Dinosaurs existed!

[coffee4u]

A Real Creationist knows that God created the Cosmos. They also know that the date of Creation of the Cosmos is very vague. They also know that no two Biblical scholars have ever arrived at the same date for Creation ,because doing so involves scores of assumptions about the timing of events and the ages of a long list of people.

I actually agree with you. I don't believe in using the Bible as a calculator as I don't think that is its purpose. I don't think 6 thousand years is long enough for man and animals to have travelled over and populated the earth after the flood. If the earth is 15 to even 40 thousand years does not bother me as it does not alter 6-day creation or the global flood. However, if you mean millions that I won't agree with since the only reason for someone to suggest millions is because they believe in evolution which I do not (cells to man) since that directly conflicts with scripture. I do not call specialization of species evolution.

This is a very common belief among TE. Commonly called the "gap" theory(not a theory to me) it proposes that there were men and civilizations before Gen 1:2. It also opens the door to the idea that the earth and creation can be billions of years old, and the creatures like the dinosaurs existed in these "Pre-Adamic" ages. However, the age of man, included all those we consider "proto human" man, were brought up since Gen 1:2 and "evolved" into what I call "earth men" because they came from the earth at the command of God. "Let the earth bring forth...".
It was only after God created Adam and Eve in the GOE and their subsequent crossing with "earth man" that we have what we see today.

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth
Is not enough scripture to base a doctrine of previous creations, men or animals on.
I've always said that it's possible that there was a gap before creation(the first and only creation) but 'gap theorists' extend that to mean all kinds of fanciful things when there is no scriptural backing to suggest them which means a gap is never looked at because it's associated with that teaching/theory above ^

1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters.
Why could the earth not be sitting formless and empty and dark for some undetermined amount of time before God started the creation? I have no issue with that, as a possibility, but I don't see anyone else but myself suggesting it.

 

[SkyWriting]

If the real date for the beginning of the Universe was given, for example: suppose it was written in somewhere like -- "...and then after 9 thousands of thousands of thousands of years, then God looked upon the waterworld Earth..." [nothing even slightly like this is anywhere in the Bible, nor any other way of dating the Universe or Earth, but only the genealogy from after Adam and Eve left the garden and entered into normal, mortal, ordinary time, where they would age] -- this would eventually be something science, once finally advancing enough, could eventually answer for us to compare....

Think on that a moment.

If the scripture did give an age, and then science one day confirmed it....

Then something directly against God's will would happen.

God explicitly wants us, we learn from the words of Christ, to believe in Him Whom God has sent.

Faith -- trust in God.

But faith is not merely confirming evidence, so that any distrusting person could just check and verify.

Not faith. That's only observation/proof.

With easy proof, then even the most distrusting person that is arrogant and contemptuous towards God could nevertheless just "turn and repent and be saved".

Christ directly, clearly says (in the gospels) that outcome is not the goal.

Instead, we are to come to Him in faith, belief without proof, before there is any possible confirmations about God and Christ.

So, an age for the Earth in the Bible would widely contradict the Bible, and prevent the real goal of life here: to learn to love and to have trust in God.

Except that the Bible doesn't give any age that anyone can figure out.
So it's clearly not an important fact as so many claim.

 

[SkyWriting]

Some ways this is correct, yes (I think or hope). When I/ we (others)/ believe the Bible, and the age of the earth from the Bible only, from what Yahweh Reveals,

God doesn't reveal any age.
Biblical scholars have always concluded different numbers.
The Bible claims the earth is ancient, and that the hills are even everlasting.

 

[SkyWriting]

The people of Yahweh, all Israel, all the prophets , all the appointed kings and all the men of Yahweh from Creation to the time of Jesusnever , ever, ever, ever, even had one thought that YahwehHimselfWouldSacrifice His Own Begotten Son .... .... for them... ... ... Yet that was Yahweh's and Yahushua's Plan since before anything was Created. Yahweh Revealed /Reveals Everything Concerning Salvation in this life and in the life to cometo little children. They have peace, joy and righteousness from Him, and are contented in Him, safely guarded with a strong guard/bulwark/as written.No one can change this.He Reveals as He Pleases, to whom He Pleases.

God claims the earth is ancient and the hills are eternal. We can go with that.

 

[SkyWriting]

I see all fossil evidece as having occured prior to Gen 1:2.

It's an ongoing process. I buried my dog a couple decades ago.
But volcanic activity works the best.

