Gay Sex in Politics

[Jenny_8675309]

None of that addresses what I said: A fact all agree on is that wherever homosexual behavior is mentioned in the Bible it is condemned.

I just provided you an example of someone disagreeing. I appreciate you'd really like this to be something everyone agrees on, but that is not the case.

 

[ken777]

I suppose that is technically true.....

My point is that:
22 You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination.
means that one person is sleeping with both genders and not what peoples like it to mean.

I don't think the scholars who provided us with the NIV were all homophobic, and it does seem pretty clear:

"Do not have sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman; that is detestable."

 

[SkyWriting]

It has nothing to do with hate. I love my children but I would teach them that if they have homosexual inclinations they should resist them, just as I would tell a married friend or child that if they are sexually attracted to someone other than their spouse they should resist the temptation. We all have temptations and we should be encouraged to flee these temptations and seek to do God's will.

Do you wish Gay people to ask you to resist your heterosexual inclinations?
If so, then you may insult them as well.
That's what scripture says.

 

[Adstar]

But it actually means promiscuous behavior, not orientation.

Nope.. the scriptures clearly reveal it is about men having sexual intercorse with men and that it is an abomination to God and thus a sin..

 

[ken777]

I just provided you an example of someone disagreeing. I appreciate you'd really like this to be something everyone agrees on, but that is not the case.

You need to read what you linked because it does not contradict my statement that all agree wherever homosexual behavior is mentioned in the Bible it is condemned. Perhaps I need to be more explicit: homosexual behavior refers to two people of the same gender engaging in a sexual act with each other.

Your article does refer to people of the same gender who loved each other but it does not say they were engaging in sexual acts. When an article as pro-gay as that one cannot provide evidence of homosexual acts you can be very sure it does not exist.

 

[ken777]

The bible considers such matters to be private.

Not that private: "Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain".

 

[JLB777]

As a Christian are we bound to the laws of the old testament? or do we live under a new covenant?

This statement shows your lack of understanding of what old and new means, and the covenant were have been grafted into through faith in Christ Jesus.


Here's a hint:

Why do you suppose we who are in Christ, are called Abraham's seed?


And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Galatians 3:29


Even if you don't understand the old and new covenant, the verse I quoted is from the new testament.


Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 1 Corinthians 6:9


Homosexuality is an abomination, in the New Testament.


Here is the fate of the abominable:


But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.” Revelation 21:8



JLB

 

[Thursday]

Procreation isn't automatically redemptive.

And therefore...?

 

[Thursday]

The bible considers such matters to be private.

False. The bible explicitly condemns homosexual acts.

 

[SBC]

which is relevant how?

God reveals His creation, (male and female) and its intended purpose (male and female wife to be joined as one flesh).

You should have discovered it is a preparation for mankind to be joined together in One body of Christ.

​

were all of the men of Sodom homosexuals? All of them?

Pretty clear; All the men, of all ages, were wicked, sinners, with grievous sin.

Gen 13 [13] But the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the LORD exceedingly.

Gen 18 [20] And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous;

Gen 19 [4] But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:

Gen 18 [32] And he said, Oh let not the Lord be angry, and I will speak yet but this once: Peradventure ten shall be found there. And he said, I will not destroy it for ten's sake.

Were 10 spared? Doesn't say so.

If they were then why did Lot offer up his daughters for the men to "know"?

Because what was being revealed is the intentions of the wicked men of the city ~
being the wicked men intending to TAKE Lots male guests by FORCE to have sex with them.

The FORCE (by the men of the city) is revealed;

Gen 19
[4] But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter:
[5] And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.
[6] And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him,

[9] And they said, Stand back. And they said again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a judge: now will we deal worse with thee, than with them. And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and came near to break the door.

The plea of Lot, for the men to not doing wickedness, but instead, do what is righteous; Lot offered his Daughters to the men; to take them to wife; and know them (sexually).

Gen 19
[7] And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.

[8] Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing;

[/QUOTE] and bible also said that:[/QUOTE]

Eating shellfish is an abomination Lev 11:9-12
Having a Christmas tree is an abomination Lev. 18:30
Snacking on four legged insects is an abomination Lev 11:20 (I know there aren’t any but if there were I bet they would be tasty.)
Wanting to win the lottery is an abomination Deut 7:25
Reading your daily horoscope is an abomination Deut 18:11-12
Incense is an abomination Isaiah 1:13
Remarriage after divorce is an abomination Deut 24:1-4
A woman wearing pants is an abomination Deut 22:5
Having your way with another man’s concubine, without permission, is an abomination Judges 20:6 (it’s OK if you ask first)
Thinking that you are a better Christian than someone else is an abomination Proverbs 6:16-19 and Proverbs 11:20

and about 90 other things that are abominations.

Do you do any of these things?

Sure, some of those things I do. Are they an abomination unto me? No.
Because I KNOW and UNDERSTAND, what applies to WHOM, WHEN, and WHY.

As a Christian are we bound to the laws of the old testament?

Well? Are you a Hebrew, that specific LAWS were given to the Hebrews?
Well? Are you an earthly born man, that OT knowledge concerning ALL men, apply to you? If so, Did something notify you, otherwise?

or do we live under a new covenant?

Covenant ie promises.

There were particular "promises" made between God and particular "Hebrews/Jews".

Later there are particular "promises" made between God and particular "Gentiles".

If you are in understanding: Old, New, Hebrew, Jew, Gentile ~ all hinges on the individual trusting and believing and committed faithfulness to the Word of God.

you left out the part about how they are to be killed.

Be specific what you are asking. "they are killed" for what?

you left out the part where it was God who did this to those people.

God creates Body's. Body's have a mind, that can freely decide and choose; to submit to Gods Truth, or submit to their own truth.

