Daily Christian Universalist Verses

[Der Alte]

Let's take another crack at it. Does God save everyone He chooses? - YES or NO?

This is a discussion forum not a word game. You answer your own question and back it up with a few scriptures AND I will show you to be wrong and back it with scripture. My main guns are Matthew 7:21-23, Jeremiah 13:11-14 and Romans 1:24, 26, 28. The ball is in your court.

 

[Deafsilence]

This is a discussion forum not a word game. You answer your own question and back it up with a few scriptures AND I will show you to be wrong and back it with scripture. My main guns are Matthew 7:21-23, Jeremiah 13:11-14 and Romans 1:24, 26, 28. The ball is in your court.

I didn't see a Yes or No in that response. I'm pretty sure if anyone goes back and reads this - it was YOU that requested a Yes or No response to your question and I gave you one and will continue to do so. Also, I have the Spirit of God, if the Bible were taken from me tomorrow, I could still discern the Truth.

 

[Der Alte]

Yes! Can you do that?
Edit to add. Any question in which you want a direct answer of Yes or No, let me know and I'll give you a Yes or No. I'm that confident that God will save everyone in due time.

I am assuming this is in answer to my question. "Was the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah saved?" Your answer is, "yes." God's answer is "no."

Jeremiah 13:11
(11) For as the loincloth clings to the waist of a man, so I made the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah cling to me, declares the LORD, that they might be for me a people, a name, a praise, and a glory, but they would not listen.
Jeremiah 13:13-14
(13) Then you shall say to them, ‘Thus says the LORD: Behold, I will fill with drunkenness all the inhabitants of this land: the kings who sit on David's throne, the priests, the prophets, and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
(14) And I will dash them one against another, fathers and sons together, declares the LORD. I will not pity or spare or have compassion, that I should not destroy them.’”​

God chose the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah. God did NOT save the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah.

 

[Der Alte]

Let's take another crack at it. Does God save everyone He chooses? - YES or NO?

NO! God CHOSE the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah.

Jeremiah 13:11
(11) For as the loincloth clings to the waist of a man, so I made the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah cling to me, declares the LORD, that they might be for me a people, a name, a praise, and a glory, but they would not listen.
Jeremiah 13:13-14
(13) Then you shall say to them, ‘Thus says the LORD: Behold, I will fill with drunkenness all the inhabitants of this land: the kings who sit on David's throne, the priests, the prophets, and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
(14) And I will dash them one against another, fathers and sons together, declares the LORD. I will not pity or spare or have compassion, that I should not destroy them.’”​

But God did NOT save the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah. Instead, Yahweh said, "I will not pity or spare or have compassion, that I should not destroy them."

 

[Deafsilence]

I am assuming this is in answer to my question. "Was the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah saved?" Your answer is, "yes." God's answer is "no."

Jeremiah 13:11
(11) For as the loincloth clings to the waist of a man, so I made the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah cling to me, declares the LORD, that they might be for me a people, a name, a praise, and a glory, but they would not listen.
Jeremiah 13:13-14
(13) Then you shall say to them, ‘Thus says the LORD: Behold, I will fill with drunkenness all the inhabitants of this land: the kings who sit on David's throne, the priests, the prophets, and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
(14) And I will dash them one against another, fathers and sons together, declares the LORD. I will not pity or spare or have compassion, that I should not destroy them.’”​

God chose the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah. God did NOT save the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah.

That is incorrect! You stating stuff I DID NOT SAY. Your question was:

"Did God choose the whole house of Israel and Judah? Yes or no!"

Of which I said "Yes".

I answered your question with a Yes because you asked it because I gave you a direct question of which you couldn't give a direct answer so instead you answered with a direct questions and specifically requested a Yes or No response. Of which you still haven't answered my direct question (And I understand why). At this point, I see no reason to continue discussing with you since your not discussing anything. You have used scriptures out of context, you have used scriptures that you presented as giving a future tense only to have me show you that they were stated in the Present tense of which you then acknowledged after the fact. You also, twist the questions of which i specifically gave answers to different questions. This is NOT a discussion at this point. This is just you avoiding questions and logical debate and instead providing fallacies. I see nothing productive in this back and forth and will response openly to your statements but not directly.

 

[Der Alte]

That is incorrect! You stating stuff I DID NOT SAY. Your question was:
"Did God choose the whole house of Israel and Judah? Yes or no!"
Of which I said "Yes".

And you were dead wrong!

