Earth Tilt Question

[juvenissun]

Might be interesting to link to this thread whenever Juve starts doing it again.

No need to do that. If you want to learn geology, I will teach you. Until you also say that I am not a geologist (I forgot if you said that before).

I don't have to be consistent on who I am in this forum, as long as I am consistent on the content of my opinion.

 

[juvenissun]

No, I'm not a scientist. Long way from being a scientist. More theologian than scientist, but my first profession was teaching language and literature. Then I got into social action for justice, teaching and mobilizing Christians to "speak truth to power". I didn't even get interested in science much until I saw what bad theology creationism is built on.

No, forbidden fruit has to do with knowing good and evil -- knowing what to do with the power knowledge gives us. When we use knowledge selfishly to reward ourselves, that is sin and having eaten the forbidden fruit we know it is sin.

But just knowing what we know about creation is not a problem. Adam and Eve would have to know what was necessary to know about plants and animals to carry out their task of caring for the garden. Also, the bible doesn't say that they had to learn about farming when they were expelled from the garden so they must already have had that scientific knowledge.

You impressed me as one who knows how to argue about science. To me, that is enough to be called a scientist.

OK, a theological question: How could we tell good from evil? It is a deep question. But a shallow answer (necessary, but not sufficient) is that we need to know how to do analysis (to know right and wrong). So, to me, the forbidden fruit gives us the ability of logic thinking. After the sin, we can analyze well in addition to just feel. This is an ability and has nothing to do with data. So Adam may have some knowledge (by experience?), and some abilities (created) before he sinned , but he did not need the ability of analysis to live in the perfect Garden.

Science would not be science without analysis. That is why I said the forbidden fruit gives us the ability of doing science.

 

[Orogeny]

You said I am not a geologist. I admitted it.

If you want to learn geology, I will teach you.

 

[Papias]

And Orogeny, don't forget:

Juvie wrote:

I don't have to be consistent on who I am in this forum, as long as I am consistent on the content of my opinion.

my bold. Wow, yet another admission not just of outright deception, but of the view that lying is OK. Gotta love them creationists, who say that accepting evolution causes moral decay.




Papias

 

[The Lady Kate]

No need to do that. If you want to learn geology, I will teach you. Until you also say that I am not a geologist (I forgot if you said that before).

Who's going to teach you?

I don't have to be consistent on who I am in this forum, as long as I am consistent on the content of my opinion.

So, as long as you have a consistent opinion, the rest of us should overlook the fact that you have no training, no background, no credentials, and no basis for your opinion?

Right, sonny... let us know if anyone falls for that.

 

[juvenissun]

Who's going to teach you?



So, as long as you have a consistent opinion, the rest of us should overlook the fact that you have no training, no background, no credentials, and no basis for your opinion?

Right, sonny... let us know if anyone falls for that.

If a "system" of opinion is consistent, then it may have something worth to consider. For example, Ahmadinejad consistently said that there is no Holocaust. Of course, in this case, he did have some training and background.

 

[The Lady Kate]

If a "system" of opinion is consistent, then it may have something worth to consider. For example, Ahmadinejad consistently said that there is no Holocaust. Of course, in this case, he did have some training and background.

So... your opinion on geology is as valid as Ahmadinejad's opinion on the Holocaust?

You know, I actually agree with you on that.

 

[juvenissun]

So... your opinion on geology is as valid as Ahmadinejad's opinnion on the Holocaust?

You know, I actually agree with you on that.

Your ability of logic connection continuously amazed me. It is very creative and interesting. I suggest you to write to Sarah Palin and volunteer yourself to her. You may find an important job in her campaign.

 

[The Lady Kate]

Your ability of logic connection continuously amazed me. It is very creative and interesting. I suggest you to write to Sarah Palin and volunteer yourself to her. You may find an important job in her campaign.

You're the one who compared your own opinion to Ahmadinejad's.

Why drag Palin into it? Can she see Iran from her house?

 

[juvenissun]

You're the one who compared your own opinion to Ahmadinejad's.

Why drag Palin into it? Can she see Iran from her house?

I am trying to do what you were doing.

 

[The Lady Kate]

I am trying to do what you were doing.

Considering that you don't even know what I'm doing, your attempt to copy it only embarasses yourself further.

 

[Papias]

We are drifting yet again. We were last discussing #8, with specific reference to post #302, where it was shown to Juvie that the actual pole shifting that has been studied has nothing to do with the pseudoscientific tectonic dancing he is apparently advocating. So in an attempt to get us off the Juvie-go-round, here is our current list. Juvie, on #8, after spending well over a month thinking about post #302, can you now see that real pole shifting has nothing to do with a global flood?
***************************************************

• Earth tilt thread question #1 (ETQ #1)Doe Juve think that the earth is about 6,000 years old, as described by a literal reading of the geneologies in genesis (see post #161)? ****answered - he does - correction - unclear again. He says the ages are literally correct, but that they aren't literally correct. See other thread. *******
• ETQ2: Which Bible has Juve chosen as the one correct Bible, and why does he feel this one Bible is correct and the others wrong? (See post #161)
• ETQ3: Juve, would you like to change your enthusiatically favororable review of this site?
  World Mysteries - Science Mysteries - Pole Shifting
• ETQ4: What are you talking about in this quote:

May be. But at least they think it that way. You do not even think that way. This is similar to a church goer and one who does not attend any church. (maybe just drop this one, it appears to be just another example of Juvie's word salad.)