Meaning God makes people homosexual.

No. God does not "MAKE" people homosexuals. God ALLOWS men to decide what they will or will not subject themselves to.

define effeminate

having feminine qualities untypical of a man :
not manly in appearance or manner.

feminate ~ equal to feminine, female, woman
ef - (prefix, before an f) ~ equal to making what was NOT feminine, to, being feminine.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[Jenny_8675309]

You need to read what you linked because it does not contradict my statement that all agree wherever homosexual behavior is mentioned in the Bible it is condemned. Perhaps I need to be more explicit: homosexual behavior refers to two people of the same gender engaging in a sexual act with each other.

Your article does refer to people of the same gender who loved each other but it does not say they were engaging in sexual acts. When an article as pro-gay as that one cannot provide evidence of homosexual acts you can be very sure it does not exist.

This is called "shifting the goal posts, what you're doing. No one was talking about "evidence of homosexual acts", I said people disagree with your position. And they do. As has been demonstrated.

 

[Jenny_8675309]

False. The bible explicitly condemns homosexual acts.

It ARGUABLY condemns homosexual acts, in certain circumstances. Not the same thing.

 

[SBC]

I appreciate what you think is the focus, but you will be very hard pressed to
find supporting reasons for what you think is the "real" issue.

The number one rules is that love wins.

The OP is about a behavior. Not an ardent "feeling" or extent of a "mans passion."

God IS LOVE, thus that IS His Spiritual super-natural essence.
Man IS a natural sinful thing, thus he must learn and develop a "feeling" that equates to LOVE.
Men can LOVE one thing, and LOATH another thing.
God can ONLY LOVE all of His creations, PERIOD.
And what Jesus taught is: for men to also, LOVE all of Gods mankind creations.

And additionally;
God can HATE, Things which some men do.
Men can HATE, Things which other men do.

And be informed of what HATE means ~ which is a strong dislike.

God is not secretive of what He LOVES and what HE HATES.
But the OP is not about Gods LOVE. It is about a behavior that God HATES.

And the debate and discussion is between;
Men WHO also, like God HATE the homosexual behavior;
Men WHO don't hate homosexual behavior;
Men WHOSE intent is to make homosexual behavior acceptable (for all kinds of mindful reasoning - from scripture is not opposed to it - to - it's Gods fault for making them homosexuals) <--- all psychobabble.

You will find that overrules hatred every time.

Already known, and not the topic.

So now you have to explain why you (or scripture) hates this one type
of sin.

No I do not. Scripture is clear. At no time is ANY (kind, type as you say) of sin acceptable or Loved by God.

Can you list the reasons why same gender sex would matter to God?

Because He has decided, determined, what is HIS WILL.

Gen 1
[27] So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Gen 3
[24] Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

Gen 1
[22] And God blessed them, saying, Be fruitful, and multiply

Does God hate infertile couples?

Scripture doesn't say that is so.

Does God hate women after menopause?

Scripture doesn't say that is so.

Does God hate certain sex techniques used by both types of couples?

Does scripture give you a graphic run down on such?

What exactly it it that God hates about same sex couples?

Sheesh -
Their choice, engaging in sex, fostering their preference, being proud of their preference, rejecting His Word....need more exact objections?

It took me 20 years to figure this out, so I don't expect any surprise conversions. 15 of those years living in a gay neighborhood.

Not news, everyone learns at a different pace.

God Bless,
SBC

 

[Thursday]

It ARGUABLY condemns homosexual acts, in certain circumstances. Not the same thing.

Show me one case where homosexuality is mentioned and not condemned as wrong.

 

[Cuddles333]

Before any Christians even discusses this topic with other Christians, they must know the definition of some Old Testament ancient Hebrew words, and the definition of some New Testament Koine Greek words. Without knowing the definitions, the results are many very lengthy threads that go nowhere.
Many Christians seem to be unaware that there are 3 Hebrew words, each with a slight but important definition to the English word abomination. The Hebrew word towebah is used 85% of the time and in all the passages quoted per this subject. It always means 'disgusting idolatry'. Many Christians have been mistaught that the Hebrew words Sheqets or Shiqquwts are used in the passages under consideration, but they are not.
To see how important certain Hebrew and Koine greek words come out in a Debate, look in our Formal Debate forum here at CF under the LGBT thread.

 

[JackRT]

What exactly it it that God hates about same sex couples?

I think that most of the "God hates .... " that are found in the Bible simply reflect societal norms at a particular time and place in history.

 

[JackRT]

It's not in most translations.

The first known use of the word "homosexual" in English was in 1892.

 

[SkyWriting]

I think that most of the "God hates .... " that are found in the Bible simply reflect societal norms at a particular time and place in history.

Like slimy water things?

New American Standard Bible
'Whatever in the water does not have fins and scales is abhorrent to you.

King James Bible
Whatsoever hath no fins nor scales in the waters, that shall be an abomination unto you.

Holman Christian Standard Bible
Everything in the water that does not have fins and scales will be detestable to you."

 

[SkyWriting]

The first known use of the word "homosexual" in English was in 1892.

And my point being that the classification scripture is aiming at is "sexually reckless" not preferences. "Sexually reckless" or promiscuous people cause psychological and physical damage to themselves and society. This is even spelled out:

Ezekiel 16
49"Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had arrogance, abundant food and careless ease, but she did not help the poor and needy.

 

[SkyWriting]

Sheesh -
Their choice, engaging in sex, fostering their preference, being proud of their preference, rejecting His Word....need more exact objections?

Gosh, you failed the basics, all spelled out:
48"As I live," declares the Lord GOD, "Sodom, your sister and her daughters have not done as you and your daughters have done. 49"Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had arrogance, abundant food and careless ease, but she did not help the poor and needy.