Is not believing in an eternal hell Heresy?

[By Faith Alone]

I wish that those who disagree with me on the issue of hell would just discuss it with me. Just a friendly discussion to clear the air. I wish we could sit down together face to face over a cup of coffee, with our bibles open, and discuss God's Word together as Christian brothers and sisters. What would be the harm in that? Nobody trying to convince anybody of anything, nobody saying that's a heresy, or that's unorthodox. Just all of us being together reading the Scriptures, growing together as Christians. Jesus said "My sheep hear my voice". Let's sit down together and listen for His voice. This is how people will know that we are Christians, by the love we have for one another.

Agreed!! Mild coffee. Don't want to stand my spoon up in it.

 

[abysmul]

I wish that those who disagree with me on the issue of hell would just discuss it with me. Just a friendly discussion to clear the air. I wish we could sit down together face to face over a cup of coffee, with our bibles open, and discuss God's Word together as Christian brothers and sisters. What would be the harm in that? Nobody trying to convince anybody of anything, nobody saying that's a heresy, or that's unorthodox. Just all of us being together reading the Scriptures, growing together as Christians. Jesus said "My sheep hear my voice". Let's sit down together and listen for His voice. This is how people will know that we are Christians, by the love we have for one another.

I agree and think that's a wonderful thing. Sadly I am a bit jaded, I find so many people raised in X denomination to be so firmly set in their denominational beliefs that it is almost impossible to have a discussion. Like some of the door to door folks... they really don't want to hear what I have to say, they want to tell me how they are right. It's difficult, and we are all human, I admit that.

 

[By Faith Alone]

I agree and think that's a wonderful thing. Sadly I am a bit jaded, I find so many people raised in X denomination to be so firmly set in their denominational beliefs that it is almost impossible to have a discussion. Like some of the door to door folks... they really don't want to hear what I have to say, they want to tell me how they are right. It's difficult, and we are all human, I admit that.

Col 4:5-6
5 Walk in wisdom toward them that are without, redeeming the time.
6 Let your speech be alway with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man.

 

[Mama Kidogo]

I wish that those who disagree with me on the issue of hell would just discuss it with me. Just a friendly discussion to clear the air. I wish we could sit down together face to face over a cup of coffee, with our bibles open, and discuss God's Word together as Christian brothers and sisters. What would be the harm in that? Nobody trying to convince anybody of anything, nobody saying that's a heresy, or that's unorthodox. Just all of us being together reading the Scriptures, growing together as Christians. Jesus said "My sheep hear my voice". Let's sit down together and listen for His voice. This is how people will know that we are Christians, by the love we have for one another.

We'd need a different place to do it. Annihilation discussions are not allowed here. It's unorthodox and heresy.

 

[Timothew]

We'd need a different place to do it. Annihilation discussions are not allowed here. It's unorthodox and heresy.

It's NOT heresy. It is what the Bible says.

 

[Timothew]

Kidogo, I believe that the false doctrine that God tortures the lost in hell forever is a smear of His Good and Holy name and is heresy, and if God is going to tell anyone "Away from me you evildoer, for I never knew you", He will say it to those who claim that He will do this evil thing of torturing people alive forever.

I wanted to have a nice discussion about what the Bible says. You couldn't allow that.

 

[Albion]

It's NOT heresy. It is what the Bible says.

It is heresy to those churches that declare certain beliefs to be heresies.

That you read the Bible differently from most Christians and Christian churches doesn't change that.

 

[Timothew]

It is heresy to those churches that declare certain beliefs to be heresies.

That you read the Bible differently from most Christians and Christian churches doesn't change that.

Name calling doesn't prove anything. Where does the Bible say that Annihilationism is a heresy? And when did majority vote become the rule of truth for Christians. What does John 3:16 say in your Bible? That you read it differently from what is says doesn't change anything.

I am willing to have a decent and friendly discussion about what the Bible says.
I am NOT going to sit quietly while you and Kidogo call me a Heretic for believing the Bible, while you have NO support WHATSOEVER for your false belief.

 

[Timothew]

The Doctrine of Eternal Conscious Torment is Unbiblical, Heretical and Unorthodox because it disagrees with what the Bible says.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

It is heresy to those churches that declare certain beliefs to be heresies.

That you read the Bible differently from most Christians and Christian churches doesn't change that.

From what I have been reading on CF, doesn't the EOC view Roman Catholicism as heretical?

Also, wasn't it the RCC that came up with the eternal hellfire doctrine? [note the Jack Chick Tracts]
I may be wrong on that.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7381842-12/#post52251942

Originally Posted by ProScribe

I'm not sure if Catholics are actually heretics.
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Pro-Scribe - you are Orthodox - correct ?

Then , according to Orthodoxy , Catholics are indeed heretics

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[Timothew]

Everyone is a heretic to someone else.

Name Calling proves nothing.

Is believing in eternal conscious torment in hell a heresy?

 

[Timothew]

I wish that those who disagree with me on the issue of hell would just discuss it with me. Just a friendly discussion to clear the air. I wish we could sit down together face to face over a cup of coffee, with our bibles open, and discuss God's Word together as Christian brothers and sisters. What would be the harm in that? Nobody trying to convince anybody of anything, nobody saying that's a heresy, or that's unorthodox. Just all of us being together reading the Scriptures, growing together as Christians. Jesus said "My sheep hear my voice". Let's sit down together and listen for His voice. This is how people will know that we are Christians, by the love we have for one another.

