God's TEN Commandments: Keep them? or break them?

[stevenfrancis]

From my own personal experience, since the blessed day when Christ called, AND I listened to Him, and became His, not only has my frequency and intensity of sin been on a steady decline because of my desire to do God's will, but (an this is the real miracle for those called by Christ), my tendency towards sin has diminished along with it. The more I don't sin, out of love of God, the less I want to sin, or have a tendency towards sin. There are whole swaths of things which I once counted in the category of temptations, which, by the Grace of God, are no longer temptations, nor even interests. When I DO stumble, and commit some sin, I am immediately remorseful and contrite, seeking God's forgiveness. I did none of this. This is all workings of the Holy Spirit of God, as a direct result of handing my life over to the Father, through the Son, and by the power of the Holy Spirit. By using my free will to decide to conform to the will of God. So the law, which once was on tablets, and then on scrolls, and then in books, is now inscribed on my heart. I don't live by the 10 commandments any longer because of the fear of Hell. I live by them because they are of God, and I am of God, and I love Him, and He loves me. We don't intentionally hurt those we love. We try to please them, and when we come up short, we are sorry. This, for me, is the essence of conversion.

 

[maco]

http://www.christianforums.com/t7803092/

 

[Sophrosyne]

Rom 8
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.



Astounding that you can do that with Paul's affirmations of the Law of God.


In Christ,

Bob

Read the verses before these to get the correct context if you dare to.

 

[Sophrosyne]

Quoting yourself to cut and past to is spamming.

 

[Sophrosyne]

So that would be ...

I'm no longer replying to your posts..... as I don't like them in the midst of your spam.

 

[MJohn7]

Instead of debating the 10Cs, why not just stick with the NT doctrine? The Lord and his apostles teach us to cast off the works of darkness and put on the armor of lite

Love Your Neighbor

8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,”[a] “You shall not covet,”[b] and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”[c] 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.
Put on Christ

11 And do this, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep; for now our salvation is nearer than when we first believed. 12 The night is far spent, the day is at hand. Therefore let us cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armor of light. 13 Let us walk properly, as in the day, not in revelry and drunkenness, not in lewdness and lust, not in strife and envy. 14 But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts.

 

[MJohn7]

1 Ti 3 As I urged you when I went into Macedonia—remain in Ephesus that you may charge some that they teach no other doctrine, 4 nor give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which cause disputes rather than godly edification which is in faith. 5 Now the purpose of the commandment is love from a pure heart, from a good conscience, and from sincere faith,


Chapter 4

Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 2 speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, 3 forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. 4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing is to be refused if it is received with thanksgiving; 5 for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.

If you instruct the brethren in these things, you will be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished in the words of faith and of the good doctrine which you have carefully followed. 7 But reject profane and old wives’ fables, and exercise yourself toward godliness. 8 For bodily exercise profits a little, but godliness is profitable for all things, having promise of the life that now is and of that which is to come. 9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance. 10 For to this end we both labor and suffer reproach,[a] because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe. 11 These things command and teach.



Chapter 6:3

If anyone teaches otherwise and does not consent to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which accords with godliness, 4 he is proud, knowing nothing, but is obsessed with disputes and arguments over words, from which come envy, strife, reviling, evil suspicions, 5 useless wranglings[a] of men of corrupt minds and destitute of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain. From such withdraw yourself.[b]
6 Now godliness with contentment is great gain. 7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain[c] we can carry nothing out. 8 And having food and clothing, with these we shall be content. 9 But those who desire to be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and harmful lusts which drown men in destruction and perdition. 10 For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.


11 But you, O man of God, flee these things and pursue righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, gentleness. 12 Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, to which you were also called and have confessed the good confession in the presence of many witnesses.

 

[Optimax]

God's TEN Commandments: Keep them? or break them?

Do not attempt to keep them to earn or partially earn salvation.

Once a person is born again (a Christian) the laws of God are written in their heart(born again spirit of man).

