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KJV Bible verses that may make you scratch your head in wonder

Discussion in 'Christian Scriptures' started by The Parson, May 17, 2020.

  1. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    I know I've mentioned this before but I gave a church tour talking about the Christian faith and went to Q&A. "Do you all still worship Zeus?", "What makes you different from other Protestants?" Sigh, There are two kinds of people - Greeks, and everyone else who wish they was Greek. (Although to be honest, I'm a convert, but after 18 years, I figure I can claim some kind of citizenship status :p )

    I've been listening to a "A History of Philosophy Without Any Gaps" and every so often, I think that swinging around in the trees would be a lot more fun.
     
  2. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    Dear Parson, yes, Im fine thanks. I support a communications network for a 500 bed hospital. We only have a few in-patient cases of Covid and I'm restricted in going out. Just makes for a long day being stuck in my office alone for 8 hours a day. I'm an extrovert and feel like this
     
  3. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

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    I see your point. I still have a KJV Thompson myself.

    But when it comes to a contest between the Providence of God and your brain, I'm still betting on the the Providence of God.
     
  4. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

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    I thought that was "Scots, and everyone else who wishes they were Scots"?

    What if I dye my hair black?

    Ethnix Comedy on Facebook Watch
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
  5. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    Well there are blond Greeks out there, just not that many. And since Im part Scot, well, that just goes without saying!
    And the video is pretty much us at the end of Lent! How do we celebrate the end of fasting of Lent? With stricter fasting during Holy Week!
     
  6. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

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    Well, the video is Australian Greek comedy by Australian Greeks for Australian Greeks.

    If you didn't catch it, "Skip" is (rather old) Immigrant-Australian slang for "not ethnic" (from here).
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2020
  7. The Parson

    The Parson Your servant

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    Oh, that video is a riot!
     
  8. The Parson

    The Parson Your servant

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    The greek text your church uses, is it the 4th century Alexandrian texts?

    So glad to hear that it isn't you that needed the hospitalization by the way!!!

    Look, if I were in your shoes listening to what I'm telling you, I would defiantly be of the same mind.
     
  9. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    We use a Byzantine majority text. Again, we've been keeping our own texts in Koine Greek since that is the root of our liturgical language. We dont even use modern Greek in our services.
     
  10. The Parson

    The Parson Your servant

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    I figured as much and am pleased it's not the Alexandrian. IMHO they (the Alexandrian) are as corrupt as they come. And honestly, there is nothing I've mentioned so far that even slightly gives you any light into what I'm asserting? Do you think maybe if I posted more of the scripture that I believe has changed, you would consider it as kindly as you already have? My bringing up this subject hasn't gotten very many kind responses to date.

    Gosh, I feel like one of those Mormon elders knocking on doors. I never let them in. Even though I'll talk to them on the porch. Get my meaning?
     
  11. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    Honestly, since I dont really have a dog in the text fight, it is not a issue to me. We have our own textual history and the western churches are dependent on our native texts, not the other way around.

    The main reason why I cant stand KJVO is that it pushes a very poor theological point of that in order to be saved, you have to know 17th century English. That's as stupid as me saying that in order to be saved you have to know koine Greek. It is a decent translation and IMHO one of the most beautiful. However, it is dated and can be misread by someone who isnt familiar with older English. Even koine Greek has its problems as the language has evolved. For example, the dative case, that is in English, the direct object of a sentence, disappears over the centuries and no longer exists in modern Greek. If you studied only modern Greek, you would have a difficult time trying to parse out the Scriptures.

    Are their poor translations and copies? Of course there are. Heck I've even had muddle my way through some horrible translations of liturgical texts or misprintings. We have one printing of a service that in one instance of the Lord's prayer it ends with "...deliver us for evil." This was corrected in later editions, but as I find copies of this particular printing, I correct the prayer. Do I consider it a corrupt and satanic copy? No, just someone forgot to read through it one last time. Is every copy of the KJV a good one? Look up the 1631 reprint of the KJV known as "The Wicked Bible"
     
  12. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

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    And it's worth pointing out that this unbroken tradition of passing on the koine Greek text commands respect from all modern Evangelical scholars.

    The standard scholarly Greek New Testament indicates all the places where Byzantine manuscripts differ from other texts. Even those who prefer the reading of, say, the Codex Sinaiticus, will take note of what the Byzantine manuscripts say. Where the differences are significant, Bible translations will contain a footnote. Individual pastors have been known to base their sermon on the Byzantine reading.
     
  13. prodromos

    prodromos Senior Veteran Supporter

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    One of the issues I have with textual criticism with regards to the Biblical text is the implied assumption that older is better, rather than considering that a particular old manuscript survived precisely because no one was using it, because it was recognised back then that there was something wrong with it. There aren't any surviving early manuscripts representing the Byzantine texts for the simple reason they were in constant use and eventually fell apart.
     
  14. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

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    Well, a modern "critical" text will show all the major variant manuscript readings at the bottom of the page:

    [​IMG]

    There is an implied preference for the older manuscripts. Scholars, translators, and pastors will not go for the older reading every time.

    There are hundreds of Byzantine manuscripts, although none of the surviving ones are very early.

    There is, of course, a bias in survival towards Egypt, because fell-to-bits manuscripts survive well in low humidity.
     
  15. GreekOrthodox

    GreekOrthodox Psalti Chrysostom

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    Radagast, what is that Bible? I'd love to get something like that as my interlinear has tiny print and I now wear bifocals.
     
  16. Radagast

    Radagast comes and goes Supporter

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    That's the United Bible Society Greek New Testament, 5th edition (so not your preferred Greek text) with parallel NIV, from Zondervan: The UBS Greek New Testament, Fifth Edition with the NIV

    There is also a plethora of other interlinears out there, plus (next level up) Greek New Testament "Readers Editions" that footnote word meanings.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2020
  17. CaspianSails

    CaspianSails Active Member

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    The question is to engage in this or not. Clearly some is due to context and some is how one translates it as well as sentence structure and comprehension. I don't see in those passages that the writer is stating there is no God. Rather in some there is no other God would be the proper meaning.
    In the first example the question is, is there a God beside me and the answer, no there is none that I know. Same is true for the second Isaiah passage. God is in thee there is no other God is the meaning. The remaining verses prove this clearly

    15 Verily thou art a God that hidest thyself, O God of Israel, the Saviour.

    16 They shall be ashamed, and also confounded, all of them: they shall go to confusion together that are makers of idols.

    17 But Israel shall be saved in the Lord with an everlasting salvation: ye shall not be ashamed nor confounded world without end.

    18 For thus saith the Lord that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the Lord; and there is none else.

    Solomon is saying he has not found a wise women, not that none exist. I have not found, not there are none saith the Lord.
     
  18. CaspianSails

    CaspianSails Active Member

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    I suppose if I had read this first I would not have bothered to reply. You are most certainly out of context and trolling if you ask me. It is not possible to take a verse out of a passage and derive a separate meaning, context is everything.
     
  19. The Parson

    The Parson Your servant

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    Sorry for the absence. I went on a camping trip. Very little net access.

    So, when I got home just after lunch today, I was doing some search for residue. Hey somebody needs to contact the Washington National Cathedral asap... Look what they've got posted on their website telling folks what's on their stained glass windows:
    Boy, now that's a terrible typo! Isaiah 11:6 says: "the wolf also shall dwell with the lamb", not the "lion shall lie down with the lamb". Shameful inaccuracies! Go figure...

    Proclaiming Peace - Washington National Cathedral
     
  20. The Parson

    The Parson Your servant

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    Yeah, probably have been best not to reply.
     
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