Do YOU have a crush on anyone? (59)

MehGuy

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I'm addressing your comments. Not societal perceptions.

I have a hard time believing this.

Do you believe that's true for most men or simply the ones you encountered growing up? I know many women who cook and their men aren't surviving on Hamburger Helper and the like.

Someone with a more discriminating palate is unlikely to tolerate that kind of fare for long. They'd insist on home cooked meals or have her take classes. Maybe their willingness to go along is a reflection of upbringing or an unsophisticated palate.

That's all I saw. I can only really think of one housewife that I admired somewhat.. although I only saw her a few times in my life.

Like I said before.. it doesn't start out like this. When a woman has babies and toddlers the work load can be daunting and needed.. just that little by little the men become more and more complacent with increasingly lazy behavior from their wives as the years go on. I doubt most of these men would have accepted her if that's how she acted from the start.

Would the same hold true for Mr. Mom's or do women have a monopoly on laziness? I'm hearing a consistent narrative. A continuous suggestion of feminine ineptitude I can't sanction.

No. Most of my friends outside of the Christian circles had working mothers.. I wouldn't call them lazy.

I'm not saying women are more inherently lazy than men.. just that society (and really biology) is more accepting of dead beat behavior when it comes from women.

If you were disparaging men I'd raise the same questions. But your hostility towards feminism makes men an unlikely target.

We'll see.. a year from now or whatever I'll make some negative comments about men.. and see what happens.

Christian men don't assume women are seeking to exploit them. They recognize good and bad apples in both sexes.

Christian men don't immerse themselves in anti-feminist rhetoric. They know the problem and seek compatible suitors. We don't treat one another like the enemy. That's a secular practice.

I know plenty of Christians who do immerse themselves in anti-feminist rhetoric. The Christian world has tons of fighting and infighting.. I don't see much of a difference between that world and the secular one.

All entertainment promotes unrealistic stereotypes because aspirational content converts more than the rest. The shtick doesn't matter. The method is the same. Sell them an ideal and they'll eat it up.

Yeah.. one is telling men to protect their family.. and the other is women getting their rocks off on being abused by handsome men. The shtick matters.

There's no recognition of personal responsibility in your remarks. The problems you're citing are easily avoided. If you value health, productivity, home cooked meals, and so on, choose someone who embodies those qualities from the start. That isn't hard to do.

If only things were that simple.. people change.

I think you're inferring a lot and neglecting a glaring truth. The flaws you're emphasizing may have been of no concern to their spouses during the mating period.

That's a common response from outsiders. You're judging according to your standard not the other person's. The behaviors may be grievous to you and unimportant to them. No one is perfect.

Nah.. I heard arguments occasionally from the husbands that the wife should at least get a part time job and the idea that she even work a little bit was met with anger and hostility.

Most men don't want a trophy wife that does nothing.. not that these women remotely resembled one, lol.
 
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DragonFox91

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Slasher films that depict beautiful young women being stabbed to death by usually deranged men are something I find creepy about male entertainment. The thing is that these kind of films are low in quantity.
The trope is it's the ones who sleep around. It's either a byproduct of earlier times & they were trying to teach a lesson, or maybe something darker.

Also, those don't sound like traditional women. They just sound like stay-at-home women. There's a difference.

EDIT: Oh, I see your most recent post where they just can't keep up w/ raising children too. Yes, I suppose that's possible.
Do you know if she is even available in the first place?
She's not in a relationship.
 
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DragonFox91

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Yeah.. one is telling men to protect their family.. and the other is women getting their rocks off on being abused by handsome men. The shtick matters.
Interesting. I must not be familiar w/ a lot of women's entertainment. Can you give some examples, other than 50 Shades?


Nah.. I heard arguments occasionally from the husbands that the wife should at least get a part time job and the idea that she even work a little bit was met with anger and hostility.
I still think a lot of stay-at-home moms who get a part-time job too do so not just b/c of money or anything, but b/c they're just that ambitious
 
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bèlla

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I have a hard time believing this.

That doesn't surprise me at all.

That's all I saw. I can only really think of one housewife that I admired somewhat.. although I only saw her a few times in my life.

What we see isn't all there is. You've encountered a sliver. When you address experiences from childhood it's difficult to perceive that others live differently. But they do. Your norm wasn't necessarily the norm. It was characteristic of the people in your environment during a specific period.

My examples were different. As was their life philosophy. Which explains it. My norm wasn't the norm either. That's true for everyone.

Like I said before.. it doesn't start out like this. When a woman has babies and toddlers the work load can be daunting and needed.. just that little by little the men become more and more complacent with increasingly lazy behavior from their wives as the years go on. I doubt most of these men would have accepted her if that's how she acted from the start.