• ETQ5: Can you clarify which ideas you see as "good ideas" in your pseudoscience pole shifting web page?
• ETQ6: So you are saying that birds were created before any land animals, etc? Do you think the fossil record agrees with the order in genesis?
  ETQ7: How are you resolving the literal difference between the plants made before humans in Gen 1, and plants literally only after humans in Gen 2, without adding words that are not in the text? Or do you think it is OK to add words when you want to? Of course, if Juve decides it is OK to see Genesis figuratively, then these two stories can be seen as just two sides of the same story.
  
  ETQ8: You said you were evaluating all models of the origin of Earth tilt. We've seen that the flood idea of Earth tilt not only has too many problems to count, but has been dropped even by creationists. So why not tentatively accept the leading scientific explanation, the theia impact?

 

[juvenissun]

We are drifting yet again. We were last discussing #8, with specific reference to post #302, where it was shown to Juvie that the actual pole shifting that has been studied has nothing to do with the pseudoscientific tectonic dancing he is apparently advocating. So in an attempt to get us off the Juvie-go-round, here is our current list. Juvie, on #8, after spending well over a month thinking about post #302, can you now see that real pole shifting has nothing to do with a global flood?

I heard people said the recent Chilean earthquake shifted the earth axis a little bit. Can you see this news echoed my suggestion which was made before the earthquake?

God gives us wisdom so we can understand things without having data.

 

[The Lady Kate]

God gives us wisdom so we can understand things without having data.

Understand things without learning about them? I can see the appeal...

 

[juvenissun]

Understand things without learning about them? I can see the appeal...

Confucius said: " I do not know more than a farmer ..."

 

[philadiddle]

God gives us wisdom so we can understand things without having data.

So did you get your degree in geology directly from God?

 

[Orogeny]

Confucius said: " I do not know more than a farmer ..."

Yes, but Confucius didn't farm, and the farmer didn't deal in philosophy. Their knowledge was equal, simply in differing disciplines. To say that either is unlearned would be false.

 

[Papias]

Juvie wrote:

I heard people said the recent Chilean earthquake shifted the earth axis a little bit. Can you see this news echoed my suggestion which was made before the earthquake?

News flash for Juvie - EVERY non-equatorial movement of matter to or from the axis changes the axis of rotation and the length of the day. So when you went to the bathroom yesterday, you changed the axis of rotation. The chilean quake is the same, only on a larger scale, which as you saw is still insignificant. The only reason the chilean quake was mentioned in the news in that regard was because that change was barely detectable with extremely sensitive instruments.

All that has nothing to do with the myth of a global flood. The fact that you can't tell the difference between the new age "pole shifting" stuff and the sensitive measurements discussed there and elsewhere shows that you don't seem to understand orders of magnitude. You say things about yourself here that are much worse than anything others could say about you.

Now, back to our list:
Juvie, on #8, after spending well over a month thinking about post #302, can you now see that real pole shifting (like the chilean quake or your actions yesterday) has nothing to do with a global flood?
***************************************************

• Earth tilt thread question #1 (ETQ #1)Doe Juve think that the earth is about 6,000 years old, as described by a literal reading of the geneologies in genesis (see post #161)? ****answered - he does - correction - unclear again. He says the ages are literally correct, but that they aren't literally correct. See other thread. *******
• ETQ2: Which Bible has Juve chosen as the one correct Bible, and why does he feel this one Bible is correct and the others wrong? (See post #161)
• ETQ3: Juve, would you like to change your enthusiatically favororable review of this site?
  World Mysteries - Science Mysteries - Pole Shifting
• ETQ4: What are you talking about in this quote:

May be. But at least they think it that way. You do not even think that way. This is similar to a church goer and one who does not attend any church. (maybe just drop this one, it appears to be just another example of Juvie's word salad.)

• ETQ5: Can you clarify which ideas you see as "good ideas" in your pseudoscience pole shifting web page?
• ETQ6: So you are saying that birds were created before any land animals, etc? Do you think the fossil record agrees with the order in genesis?
  ETQ7: How are you resolving the literal difference between the plants made before humans in Gen 1, and plants literally only after humans in Gen 2, without adding words that are not in the text? Or do you think it is OK to add words when you want to? Of course, if Juve decides it is OK to see Genesis figuratively, then these two stories can be seen as just two sides of the same story.
  
  ETQ8: You said you were evaluating all models of the origin of Earth tilt. We've seen that the flood idea of Earth tilt not only has too many problems to count, but has been dropped even by creationists. So why not tentatively accept the leading scientific explanation, the theia impact?

 

[juvenissun]

Juvie wrote:



News flash for Juvie - EVERY non-equatorial movement of matter to or from the axis changes the axis of rotation and the length of the day. So when you went to the bathroom yesterday, you changed the axis of rotation. The chilean quake is the same, only on a larger scale, which as you saw is still insignificant. The only reason the chilean quake was mentioned in the news in that regard was because that change was barely detectable with extremely sensitive instruments.

All that has nothing to do with the myth of a global flood. The fact that you can't tell the difference between the new age "pole shifting" stuff and the sensitive measurements discussed there and elsewhere shows that you don't seem to understand orders of magnitude. You say things about yourself here that are much worse than anything others could say about you.

I still talk to you because I still feel your attitude is acceptable. If you keep pulling me personally into the argument, I may want to stop the whole conversation. From the beginning, you seems to be more interested in trapping me than to talk about issues.

Do you know you can make the same high grade coal from low grade coal in two ways: Heat it up real quick and then stop. Or, heat it very very slowly for a much longer time.

Can you relate what I said above as an answer to your argument?

 

[The Lady Kate]

I still talk to you because I still feel your attitude is acceptable. If you keep pulling me personally into the argument, I may want to stop the whole conversation.

One can only hope.