Different Public Schools for Different Faiths ?

[Nithavela]

Believe in science and not God, bad effects of it in schools since circa 1965. Kick God to the curb, and have more drugs, school shootings, stabbings, the list goes on. Disobey God the Father, like in the book of Job, and He lets Satan, to punish his children, but hopefully restore them.

Job never disobeyed god before god allowed satan to torment him. He was expressly one of gods most faithful servants.

 

[Tuur]

Definition of yoked - If two or more people or things are yoked together, they are forced to be closely linked with each other.

Yet we have private schools in the US, from schools run by denominations to secular schools, and if we had these in a rural area, I'm sure you can find them in an urban setting.

Now, if you get called up for a jury pool, then you are in a situation where you could be forces to associate with non-believers. You are more than welcome to use 2 Corinthians 6:14 as an argument to be excused. If you ever do so, let us know how it was received by the judge.

 

[Tuur]

They won't. That's the point. The crusade against public, secular education is to keep a permanent underclass in place and impose "christian government".

Not necessarily. I've met families who wanted a religious education for their children. Such as the Protestant parents I know of who sent their child to a Roman Catholic school. Then there's the problem of some public schools that don't seem to do that well with teaching.

Then there's something I saw in the days of desegregation: private schools set up for no other reason than their parents didn't want their children to mix with other races. No other reason. Most of those have bit the dust. One still in operation is now integrated.

This is why this whole thing is a sore point with me: I've seen this show before. It's called segregation, and whether it's by race or religion, it's still the same. To separate for a religious education is one thing; to separate so as not to associate with those of different faiths is quite another.

 

[Richard T]

Though the First Amendment says the government cannot establish A religion as was in England, here's an idea to reduce cultural friction between people of various faiths and those of anti faith in the public schools, which can happen in larger school districts with dozens of schools. Have separate schools for Christian, possibly for various denominations within, Catholic, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, not believers of traditional marriage lifestyle, Atheists, etc. and not restricted to skin color, ethnicity, race, or nationality. Parents choose for their children which is cheaper than private school and less time constraining for parents than home schooling. Some interaction between different belief schools in the school districts with sports games and academic competitions. Also so if the Christian kids want to pray or study the Bible in their own Christian publc school, they could do so without offending others, likewise if Muslim, Jewish, or choose to participate in an alternative lifestyle.

Larger school districts have the real estate of many buildings to do this. I do see added school bus transportation costs with this, but reducing cultural friction and lawsuits is priceless. Maybe this idea is being done today in sections of other countries besides the United States, but I don't know. Some districts do have special schools for bad behavior students, gifted academically, or the disabled, so why not of various beliefs?

Thoughts, pro or con?

It would be easier to just allow different faiths to come in and teach for one hour. Merely providing a building for a venue is not the establishment of a religion. Giving credit for outside work in a religion is not either as long as the school district is not hiring the teachers or requiring any student to participate.

 

[Larniavc]

Not to be the political pawns of adults.

This is a big part of the problem. Other folks who are not Christians having an equal place in society is not playing politics.

 

[Larniavc]

Your only solution, by your argument, is for Christians to completely withdraw from contact with everyone who isn't.

I’ve been saying that for ages. The Amish (as much as I find them different and strange) at least have the courage of their convictions not to be a part of this world.

 

[JustOneWay]

At least as important is that the leftists (to my mind leftists aren't liberals) don't push those things. They can indoctrinate their kids at home as they see fit, but the students are there to learn academics and basic skills. Not to be the political pawns of adults. Better schools, whether religious or secular, focus on academic performance.

You do realize that indoctrination is rampant at religious schools, yes?

indoctrination: : to imbue with a usually partisan or sectarian opinion, point of view, or principle

 

[JustOneWay]

I’ve been saying that for ages. The Amish (as much as I find them different and strange) at least have the courage of their convictions not to be a part of this world.

That is not entirely accurate. Rumspringa allows young Amish to explore the world, and make their choice to commit to the church.

 

[KCfromNC]

Many families, unless upper class or wealthy, cannot afford private school tuition of thousands of dollars, with the other basic necessities of life, mortgage/rent, utilities, food, clothing, etc., plus paying taxes which typically up to around 50% goes for public schools.

Then it is a good thing other people are willing to pitch in to provide those public schools.

 

[KCfromNC]

Is this the reason you consider having public schools be segregated by religion, just so students are not forced to attend Pride events or barred from wearing their religion on their shirts?

