers -- a very safe, very nice thing. They were thrown out. They weren't allowed to watch. You know why? Because bad things happen in Philadelphia, bad things. And I -- I am urging -- I am urging my people. I hope it's going to be a fair election. If it's a fair election...

Donald Trump's worst moment of the 1st debate (that you probably missed) - CNNPolitics

And then, there is of course the "Stand back and stand by"
So indeed, you democracy is in danger.

Beautiful post. Again, it does seem that his supporters don't really notice what he is doing.

 

[Pommer]

Cheese indeed.

Plural, (out loud)

 

[Albion]

You may disagree but you provide a poor argument.

Are you seriously saying to me that your post did not list a number of complaints about the President and none in particular about his opponents, and then say, in the next post, that you had made an "explicit effort to reach out and sympathize with Trump supporters"?

Let me just run the specifics by you in black and white so there is no misunderstanding the point.--

*your president didn't do something you couldn't comprehend OR you didn't have to justify to people who disagree with you
*there wasn't an "investigation" into someone connected in ANY way to the oval office

*a president's twitter account didn't say something weird
*your president didn't do something confounding
*the press wasn't absolutely blowing up because of it

*people from other countries didn't really care too much about average americans
*There were, less say, 40% less comments, posts, tweets, whathaveyou that are not related to conspiratorial who-ha

*your president was so boring, all he did was his job

 

[Goonie]

I still favor free elections and Constitutional government.

Whilst voting and supporting someone who promises the exact opposite.

 

[rambot]

Are you seriously saying to me that your post did not list a number of complaints about the President and none in particular about his opponents, and then say, in the next post, that you had made an "explicit effort to reach out and sympathize with Trump supporters"?

Let me just run the specifics by you in black and white so there is no misunderstanding the point.--

Were you so incensed you didn't read the rest of my posts? Yes, I recognize several of them were critical of Trump. Guess what? I get to say those things. Because they are.....(and I know this will be hard to hear...) LEGITIMATE complaints.

And YES I pretty clearly listed (in my second post) examples to sympathize with Trump supporters.
So I'm really not sure where your incredulity is coming from.

I would also posit that you are conflating some of my "bipartisan" comments as critical of Trump when they TRULY are not. Example:
*the press wasn't absolutely blowing up because of it [who isn't tired of the press doing this?]
*people from other countries didn't really care too much about average americans [nothing EVEN REMOTELY tried to Trump with this]
*There were, less say, 40% less comments, posts, tweets, whathaveyou that are not related to conspiratorial who-ha [I'm not referring to Trump here though I am referring to people who tend to support him. But, if I am to respond to the CONTENT of your post, we are discussing the president and his opponents NOT the president's supporters.

None of these are actually directed at Trump in ANY way.

If we need to do this, here is how I would break down my comments:

*your president didn't do something you couldn't comprehend [critical of Trump]
*your president didn't do something confounding [Trump critical]
*there wasn't an "investigation" into someone connected in ANY way to the oval office [100%, and unabashadly Trump critical...also, factual]
*a president's twitter account didn't say something weird [100%, and unabashadly Trump critical...also, factual]

*There were, less say, 40% less comments, posts, tweets, whathaveyou that are not related to conspiratorial who-ha [critical of Trump supporters]

*people from other countries didn't really care too much about average americans [Not Trump]
*you could wake up and the news talked about anything else [critical of news media]
*the press wasn't absolutely blowing up because of it [news media critical]

"Trump supporters are tired of all the vitriole he receives." [DIRECTLY critical of Trump's critics]
*....OR you didn't have to justify to people who disagree with you" [empathizing with Trump supporters having to justify it]
*your president was so boring, all he did was his job [You could argue it's Trump specific for sure, but not necessarily exclusively]

So as I see it:
4 directly critical of Trump
1 that is mostly critical of Trump but not necessarily exclusively
1 critical of his supporters
2 critical of news media
1 (who knows?)
2 that CLEARLY are empathizing

Honestly, I really don't see what is so shocking a bout that. I still think it's reasonably leveled. But I am MORE curious how you understood those sentiments because you seem to have got something very different out of them.