You have used scriptures out of context, you have used scriptures that you presented as giving a future tense only to have me show you that they were stated in the Present tense of which you then acknowledged after the fact.

Absolutely false accusation! Get your facts straight, if you are going to compete with the big boys! I did NOT use any scripture "out of context." The version of the Bible I quoted had a word in the future tense, you found another version that had the word in the present tense. And in that verse the difference did NOT materially affect the meaning as I showed you. Strike 1 false accusation.

You also, twist the questions of which i specifically gave answers to different questions. This is NOT a discussion at this point. This is just you avoiding questions and logical debate and instead providing fallacies. I see nothing productive in this back and forth and will response openly to your statements but not directly.

I twisted nothing! I have provided no fallacies! Unlike you making vague references to previous posts, see red highlights above, I quoted everything as posted and posted my response immediately after. Strike 2
Go ahead leave, it won't hurt my feelings a bit. but that will not prevent me from pointing out errors wherever I see them.

 

[Deafsilence]

You ask me, it seems God is pretty bold here:

Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

He seems to believe that He can get anything He desires. And I believe Him.

 

[Der Alte]

You ask me, it seems God is pretty bold here:
Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
He seems to believe that He can get anything He desires. And I believe Him.

Is this the same God who said of the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah, "I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them?'

Jeremiah 13:11-14
(11) For as the girdle cleaveth to the loins of a man, so have I caused to cleave unto me the whole house of Israel and the whole house of Judah, saith the LORD; that they might be unto me for a people, and for a name, and for a praise, and for a glory: but they would not hear.
(12) Therefore thou shalt speak unto them this word; Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Every bottle shall be filled with wine: and they shall say unto thee, Do we not certainly know that every bottle shall be filled with wine?
(13) Then shalt thou say unto them, Thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will fill all the inhabitants of this land, even the kings that sit upon David's throne, and the priests, and the prophets, and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, with drunkenness.
(14) And I will dash them one against another, even the fathers and the sons together, saith the LORD: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them.​

I am going to quote scripture like UR-ites do.
Psalm 14:1 and Psalm 53:1 both say, "There is no God."
And no fair looking at the context.

 

[Deafsilence]

Just remember Universalists,

God IS:

1. All Powerful
2. All Knowing (knows end from the beginning)
3. All Purposeful (nothing done in vain)
4. Full of Mercy
5. Desires all to be saved.
6. Get's what He desires
7. Giver of Life.
8. God is Responsible
9. God finishes what He starts.

What do ETers preach:

1. Believe God cannot eradicate sin (though John says the purpose that Jesus came was to eradicate sin) but instead must relocate them with their sins into a fiery abode.

1Jn_3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

2. While God knows the end from the beginning He creates most people to go to a fiery punishment that never ends.

3. Believe God can fail to save everyone.

4. They believe that FEW shall be saved because the many that call Jesus Lord Lord will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

5. Don't believe God gets what He desires ultimately.

6. They don't believe that salvation is 100% the work of God but believe that a portion of that work requires man's OWN part so that man can be blamed when he fails.

7. God allows sin and Death to rob God of His potential Family members.

8. Believe that Man is responsible for the work of God and ultimately his failure will require that man be held responsible.

9. God is either incapable or undesirable to finish the work He started in many people.

 

[Der Alte]

What do ETers preach:
1. Believe God cannot eradicate sin (though John says the purpose that Jesus came was to eradicate sin) but instead must relocate them with their sins into a fiery abode.
1Jn_3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
2. While God knows the end from the beginning He creates most people to go to a fiery punishment that never ends.
3. Believe God can fail to save everyone.
5. Don't believe God gets what He desires ultimately.
6. They don't believe that salvation is 100% the work of God but believe that a portion of that work requires man's OWN part so that man can be blamed when he fails.
7. God allows sin and Death to rob God of His potential Family members.
8. Believe that Man is responsible for the work of God and ultimately his failure will require that man be held responsible.
9. God is either incapable or undesirable to finish the work He started in many people.

You evidently disagree with Matthew 7:23. "They believe that FEW shall be saved because the many that call Jesus Lord Lord will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven."
Since you disagree with what Matthew 7:23 says you tell us what it really means. Here I quote from the Eastern Greek Orthodox Bible.

