is it wrong to drink alcohol/wine

[seangoh]

There is nothing to support the idea that wine in Jesus time was watered down.

I don't know what you mean by watered down. But to determine the kind of wine Jesus could not have used is easy. Just look at the Bible and do a search for "wine" and see the generally attitude it is regarded and you can make a good guess at the the kind of wine he could not have turned it to. There can only be two choices-wine with alcohol or without.

All those verses tell people to drink newer wine for Pesach (Passover) in spring time. The grapes are harvested in summer so there is no way that they weren't fermented at Pesach.

It may be true that the Passover was six months after the grape harvest. However, it was common at that time to preserve grape juice from fermentation by various methods such as boiling, storing in airtight wineskins, adding preservatives like sulphur, and filtering any yeast that would cause fermentation. For further information about preservation in ancient times and references, look here under the heading "Preservation of Grapes".

 

[seangoh]

There are two references i would like to recommend. One is on the scientific perspective on whether wine is good and the other is the
spiritual perspective. I've said before that alcohol reduces heart disease, but i've never mentioned the other effects it has. Apparantly scientific literature tends to give much hype on the benefits of alcohol by stating this, but it hides the other effects it gives.

As you can tell, i'm totally against the drinking of wine. But that doesn't cause me to lose my logical thinking process. The Bible is a logical book for study and there are many clear texts that most kids will easily understand such as "Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise." Prov. 20:1.
A rule of bible interpretation is to stick with what is clear. You might not know what kind of wine Jesus turned water to or what kind of wine Paul meant when he recommended it to Timothy, but at least you know what kind of wine it couldn't have been because you compare with other scriptures which are clear and you stick to this methodology.

For the onlooker, he would find much debate going on on whether alcohol is good or not such that it confuses a person! And it'll be wise if he just plays it safe and skip it. God tells us our bodies are a temple of the Holy Spirit, why risk defiling it by injesting something that you're not sure will kill or save you?

That's all i have to say for now.

 

[New Creation]

This has been quite a helpful thread folks; this is something I have thought about often in my whole 6 months as a Christian and for years before. I used to work in bars and part of my job was to drink and so I did. I've never known a normal social drinking atmosphere for the most part. The last time I got drunk was a week before I accepted Christ. My boyfriend is an alcoholic and has not drank since January-period- except for communion- which even freaked him out a bit. the more I type the more I'm seeing that I really shouldn't be drinking at all although I have to admit I do enjoy a glass of wine on occassion but feel rather secretive and guilty about it which tells me AGAIN that I shouldn't be doing it. the Pauline Epistles bit was most helpful Seangoh- the bit about "don't offfend a brother, lest he stumble. and Seangoh I also feel you are on the $ about the frog in the water analogy. WHy get in the pot to begin with if it's not necessarry. I've just seen too many drunks to be unbiased I suppose. tahnks again all
God Bless

 

[JC 101 FM]

the bible says, drink, but don't be a drunk. If you have to be a drunk in order to drink...don't drink.

His first miricale was water to wine people!!!!!!

 

[cyberwing]

AMEN JC101fm!!! You are correct. If someone bothers to learn about Jesus' people they will find the Jewish people have always known the difference between grape juice and wine. They used wine because you can keep it longer and it will stay safe to drink. They knew good wine and poor, remember what the Rabbi said at the wedding where Jesus turned the water to wine!! You have saved the best for last!
They called Jesus a wine-bibber meaning they accused him of drinking too much. So guess what that means? HE drank WINE!!!!!
This concept seems to gain ground when you have recovering alcoholics who can't stop once they start and Paul said to drink but not until you are drunk. A little wine for your stomach's sake Paul says. So drinking is not forbidden in the Bible. Being drunk is.
Good question!
{{{hugs}}}
Cyberwing

 

[Rising_Suns]

To those who mentioned about moderation, remember, not everything in moderation is ok though. Heroin in moderation is not ok. Alchohol is really a more hazy matter. My advice would be to just stay away from it. There is no reason to allow yourslelf to be put into a tempting situation.

Also, you must abide by the laws of the land, as the bible tells us. So in other words, it is wrong to drink if you are under 21. Likewise, it is wrong to have more than 1 drink per hour (varies from state to state, but generally speaking). If you are legally too intoxicated to drive (above 1 drink per hour roughly), then you are breaking the law and thus in conflict with the bible. Simple as that.

To give you a little background, I was arrested once for driving under the influence. I was just over the legal limit and I paid the consequences for it with a 1 year suspension of my license. I will say this again, it is just better to stay away from it and not put yourself at risk. If all the alchohol in the world burned up in an instance, I wouldn't miss it. I would say; "good ridens"

 

[SqueakyGerbil]

The one drink per hour is a very loose way to figure it. It depends on what your weight it. Also many people are very wrong when it comes to guessing if they are legally above the limit (you would be suprised how little it takes some people to get past .08 ((the legal limit for my province and Hawaii)) most people don't even feel a buzz at that level).

