FLAT or ROUND Earth?

[trophy33]

To be both something owing its truth to God Himself, and at the same time to be "a mythological drama. Addressed to Babylonian Jews."? I don;t see how.

Imagine that somebody wrote a Scripture today and did a cultural reference to Batman or Star Wars. Somebody 3,000 years in the future will have two options:
a) to study our culture to understand the genre and meaning of the reference
b) to be ignorant of our culture and to come with some absurd interpretations like that there was a real Batman or the Galactic Empire

It is the same thing with the Genesis cultural concepts (Giants, Sons of God, Flood, Babel, Eden, serpent, dust, primordial waters, firmament...).

 

[David Lamb]

So the phrase "God said" isn't a how to you?

Yes of course. But no further details are given (apart from in certain cases, such as Eve).

Even following that line of logic, there is still no way to reconcile the Earth being as old as it and with the history it shows, and the short time frame and the order of creation that Genesis shows. So a literal Genesis account is incorrect as literal fact and history.

That is why many Christians do believe in a relatively "young" earth.

 

[David Lamb]

Imagine that somebody wrote a Scripture today and did a cultural reference to Batman or Star Wars. Somebody 3,000 years in the future will have two options:
a) to study our culture to understand the genre and meaning of the reference
b) to be ignorant of our culture and to come with some absurd interpretations like that there was a real Batman or the Galactic Empire

What a strange way to understand the bible. As I have said, we don't rely only on Genesis for believing in God as Creator. There is no indication that the Psalmist, the apostle John, or other human writers of the word of God, were making reference to a contemporary equivalent of Batman or Star Wars.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

Yes of course. But no further details are given (apart from in certain cases, such as Eve).

It's still a how, and to the ancient Jews and ancient people in general, that would be more than enough for them.

That is why many Christians do believe in a relatively "young" earth.

'Many' is overstating the numbers I feel, and the accepted 6000 year timeframe that many YEC's accept is not 'relatively' young but astronomically young, enough to make anything considered ancient history impossible. There's places in the UK that show human settlement that somehow occurred right when God created everything. So something is wrong.

 

[trophy33]

What a strange way to understand the bible. As I have said, we don't rely only on Genesis for believing in God as Creator. There is no indication that the Psalmist, the apostle John, or other human writers of the word of God, were making reference to a contemporary equivalent of Batman or Star Wars.

There is plenty of cultural references in Genesis. You just need to learn about their culture to see them. Without that, you will think they are literal history - and you will get yourself into absurd positions. Similar to believing in the Galactic Empire.

It is not that hard to learn what they thought about and how they symbolically used serpents, dust, waters, numbers like 7, abyss, temples, towers, main rivers, genealogies... The Flood and similar concepts are not "God's revealed history", but a common ancient mythological theme, for example.

I see it as disrespectful towards the Bible when somebody refuses to learn about its context.

 

[trophy33]

But those who believe as I do don't rely only on Genesis. Other passages of the bible, such as John 1, support the teaching that God created all things. The apostle John was not a Babylonian Jew, nor was he writing a mythological drama. He explains His reason for writing:

“And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.” (Joh 20:30-31 NKJV)

John's creation description is not mythological, it is philosophical. A different culture, different times, different audience, different concepts.

In his culture, it was not "in" to use the mythological cosmic waters, for example. On the other hand, it was culturally "in" to use the term Logos. If you had some Philosophy subject in college, you know why:

Philo - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Again, when John talks about Logos, he is not revealing something foreign to his readers. He is just referring to the common cultural concepts and gives them the Christian spin - identifying the Logos with Jesus Christ. Similarly, the Jewish authors of Genesis 1 gave their Mesopotamian cultural concepts the Yahwist spin.

 

[d taylor]

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News Headlines

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Musk Says He Wants To Send Rocket To Mars Next Year, With Human Missions As Soon As 2029
-----------------------------------
Elon Musk's Plan to Put a Million Earthlings on Mars in 20 Years

When will the lies get too big to be believed by humanity, does not look like anytime soon.

 

[Michie]

Elon Musk Says He Wants To Send Humans To Mars As Soon As 2029

Musk—who has a history of setting unrealized goals for his companies—says he wants to send humans to Mars by 2029, though he says 2031 may be more likely.

www.forbes.com

 

[dlamberth]

What mystical aspect do you have in mind?

The "inner experiential" aspect.

 

[Hans Blaster]

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News Headlines

​

Musk Says He Wants To Send Rocket To Mars Next Year, With Human Missions As Soon As 2029
-----------------------------------
Elon Musk's Plan to Put a Million Earthlings on Mars in 20 Years

When will the lies get too big to be believed by humanity, does not look like anytime soon.

If vaporware could power rockets, Musk would have made it to Mars years ago.

 

[Apple Sky]

Elon Musk Says He Wants To Send Humans To Mars As Soon As 2029

Musk—who has a history of setting unrealized goals for his companies—says he wants to send humans to Mars by 2029, though he says 2031 may be more likely.

www.forbes.com

Will he succeed ?

 

[d taylor]

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Maybe it will be rich people and their ego that will eventually expose the globe, outer space, etc.. lie

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

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Maybe it will be rich people and their ego that will eventually expose the globe, outer space, etc.. lie

Does salvation really depend on there being a flat earth?

 

[Michie]

Does salvation really depend on there being a flat earth?

No.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

No.

To be fair, I want to see what they have to say on the matter.

 

[Michie]

To be fair, I want to see what they have to say on the matter.

Well that’s my plop in the bucket.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Minnesota Republicans elect a flat-earther to a party leadership post​

 

[d taylor]

Does salvation really depend on there being a flat earth?

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No, there is only one condition that a person must meet to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life, belief in Jesus.

And that is not believing Jesus was an actual person or really existed, but believing Jesus is who He says He is.

Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

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No, there is only one condition that a person must meet to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life, belief in Jesus.

And that is not believing Jesus was an actual person or really existed, but believing Jesus is who He says He is.

Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live. And whoever lives and believes in Me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

So... there really is no need for Christians to accept a flat earth then.

 

[d taylor]

So... there really is no need for Christians to accept a flat earth then.

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No reason relating to eternal life salvation.

But God does like to be believed and that would include God's creation accounts given in The Bible.