 

[SkyWriting]

Ok, sure, it's logically fitting that if the Earth appears 4.5 bn years old but is in reality only 10,000 yrs old for example, that would indeed fit the conditions of not being easily provable with science, and would allow also, that same requirement I pointed at above: no easy, obvious proof that anyone could just examine and use, no matter their attitude.

But, the dating of the Earth to those young ages depends on adding assumptions on top of scripture that aren't in scripture. Both the assumption of little/no time in verse 1 before the moment in verse 2, and also the assumption that the Tree of Life didn't really change time inside the Garden or had no effect, or such, and that somehow Adam aged inside the Garden before he ate the forbidden fruit (so that the Garden time was included in his overall lifespan in mere mortal years) -- which is nowhere suggested by anything in the scripture. (also it the YEC assumption seems to require removing or obviating verse 2:17, and think Adam somehow then didn't have Life in the Garden before he ate that 2:17 fruit he was warned would lead to mortality)

So, if you insist on this extraneous added doctrine, we will have to agree to disagree on it. God bless though!, and have a good day!

What happened to those trees? Or was Paradise more of a Spiritual place where man didn't die? Being vegetarian and unable to die would be more like Hell.

 

[steppinrazor]

I think you have to look around. Look at the stars, the planets and shear vastness of space. Look how far these stars are from our earth and how long the light (they emit) has been traveling through space to reach out planet. Look at the processes of weather, time, and depositions arpund the planet today. If you watch the slow rate of erosion and deposition around our planet you can see the processes that formed our planet. From simple radiologic evidence, we can ESTIMATE the age if the earth around 4-5 billion years, and that same science can be applied to fossilized remains. We dont just use it for the dinosaurs, but for human remains as well. An creation evolutionist (like myself) can also believe every word of the Bible and still understand that God created the heavens and the earth yesterday just like he is creating them today.

 

[dqhall]

A Real Creationist knows that God created the Cosmos. They also know that the date of Creation of the Cosmos is very vague. They also know that no two Biblical scholars have ever arrived at the same date for Creation ,because doing so involves scores of assumptions about the timing of events and the ages of a long list of people.

If God wanted to set a "young" date on Creation, His message to us would not have involved scores of assumptions and required use of an Abacus.

"Any attempt to specify a date for the creation in Genesis, or, for that matter, for any epoch in the Bible prior to roughly the reign of King David, based solely on the biblical text, is an exercise in futility."
Can biblical chronology be used to date creation?

It is important to realize God has power to create and do miracles.

I had some college courses in geology for geology majors. It is important to know scientific observation can be profitable and true. Geochronology theories supersede a six day creation story.

 

[Shrewd Manager]

I think you have to look around. Look at the stars, the planets and shear vastness of space. Look how far these stars are from our earth and how long the light (they emit) has been traveling through space to reach out planet. Look at the processes of weather, time, and depositions arpund the planet today. If you watch the slow rate of erosion and deposition around our planet you can see the processes that formed our planet. From simple radiologic evidence, we can ESTIMATE the age if the earth around 4-5 billion years, and that same science can be applied to fossilized remains. We dont just use it for the dinosaurs, but for human remains as well. An creation evolutionist (like myself) can also believe every word of the Bible and still understand that God created the heavens and the earth yesterday just like he is creating them today.

That 'vastness of space' doctrine is just Mystery Babylon. There's no reliable evidence in favour, and so much against. Do we see 'billions and trillions' in the Bible?

You can't eat at the table of angels and demons there friend. Either the Bible's true, or evilotion and Cretinous Parkism are true. They're patently and fundamentally incompatible. City of God or City of Man. For what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

 

[SkyWriting]

It is important to realize God has power to create and do miracles. I had some college courses in geology for geology majors. It is important to know scientific observation can be profitable and true. Geochronology theories supersede a six day creation story.

God uses all "natural" processes in his miracles. What we call "natural" is a miracle.

 

[steppinrazor]

That 'vastness of space' doctrine is just Mystery Babylon. There's no reliable evidence in favour, and so much against. Do we see 'billions and trillions' in the Bible?

You can't eat at the table of angels and demons there friend. Either the Bible's true, or evilotion and Cretinous Parkism are true. They're patently and fundamentally incompatible. City of God or City of Man. For what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

Oh geeze dude, what on earth are you talking about? Im talking about easy to understand and verified findings (vastness of space). There is no question about the size the universe and the spaces between the galaxies. To dispute those findings is just denial, plain and simple. Im not splitting hairs, the science is concrete. The amazing thing about space and Gods creation is watching the design in process...

