Doctrines of Devils?

[claninja]

Close but no cigar.
Look into it, if you want to know the truth.
Don't bother, if you don't care.

This was a hypothetical question, so I don't really understand your response

 

[amariselle]

Did you notice the topic of the title, and the op, and the thread ? (of course you did).

Why do you think there is here such controversy over TORAH ?
It is because the devil hates it.

See in the title "doctrines of devils" ?

Now, do you think you should obey man's laws, and NOT OBEY GOD ? if so, why ?

And, if you do obey man's laws, then why not obey God's Laws, which are much better ?

Who do you think started the doctrines of devils, opposed to God's Laws, opposed to God's Word, opposed to Salvation, and opposed to Jesus ?

I actually started this thread....

If you go back and re-read the OP, you'll see what the topic is actually about.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Well, that would be between each person and God. We don't have any way of discerning whether that is truly the case in someone else's life.

When we read the New Testamen Epistles, God's Word, God's Instructions,

we see it is not just between each person and God. Along with many warnings for each other.

God also says in His Word how to discern when a person is outside of God's Will, when a person is opposed to God, when a person is opposed to Jesus,
and when they are blameless, pleasing to the Father, and when they are obedient to the Gospel of Jesus --- it is all written out in the BIBLE for us to know, for all who are immersed in Jesus Name and dwell in union with Him.

 

[amariselle]

When we read the New Testamen Epistles, God's Word, God's Instructions,

we see it is not just between each person and God. Along with many warnings for each other.

God also says in His Word how to discern when a person is outside of God's Will, when a person is opposed to God, when a person is opposed to Jesus,
and when they are blameless, pleasing to the Father, and when they are obedient to the Gospel of Jesus --- it is all written out in the BIBLE for us to know, for all who are immersed in Jesus Name and dwell in union with Him.

Again, you need to take the time to understand in context what is being discussed here and what I was actually saying.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

So if the American cancer association starts telling people to abstain from meat, as processed meat is a group 1 carcinogen, than they would be of the devil?

This was a hypothetical question, so I don't really understand your response

It is still a good and valid question. Most people never learn the truth. (the answer)

 

[Goatee]

Yes. I agree.

Also, we search the Scriptures to be sure that what we are told or experience is in accordance with his word. It believe that is so very important.

But, you have to be careful of how you interpret what you read!

 

[Soyeong]

Are we still under the Law?

As followers of God, we are still under God's Law by grace through faith, and not under the law of sin. In Romans 7:21-25, Paul said that he delighted in obeying God's Law and that he served it with his mind, but contrasted that with the Law of sin that held him captive that he served with his flesh. This is a summary statement of what was said previously, so it is important to correctly determine which of the two he is talk about. It is the law of sin that came about to increase tresspasses (5:20), that stirs up sinful passions to bear fruit unto death (7:5), that held us captive (7:6), that gave sin its power (7:8), that deceived him through the commandment and through it killed him (7:11), and that caused him not to do the good that he wanted to do (7:13-20), while God's Law is not sin, but reveals to us what sin is (7:7), is holy, righteous, and good (7:12), is the good that Paul did not blame for bringing death to him (7:13), and is the good that he wanted to do (7:13-20). So based off of Paul's description of God's Law and the law of sin, we should be able to correctly identify which law is being talked about in these verses:

Romans 6:13-19 Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace. Slaves to Righteousness 15 What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! 16 Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17 But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, 18 and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness. 19 I am speaking in human terms, because of your natural limitations. For just as you once presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness leading to sanctification.

It's is God's Law that reveals to us how to avoid sin and how to do what is holy, righteous, and good, so in other words, it is God's instructions for how to present every part of ourselves as instruments of righteousness and how to avoid presenting any part of ourselves as instruments of unrighteousness. It's is not God's Law where sin had dominion over us, but rather God's Law reveals what sin is, while it is the law of sin that Paul described as being the law where sin had dominion over him, so we are not under the law of sin when we under under grace. According to Psalms 119:29, David asked God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His Law, so if we are under God's grace, then we are under God's Law. This is also confirmed in Titus 2:11-14, where it describes our salvation as grace training us to do what is godly, righteous, and good and to renounce doing what is ungodly and sinful, which is an accurate description of what God's Law was given to instruct us how to do. So it wouldn't make any sense to contrast God's Law with His grace, as if a house divided against itself could stand, and as if God were acting against His grace when He gave His Law, but rather God is gracious to us by teaching us how to rightly live and how to avoid sin. According to Romans 3:20, the law was given to make us conscious of sin, according to Romans 7:7, Paul wouldn't have even known what sin was if it weren't for the Law, and according to 1 John 3:4, sin is defined as Lawlessness, so it wouldn't make any sense for Paul to say that we aren't under God's Law, but under grace, and then say in Romans 6:15 that being under grace doesn't mean that we are permitted to do what God's Law reveals to be sin. We are to present ourselves to God as instruments of righteousness, which means that we need to follow His commands for how to practice righteousness. We are once slaves to sin, which the transgression of God's Law, but now we have been set free from living in transgression of God's Law in order to become slaves of righteousness. No more are we to present ourselves as slaves of impurity and Lawlessness leading to more Lawlessness, but now we are to present ourselves as slaves of righteousness leading to sanctification.

