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Gentiles 101

Discussion in 'Traditional Adventists' started by Cribstyl, Mar 22, 2011.

  1. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    The text you posted was disputed as pointing to what Jesus alone would do. Do you have other scriptures?
    This text in question reenforces that Samaritans (mixed race) were not sure about the God they worshipped. Jesus told her that the Jews are the one that God promised salvation to.


    I cannot adopt your train of thought on this because; from Genesis' account to Paul's revelation of this mystery; God chose a man named Abraham before chosing to be God to His ansestors. The fact that Abraham's father worship other God's should expose some false teachings.;)
    God made an everlasting covenant, that all the nations of the world would be blessed through His seed (with circumcision as a sign).
    This blessed seed is Jesus Christ. Paul teaches us about the wall between Gentiles and Jews that existed and the blood of Jesus that broke down that wall. Are you sure you want to push back against this chapter below?

    Eph 2:11¶Wherefore remember, that ye [being] in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
    Eph 2:12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
    Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
    Eph 2:14¶For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition [between us];
    Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, [even] the law of commandments [contained] in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, [so] making peace;
    Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
    Eph 2:17 And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
    Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
    Eph 2:19¶Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
    Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner [stone];


    Question dont always articulate the truth. The Jews in general were not to have any dealing with the Gentiles.

    You're actually making the case that no other nation was given the law.



    Those text above dont tell a historical story about Jews preaching the to Gentiles.
    We can agree that Gentiles did and do join the Jewish faith before Christ and after Christ came.
     
  2. Revelation 14:6-12

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    I think you may have a misunderstanding of the Seventh Day Adventist's position [concerning the Gentiles],

    And if ye [be] Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. Galatians 3:29

    There is neither Jew nor Greek (Galatians 3:28)...

    ...JESUS, HIMSELF, is Israel:

    When Israel [was] a child, then I loved him, and called my son out of Egypt. [Hosea 11:1]

    And was there until the death of Herod: that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying, Out of Egypt have I called my son. [Matthew 2:15]

    Anyone "in CHRIST JESUS" [Romans 3:24, 8:1-2,39; 1 Corinthians 1:2,30, 4:15; Galatians 3:26,28, 6:15; Ephesians 2:6,13, 3:11; 1 Thessalonians 2:14; 2 Timothy 1:1, etc] is Spiritual Israel


    "For all the promises of God in him [are] yea, and in him Amen..." 2 Corinthians 1:20;p


    Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. Acts 4:12


    ...for a Christian (Matthew 16:24; John 8:11),
    ...is not of the flesh which cannot receive the spirit (Matthew 21:19, 23:38; Acts 13:46),

    ...but is of the spirit (Romans 2:28-29, 9:6-8; Galatians 4:29),

    ...and bringing forth the fruits thereof (Matthew 21:43; 1 Corinthians 7:19),

    ...obeying HIM in HIS Commandments (Acts 5:32; Hebrews 5:9) and,

    ...is indeed a child and a seed of Abraham (Galatians 3:7, 29),

    ...cut and grafted into the True Vine
    (Romans 11:17-24,30-32),


    ...of the spiritual circumcision made without hands keeping the Commandments (1 Corinthians 7:19; Colossians 2:11),

    ...a Spiritual Jew or Israel (Romans 2:29),

    ...and the Everlasting Covenant made only with them (Jeremiah 31:31,33; Ezekiel 36:27; Hebrews 8:8,10, 10:16).

    The
    very first time "Israel" [Genesis 32:28] is mentioned, it belongs to one single individual who "overcame" with God, and GOD gave the name. It had nothing to do with bloodlines, but everything to do with Faith.

    The Gentiles were indeed "strangers" [as was stated]. They did not have the written Law. No one is saying they did. However, the Ten Commandments exist outside of the stone tables and existed before those stone tables were ever given at Mt. Sinai.

    Paul specifically said of the gentiles:

    For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Romans 2:14

    Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and [their] thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;) Romanbs 2:15


    Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision? Romans 2:26

    And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law? Romans 2:27


    Paul specifically said,

    Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, [there is] no transgression. Romans 4:15

    Yet we see from the very beginning with even Cain and Abel, that sin existed, and since sin existed, Law existed first...

    If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee [shall be] his desire, and thou shalt rule over him. Genesis 4:7

    Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. 1 John 3:4

    Not as Cain, [who] was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous. 1 John 3:12

    Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15

    GOD's law is oringally written in every man, since the Law [Ten Commandments] are all moral and spiritual.

