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God's TEN Commandments: Keep them? or break them?

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by BobRyan, Feb 1, 2014.

  1. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    Wild assertions?

    Where did you deal with this taken directly from MK 2:27 -

    The verse contrasts mankind with the man. The phrase τὸν ἄνθρωπον isn't the same as ὁ ἄνθρωπος.
     
  2. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    Why do you need to appeal to religious quotes to support your position? Why won't the Bible do it?

    Why won't you acknowledge -

    Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake
     
  3. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    You defeat your own argument by quoting the above.
     
  4. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    In context Jesus is talking to Jews only.

    Besides what you're trying to do makes Moses a liar.

    13 Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you. Ex 31

    Thirteen is your unlucky number. Why doesn't Moses say the Sabbath was a sign for all mankind?

    It also makes Ezekiel a lair.

    12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the Lord that sanctify them.

    Why doesn't Ezekiel say the Sabbath was given to mankind?
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    Only if my argument was that these Sunday Sources don't keep sunday. A point I never make as it turns out ... as we all knew.

    What that quote DOES show is that the Sabbath commandment applicable to all mankind since Eden and is part of the moral law of God - specifically stated to be the TEN Commandments in the documents of each of those Sunday sources.
     
  6. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    Turns out - you were not correct - because in context this can only be mankind. No text argues for the "Making" of Jews, but rather the "making" of the Sabbath and the "making" of Mankind.

    [FONT=&quot]27 Jesus said to them, "" The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. (G444 Anthropos)
    28 ""So the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.''


    [FONT=&quot]"All Nations of Mankind" G444 Acts 17:26[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]"The rest of mankind" - G444 Acts 15:17[/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]"Son of Man is Lord of the Sabbath" - Man. [/FONT]G444

    [FONT=&quot]And "Made for Mankind" in -- Man G444 Mark 2:27-28[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]"All Nations of Mankind" G444 Acts 17:26[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]"The rest of mankind" - G444 Acts 15:17[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]MAN in Mark 2:27 and 28 [/FONT] ἄνθρωπος
    [/FONT]

    If the intent is to dismiss the entire life of Christ and the Gospels - then I suppose you could ignore the Gospels by saying "He was talking to Jews" -- how sad.

    Good for the Sunday Sources I quote - they do no such thing as that.


    The Sabbath was made for mankind - "and rested the seventh day therefore God Blessed THE Sabbath day and made it holy" -- however the "Sabbaths" of Lev 23 as annual holidays are for the Jews as Paul points out in Acts 21 while observing the ceremonial law.

    In any case - whoever said that the "mankind does not include the Jews"??

    Not me that is for sure.

    Is 56
    For thus says the Lord:
    “To the eunuchs who keep My Sabbaths,
    And choose what pleases Me,
    And hold fast My covenant,
    5 Even to them I will give in My house
    And within My walls a place and a name
    Better than that of sons and daughters;
    I will give them an everlasting name

    That shall not be cut off. 6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
    Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
    And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
    Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
    And holds fast My covenant—
    7 Even them I will bring to My holy mountain,
    And make them joyful in My house of prayer.
    Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices
    Will be accepted on My altar;
    For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations.”



    Seven is your unlucky number.
     
  7. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

    +0
    I don't think your separated passages say what you want them to mean.

    Who is ἄνθρωπον? How can ἄνθρωπος be the same? Where in the Bible do you find a phrase such as the man Adam? We do find the man Christ Jesus in 1 Tim 2:5. No where do we find such a phrase or reference to Adam or mankind.

    anthrōpos (ἄνθρωπος) Christos (Χριστὸς) Iēsous (Ἰησοῦς).
     
  8. VictorC

    VictorC Jesus - that's my final answer

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    Bob, you completely dismissed the point from Exodus 31:13 you're responding to. Instead, you're advocating a rejection of the Law by Jesus, by applying a statement He made that the sabbath was 'made for man'. The Law itself makes the sabbath exclusive to the children of Israel, and what many of us see in Jesus' statement is that the sabbath wasn't God's rest; it was not 'made for God'.
     
  9. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    I don't need the Jews to be excluded from a promise given to all mankind to make my point - you do. The text as we see in both Mark 2:27 and in Isaiah 56 and in Is 66:23 "From Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before Me to worship" does not exclude Jews from "mankind".

    Bending/wrenching Ex 31:31 to mean "the rest of mankind should not keep this commandment" is eisegesis in the extreme. Both OT and NT refute it.

    The promised blessing to Israel remains for keeping the 4th commandment as to all mankind who chooses to do it.

    Even well known Sunday sources admit to the continued binding nature of the 4th commandment.

    The "Baptist Confession of Faith"
    The "Westminster Confession of Faith"
    The Catholic Catechism
    D.L. Moody
    R.C Sproul
    Andy Stanley
    Thomas Watson



    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  10. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    What did the Apostles call all the multitude (translated Gentiles) to do in Acts 15:17 and following? It wasn't to keep the law.

    Your citation doesn't support your argument. You argue form a literary view point which isn't valid.
     
  11. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    No, no. You're trying your hardest to make these sources support the keeping of the law while they say clearly they do something else. I think that's really called slander. It also violates the 9th commandment about false witness.
     
  12. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    I suppose you can show us Jesus was talking to the world.

    Let's see it.
     
  13. VictorC

    VictorC Jesus - that's my final answer

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    Bump for BobRyan
    Bob, do you advocate a premise that Jesus violated the Law, where it records a statement made directly by God?
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2014
  14. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    I've no clue why would you say that?
     
  15. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    Where did you lift the above quote from?
    Who is trying to make such a foolish argument?
    Really? who else has posted such a notion?
    Who is the everyone since you highlighted it? You cling to the law (old covenant) and refuse to accept the New Covenant.

    3 Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the Lord, speak, saying, The Lord hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree.

    4 For thus saith the Lord unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

    5 Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.

    6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant;


    How does one join themselves to that covenant? Are they then strangers to it?

    Rhetorical question answered with -

    48 And when a stranger shall sojourn with thee, and will keep the passover to the Lord, let all his males be circumcised, and then let him come near and keep it; and he shall be as one that is born in the land: for no uncircumcised person shall eat thereof. Ex 12

    This show they're no longer a stranger.
     
  16. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    Never give up. You'll never make me say uncle, ever!

    Your argument is so bad you have to say from ... to means on. This is simply way beyond laughable. Are the activities of the following verse 24 activities you do on the Sabbath?
     
  17. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    In Acts 15 they do not mention "Honor your Parents" (But Paul says that does not mean that the 5th commandment is excluded from gentiles in Eph 6:1-2 so no such thing as deleting all the Bible using Acts 15).

    In Acts 15 they do not mention "Love God with all your heart", nor "Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18 but James does mention Lev 19:18 in James 2 so then no such thing as deleting all the Bible using Acts 15.

    Hence even the Sunday sources listed - "get the point" - the Ten Commandments remain.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  18. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    He's looking for a c & p quote from someone to quote so he doesn't have to make a statement. Can't hardly wait. The anticipation is killing me.;)
     
  19. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member

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    "From Sabbath to Sabbath" AND "From New Moon to New Moon" in Is 66 BOTH cycles are kept by observing cycles -- not "ignoring them".

    As perhaps we all knew to start with.

    So then - just stating the obvious.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  20. from scratch

    from scratch Guest

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    What did the Apostles call the Gentiles to do? Was it to keep the law.

    Surely you can't be saying someone here calling themselves a Christian is telling others to hate God.

    But you don't accept -

    Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake...
     
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