EOB Matt 7:21 It is not everyone who tells me, ‘Lord, Lord’ who will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will tell me in that Day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your Name, cast out demons in your Name, and do many deeds of power in your Name?’ 23 Then I will tell them, ‘I never knew you! Depart from me, you who do what is wicked.’
Laurent Cleenewerck, ed., The Eastern/Greek Orthodox Bible: New Testament (Laurent A. Cleenewerck, 2011), Mt 7:21–23.​

Link to EOB online:
The New Testament ( The Eastern-Greek Orthodox Bible) : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

I think it means what it says but you disagree so tell us what it "really means."
Who better than the native Greek speaking scholars who translated the EOB know the correct meaning of the Greek in the NT,

 

[Deafsilence]

This is just a great verse I like to provide it often so others can really appreciate what it says:

1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

Often I have to tell others that Jesus was sent to ERADICATE sin. The man-made doctrine of Eternal Torment never addresses this key purpose for which the Lord was manifested.

Again this Traditional Hell is a relocation plan. It does nothing to eradicate sin and negates and mocks the purpose for which Jesus has come.

 

[Der Alte]

This is just a great verse I like to provide it often so others can really appreciate what it says:
1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Often I have to tell others that Jesus was sent to ERADICATE sin. The man-made doctrine of Eternal Torment never addresses this key purpose for which the Lord was manifested.
Again this Traditional Hell is a relocation plan. It does nothing to eradicate sin and negates and mocks the purpose for which Jesus has come.

Your opinion about "eternal punishment," the Biblical term, is rubbish.
The Greek word for "torment" is βασανίζω/basanizo, It occurs 12 times in the NT. It only occurs with for ever and ever one time in Rev 20:10. It never occurs with "eternal." It does NOT occur in Mat 25:46.

EOB Matthew:25:46 When he will answer them, saying: ‘Amen, I tell you: as much as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to me.’ 46 These [ones on the left] will go away into eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] punishment, [κόλασις/kolasis] but the righteous into eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life.”[EOB p. 96]​

…..Greek has been the language of the Eastern Greek Orthodox church since its inception, 2000 years ago +/-. Note, the native Greek speaking Eastern Orthodox Greek scholars, translators of the EOB, translated “aionios,” in Matt 25:46, as “eternal,” NOT “age.”
…..Who is better qualified than the team of native Greek speaking scholars, translators of the Eastern Greek Orthodox Bible [EOB], quoted above and below, to know the correct translation of the Greek in the N.T.?
Link to EOB online:
The New Testament ( The Eastern-Greek Orthodox Bible) : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
…..The Greek word “kolasis” occurs only twice in the N.T., 1st occurrence Matt 25:46, above, and 2nd occurrence 1 John 4:18., below.

EOB 1 John 4:18 There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear, because fear is connected with punishment.[κόλασις/kolasis] But the one who fears is not yet perfect in love.[EOB p. 518]​

In the EOB the Greek word “kolasis” is translated “punishment” in both Matt 25:46 and 1 John 4:18.
…..Some badly informed folks claim “kolasis” really means “prune” or “correction.”
Sorry, that is impossible, both “prune” and “correction” are verbs. “Kolasis” is a noun. A noun cannot be translated as a verb.
Also according to the EOB Greek scholars “kolasis” means “punishment.”
Note: in 1 John 4:18 there is no correction, the one with “kolasis” is not made perfect. Thus “kolasis” does not/cannot mean “correction.”
…..It is acknowledged that modern Greek differs from koine Greek but I am confident that the native Greek speaking EOB scholars, supported by 2000 years +/- of continuous, uninterrupted Greek scholarship, are competent enough to know the correct translation of obsolete Greek words which may have changed in meaning or are no longer in use and to translate them correctly. In the same way English speaking scholars today know the meaning of obsolete English words which occur in the 1611 KJV and can define them correctly.
I can post the complete definition of "kolasis" from BDAG Greek lexicon. That might refresh your memory.

Link to definition of Kolasis from Bauer, Danker, Arndt, Gingrich Greek lexicon another thread this forum.
The Gospel Plus Nothing

 

[Deafsilence]

For my Universalists Brothers and Sisters, understand that Aionios is NOT a "limited duration". I know that many of you have been taught that but it really isn't and can't pass the context test when used in that manner. This misunderstanding of the term only emboldens Eternal Torment crowd.

Aionios is an Adjective describing a time the something as AGE-Enduring. Meaning it doesn't tell you if something has an infinite or finite duration. Instead it simple means something is of a nature to exist and continue to exist beyond the horizon of the existing age.

 

[FineLinen]

For my Universalists Brothers and Sisters, understand that Aionios is NOT a "limited duration". I know that many of you have been taught that but it really isn't and can't pass the context test when used in that manner. This misunderstanding of the term only emboldens Eternal Torment crowd.