What do you know about child-rearing? You can't speak for the daily realities of raising of child and running a home. You've never done it. All you have is secondary details. What you experienced as a non contributing member of the household, observer, and what you've read. You haven't lived it.

The rigors of parenting and life demands impact both. Neither are unscathed. A person with responsibilities beyond themselves will tell you the same. You haven't entered that realm. You're your only concern.

I'm not saying women are more inherently lazy than men.. just that society (and really biology) is more accepting of dead beat behavior when it comes from women.

I would eliminate that word from my vernacular. When you charge someone with being a deadbeat you shine a light on yourself. You go under the microscope. What qualifies you to make that assessment?

You're conversing with someone who spent significant time at home with her a child. Yet I've accomplished more than most. I'm not alone in that.

We'll see.. a year from now or whatever I'll make some negative comments about men.. and see what happens.

Feel free to tag me.

I know plenty of Christians who do immerse themselves in anti-feminist rhetoric. The Christian world has tons of fighting and infighting.. I don't see much of a difference between that world and the secular one.

I've been in the company of men of who speak like you. There's a difference between awareness and digesting an ideology and making it your mantra. That's where you differ.

Yeah.. one is telling men to protect their family.. and the other is women getting their rocks off on being abused by handsome men. The shtick matters.

If you're referring to Grey the qualifier was money. He wasn't an ordinary man. He was immensely wealthy. You couldn't sell that story without it.

Nah.. I heard arguments occasionally from the husbands that the wife should at least get a part time job and the idea that she even work a little bit was met with anger and hostility.

It depends on their agreement. You weren't around for that. Your analysis is incomplete.

Most men don't want a trophy wife that does nothing.. not that these women remotely resembled one, lol.

If you've never kept a woman you're depending on secondhand information. Responsibilities differ depending on the connection. Some men want a looking glass. Others want a socialite. Some need a power broker. She's a connector who makes inroads with wives and important people on his behalf.

It depends on the relationship and their goals.
 
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MehGuy

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Interesting. I must not be familiar w/ a lot of women's entertainment. Can you give some examples, other than 50 Shades?

The Lifetime channel is one. They're not always upfront about what they're about.. but when you watch enough of them.. you start getting this creepy romantic vibe behind them.

It all ties into the personality of a feminist. If you want to see an example of feminism drenched in masochism.. the Everyday Feminism website is pretty vile..
 
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MehGuy

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What we see isn't all there is. You've encountered a sliver. When you address experiences from childhood it's difficult to perceive that others live differently. But they do. Your norm wasn't necessarily the norm. It was characteristic of the people in your environment during a specific period.

Of course others live differently. I am talking about the statistical likelihood. I don't see too many people being above falling into laziness. This would include the men if society accepted behavior like that from them.

My examples were different. As was their life philosophy. Which explains it. My norm wasn't the norm either. That's true for everyone.

What do you know about child-rearing? You can't speak for the daily realities of raising of child and running a home. You've never done it. All you have is secondary details. What you experienced as a non contributing member of the household, observer, and what you've read. You haven't lived it.

It wasn't rocket science for me to figure out that my mother and other single mothers I stayed with hardly did anything all day. Being an observer is more than enough.

The rigors of parenting and life demands impact both. Neither are unscathed. A person with responsibilities beyond themselves will tell you the same. You haven't entered that realm. You're your only concern.

Can you give me an example of what a mother with children beyond the toddler years needs to do all day that compared to a full time job? Keep in mind.. I want things that are necessary. A housewife in theory could be working hard all day.. but in reality what is the bare limit they really have to do?

I would eliminate that word from my vernacular. When you charge someone with being a deadbeat you shine a light on yourself. You go under the microscope. What qualifies you to make that assessment?

Lol.

The courts will order men not to be deadbeats. Women not so much..

You're conversing with someone who spent significant time at home with her a child. Yet I've accomplished more than most. I'm not alone in that.

That's good for you.. I worry about the statistics of other men who get into this arrangement.

Feel free to tag me.

No, that'd spoil it.

I've been in the company of men of who speak like you. There's a difference between awareness and digesting an ideology and making it your mantra. That's where you differ.

Mantra? This stuff is shoved down my throat constantly.

If you're referring to Grey the qualifier was money. He wasn't an ordinary man. He was immensely wealthy. You couldn't sell that story without it.

No.. the excitement was bdsm. That's what made the series stand out. As far as 50 Shades go.. it's pretty tame compared to a lot women's entertainment. Grey would rank low on abusive men. I find him more comical than anything.

