Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier

[redleghunter]

Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier

Israel said Sunday that work to strengthen its border with the Gaza Strip had entered a new phase, with construction starting on a massive new barrier along the frontier.

"Over the weekend we began building the above-ground barrier along the Gaza border," Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told journalists before the weekly cabinet meeting.

The barrier, set to stand six metres (20 feet) off the ground, "will prevent terrorists from Gaza from penetrating into our territory on the ground", he said in Hebrew.

Netanyahu gave no further details but a defence ministry statement said that work on the structure began Thursday.

It is set to follow the 65-kilometre (40-mile) course of an underground barrier also under construction meant to neutralise the threat of cross-border tunnels built by Gaza militants.

At its western end, the statement said, the above-ground barrier would join a fortified sea wall jutting into the Mediterranean, aimed at blocking Palestinian attacks by water.

More at link: Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier


Why is Israel opting for physical barriers? Why not just increase ground sensors and drones?

 

[hislegacy]

QFT

 

[civilwarbuff]

Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier

Israel said Sunday that work to strengthen its border with the Gaza Strip had entered a new phase, with construction starting on a massive new barrier along the frontier.

"Over the weekend we began building the above-ground barrier along the Gaza border," Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told journalists before the weekly cabinet meeting.

The barrier, set to stand six metres (20 feet) off the ground, "will prevent terrorists from Gaza from penetrating into our territory on the ground", he said in Hebrew.

Netanyahu gave no further details but a defence ministry statement said that work on the structure began Thursday.

It is set to follow the 65-kilometre (40-mile) course of an underground barrier also under construction meant to neutralise the threat of cross-border tunnels built by Gaza militants.

At its western end, the statement said, the above-ground barrier would join a fortified sea wall jutting into the Mediterranean, aimed at blocking Palestinian attacks by water.

More at link: Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier


Why is Israel opting for physical barriers? Why not just increase ground sensors and drones?

We need to send these people to talk to the democrat party.....they'll let'em know that walls are immoral and don't work. That should take care of that......

 

[Hank77]

The barrier, set to stand six metres (20 feet) off the ground, "will prevent terrorists from Gaza from penetrating into our territory on the ground", he said in Hebrew.

Are we trying to keep out terrorists that are determined to destroy us?

 

[civilwarbuff]

I dunno…..do terrorists smuggle drugs and guns to support their "cause"?

 

[redleghunter]

Are we trying to keep out terrorists that are determined to destroy us?

In some manner yes. But not like Israel which is surrounded by failed states and transnational terrorists organizations.

I think what to look at is each nation has some utility for physical barriers. Our border patrol supports physical barriers with observation. Meaning a wall without someone watching them (drones) can be defeated. As having sensors only puts the burden on ground units to respond to the collected intelligence with mixed results. It’s all of the above.

 

[redleghunter]

We need to send these people to talk to the democrat party.....they'll let'em know that walls are immoral and don't work. That should take care of that......

You don’t think putting up physical barriers send some sort of message?

 

[Not David]

Israel is not the best moral example of building a wall.

 

[redleghunter]

Israel is not the best moral example of building a wall.

Why?

 

[Not David]

Why?

It's the same government who takes away lands of Palestinian living there to give it to Jews coming, and takes away territory of the Christian Churches.
Plus, the inefficient attacks that cost a lot of children' lives.

 

[redleghunter]

It's the same government who takes away lands of Palestinian living there to give it to Jews coming, and takes away territory of the Christian Churches.
Plus, the inefficient attacks that cost a lot of children' lives.

It’s also the nation which has been at a state of war within and without its borders since 1948. Three times her neighbors have tried to eradicate them as a nation and people.

Now what you mention also shows their hands are not clean. But let us not forget Israel has been under constant attack.

In fact before and after the ‘73 war Israel showed restraint towards the PLO (even after Munich) and this resulted in Lebanon becoming a PLO haven precipitating the Lebanon war in the 80s.

Then after driving the PLO out of Lebanon, Israel came back to the negotiating table to carve out a Palestinian state. Only to be snookered again and again.

 

[civilwarbuff]

You don’t think putting up physical barriers send some sort of message?

The wrong kind of message according to Her Majesty Nancy P.

 

[Not David]

It’s also the nation which has been at a state of war within and without its borders since 1948. Three times her neighbors have tried to eradicate them as a nation and people.

Now what you mention also shows their hands are not clean. But let us not forget Israel has been under constant attack.

In fact before and after the ‘73 war Israel showed restraint towards the PLO (even after Munich) and this resulted in Lebanon becoming a PLO haven precipitating the Lebanon war in the 80s.

Then after driving the PLO out of Lebanon, Israel came back to the negotiating table to carve out a Palestinian state. Only to be snookered again and again.

Not saying that the Palestinian government is innocent, just that Israel should not be used as a good example.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Plus, the inefficient attacks that cost a lot of children' lives.