Even the keeping of the sabbath which is not a day.

It is a rest that the born again person has available to them.

 

[MJohn7]

God's TEN Commandments: Keep them? or break them?

Do not attempt to keep them to earn or partially earn salvation.

Once a person is born again (a Christian) the laws of God are written in their heart(born again spirit of man).

Even the keeping of the sabbath which is not a day.

It is a rest that the born again person has available to them.

I was just wondering about how God writes the law on our hearts and minds. It doesn't seem to be absent of written commandment or doctrine. If we Look at Php 4 we see that Paul tells us to meditate (think) about things that are truth, lovely, pure and praiseworthy. He goes on to exhort the readers/listeners to do the things that he teaches (his commands) and to follow his example as well. And i think its truthful to declare that the words of Christ Himself are truth and worthy to be studied, meditated on and followed.




Hebrews 10:15 But the Holy Spirit also witnesses to us; for after He had said before, 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,”[c] 17 then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”[d] 18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.


Php 4:4 Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I will say, rejoice!
5 Let your gentleness be known to all men. The Lord is at hand.
6 Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; 7 and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.


8 Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things. 9 The things which you learned and received and heard and saw in me, these do, and the God of peace will be with you

 

[Optimax]

He "writes" them in our heart because when a person is born again the Holy Spirit comes and dwells in that person's spirit.

Because The Holy Spirit lives in us His laws or His ways are in us.

 

[BobRyan]

He "writes" them in our heart because when a person is born again the Holy Spirit comes and dwells in that person's spirit.

Because The Holy Spirit lives in us His laws or His ways are in us.

Amen - they go from being external on "tablets of stone" to then being internal on "tablets of the human heart" - same Law - different context.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

I was just wondering about how God writes the law on our hearts and minds. It doesn't seem to be absent of written commandment or doctrine. If we Look at Php 4 we see that Paul tells us to meditate (think) about things that are truth, lovely, pure and praiseworthy. He goes on to exhort the readers/listeners to do the things that he teaches (his commands) and to follow his example as well. And i think its truthful to declare that the words of Christ Himself are truth and worthy to be studied, meditated on and followed.

Hebrews 10:15 But the Holy Spirit also witnesses to us; for after He had said before, 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,”[c] 17 then He adds, “Their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.”[d] 18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

Amen!

And notice what Paul says in 1Cor 9:8-9.

In true "study the scriptures daily to see IF those things are so" Paul argues that his words are NOT to be dismisses as merely the odd ideas of one man - because they are backed up by the teaching of Moses.

1Cor 9
8I am not speaking these things according to human judgment, am I? Or does not the Law also say these things?

9 For it is written in the Law of Moses, “You shall not muzzle the ox while he is threshing.” God is not concerned about oxen, is He?

 

[MJohn7]

He "writes" them in our heart because when a person is born again the Holy Spirit comes and dwells in that person's spirit.

Because The Holy Spirit lives in us His laws or His ways are in us.

God doesn't just write them on our heart, but He writes them on both our heart and mind. What does Paul teach us in PHp 4?

 

[Optimax]

God doesn't just write them on our heart, but He writes them on both our heart and mind. What does Paul teach us in PHp 4?

Romans tell us to renew our mind.



Not sure what "PHp" is but I am sure that Paul taught a lot there.

 

[MJohn7]

Romans tell us to renew our mind.



Not sure what "PHp" is but I am sure that Paul taught a lot there.

Php is an abbreviation of Philippians.

Yes be renewed in our thinking.




Php 4:4 Rejoice in the Lord always. Again I will say, rejoice!
5 Let your gentleness be known to all men. The Lord is at hand.
6 Be anxious for nothing, but in everything by prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God; 7 and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.


8 Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthy—meditate on these things. 9 The things which you learned and received and heard and saw in me, these do, and the God of peace will be with you

 

[BobRyan]

Rom 8
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Regarding Romans 8:6-8 being ignored --

Read the verses before these to get the correct context if you dare to.