 

[Monk Brendan]

I think pretty much everyone knows the answer to that question. I'm not trying to avoid the question, however, as I said, this thread is not intended to target specific churches.

But there is only one major Christian Church that practices those specific "doctrines of demons"

BTW, there was, and is, still is another church that forbids marriage--and does all sorts of other unBiblical things, the United Society of Believers in Christ's Second Appearing, aka Shakers. Women teaching, dancing, all sorts of evil behavior.

 

[amariselle]

But, you have to careful of how you interpret what you read!

It's not for personal interpretation, nor should we simply take any one else's word for it, Scripture interprets Scripture.

 

[faroukfarouk]

As followers of God, we are still under God's Law by grace through faith, and not under the law of sin. In Romans 7:21-25, Paul said that he delighted in obeying God's Law and that he served it with his mind, but contrasted that with the Law of sin that held him captive that he served with his flesh. This is a summary statement of what was said previously, so it is important to correctly determine which of the two he is talk about. It is the law of sin that came about to increase tresspasses (5:20), that stirs up sinful passions to bear fruit unto death (7:5), that held us captive (7:6), that gave sin its power (7:8), that deceived him through the commandment and through it killed him (7:11), and that caused him not to do the good that he wanted to do (7:13-20), while God's Law is not sin, but reveals to us what sin is (7:7), is holy, righteous, and good (7:12), is the good that Paul did not blame for bringing death to him (7:13), and is the good that he wanted to do (7:13-20). So based off of Paul's description of God's Law and the law of sin, we should be able to correctly identify which law is being talked about in these verses:

Romans 6:13-19 Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace. Slaves to Righteousness 15 What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! 16 Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17 But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, 18 and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness. 19 I am speaking in human terms, because of your natural limitations. For just as you once presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness leading to sanctification.

It's is God's Law that reveals to us how to avoid sin and how to do what is holy, righteous, and good, so in other words, it is God's instructions for how to present every part of ourselves as instruments of righteousness and how to avoid presenting any part of ourselves as instruments of unrighteousness. It's is not God's Law where sin had dominion over us, but rather God's Law reveals what sin is, while it is the law of sin that Paul described as being the law where sin had dominion over him, so we are not under the law of sin when we under under grace. According to Psalms 119:29, David asked God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His Law, so if we are under God's grace, then we are under God's Law. This is also confirmed in Titus 2:11-14, where it describes our salvation as grace training us to do what is godly, righteous, and good and to renounce doing what is ungodly and sinful, which is an accurate description of what God's Law was given to instruct us how to do. So it wouldn't make any sense to contrast God's Law with His grace, as if a house divided against itself could stand, and as if God were acting against His grace when He gave His Law, but rather God is gracious to us by teaching us how to rightly live. According to Romans 3:20, the law was given to make us conscious of sin, according to Romans 7:7, Paul wouldn't have even known what sin was if it weren't for the Law, and according to 1 John 3:4, sin is defined as Lawlessness, so it wouldn't make any sense for Paul to say that we aren't under God's Law, but under grace, and then say in Romans 6:15 that being under grace doesn't mean that we are permitted to do what God's Law reveals to be sin. We are to present ourselves to God as instruments of righteousness, which means that we need to follow His commands for how to practice righteousness. We are once slaves to sin, which the transgression of God's Law, but now we have been set free from living in transgression of God's Law in order to become slaves of righteousness. No more are we to present ourselves as slaves of impurity and Lawlessness leading to more Lawlessness, but now we are to present ourselves as slaves of righteousness leading to sanctification.

Romans is a wonderful, searching Epistle, which clearly explains the right basis for the believer's standing before God.

 

[amariselle]

But there is only one major Christian Church that practices those specific "doctrines of demons"

BTW, there was, and is, still is another church that forbids marriage--and does all sorts of other unBiblical things, the United Society of Believers in Christ's Second Appearing, aka Shakers. Women teaching, dancing, all sorts of evil behavior.

Remember, it is the Bible that calls the forbidding of marriage and abstaining from certain "meats" "doctrines of devils", not me.

This is not about my own personal opinion. I started this thread to take a look at Scripture, not how I personally feel about this matter.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

This has been truth for centuries. Nothing new about this. Still yes, a good subject, as most people are not aware that the whole world is deceived. Most people never find out.

"Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

====================================================

If the Bible says that forbidding to marry and commanding that people "abstain" from meats are "doctrines of devils", why do so many Christians accept these restrictions (often commanded and imposed by church leadership) as actually from God Himself?

Thoughts?

Why are people deceived ? Basically because they choose to be, they want to be, according to Scripture (much Scripture, in Harmony with All Scripture, and perfectly in line with God's Plan and Purpose of Salvation in Christ Jesus, as He Says) ...)
======================================================

It is wide spread (deception is), throughout society. Government, social, medical, finance, etc etc and of course religious. Exactly as written in Scripture (God's Word)

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

moved

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

God told Peter that it is okay to eat food that had been considered unclean for the Israelites since Old Testament times.