You mean the lives of children who are brought into the protesting areas by their parents where near combat conditions exist?......Those children?.....the ones the so called 'palestinians' use as human shields?.....hoping for casualties so they can trade that for money and headlines?....those so called 'palestinians'?

 

[Not David]

You mean the lives of children who are brought into the protesting areas by their parents where near combat conditions exist?......Those children?.....the ones the so called 'palestinians' use as human shields?.....hoping for casualties so they can trade that for money and headlines?....those so called 'palestinians'?

There are times where the Israeli army didn't care there were children there. I know some horrible things Palestinians do but that doesn't justify other stuff.

 

[civilwarbuff]

The Israeli's don't go hunting those children down; the 'palestinians' bring them to sacrifice for political purposes.....

 

[Yarddog]

Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier

Israel said Sunday that work to strengthen its border with the Gaza Strip had entered a new phase, with construction starting on a massive new barrier along the frontier.

"Over the weekend we began building the above-ground barrier along the Gaza border," Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told journalists before the weekly cabinet meeting.

The barrier, set to stand six metres (20 feet) off the ground, "will prevent terrorists from Gaza from penetrating into our territory on the ground", he said in Hebrew.

Netanyahu gave no further details but a defence ministry statement said that work on the structure began Thursday.

It is set to follow the 65-kilometre (40-mile) course of an underground barrier also under construction meant to neutralise the threat of cross-border tunnels built by Gaza militants.

At its western end, the statement said, the above-ground barrier would join a fortified sea wall jutting into the Mediterranean, aimed at blocking Palestinian attacks by water.

More at link: Israel begins construction of new Gaza border barrier


Why is Israel opting for physical barriers? Why not just increase ground sensors and drones?

Because Israel is dealing with terrorist, not people seeking asylum in those places.

 

[redleghunter]

Because Israel is dealing with terrorist, not people seeking asylum in those places.

Border physical barriers either keep things and people out or they try to keep them in (Berlin wall).

 

[Aldebaran]

Because Israel is dealing with terrorist, not people seeking asylum in those places.

It could block both. You never know if someone is trying to cross into Israel to seek asylum, and we never know if someone is crossing the Mexico/America border to commit terrorism.

 

[redleghunter]

The Israeli's don't go hunting those children down; the 'palestinians' bring them to sacrifice for political purposes.....

The Israelis had some serious issues in dealing with collateral damage in the 2006 border conflict with Hezbollah.

What we call the non-combatant concerns, Israel did not have a good system to assess. We sent folks over there to help them adopt our Collateral Damage Methodology which at the time of the 2006 conflict I was at an advanced school getting certification. We all watched the conflict unfold on CNN and Fox News at the school.

We gave them lessons learned from our experiences in Iraq and Afghanistan. They did get better but fighting a war against terrorists with no regard for the local populace presents challenges. In the Hezbollah and Hamas conflicts the Israelis faced targeting missile, rocket and artillery sites positioned next to apartment complexes, schools and places of worship. This is done on purpose of course and some call it human shields. It’s a common tactic of terrorists organizations who do not fight according the Laws of Armed Conflict or LOAC. Most refer this term to Geneva convention protocols.

The Israelis never violated the LOAC provisions for proportional response as far as I know. But of course one non-combatant death or injury is what we call strategic exposure. Meaning everyone sees it on the news.

So if you have rockets firing on your populace and incur casualties, by LOAC you are justified to use proportional means to respond in self defense. In the case of the apartment building the Israelis targeted the rocket launchers to stop the attacks on their citizens and military. It was a self defense situation. However, there were casualties. Still to this day there was no confirmation the casualties were due to the Israeli counter attacks as the bodies were quickly buried in accordance with Muslim custom.

An apartment building, school and hospital are what LOAC categorizes as protected sites. In and of themselves they cannot be attacked. However, such facilities lose their protection when a legal combatant, partisan fighter or illegal combatant (read terrorists) uses the protected site for military purposes (sets up a headquarters, ammo storage, emplacement weapons) and/or conducts hostile acts (shooting at you) from the facility or site location.

If such happens the opposing force (being shot at) may engage the facility which has lost its protected status but proportionally. Meaning if terrorists are
shooting small arms (rifles and machine guns) at you and your patrol, you have an inherent right to self defense but respond proportionally. Meaning return fire to end the immediate threat. A non proportional response would be leveling the hospital to get two snipers. However using rotary aircraft to dispatch the threat can be proportional if the means you have are not successful for you or pinned down.

Encountered these challenges daily when running the Joint Fires center (JFC) in Iraq during the Iraq surge in 2007. We found that the best response to human shield situations was direct action ground forces with Army Attack aviation in support and AF or Navy fixed wing fighters as back up if things got out of hand. The ground forces always had their mortars and artillery in direct support. And we (JFC) maintained an MLRS battery for such support with precision guided munitions.