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Did Yahshua and his Disciples Abstain from Meat?

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by HARK!, Feb 16, 2020.

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  1. ewq1938

    ewq1938 When something is "mind bottling" Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    Lev 23:6 And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread.

    Mat 26:17 Now the first day of the feast of unleavened bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that we prepare for thee to eat the passover?
    Mat 26:18 And he said, Go into the city to such a man, and say unto him, The Master saith, My time is at hand; I will keep the passover at thy house with my disciples.
    Mat 26:19 And the disciples did as Jesus had appointed them; and they made ready the passover.
    Mat 26:20 Now when the even was come, he sat down with the twelve.
    Mat 26:21 And as they did eat, he said, Verily I say unto you, that one of you shall betray me.

    Jesus was not killed on the 14th. He was alive on the 15th, the first day of the feast of unleavened bread and that's when they ate of the Passover.
     
  2. dqhall

    dqhall Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Evidently you do not understand the feeding of the 5000 with loaves and fishes is in all four Gospels. Your debate is convoluted.

    Why question what a reptile is? The Jews of Israel bought fish in their markets and restaurants. Do you pretend to know Hebrew and not know Jews own fishing boats and fished the Sea of Galilee (Chinnereth) to this day? Why do you argue in vain?
     
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  3. ewq1938

    ewq1938 When something is "mind bottling" Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    And it wasn't sport fishing in Christ's day. They ate fish and so did Christ.

    For those reading, meat is the muscle of animals and fish are almost all muscle so they provide lots of meat.
     
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  4. dqhall

    dqhall Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have been to Israel nine times since the 90’s. There were commercial fishermen working the Sea of Galilee with boats and nets. They catch more than those with casting rods. The fisherman set out at dusk and fished all night. The restaurants in Tiberias served tilapia that they called “St. Peter’s fish.” Christian tourists traversed the area in tour buses. A few had rental cars. Fish is kosher.
     
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  5. ewq1938

    ewq1938 When something is "mind bottling" Staff Member Supervisor Supporter

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    Those with scales and fins are :)
     
  6. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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  7. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    Hi Hark, the word, under "eat flesh" is abstinence and has a specific context in Judaism.

    " Fasting implying abstinence was ordained by law for the Day of Atonement (Leviticus 16:29 sq.). The ceremony incident to this feast was observed by the Jews on the fifth day before the feast of Tabernacles. From evening of the ninth until evening of the tenth day labour and eating were strictly prohibited. Besides this passage the sacred narrative contains many others which show how adversity moved the Jews to assume the burden of fasting and abstinence in a spirit of penance (Judges 20:26; Judith 6:20; Joel 1:14; 2:15). Moreover, the Jews abstained on the ninth day of the fourth month, because on that day Nabuchodonosor captured Jerusalem (Jeremiah 52:6); on the tenth day of the fifth month, because on that day the temple was burned (Jeremiah 52:12 sq.); on the third day of the seventh month, because on that day Godolias had been murdered (Jeremiah 41:2); and on the tenth day of the tenth month, because on that day the Chaldees commenced the siege of Jerusalem (2 Kings 25:1 sq.). They were told that fidelity to these regulations would bring joy, gladness, and great solemnities to the house of Juda (Zechariah 8:19). During the month of new corn they were obliged to spend seven days without leaven, and to eat the bread of affliction in memory of their delivery from Egypt (Deuteronomy 16:3). In addition to those indications concerning the seasons of abstinence amongst the Jews, the sacred text contains passages regarding the ways and means whereby the law of abstinence assumed more definite shape amongst them. After the deluge God said to Noah: "Everything that moveth upon the earth shall be a meat for you, saving that flesh with blood you shall not eat" (Genesis 9:3-4; similar passages are contained in Leviticus 7:26 sq.; 17:14 sq.; Deuteronomy 12:15,16). A prohibition whereby corn, oil, wine, and the first-born of herds and cattle are forbidden in towns is set forth in Deuteronomy 12:17. Priests were forbidden to drink any intoxicant lest they die (Leviticus 10:9). The eleventh chapter of Leviticus contains a detailed enumeration of the various beasts, birds, and fish that fall under the ban. Such were reputed unclean. Abstinence from things legally unclean was intended to train the Israelites in the pursuit of spiritual cleanness." CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA: Abstinence
     
  8. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    This false teaching of the Ebionites, puts them so far outside of Christianity, ...