    For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin. Romans 7:14


    However, through our fallen nature and our choosing to sin we degrade further and further from His Law and His Image. Mankind had become so degraded that the Law written entered... and so there is no excuse for sin.


    And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent: Acts 17:30

    But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God. Romans 2:29


    As for the Samaritan, Jesus clearly said, that GOD wants worshippers in "spirit" and "in truth".

    The Law is spiritual [Romans 7:14] and is truth [Psalms 119:142,151].

    But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. John 4:23


    Such a worshipper was that Samaritan woman.


    The Everlasting Covenant is actually the covenant between the FATHER and SON, before there was ever an Angel or ever a Man.


    That the Stranger that travelled with them, or sojourned among them, or were their neighbours, could also join the Lord and be taught is also witnessed here:

    One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you. Exodus 12:49


    And [this] shall be a statute for ever unto you: [that] in the seventh month, on the tenth [day] of the month, ye shall afflict your souls, and do no work at all, [whether it be] one of your own country, or a stranger that sojourneth among you: Leviticus 16:29


    Ye shall therefore keep my statutes and my judgments, and shall not commit [any] of these abominations; [neither] any of your own nation, nor any stranger that sojourneth among you: Leviticus 18:26

    [But] the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I [am] the LORD your God. Leviticus 19:34


    Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I [am] the LORD your God. Leviticus 24:22


    ...etc...

    Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to the LORD, to serve him, and to love the name of the LORD, to be his servants, every one that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; Isaiah 56:6

    For every one of the house of Israel, or of the stranger that sojourneth in Israel, which separateth himself from me, and setteth up his idols in his heart, and putteth the stumblingblock of his iniquity before his face, and cometh to a prophet to enquire of him concerning me; I the LORD will answer him by myself: Ezekiel 14:7


    And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. Jeremiah 31:34


    And there came of all people to hear the wisdom of Solomon, from all kings of the earth, which had heard of his wisdom. 1 Kings 4:34


    And when the queen of Sheba heard of the fame of Solomon concerning the name of the LORD, she came to prove him with hard questions. 1 Kings 10:1


    And Solomon told her all her questions: there was not [any] thing hid from the king, which he told her not. 1 Kings 10:3


    And she said to the king, It was a true report that I heard in mine own land of thy acts and of thy wisdom. 1 Kings 10:6


    The Jews were to be the Light unto the Nations...a City set on a Hill...sharing the LAW of GOD which is LIGHT [a proverb of Solomon...]:

    For the commandment [is] a lamp; and the law [is] light; and reproofs of instruction [are] the way of life: Proverbs 6:23

     
  3. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    You've overwhelmed me, I'm to busy to tackle this beast of a response.
     
  4. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    You asked for more scripture Crib, the man gave you more scripture... I thought you like scriptural responses.

    You dismiss commentary and you don't have time for lengthy scriptural reponses... me thinks you just don't like ideas different from your own. :|
     
  5. Cribstyl

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    Lord help me to love this brother more perfectly. Help me to not see Him as an adversary but rather as brother striving to know you better.:amen:
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2011
  6. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    Proverbs 28:9
    He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.
     
  7. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    Using the bible to insult others is not one of the ten commandments, so I guess it fair game;). If I dont trade insults with you, I win..:p

    Hearing the law is not an issue to Christians, being under the law is.;)

    Being under the law is like playing football on the autobahn..You will lose.

    Rom 9:30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
    Rom 9:31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
    Rom 9:32 Wherefore? Because [they sought it] not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2011
  8. Byfaithalone1

    Byfaithalone1 The gospel is Jesus Christ!

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    It's an interesting chapter. Later on, we find this:
    An arrogant man stirs up strife,
    But he who trusts in the LORD will prosper.
    26He who trusts in his own heart is a fool,
    But he who walks wisely will be delivered.
    Wise words, indeed . . . .

    BFA
     
  9. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    Let's break this verse down, shall we?

    An arrogant man stirs up strife
    Who is it that comes into an Adventist room and challenges SDA belief? Is that not arrogance?
    But he who trusts in the LORD will prosper.
    The Lord told me to keep His Cammandments... don't recall Him telling me different.
    He who trusts in his own heart is a fool,
    But he who walks wisely will be delivered.
    Where does Jesus dismiss the Law? Show me one passage that He said that supports your claim. My faith is in His Words...
     