 

[Shrewd Manager]

m talking about easy to understand and verified findings (vastness of space).

Nothing verified about that. Don't listen to satanic Nasa and their minions with their fake space monopoly.

Im not splitting hairs, the science is concrete.

Are we talking about the same 'standard model cosmology' that's forced to admit it's:

1. 95% stupid (DeGrasse Tyson re the absence of evidence of dark matter), and
2. out by a factor of 10^120 (according to Michiu Kaku, who proceeds to confess it's the largest mismatch between observation and theory in the history of science).

Sorry to burst your bubble there chum, but zombie paradigm destroyed - from the very mouths of its own false prophets.

 

[steppinrazor]

Youll need a sharper pin to burst my bubble, chum.

 

[SkyWriting]

That 'vastness of space' doctrine is just Mystery Babylon. There's no reliable evidence in favour, and so much against. Do we see 'billions and trillions' in the Bible?

You can't eat at the table of angels and demons there friend. Either the Bible's true, or evilotion and Cretinous Parkism are true. They're patently and fundamentally incompatible. City of God or City of Man. For what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

No one has shown they are incompatible. The only error in evolution
is the idea of "random" which does not exist in nature.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

God claims the earth is ancient and the hills are eternal. We can go with that.

Not obviously the way you mean in most of all your content/posts.
His Ways and His Plan is far far far above man's, and not at all similar ever even.

 

[SkyWriting]

Not obviously the way you mean in most of all your content/posts.

My posts are most often a majority of scripture with links to the context. This is in contrast to others content.

His Ways and His Plan is far far far above man's, and not at all similar ever even.

Oh? In what way is that?

Romans 1:20
For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Psalm 19:1
To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David. The heavens declare the glory of God, and the sky above proclaims his handiwork.

Genesis 1:1
In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

Jeremiah 10:12
It is he who made the earth by his power, who established the world by his wisdom, and by his understanding stretched out the heavens.

Nehemiah 9:6
“You are the Lord, you alone. You have made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth and all that is on it, the seas and all that is in them; and you preserve all of them; and the host of heaven worships you.

Psalm 8:3
When I look at your heavens, the work of your fingers, the moon and the stars, which you have set in place,

Colossians 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

I can go with the most literal meanings. Some say otherwise.




Deuteronomy 33:15
With the finest produce of the ancient mountains and the abundance of the everlasting hills,

Genesis 49
26 The blessings of your father have surpassed the blessings of the ancient mountains and the bounty of the everlasting hills. May they rest on the head of Joseph, on the brow of the prince of his brothers.

Habakkuk 3
6 He stood and measured the earth; He looked and startled the nations; the ancient mountains were scattered; the perpetual hills bowed. His ways are everlasting.

Psalm 76:4 You are radiant with light, more majestic than the ancient mountains

Micah 6:2 "Hear, you mountains, the LORD's accusation; listen, you everlasting
foundations of the earth.

Jude 1:6
And the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under gloomy darkness until the judgment of the great day

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

My posts are most often a majority of scripture with links to the context. This is in contrast to others content.

No, that is so not right. When you post something contrary to Scripture, and it is pointed out by perhaps a dozen others , you ignore it, and post other Scripture AS IF to somehow make it all okay - but it is not okay.
You denied in the past the authority of Scripture, several times, directly, and always indirectly.
Thus, the origin of your information, the purpose of your trying to persuade others, starts in error, and stays in error when there has been and is no repentance - no turning to God's Way as repeatedly posted in reply to the errors in your ideas/ posts/ content. (for instance, purposefully and willingly advocating, encouraging, or promoting sin is always wrong, as God Says - it is always opposed to His Kingdom and violating His direction.)

 

[Halbhh]

What happened to those trees? Or was Paradise more of a Spiritual place where man didn't die? Being vegetarian and unable to die would be more like Hell.

The Tree of Life, in Genesis chapter 2 -- is also in Revelation chapter 22, the last chapter of our Revelation about the transition to and beginning of that age to come.

 

[Shrewd Manager]

Youll need a sharper pin to burst my bubble, chum.

Kind of takes the 'concrete' claim out though, when 95% is abstract and its predictions are massively removed from reality. Deflates the 'science' claim too, exposes the emperor's nakedness. Just pseudoscience friend. Why hold on to trash?

 

[Shrewd Manager]

No one has shown they are incompatible. The only error in evolution
is the idea of "random" which does not exist in nature.

Where does life evolve in the Bible? Where does the Bible teach of natural selection and survival of the fittest?