This also falls into the catagory of "doctrines of demons". btw.

 

[amariselle]

As followers of God, we are still under God's Law by grace through faith, and not under the law of sin. In Romans 7:21-25, Paul said that he delighted in obeying God's Law and that he served it with his mind, but contrasted that with the Law of sin that held him captive that he served with his flesh. This is a summary statement of what was said previously, so it is important to correctly determine which of the two he is talk about. It is the law of sin that came about to increase tresspasses (5:20), that stirs up sinful passions to bear fruit unto death (7:5), that held us captive (7:6), that gave sin its power (7:8), that deceived him through the commandment and through it killed him (7:11), and that caused him not to do the good that he wanted to do (7:13-20), while God's Law is not sin, but reveals to us what sin is (7:7), is holy, righteous, and good (7:12), is the good that Paul did not blame for bringing death to him (7:13), and is the good that he wanted to do (7:13-20). So based off of Paul's description of God's Law and the law of sin, we should be able to correctly identify which law is being talked about in these verses:

Romans 6:13-19 Do not present your members to sin as instruments for unrighteousness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life, and your members to God as instruments for righteousness. 14 For sin will have no dominion over you, since you are not under law but under grace. Slaves to Righteousness 15 What then? Are we to sin because we are not under law but under grace? By no means! 16 Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? 17 But thanks be to God, that you who were once slaves of sin have become obedient from the heart to the standard of teaching to which you were committed, 18 and, having been set free from sin, have become slaves of righteousness. 19 I am speaking in human terms, because of your natural limitations. For just as you once presented your members as slaves to impurity and to lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves to righteousness leading to sanctification.

It's is God's Law that reveals to us how to avoid sin and how to do what is holy, righteous, and good, so in other words, it is God's instructions for how to present every part of ourselves as instruments of righteousness and how to avoid presenting any part of ourselves as instruments of unrighteousness. It's is not God's Law where sin had dominion over us, but rather God's Law reveals what sin is, while it is the law of sin that Paul described as being the law where sin had dominion over him, so we are not under the law of sin when we under under grace. According to Psalms 119:29, David asked God to be gracious to him by teaching him to obey His Law, so if we are under God's grace, then we are under God's Law. This is also confirmed in Titus 2:11-14, where it describes our salvation as grace training us to do what is godly, righteous, and good and to renounce doing what is ungodly and sinful, which is an accurate description of what God's Law was given to instruct us how to do. So it wouldn't make any sense to contrast God's Law with His grace, as if a house divided against itself could stand, and as if God were acting against His grace when He gave His Law, but rather God is gracious to us by teaching us how to rightly live and how to avoid sin. According to Romans 3:20, the law was given to make us conscious of sin, according to Romans 7:7, Paul wouldn't have even known what sin was if it weren't for the Law, and according to 1 John 3:4, sin is defined as Lawlessness, so it wouldn't make any sense for Paul to say that we aren't under God's Law, but under grace, and then say in Romans 6:15 that being under grace doesn't mean that we are permitted to do what God's Law reveals to be sin. We are to present ourselves to God as instruments of righteousness, which means that we need to follow His commands for how to practice righteousness. We are once slaves to sin, which the transgression of God's Law, but now we have been set free from living in transgression of God's Law in order to become slaves of righteousness. No more are we to present ourselves as slaves of impurity and Lawlessness leading to more Lawlessness, but now we are to present ourselves as slaves of righteousness leading to sanctification.

Christ fulfilled the Law. He is the end of the Law for all who believe. If we still need to keep the Law to be saved, none of us will be saved. For by the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified.

 

[Monk Brendan]

This is not about my own personal opinion. I started this thread to take a look at Scripture, not how I personally feel about this matters.

A question, then. Why pick THIS particular part of Scripture to worry about? Do you think YOU are going to a church that practices the dogmas of demons? Are there not other planks in your eye that need cleaning out first, before trying to clean the speck out of others?

Just asking...

 

[amariselle]

This is why I asked several related questions, to find out why you started this thread, and to see if you understood how widespread the doctrines of demons , the deception, is. (apparently much more widespread than you ever realized yet, from all the posts so far )

This thread deals with Scripture verses that outline two different "doctrines of devils", the forbidding of marriage and of eating certain foods.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

If we still need to keep the Law to be saved, none of us will be saved. For by the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified.

This is a kind of doctrine of demons -
not that it specifically is, but it is used to oppose God's Word instead of to obey God's Word.

We don't obey God's Word in order to be saved. We obey JOYOUSLY and GLADLY and TOTALLY WILLINGLY because we are GOD'S CHILDREN BORN AGAIN BY HIM !!!!!!!!!!!!
as written throughout His Word.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

This thread deals with Scripture verses that outline two different "doctrines of devils", the forbidding of marriage and of eating certain foods.

The OP and the Title and many of the posts.... but as just posted, there are other doctrines of demons also being posted about - all from the same source, as described in Scripture.

 

[faroukfarouk]

Christ fulfilled the Law. He is the end of the Law for all who believe. If we still need to keep the Law to be saved, none of us will be saved. For by the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified.

Well, exactly. This is right and Scriptural.