How Could God allow this?

[Dorothy Mae]

Isaiah 5:13 Therefore my people are gone into captivity for lack of knowledge; and [g]their honorable men are famished, and their multitude are parched with thirst. 14 Therefore Sheol hath enlarged its desire, and opened its mouth without measure; and their glory, and their multitude, and their [h]pomp, and he that rejoiceth among them, descend into it.

This doesn’t answer my question

 

[ZNP]

This doesn’t answer my question

One of Your questions: The Chinese sell bats in a food market and the creatures are known to carry infections and when an infection is spread to the people there, God was supposed to have given His permission for this. If no one asks God’s permission how is He giving it? What if He told the Chinese no and they did it anyway? That wouldn’t be a first.

There are two reasons why the Chinese would do this, the people selling lack knowledge and the government regulating lacks knowledge. Either way the OT is very clear on what is and is not kosher and selling bats in a food market is not kosher.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

One of Your questions: The Chinese sell bats in a food market and the creatures are known to carry infections and when an infection is spread to the people there, God was supposed to have given His permission for this. If no one asks God’s permission how is He giving it? What if He told the Chinese no and they did it anyway? That wouldn’t be a first.

There are two reasons why the Chinese would do this, the people selling lack knowledge and the government regulating lacks knowledge. Either way the OT is very clear on what is and is not kosher and selling bats in a food market is not kosher.

That wasn’t the point. The point was the Chinese DONT ask God and neither do most of the world so how is God giving permission? Permission requires being asked.

 

[ZNP]

That wasn’t the point. The point was the Chinese DONT ask God and neither do most of the world so how is God giving permission? Permission requires being asked.

My point is that God has already made it clear that this is unclean. This disease therefore can show that that no flesh should glory before God. 1Cor 1:29
Choose to ignore his word at your peril.

 

[Religiot]

Never did I say, nor insinuate, that God takes pleasure in evil.
Nor do I imagine God to be the first cause in any evil...

Brother, I don't think we are far off, because I do agree with you that God does render to men according to their will, because that is how He wants to do it.

God creates darkness, that does not mean He has darkness inside of Him.

God creates evil, that does not mean He has evil inside of Him.

Please realize this principle, and accept it for the obvious truth that it is.

God takes evil, and turns it for good: I proved this by my example of Dr. Levatino's testimony.

Understand, also, that God created the Tree of Knowledge of good and evil.

--Brother, you presuppose that evil may only originate from evil; if that were true, then God would be evil, because everything originates from God.

 

[Religiot]

Jeremiah 9:23 Thus saith Jehovah, Let not the wise man glory in his wisdom, neither let the mighty man glory in his might, let not the rich man glory in his riches; 24 but let him that glorieth glory in this, that he hath understanding, and knoweth me, that I am Jehovah who exerciseth lovingkindness, justice, and righteousness, in the earth: for in these things I delight, saith Jehovah.

Amen.

 

[ZNP]

That wasn’t the point. The point was the Chinese DONT ask God and neither do most of the world so how is God giving permission? Permission requires being asked.

That is not the complaint. We have already gone over this but I'll do it again. John says that all things came into being because of the word and apart from the word there is nothing that has come into being. This "all things" and "nothing" should also include people like Hitler, serial killers, genocide, and what we generally refer to as evil.

In an earlier post I quoted the Lord in the OT saying nothing happens without Him giving the command.

If you say that we did things without God knowing or without God being in charge then you are denying that God is omniscient or omnipotent.

If I am in charge of a business and someone in my employ commits a crime using my business, then it looks very bad for me. Either I am involved, or I am a very poor overseer of my business. That is the question. I answer this in posts #6, #14 and #20

 

[ZNP]

--Brother, you presuppose that evil may only originate from evil; if that were true, then God would be evil, because everything originates from God.

No, I don't. The "problem of evil" presupposes this. You can google this. I have merely restated this problem before responding to it. I have already shown the fallacy in this in posts #6, #14 and #20.

 

[pescador]

That is not the complaint. We have already gone over this but I'll do it again. John says that all things came into being because of the word and apart from the word there is nothing that has come into being. This "all things" and "nothing" should also include people like Hitler, serial killers, genocide, and what we generally refer to as evil.

In an earlier post I quoted the Lord in the OT saying nothing happens without Him giving the command.

If you say that we did things without God knowing or without God being in charge then you are denying that God is omniscient or omnipotent.

If I am in charge of a business and someone in my employ commits a crime using my business, then it looks very bad for me. Either I am involved, or I am a very poor overseer of my business. That is the question. I answer this in posts #6, #14 and #20

Satan is in charge of this world until Christ returns. There will always be evil on Earth in its present form. If you have the time or inclination, read Paul's letter to the Romans, particularly chapters 6 and seven. Here is a small excerpt: "So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me." If you pay attention to what is written you might have a better understanding of good and evil.

BTW, it's a lot better than "cherry-picking" certain verses to prove your point. Ask God to open your mind to the truth.

 

[pescador]

Isaiah 5:13 Therefore my people are gone into captivity for lack of knowledge; and [g]their honorable men are famished, and their multitude are parched with thirst. 14 Therefore Sheol hath enlarged its desire, and opened its mouth without measure; and their glory, and their multitude, and their [h]pomp, and he that rejoiceth among them, descend into it.