I'm too angry right now to continue this discussion. I still wish for a a friendly discussion but those who believe in eternal torture will not allow it. Too bad.

 

[Mama Kidogo]

Kidogo, I believe that the false doctrine that God tortures the lost in hell forever is a smear of His Good and Holy name and is heresy, and if God is going to tell anyone "Away from me you evildoer, for I never knew you", He will say it to those who claim that He will do this evil thing of torturing people alive forever.

I wanted to have a nice discussion about what the Bible says. You couldn't allow that.

I don't make the rules. i'd be more than happy to discuss things with you. But we'll need to find a different place. As I don't own the site, no, I could not allow that. I don't have that authority.

That said, I do not believe God tortures people. I believe man's hate toward God make experiencing His love a self torture. And yes eternally. The Orthodox view of hell is not what most subscribe to here. Except for the Orthodox posters. I don't see hell as a place per say. I see hell as a condition of one's soul experiencing the love of God.
Consider this verse:"Thou preparest a table before me
in the presence of my enemies;
thou anointest my head with oil,
my cup overflows."
Now is this verse true? How so if our enemies cease to be? How so if they are separated completely from us? Would such a sight not be hell to our enemy?

 

[Albion]

Everyone is a heretic to someone else.

Name Calling proves nothing.

Why should this upset you so? We're all heretics to the Roman Catholic Church and some others...but there's no reason to lose sleep over it if you are convinced that your belief is correct.

Is believing in eternal conscious torment in hell a heresy?

Not according to any church I am familiar with. There are those churches which reject that belief in eternal conscious punishment, but they aren't the ones that usually make pronouncements about who may be a heretic for disagreeing with them.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

From what I have been reading on CF, doesn't the EOC view Roman Catholicism as heretical?

Also, wasn't it the RCC that came up with the eternal hellfire doctrine? [note the Jack Chick Tracts]
I may be wrong on that.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7381842-12/#post52251942

Originally Posted by ProScribe

I'm not sure if Catholics are actually heretics.

Pro-Scribe - you are Orthodox - correct ?

Then , according to Orthodoxy , Catholics are indeed heretics

.

Everyone is a heretic to someone else.

Name Calling proves nothing.

Is believing in eternal conscious torment in hell a heresy?

I don't know if that has actually been defined on CF.
I guess we will have to let CF Staff chime in on that, since it appears so many "Hell" threads are relegated to the UT board.


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[By Faith Alone]

I'm too angry right now to continue this discussion. I still wish for a a friendly discussion but those who believe in eternal torture will not allow it. Too bad.

I know how you feel. Ever tell a child there is no Santa Clause? God is not a monster. The unbelievers make hay with that view and I cannot blame them.

 

[Timothew]

Why should this upset you so? We're all heretics to the Roman Catholic Church and some others...but there's no reason to lose sleep over it if you are convinced that your belief is correct.


Not according to any church I am familiar with. There are those churches which reject that belief in eternal conscious punishment, but they aren't the ones that usually make pronouncements about who may be a heretic for disagreeing with them.

Too bad. Eternal Conscious Torture is a heresy according to those who believe it is a heresy. That's what you said to me. So how does it feel to be called a heretic? Why should this upset you? I don't believe that God set up a place of eternal torture and approves of the operation. I believe that torture is evil and God is good Furthermore ther is not even ONE verse in the Bible that says that God tortures anyone in hell. Not even one verse. But there are HUNDREDS of verses that say that the lost will perish.

Tell me I am a heretic for believing that the lost will perish and will not receive eternal life, and THEN tell me what John 3:16 says in your Bible. Do it now.

 

[Timothew]

I don't know if that has actually been defined on CF.
I guess we will have to let CF Staff chime in on that, since it appears so many "Hell" threads are relegated to the UT board.


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The staff believes that Annihilationism is against the Nicene Creed, but has never been able to show where the Nicene Creed speaks against Annihilationism. The staff has been decent on this thread so far. Let's hope it continues. As for me, I will continue to say and believe what the Bible says and I will continue to speak out against eternal torture as long as I can.

 

[Mama Kidogo]

Why should this upset you so? We're all heretics to the Roman Catholic Church and some others...but there's no reason to lose sleep over it if you are convinced that your belief is correct.


Not according to any church I am familiar with. There are those churches which reject that belief in eternal conscious punishment, but they aren't the ones that usually make pronouncements about who may be a heretic for disagreeing with them.

I'm thinking you have to be or have once been a Catholic to be condemned as a heretic by the Catholic Church.

But you don't have to be or have been to speak what they call heresy. I'm thinking what they see us as is heretical. Maybe a Catholic could confirm this for us?

Like you, I'm not losing much sleep over it in any event.

 

[Mama Kidogo]

The staff believes that Annihilationism is against the Nicene Creed, but has never been able to show where the Nicene Creed speaks against Annihilationism. The staff has been decent on this thread so far. Let's hope it continues. As for me, I will continue to say and believe what the Bible says and I will continue to speak out against eternal torture as long as I can.

I can't condemn you for holding to your guns. But I'd use my words carefully if I wanted to continue being a member. I don't think the Creed is their reason. Annihilation is on a list of subjects (heresies) called unorthodox by CF. The Creed doesn't address it at all.