As far as is it okay to drink wine? Yes but don't get drunk. To someone who doesn't drink, has never drank then it is hard to tell how much is too much and how to accomidate for the time laps from when you swallow to when it hits you. I personally know my limits of being drunk and make sure I don't go near there (often this means one small glass of wine and it lasts for about 4 hours).

 

[Rising_Suns]

The one drink per hour is a very loose way to figure it. It depends on what your weight it. Also many people are very wrong when it comes to guessing if they are legally above the limit (you would be suprised how little it takes some people to get past .08 ((the legal limit for my province and Hawaii)) most people don't even feel a buzz at that level).

That's true, but it's a good general rule for the average sized person. On a side note, they make disposable breathe-alizers now don't they?

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

i was wondering whether drinking alcohol is wrong? u see, drinking wine/alcohol, damages our organs for example the liver. according to the Bible, we're not suppose to do anything which may hurt our organs. it is said that smoking is a sin. but what bout drinking? in the Bable, Jesus turned water into wine during a gathering and they drink it. so is it considered a sin?

If the Holy Spirit is convicting you of these things then yes, for you it would be a sin.

its almost the same thing bout giving someone Euthanasia. wat if this guy's bed-ridden and is a burden to his family, and everybody's sure there's 0% of recovery. wat if he request for Euthanasia so that he can lessen his family's "already worst" situation? committing suicide is a sin? bout wat about this situation? if he isnt given Euthanasia, his family would be the one suffering n might starve to death. so wat's ur opinion?

Things work out differently for those who trust in the LORD. . .for all things and situations.

and wat bout the late Iranian conjoined twins? it was of course a sad tragedy, but is it right to change their fate? ur opinions will be most appreciated. thanks.

God has given man a lot of knowledge and sometimes what little knowledge that really is works. I do not believe it is wrong for man to appy the knowledge he has but in the end it depends on God.

 

[SAVEVERYONE]

I think that alcoholic beverages are just fine. As with all things, it has most to do with moderation and refraining from abuse. Examples of drinking alcohol are very common in the bible, and it does go to point out the difference by calling out drunkeness.

Examples of people drinking while under the influence, are found in the grave.
lets quit playing games here the people that thinks its ok to drink are the ones drinking, the ones that dont drink are the ones who think its a sin, I am one who does think its a sin and dont drink, the real problem with drinking is it brings the person to a state of disillusionment thinking there feeling good or being popular by drinking , and yes it makes you feel good but just like sin it feels good then kills you! But those who are in christ who drinks eventually that christian will grow and want to quit drinking, we will begin to see the errs of our ways from the light of God being shown in us, and will one day quit, but that one day might be to late when driving home. So I pray for whoever drinks to quit now, and seek the lord on this issue instead amen.

 

[SqueakyGerbil]

Examples of people drinking while under the influence, are found in the grave.
lets quit playing games here the people that thinks its ok to drink are the ones drinking, the ones that dont drink are the ones who think its a sin, I am one who does think its a sin and dont drink, the real problem with drinking is it brings the person to a state of disillusionment thinking there feeling good or being popular by drinking , and yes it makes you feel good but just like sin it feels good then kills you! But those who are in christ who drinks eventually that christian will grow and want to quit drinking, we will begin to see the errs of our ways from the light of God being shown in us, and will one day quit, but that one day might be to late when driving home. So I pray for whoever drinks to quit now, and seek the lord on this issue instead amen.

My fiance doesn't drink! He never has and I would be seriously suprised if he ever did. He doesn't see a problem with people drinking only with people getting drunk and I do know of others who feel the same way. There is a line there. I like the taste, I never drink enough to get any "superman syndrome" so your "feeling good or being popular by drinking" reply doesn't really work.
You are throwing in people with a problem drinking, those who drive while drunk in with people who are actually responsible adults who choose to have an occasonal drink. I am sorry if that is the only people you've ever met but that doesn't mean we are all that way.

 

[SAVEVERYONE]

I'll say this and shut up, all I know when Jesus comes back in the rapture I wouldn't want to be caught drinking a beer or wine, I would want to be found praise and worshiping God and on my knees praying not wondering if drinking is a sin or not, then dont drink if your worried about it being a sin.

 

[Foundthelight]

This is a great thread!

Pardon me while I give some personal testimony.

I too had long been a "social drinker". I was also a drunkard. I would drink way too much. I slept on the bathroom floor a couple of years ago after a night out with my boss.

I have two sons ages 16 and 10. I know that the 16 year old has had some experience with alcohol in a formal social setting.