So you know some Jewish history! Mazel tov!

BTW, when you quote the Bible please don't include references like [g] and [h], or for that matter verse numbers. They are not part of the Bible. See my previous post (just above) for an example.

 

[Religiot]

No, I don't. The "problem of evil" presupposes this. You can google this. I have merely restated this problem before responding to it. I have already shown the fallacy in this in posts #6, #14 and #20.

I must apologize: I don't read other posts, I simply respond to posts made to me.

After reading your other posts I can see that you've already considered these things; and I can also see that we disagree on more than I thought.

--What the Lord actually said about death:

"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." --Matthew 10:28

The first time we die is temporary, because God will resurrect everyone who has ever lived to face Him in judgment, after which, He will then kill them again, but this time, permanently, by destroying them in His eternal fire, from which there is no promise of resurrection, but a guarantee of eternal death.

The second death is final.

Only God has immortality, and has promised His children the same.

The wicked shall die the second time, and forever.

 

[St. Helens]

ADMIN HAT ON
Please stay on topic which is why did God allow the pandemic and other diseases in the world.
Other topics have been removed from the thread.
ADMIN HAT OFF

 

[Dorothy Mae]

My point is that God has already made it clear that this is unclean. This disease therefore can show that that no flesh should glory before God. 1Cor 1:29
Choose to ignore his word at your peril.

Ok, you can’t answer my question, I get it.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

That is not the complaint. We have already gone over this but I'll do it again. John says that all things came into being because of the word and apart from the word there is nothing that has come into being. This "all things" and "nothing" should also include people like Hitler, serial killers, genocide, and what we generally refer to as evil.

You are wrong. God finished creating long ago and has not created since He rested.

The world he created had within it the power to continue reproducing life. He wasn’t doing that.

So He isn’t creating babies, we are. He isn’t creating evil people, we are. You can attribute evil to his hands but it’s not something anyone who knows Him would advise.

In an earlier post I quoted the Lord in the OT saying nothing happens without Him giving the command.

Better do it again and I’ll give you the verse where he said the Israelies did what never had come to his mind. There’s a problem because he cannot give a command to them to do what never had occurred to him.

If you say that we did things without God knowing or without God being in charge then you are denying that God is omniscient or omnipotent.

Nonsense. If you say God commands all the evil men and devils do, you are denying he is good.

If I am in charge of a business and someone in my employ commits a crime using my business, then it looks very bad for me. Either I am involved, or I am a very poor overseer of my business. That is the question. I answer this in posts #6, #14 and #20

No man in charge of a country is accountable for every crime done in the country. You make God accountable for all the sin men do.

You still don’t understand my question.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

The title assumes facts not in evidence. Where is the evidence that God gives permission for the plague? Who asked him and who did he give permission to?

 

[ZNP]

You are wrong. God finished creating long ago and has not created since He rested.

When I said "that is the complaint" I was saying that is "the problem of evil". It is not my complaint, I am simply explaining the complaint.

The world he created had within it the power to continue reproducing life. He wasn’t doing that.

So He isn’t creating babies, we are. He isn’t creating evil people, we are.

How exactly are we doing that. According to John "all things came into being through the word and apart from the word nothing that has come into being has come into being" but you are saying that it is man who is creating evil, so then something did come into being apart from the word of God.

You can attribute evil to his hands but it’s not something anyone who knows Him would advise.

Really, Genesis says that God created the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and planted it in the garden of eden. Job says we receive evil at the hands of God. Isaiah says God created calamity (or evil), depending on the translation. Jeremiah says that man is not able to do evil unless God commands it. Joseph said that his brothers meant evil when they sold him into slavery but God meant it for good. And Paul said that God made Jesus who knew no sin, sin for us.

 

[ZNP]

The title assumes facts not in evidence. Where is the evidence that God gives permission for the plague? Who asked him and who did he give permission to?

We have provided numerous verses referencing this. Do you read anything more than just the title of a thread?

 

[ZNP]

God isn't responsible for sin, according to scripture.

God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone" (James 1:13). "God is light, and in Him there is no darkness at all" (1 John 1:5). "God is not the author of confusion" (1 Corinthians 14:33)—and if that is true, He cannot in any way be the author of evil.

Sin is not itself a thing created. Sin is neither substance, being, spirit, nor matter. So it is technically not right to think of sin as something that was created.

Sin is simply a lack of moral perfection in a person. The sinners themselves bear full responsibility for their sin.

Did you read my posts #6, #14 and #20? If 3 verses prove that God is not responsible for evil what about these verses?
Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Amo 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?

 

[renniks]

Job says we receive evil at the hands of God.

Job was just plain wrong. He received evil at Satan's hands. Anyone who reads the book should know that.

 

[renniks]

Did you read my posts #6, #14 and #20? If 3 verses prove that God is not responsible for evil what about these verses?
Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Amo 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?

Read them in context. God allows his people to suffer for their rebellion by removing his protection on them. It's not about God inventing evil, but he does allow it at times to punish those who deserve punishment.