  10. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    I posted a verse from the Bible that I felt pertained to the flow of the thread. You were shown by brother Rev 14 many verses to answer your question and you dismissed them. Then you post a public prayer to show your struggle of patience with me... you do remember the story of the pharisee and the publican don't you?

    A Biblical reproof is not an insult but you take however you want...
     
  11. Byfaithalone1

    Byfaithalone1 The gospel is Jesus Christ!

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    I honestly don't know the answer to that. I only know that this does not seem to describe me or my motives.


    OK. Good. Go and do, then. I would never wish to stand in your way.


    He did not come to destroy, but to fulfill.


    What claim are you interested in discussing?


    As it should be.


    BFA
     
  12. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    In the flow of this thread this was our last dialog #52, Where is your response to my post and questions I posed to you? Then why cant I chose not to respond to Rev, just like you did to me??
    My questions to Rev was addressed in his previous post and I responded accordingly.

    As far as I know Rev14 and I are not beyond reasoning together, nor does he have chip on his shoulder or an axe to grind as you seem to have.

    You're seeking desperately for a fight rather than dialogs about Christian doctrines.
    If your anger was because of a dialog between us, I could understand it, but you're running me down because you feel I should respond to Rev14's post. You need to check yourself.


    Your attitude and tolerance of nonSDA helps me to understand why so many Adventist teens reach a dead end before and after graduating HS. YES I volenteer to hang out with them. This includes praying with and helping them to know that Jesus died for them too. My hopes and prayers are not based on works but rather my faith in God to keep the promises of His word.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2011
  13. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    Well, I hope he has more fortitude than all the rest of the posters on here that you've developed issues with. No matter what you claim Crib, you are not a seeker. You are fundamentally opposed to Adventist teaching... why you insist on trying to get us to see your point of view is beyond me. We believe in Adventist doctrine, you do not... whats left to be said?
     
  14. Stryder06

    Stryder06 Check the signature

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    You do know that every promise of God in regards to salvation is conditional right?
     
  15. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    First Crib, I'm not itching for a fight, as you suppose, I am just not interested in your ideas of Christian doctrines. I hold fast to the platform and pillars of Adventism, as all that proclaim to be Adventists should. Why would I be interested in a Pentecostal viewpoint? Do you seek the advice of Catholics or other denominations to further your understanding of the Bible? If you don't, and even if you do, why would you think we would?

    The Adventist church has been infiltrated enough by outside influences to the point that it hardly resembles the pioneers understanding of our faith. If I seem upset by times, it's my frustration that Adventists have embraced these spurious doctrines and are ignoring the clear council of sister White regarding this very thing happening. I am happy to see that there are others that do hold to these beliefs and it is only because of them that I continue to come in here. I thought, when I joined up, that I would be able to come in and fellowship with likeminded brethren and to seek edification to counter the opposition of the world.

    You've been a member on these boards for 5 years Crib. I don't know that you have been coming to the Adventist room for that long but if you have, you surely would have found what you are looking for... and yes, I do remember you unique circumstances but I would bet you don't argue doctrine with your Adventist church members like you do here...
     
  16. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    Yes you are looking for a fight. I dont care what belief you're interested in. You could hold fast to the pillars of Hell, but that does not give you or me reason to throw anyone out of a Christian Forum.
    You have two choices, continue to butt into my conversations and attack me, or try to have peaceful dialog with all those who come here. You have no authority to speak for others or to change the rules of this forum.
    Have a good day.:cool:
     
  17. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    Really? What are the conditions?
     
  18. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    It depends on what you mean by conditional. You cant do nothing and be saved. You have to hear the Gospel and believe in it. The evidence of your faith would be repenting of sin, baptism, and living by the doctrines of faith.

    Act 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
    Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.
    Act 16:32 And they spake unto him the word of the Lord, and to all that were in his house.
    Act 16:33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed [their] stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, straightway.

    I know your question somehow implies that keeping the law is a condition of salvation.
     
  19. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

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    How am I throwing anyone out of the forum Crib? I simply asked why you come into a room where you don't agree with the doctrine?
     
  20. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    You're not interested in my point of view.....but you attack me by injecting yourself into my dialog with others. I dont care about your superSDA ego..... I really have nothingelse to say about all this.:cool:

    Have a good day:thumbsup:
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2011
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