Aionios is an Adjective describing a time the something as AGE-Enduring. Meaning it doesn't tell you if something has an infinite or finite duration. Instead it simple means something is of a nature to exist and continue to exist beyond the horizon of the existing age.

The eternal torment ones love thinking our Father will keep suffering going on for ever and ever & ever.

The whole of created life shall be delivered!

Aion & Aionios

 

[Der Alte]

For my Universalists Brothers and Sisters, understand that Aionios is NOT a "limited duration". I know that many of you have been taught that but it really isn't and can't pass the context test when used in that manner. This misunderstanding of the term only emboldens Eternal Torment crowd.
Aionios is an Adjective describing a time the something as AGE-Enduring. Meaning it doesn't tell you if something has an infinite or finite duration. Instead it simple means something is of a nature to exist and continue to exist beyond the horizon of the existing age.

Too bad you can't find some kind of scholarly work e.g. a lexicon, which states any of this. Just internet gossip.
"Aionios" never means "age" anything. ""Aionios" is an adjective and "age" is a noun. Here is the definition from BDAG lexicon for you to ignore again. The blue highlights indicate the 80+ historical sources the scholars consulted in determining the correct meaning.
Only UR-ites make up their own meaning for Greek and Hebrew words.

Aionios/αἰώνιος (ία Pla., Tim. 38b; Jer 39:40; Ezk 37:26; OdeSol 11:22; TestAbr A; JosAs 8:11 cod. A; 2 Th 2:16; Hb 9:12; mss. Ac 13:48; 2 Pt 1:11; AcPl BMM recto 27=Ox 1602, 29; Just., A I, 8, 4 al.; B-D-F §59, 2; Mlt-H. 157), ον eternal (since Hyperid. 6, 27; Pla.; ins, pap, LXX, En, TestSol, TestAbr A, Test12Patr; JosAs 12:12; GrBar 4:16; ApcEsdr; ApcMos 29; Ps.-Phocyl. 112; Just.; Tat. 17, 1; Ath., Mel.; standard epithet for princely, esp. imperial, power: OGI index VIII; BGU 176, 12; 303, 2; 309, 4; Sb 7517, 5 [211/12 a.d.] κύριος αἰ.; al. in pap; Jos., Ant. 7, 352).
① pert. to a long period of time, long ago χρόνοις αἰ. long ages ago Ro 16:25; πρὸ χρόνων αἰ. before time began 2 Ti 1:9; Tit 1:2 (in these two last pass. the prep. bears the semantic content of priority; on χρόνος αἰ. cp. OGI 248, 54; 383, 10).
② pert. to a period of time without beginning or end, eternal of God (Ps.-Pla., Tim. Locr. 96c θεὸν τ. αἰώνιον; IBM 894, 2 αἰ. κ. ἀθάνατος τοῦ παντὸς φύσις; Gen 21:33; Is 26:4; 40:28; Bar 4:8 al.; Philo, Plant. 8; 74; SibOr Fgm. 3, 17 and 4; PGM 1, 309; 13, 280) Ro 16:26; of the Holy Spirit in Christ Hb 9:14. θρόνος αἰ. 1 Cl 65:2 (cp. 1 Macc 2:57).
③ pert. to a period of unending duration, without end (Diod S 1, 1, 5; 5, 73, 1; 15, 66, 1 δόξα αἰ. everlasting fame; in Diod S 1, 93, 1 the Egyptian dead are said to have passed to their αἰ. οἴκησις; Arrian, Peripl. 