The tactic seems to be to sell the idea of destroying public education using nonsense culture war issues, but the bigger goal is likely to remove education as an option for the poors and funnel as much money into private education businesses as possible.

 

[KCfromNC]

Eliminating the public schools will save taxpayers money. Given the sin in the public schools today, at least a fraction of kids, it only perpetuates crime and other bad behavior later in life.

Only? Sounds like more empty rhetoric.

I mean, sure, they're not perfect but people do graduate high school knowing more than when they started kindergarten.

 

[KCfromNC]

Let the parents of school age children in the USA speak.

Why should it be restricted to just parents? Shouldn't the discussion of how tax dollars are used include everyone who pays taxes?

 

[Margaret3110]

I'm glad your child is getting the education he needs. My child (well, an adult now) is also autistic (high functioning) and went to public school. The school, at every level, was great and worked with us to ensure the best possible education. But, in my experience, charter schools can, and often do, limit who they accept as students, and students with special needs of any kind are often the first to be excluded. Brings down the test scores, don'tchaknow. Public schools, which have to accept any and all students, including those with special needs, don't have that easy out, which is why they often don't fare as well when comparing standardized tests.

But I still stand by my statement: public funds should go to public schools. Full stop.

-- A2SG, I'm sure private schools can offer whatever form of financial aid they like....

In my state, charters are required to accept all students. There’s a lottery, but it’s entirely random and not based on ability. This would be an easy thing to implement everywhere as a requirement for taking public funds.

There are places where the public schools are still excellent, and places where the system is thoroughly broken.

 

[BCP1928]

There are places where the public schools are still excellent, and places where the system is thoroughly broken.

So rather than solve that problem, we should turn to school choice,

 

[Miles]

You do realize that indoctrination is rampant at religious schools, yes?

indoctrination: : to imbue with a usually partisan or sectarian opinion, point of view, or principle

I didn't mean to suggest that indoctrination is inherently bad. Rather, that we all do it in one form or the other. What parents teach at home is up to them. I would hope to raise my kids to know Christian doctrine, and wouldn't be opposed to sending them to a Christian school where what they learn at home isn't attacked by teachers or staff. Mostly so they can focus on their studies. With that being said, people have all sorts of views on religion, sexual morals, and political partisanship. Ideally, public school should allow for children raised in religious or secular homes to come together for the sake of learning academics and other skills along with playing sports, joining the school band, chess club, etc. It shouldn't be divisive or push specific political agendas. When that happens, we should ask what went wrong and how do we fix it?

 

[FenderTL5]

Though the First Amendment says the government cannot establish A religion as was in England, here's an idea to reduce cultural friction between people of various faiths and those of anti faith in the public schools, which can happen in larger school districts with dozens of schools. Have separate schools for Christian, possibly for various denominations within, Catholic, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, not believers of traditional marriage lifestyle, Atheists, etc. and not restricted to skin color, ethnicity, race, or nationality. Parents choose for their children which is cheaper than private school and less time constraining for parents than home schooling. Some interaction between different belief schools in the school districts with sports games and academic competitions. Also so if the Christian kids want to pray or study the Bible in their own Christian publc school, they could do so without offending others, likewise if Muslim, Jewish, or choose to participate in an alternative lifestyle.

Larger school districts have the real estate of many buildings to do this. I do see added school bus transportation costs with this, but reducing cultural friction and lawsuits is priceless. Maybe this idea is being done today in sections of other countries besides the United States, but I don't know. Some districts do have special schools for bad behavior students, gifted academically, or the disabled, so why not of various beliefs?

Thoughts, pro or con?

Leaning con.
First a hypothetical:
In XYZ Community they have established schools for the Reformed, Methodists, Southern Baptist, Independent Baptist, Muslim, Catholic and non-religious households. One Jewish family with four children move into the community; under your proposal are they:
A) expected to move/leave, B) expected to choose an existing school, C) the district is expected to create a new Jewish school, D) other/describe?

 

[BCP1928]

I didn't mean to suggest that indoctrination is inherently bad. Rather, that we all do it in one form or the other. What parents teach at home is up to them. I would hope to raise my kids to know Christian doctrine, and wouldn't be opposed to sending them to a Christian school where what they learn at home isn't attacked by teachers or staff. Mostly so they can focus on their studies. With that being said, people have all sorts of views on religion, sexual morals, and political partisanship. Ideally, public school should allow for children raised in religious or secular homes to come together for the sake of learning academics and other skills along with playing sports, joining the school band, chess club, etc. It shouldn't be divisive or push specific political agendas. When that happens, we should ask what went wrong and how do we fix it?