It depends on their agreement. You weren't around for that. Your analysis is incomplete.

Again.. this isn't rocket science to figure out.

If you've never kept a woman you're depending on secondhand information. Responsibilities differ depending on the connection. Some men want a looking glass. Others want a socialite. Some need a power broker. She's a connector who makes inroads with wives and important people on his behalf.

It depends on the relationship and their goals.

Most men don't want a partner that does the bare minimum. These women were nothing to look at, and they were not socialites. These men just fell into the fantasy and unfortunately had to wake up to the reality.
 
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bèlla

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Of course others live differently. I am talking about the statistical likelihood. I don't see too many people being above falling into laziness. This would include the men if society accepted behavior like that from them.

Women aren't statistically likely to become deadbeats because they're stay-at-home mothers.

It wasn't rocket science for me to figure out that my mother and other single mothers I stayed with hardly did anything all day. Being an observer is more than enough.

You're conflating your common denominator of inactivity with the sex. All women don't behave like your mother or those you encountered. We have different standards.

Can you give me an example of what a mother with children beyond the toddler years needs to do all day that compared to a full time job? Keep in mind.. I want things that are necessary. A housewife in theory could be working hard all day.. but in reality what is the bare limit they really have to do?

That's laughable. Most people don't work 35 hours without fail every week. There's a lot of downtime in the 8.

A mother's schedule is dependent on the workload, help, and the number of children she has. If she assumes all household responsibilities she needs to attend to the home, run errands, get grocery, make meals, get them dressed, put them down for naps, spend time together, etc.

Add in the possibility of sickness, moodiness, and the unexpected and the load increases. Mothers don't need to justify their time management. Their husbands entrust the home to their care while they work.

Embittered types may nickel and dime. But they should be avoided.

The courts will order men not to be deadbeats. Women not so much..

Your original comment didn't mention the courts. You accused stay-at-mothers of being deadbeats and having nothing to do.

This looks like a classic case of transference. Instead of addressing the problem with the women you were raised with you've projected it onto others. The elephant in the room are your personal experiences. Not the way other women behave. You're trying to affix those encounters onto others. Maybe that's too difficult to confront. Blaming other women is easier.

That's good for you.. I worry about the statistics of other men who get into this arrangement.

You're not going to talk anyone out of this. Providers have an ethos and disposition that won't be swayed. It's a badge of honor to care for their family. Including her.

Mantra? This stuff is shoved down my throat constantly.

You lap it up willingly and regurgitate without provocation. You beat the anti-feminism stick to death. It has become your identity.

No.. the excitement was bdsm. That's what made the series stand out. As far as 50 Shades go.. it's pretty tame compared to a lot women's entertainment. Grey would rank low on abusive men. I find him more comical than anything.

That's always been available. The packaging made the difference. Good looks and money diminished the taboo because they're ideals. That's why most leading men in romance novels are wealthy. That's what sells.

Aspirational content is a cash cow. It never goes out of style. You can take it to the bank.

Most men don't want a partner that does the bare minimum. These women were nothing to look at, and they were not socialites. These men just fell into the fantasy and unfortunately had to wake up to the reality.

When you look at relational problems you have to see both angles. You can't allow biases to blind you. Bad choices don't eliminate personal responsibility. You're letting them off the hook because you empathize. But it takes two to tangle.

Most aren't privy to the nitty gritty details of any partnership. You may overhear a few things or someone shares a detail. But you're still in the dark. Nobody tells you everything.
 
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MehGuy

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Women aren't statistically likely to become deadbeats because they're stay-at-home mothers.

I don't see why they're statistically not.. they're given a position that is most easily able to be abused..

You're conflating your common denominator of inactivity with the sex. All women don't behave like your mother or those you encountered. We have different standards.

If you want to get personal I can get personal too.

That's laughable. Most people don't work 35 hours without fail every week. There's a lot of downtime in the 8.

I won't even give stay at home mother's a part time job classification. Much less the work men do at home that feminist like to pretend doesn't exist.

A mother's schedule is dependent on the workload, help, and the number of children she has. If she assumes all household responsibilities she needs to attend to the home, run errands, get grocery, make meals, get them dressed, put them down for naps, spend time together, etc.

Add in the possibility of sickness, moodiness, and the unexpected and the load increases. Mothers don't need to justify their time management. Their husbands entrust the home to their care while they work.

I won't even give a typical stay at home mother's a part time job classification. Much less the work men do at home that feminist like to pretend doesn't exist.


Embittered types may nickel and dime. But they should be avoided.