So then - anything about vs 6-8?


Here as some verses before Romans 8:6-8

3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh,
4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.

Emphasizing again that the saints are in favor of the Law of God - and lost -- at war with it. Because the Law of God is written on the heart of the saints.

6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

And BEFORE that we have Romans 7


6 But now we have been released from the Law, having died to that by which we were bound, so that we serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter.

7 What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "" YOU SHALL NOT COVET.''
8 But sin, taking opportunity through the commandment, produced in me coveting of every kind; for apart from the Law sin is dead.
9 I was once alive apart from the Law; but when the commandment came, sin became alive and I died;
10 and this commandment, which was to result in life, proved to result in death for me;
11 for sin, taking an opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through it killed me.
12 So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good.
13 Therefore did that which is good become a cause of death for me? May it never be! Rather it was sin, in order that it might be shown to be sin by effecting my death through that which is good, so that through the commandment sin would become utterly sinful.

14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin.
15 For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate.
16 But if I do the very thing I do not want to do, I agree with the Law, confessing that the Law is good.
17 So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me.

18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.
20 But if I am doing the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me.
21 I find then the principle that evil is present in me, the one who wants to do good.

22 For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man,
23 but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.

 

[MJohn7]

Amen!

And notice what Paul says in 1Cor 9:8-9.

In true "study the scriptures daily to see IF those things are so" Paul argues that his words are NOT to be dismisses as merely the odd ideas of one man - because they are backed up by the teaching of Moses.

True but Paul doesnt command Gentiles to follow Moses law, but he does give us commands though in order to guide us, they are Christs instructions. If we follow and meditate on his commands and those of Christ then we have what we need. The 10C are not bad and we can learn about them but its not exactly the doctrine we Gentiles are given.

 

[BobRyan]

When I DO stumble, and commit some sin, I am immediately remorseful and contrite, seeking God's forgiveness. I did none of this. This is all workings of the Holy Spirit of God, as a direct result of handing my life over to the Father, through the Son, and by the power of the Holy Spirit. By using my free will to decide to conform to the will of God. So the law, which once was on tablets, and then on scrolls, and then in books, is now inscribed on my heart. I don't live by the 10 commandments any longer because of the fear of Hell. I live by them because they are of God, and I am of God, and I love Him, and He loves me. We don't intentionally hurt those we love. We try to please them, and when we come up short, we are sorry. This, for me, is the essence of conversion.

Amen!

This is what is expected according to the Word of God. - The lost will be at war with the Law of God for they do not subject themselves to it -- "neither indeed CAN they" - but that is not the case with the saints of God.

Rom 8
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Just as you have stated in your post.

Blessings.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

True but Paul doesnt command Gentiles to follow Moses law, .

The statement in 1Cor 9:8-9 is to a gentile church where Paul proves his authority by demonstrating a "sola scriptura test" of his doctrine, practice and teaching. Both Jews and Gentiles were to use "soal scriptura tests".

But as you appear to say - Paul was not saying that Gentiles were subject to the ceremonial law.

Notice in that same chapter 1Cor 7:19 "Neither is circumcision anything nor uncircumcision anything (the ceremonial law) - but what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God". Paul contrasts the ceremonial law to the Moral Law of God -- God's Commandments - and says that it is the Commandments that matter - in that very same chapter.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

God's TEN Commandments: Keep them? or break them?

Do not attempt to keep them to earn or partially earn salvation.

God never commands the Lost to Keep His commandments.

In Exodus 20:6 IN The TEN Commandments we are to "LOVE God and Keep His Commandments".

in John 14:15 "IF you LOVE ME - KEEP My Commandments".

All of these are the pre-cross teaching of God under the ONE Gospel.

The command to the lost is to surrender, to give up, to repent, to confess, but not to "try harder to be good" because the lost DO Not submit to the Law of God - neither indeed CAN they.

in Christ,

Bob