It becomes difficult when what is taught at home in the name of religion is not factual. That global warming is a hoax, that drag queens can turn kids gay by reading to them, that CRT is intended to make kids ashamed of being white, and so on.

 

[Hans Blaster]

Not necessarily. I've met families who wanted a religious education for their children. Such as the Protestant parents I know of who sent their child to a Roman Catholic school. Then there's the problem of some public schools that don't seem to do that well with teaching.

No, I get it. I wasn't speaking of the individual families, but rather the drivers of the movement. (Especially the rich and the power brokers.) Those families are just making a choice about their child, not trying to remake society.

Then there's something I saw in the days of desegregation: private schools set up for no other reason than their parents didn't want their children to mix with other races. No other reason. Most of those have bit the dust. One still in operation is now integrated.

This is why this whole thing is a sore point with me: I've seen this show before. It's called segregation, and whether it's by race or religion, it's still the same. To separate for a religious education is one thing; to separate so as not to associate with those of different faiths is quite another.

The existence of "segregation academies" was something that is under reported and I didn't know about them until a few years ago as they weren't a thing where I grew up.

(not so) Fun fact: Catholic schools built up in the US because the dominant culture was including Protestant theology in the public schools.

 

[Miles]

It becomes difficult when what is taught at home in the name of religion is not factual. That global warming is a hoax, that drag queens can turn kids gay by reading to them, that CRT is intended to make kids ashamed of being white, and so on.

People are taught all sorts of incorrect things regardless of their affiliations. If not in the name of religion then in the name of politics and other group memberships. Public schools should generally stick to agreed upon facts and steer away from politically charged positions.

Drag queens and CRT may be interesting and divisive to varying degrees, but they aren't facts. At least not the kind of facts that help kids pass important tests. Global warming has a degree of truth when viewed in the context of climate change, but there's also a lot of emotionally-charged misinformation out there. These are topics for adults to discuss, but they're far from being "just the facts" of the type that kids should be learning in school.

Global warming is a mixed bag. Evidence indicates that climate change is real and influenced by human activity. However, if the global warming activists when I was growing up were correct, New York City would be submerged by now. Was it a hoax? I suppose some might call it that, although most of them probably meant well. A grain of truth, that we can destroy our planet if we're not careful, buried under a mountain of misguided emotion. I hear echos of this in today's Greta Thunberg types. Do we need a generation of Chicken Littles running around rather than having the facts and thinking with a sober mind? No. Should we nevertheless strive to reduce pollution and conserve our environment? Yes. Absolutely. If you encounter a Christian or Jew who disputes this, tell them that the Bible instructs us to be caretakers of nature. Not to harm it.

As far as I've seen, most kids get along fine with other races until opinionated adults step in and tell them that they should have animosity toward different ethnic backgrounds. Kids shouldn't be shamed for being white, black, Asian, or even sentient space aliens for all I care (think Star Trek). Kids are kids. Let them play and learn together. When they are old enough, teach them about the history of race relations, but never suggest to them, whether in words or actions, that they are superior or inferior to others based on external things like skin tone. The topic of sexism can be handled similarly.

If parents want to recruit drag queens from the local drag club to read to their kids at home that's their choice. Much like a Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, and so forth might pray with their families and share religious traditions at home. Public school isn't the place to be pushing personal agendas. It's the place where kids are taught how to read, write, and solve math problems along with play and participate in shared activities. Activities that are appropriate for a mixed audience. Drag queens are a bawdy act intended for adults. They may not "turn kids gay", but they aren't appropriate either. If you want them reading to your kids under your roof, that seems sketchy to me, but it's ultimately your decision. Regardless of what you do in your own home, adult oriented acts do not belong in our public schools.

The public sometimes forgets that public education is intended for a mixed group of children. So they can (at least in theory!) become responsible, educated, adults who are at least literate, can balance a checkbook, and understand how the political system works. Not to turn them into little leftists or little rightwingers. It likewise isn't for converting them to a theistic or atheistic point of view. That's for them to decide for themselves outside of public learning institutions. When handled well enough, separate public schools for different religions shouldn't be necessary.

 

[Miles]

Job never disobeyed god before god allowed satan to torment him. He was expressly one of gods most faithful servants.

The book of job is powerful. It teaches that we should be compassionate and not misjudge people by their circumstances.

It is likewise said to "rain on the just and the unjust". Which is why our treasures are to be in heaven. Not of this world where earthly things decay and fall apart over time. Money, health, power, and fame can come and go. Even with people like Job.