    "
    They say that Christ was not begotten of God the Father, but created as one of
    the archangels
    ... that he rules over the angels and all the creatures of the
    Almighty, and that he came and declared, as their Gospel, which is called
    Gospel according to Matthew, or Gospel According to the Hebrews?,
    reports:

    "I am come to do away with sacrfices, and if you cease not sacrificing,
    the wrath of God will not cease from you."
    (Epiphanius, Panarion 30.16,4-5)

    But they abandon the proper sequence of the words and pervert the saying,
    as is plain to all from the readings attached, and have let the disciples say:

    "Where will you have us prepare the passover?"
    And him to answer to that:
    "Do I desire with desire at this Passover to eat flesh with you?"
    (Epiphanius, Panarion 30.22.4)"
    The Gospel of the Ebionites extracted from Epiphanius
     
  9. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Supposed to be so, but historians and theologians have noted that there is no mention of there being a lamb in the case of the Last Supper.

    From what I can tell, though, he almost certainly ate fish, and even if he helped other people to eat fish while abstaining himself, he never encouraged anyone else in the direction of vegetarianism, which would seem peculiar if that was his own approach.
     
  10. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    The texts I quoted showed they had lamb. If they did not eat the lamb then they were disobeying God's word.

    Numbers 9:11-12 They must celebrate Passover just before dark on the 14th day of the second month. At that time they must eat the lamb, the bread made without yeast, and the bitter herbs. They must not leave any of that food until the next morning. And they must not break any of the bones of the lamb. They must follow all the rules about Passover.

    Let's see, obeying God's word or following the teachings of those who taught that the Son of God is a created angel.

    No contest.
     
  11. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    Also, I quoted where God himself will serve meat on the mountain.
     
  12. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    who made the video? is not irrelevant answer the question please.
     
  13. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Yes, but it begs the question. Was the Last Supper a Passover meal?

    We often think, almost unconsciously, that it was one. That's because the evidence is there that the Apostles had been told to prepare such a meal. However, the undeniable 'new twist' that Christ put on that particular meal he had with his followers ("This is my body" etc.) suggests that it was not.
     
  14. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    Again who made the video?
     
  15. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    Jesus Descended From Judah Not Levi (Hebrews 7:13-14)

    Hebrews 7:13-14 Easy-to-Read Version (ERV)
    13-14 We are talking about our Lord Christ, who belonged to a different tribe. No one from that tribe ever served as a priest at the altar. It is clear that Christ came from the tribe of Judah. And Moses said nothing about priests belonging to that tribe.
     
  16. BNR32FAN

    BNR32FAN He’s a Way of life Supporter

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    Peter, Andrew, and John & James Zebedee were all fisherman before following Jesus.
     
  17. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    Simply group by types. start with who made the video.
     
  18. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    No grape juice, that did not come along until 1800's

    Hosea 4:11
    “Sexual sins, strong drink, and new wine ruin a person’s ability to think straight.

    Matthew 9:17Also, people never pour new wine into old wineskins. They would break, the wine would spill out, and the wineskins would be ruined. People always put new wine into new wineskins, which won’t break, and the wine stays good.”

    Luke 22:20
    In the same way, after supper, Jesus took the cup of wine and said, “This wine represents the new agreement from God to his people. It will begin when my blood is poured out for you.”

    "Welch's grape juice first came about in 1869 when the American physician and dentist, Thomas Bramwell Welch, invented a method of pasteurizing grape juice to halt the fermentation process, preventing it from turning into wine."
     
  19. Daniel Marsh

    Daniel Marsh Well-Known Member

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    I already gave scripture that it was a passover meal.
     
  20. Yeshua HaDerekh

    Yeshua HaDerekh Men dream of truth, find it then cant live with it

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    Yeshua was not a nazirite or under a nazirite vow, at least not until the last supper. We know he ate fish and very likely ate meat at Pesakh.
     
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