It isn't nickel and dime.. it's being honest that their significant other's are practically bankrupt.

Your original comment didn't mention the courts. You accused stay-at-mothers of being deadbeats and having nothing to do.

My point being that men will face consequences for being deadbeats and women not as frequently.

This looks like a classic case of transference. Instead of addressing the problem with the women you were raised with you've projected it onto others. The elephant in the room are your personal experiences. Not the way other women behave. You're trying to affix those encounters onto others. Maybe that's too difficult to confront. Blaming other women is easier.

You're not going to talk anyone out of this. Providers have an ethos and disposition that won't be swayed. It's a badge of honor to care for their family. Including her.

My goal isn't to talk men out of anything.. but to hopefully be more informed.

You lap it up willingly and regurgitate without provocation. You beat the anti-feminism stick to death. It has become your identity.

Yeah.. I'm a man cursed with a backbone.

That's always been available. The packaging made the difference. Good looks and money diminished the taboo because they're ideals. That's why most leading men in romance novels are wealthy. That's what sells.

I agree the books managed to diminish the taboo.. the BDSM still remains the main attraction.

When you look at relational problems you have to see both angles. You can't allow biases to blind you. Bad choices don't eliminate personal responsibility. You're letting them off the hook because you empathize. But it takes two to tangle.

Most aren't privy to the nitty gritty details of any partnership. You may overhear a few things or someone shares a detail. But you're still in the dark. Nobody tells you everything.

I view the men more worthy as victims.. but yeah they have some of the blame for what they find themselves in. Of course if this was feminist standards directed at women.. I'd be called for engaging in victim blaming.. lol.
 
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MehGuy

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Men let's be logical here.. society places more of an emphasis on us being the providers. Given this.. who is more likely to be statistically likely a deadbeat? Hint it usually goes to the group that society doesn't label or gets up in the arms if you do label as such.

Let's be honest about technology. Do you at least agree that technology is making the role of housewives easier? Do you at least acknowledge the potential that there will someday come to a threshold where the role of a housewife is going to lead more and more to sloth than something productive? Something that while not a Christian I'd imagine God wouldn't want to see in a partnership between man and a wife?
 
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bèlla

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I don't see why they're statistically not.. they're given a position that is most easily able to be abused..

That doesn't make them deadbeats. Nor do all women seek opportunities to mistreat men.

If you want to get personal I can get personal too.

That isn't personal. Do you honestly believe everyone behaves the same? We're not doppelgangers.

I won't even give a typical stay at home mother's a part time job classification. Much less the work men do at home that feminist like to pretend doesn't exist.

It doesn't matter what people think. When in you're a relationship you're concerned with your stuff. Not outside opinion.

It isn't nickel and dime.. it's being honest that their significant other's are practically bankrupt.

If she doesn't want to be subject to scrutiny or conversations along those lines she has no business with him.

My point being that men will face consequences for being deadbeats and women not as frequently.

You're comparing apples and oranges. The term typically applies to someone who neglects their responsibilities. They have little to no action.

You may disagree with the way someone manages their home. You may not respect their choices. But that doesn't make them a deadbeat.

My goal isn't to talk men out of anything.. but to hopefully be more informed.

Most men who desire to have SAHW or SAHM were reared with the same, had the ideal impressed upon them in childhood, or view it as duty or something they long to explore. They don't have negative associations with the lifestyle.

Yeah.. I'm a man cursed with a backbone.

It has nothing to do with backbone. It's realizing we're all flawed. Some are worse than others. But everyone isn't out to get you.

I view the men more worthy as victims.. but yeah they have some of the blame for what they find themselves in. Of course if this was feminist standards directed at women.. I'd be called for engaging in victim blaming.. lol.

Worthiness isn't a factor. The issue is due diligence. You can't know everything. But people reveal a lot. Most goes ignored because of feelings, wanting to settle down, etc.
 
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MehGuy

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Interesting. I must not be familiar w/ a lot of women's entertainment. Can you give some examples, other than 50 Shades?

Curious what kind of family situation did you grow up with? I grew up with only sisters.

I do like the fact that Family Guy has occasionally poked fun at the Lifetime channel. While I can't share the Lifetime clip that is more relevant to what I've been talking about I can at least share this clip.. although this clip is poking fun at the more innocent side of the channel.

 
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.Mikha'el.

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I am finding feelings for some one I never thought I would have. Some one I knew for a long time. It is awkward and wonderful and not smart. LOL

I hope it goes well for you. :)
 
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There's a 50/50 chance...

My money is on no though.

I swear I'm going to faint and have to be revived by a paramedic if you ever have a crush on someone. :p
 
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