I had been struggling with the issue of drinking and praying for guidance for many years. This summer three things happened. A young man in our village got in a car with someone who was drunk. He did this against the advice of his other friends. He is dead and the driver charged with manslughter. In the Village of Sidney, NY, just a few miles from us, a young man was beaten to death after a drunken argument at a party place by the tracks. Thare are currently 7 charged in his death ranging in ages from 16 to 23.

The third thing was that I finally gave in to the Holy Spirit and was baptised as an adult on July 13. I was immediately convicted that for me to drink was wrong. I was sinning (a drunkard), I was not bringing my sons up in the right way. I quit. I have not had the desire to drink since.

If our actions can lead others astray we are sinning.

I thank God, I praise the Lord!

 

[SAVEVERYONE]

This is a great thread!

Pardon me while I give some personal testimony.

I too had long been a "social drinker". I was also a drunkard. I would drink way too much. I slept on the bathroom floor a couple of years ago after a night out with my boss.

I have two sons ages 16 and 10. I know that the 16 year old has had some experience with alcohol in a formal social setting.

I had been struggling with the issue of drinking and praying for guidance for many years. This summer three things happened. A young man in our village got in a car with someone who was drunk. He did this against the advice of his other friends. He is dead and the driver charged with manslughter. In the Village of Sidney, NY, just a few miles from us, a young man was beaten to death after a drunken argument at a party place by the tracks. Thare are currently 7 charged in his death ranging in ages from 16 to 23.

The third thing was that I finally gave in to the Holy Spirit and was baptised as an adult on July 13. I was immediately convicted that for me to drink was wrong. I was sinning (a drunkard), I was not bringing my sons up in the right way. I quit. I have not had the desire to drink since.

If our actions can lead others astray we are sinning.

I thank God, I praise the Lord!

Amen awesome post agree totally, I know i said I was going to shut up, but I had to reply sorry .

 

[Yekcidmij]

Romans 14

 

[SqueakyGerbil]

I'll say this and shut up, all I know when Jesus comes back in the rapture I wouldn't want to be caught drinking a beer or wine, I would want to be found praise and worshiping God and on my knees praying not wondering if drinking is a sin or not, then dont drink if your worried about it being a sin.

I hope it wasn't my post that caused you to stop posting in this thread. I am worried that my post came across as both harsh and rude when it certianly wasn't ment to be either. I do respect what you have to say, I just disagree with it.

 

[Knight]

I'll say this and shut up, all I know when Jesus comes back in the rapture I wouldn't want to be caught drinking a beer or wine, I would want to be found praise and worshiping God and on my knees praying not wondering if drinking is a sin or not, then dont drink if your worried about it being a sin.

What if you happen to be on the toilet at the time?

Just kidding.

This subject has, no doubt, been beaten to death. However here is my take.
There is no sin in drinking. There is sin in drunkenness. It is possible to drink without becoming drunk. If you have a problem stopping then you should not drink.

The Romans 14 point is valid. I do occasionally drink. And I do mean occasionally as a six-pack could last me a month. However, if I was with a Christian brother who I knew had a problem with it then I am instructed by Scripture to limit myself as to not cause him to stumble.

 

[SAVEVERYONE]

I hope it wasn't my post that caused you to stop posting in this thread. I am worried that my post came across as both harsh and rude when it certianly wasn't ment to be either. I do respect what you have to say, I just disagree with it.

sorry if I sounded rude, forgive me, Just that the day I was posting I was in spiritual warfare, so I had to stay focused and alert, was a little hyped up all day because of the devil attacking me... more less I was just sick and tired of the devil rearing his ugly head everywhere I was looking on the forum so please forgive me....usually I am trying to stay calm and peaceful, but somedays lookout devil I am ripping your head off....so If anyone see's me on any post sounding like I'm a little steamed, its not any human being I'm mad at, when I am that way its because I am in spiritual warfare and ripping the devils head off..., anyways , God bless everyone..

 

[Gamecock]

As far as alcohol, yes, you see it in the Bible but I have a book that kind of answers this.. It says " Todays' wine is by biblical definitions 'strong drink'. What the NT meant by wine was basically purified waterr. Wine in ancient times was 20 parts water and one part wine. Essentially wine-flavored water."

So, in the wedding feast, the groom was commended for bringing out the best wine flavored water last?

Wine is wine.

 

[OpenMinded-Protestant]

you know when you are about to take a drink of alcohol and you get that guilty, this feels wrong feeling (maybe not everyone, but most know what im talking about!) that would be the Holy Spirit letting you know you shouldnt be doing that!


Just an opinion... i can speak from my experiences and those of people close to me..

if you dont feel guilty about it, then its probably not a sin for you.

and ill go ahead and agree w/ ...yes! its ok in moderation, and its definitly not a sin because Jesus drank back in the DAY!