1, 4 ἐς μνήμην αἰ.; Jos., Bell. 4, 461 αἰ. χάρις=a benefaction for all future time; OGI 383, 10 [I b.c.] εἰς χρόνον αἰ.; EOwen, οἶκος αἰ.: JTS 38, ’37, 248–50; EStommel, Domus Aeterna: RAC IV 109–28) of the next life σκηναὶ αἰ. Lk 16:9 (cp. En 39:5). οἰκία, contrasted w. the οἰκία ἐπίγειος, of the glorified body 2 Cor 5:1. διαθήκη (Gen 9:16; 17:7; Lev 24:8; 2 Km 23:5 al.; PsSol 10:4 al.) Hb 13:20. εὐαγγέλιον Rv 14:6; κράτος in a doxolog. formula (=εἰς τοὺς αἰῶνας) 1 Ti 6:16. παράκλησις 2 Th 2:16. λύτρωσις Hb 9:12. κληρονομία (Esth 4:17m) vs. 15; AcPl Ha 8, 21. αἰ. ἀπέχειν τινά (opp. πρὸς ὥραν) keep someone forever Phlm 15 (cp. Job 40:28). Very often of God’s judgment (Diod S 4, 63, 4 διὰ τὴν ἀσέβειαν ἐν ᾅδου διατελεῖν τιμωρίας αἰωνίου τυγχάνοντα; similarly 4, 69, 5; Jer 23:40; Da 12:2; Ps 76:6; 4 Macc 9:9; 13:15) κόλασις αἰ. (TestReub 5:5) Mt 25:46; 2 Cl 6:7; κρίμα αἰ. Hb 6:2 (cp. κρίσις αἰ. En 104:5). θάνατος B 20:1. ὄλεθρον (4 Macc 10:15) 2 Th 1:9. πῦρ (4 Macc 12:12; GrBar 4:16.—SibOr 8, 401 φῶς αἰ.) Mt 18:8; 25:41; Jd 7; Dg 10:7 (cp. 1QS 2:8). ἁμάρτημα Mk 3:29 (v.l. κρίσεως, κολάσεω, and ἁμαρτίας). On the other hand, of eternal life (Maximus Tyr. 6, 1d θεοῦ ζωὴ αἰ.; Diod S 8, 15, 3 life μετὰ τὸν θάνατον lasts εἰς ἅπαντα αἰῶνα; Da 12:2; 4 Macc 15:3;PsSol PsSol 3:12; OdeSol 11:16c; JosAs 8:11 cod. A [p. 50, 2 Bat.]; Philo, Fuga 78; Jos., Bell. 1, 650; SibOr 2, 336) in the Reign of God: ζωὴ αἰ. (Orig., C. Cels. 2, 77, 3) Mt 19:16, 29; 25:46; Mk 10:17, 30; Lk 10:25; 18:18, 30; J 3:15f, 36; 4:14, 36; 5:24, 39; 6:27, 40, 47, 54, 68; 10:28; 12:25, 50; 17:2f; Ac 13:46, 48; Ro 2:7; 5:21; 6:22f; Gal 6:8; 1 Ti 1:16; 6:12; Tit 1:2; 3:7; 1J 1:2; 2:25; 3:15; 5:11, 13, 20; Jd 21; D 10:3; 2 Cl 5:5; 8:4, 6; IEph 18:1; Hv 2, 3, 2; 3, 8, 4 al. Also βασιλεία αἰ. 2 Pt 1:11 (ApcPt Rainer 9; cp. Da 4:3; 7:27; Philo, Somn. 2, 285; Mel., P. 68, 493; OGI 569, 24 ὑπὲρ τῆς αἰωνίου καὶ ἀφθάρτου βασιλείας ὑμῶν; Dssm. B 279f, BS 363). Of the glory in the next life δόξα αἰ. 2 Ti 2:10; 1 Pt 5:10 (cp. Wsd 10:14; Jos., Ant. 15, 376.—SibOr 8, 410 φῶς αἰῶνιον). αἰώνιον βάρος δόξης 2 Cor 4:17; σωτηρία αἰ. (Is 45:17; Ps.-Clem., Hom. 1, 19) Hb 5:9; short ending of Mk. Of unseen glory in contrast to the transitory world of the senses τὰ μὴ βλεπόμενα αἰώνια 2 Cor 4:18.—χαρά IPhld ins; δοξάζεσθαι αἰωνίῳ ἔργῳ be glorified by an everlasting deed IPol 8:1. DHill, Gk. Words and Hebr. Mngs. ’67, 186–201; JvanderWatt, NovT 31, ’89, 217–28 (J).—DELG s.v. αἰών. M-M. TW. Sv.[1]
William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2000), 33.​

[1] William Arndt et al., A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and Other Early Christian Literature (Chicago: University of Chicago Press, 2000), 33.

 

[Deafsilence]

The eternal torment ones love thinking our Father will keep suffering going on for ever and ever & ever.

The whole of created life shall be delivered!

Aion & Aionios

I would disagree with his analysis of the word. I see no way in which this term would ever be applied to God if it were of a limited duration. I've studied this subject so intensely, I would have to bet I did so than more than many scholars. I looked at LENNEP on this subject and agreed with Rev Goodwin's analysis if LENNEP on this more. I went back and did a concordant analysis of the scriptures with every occurrence and not limited to just those in the NT but used the LXX as well. Most ETers don't really debate from the LXX side of things but I got tools that pull the words out from all those text as well and analyzed them all. My current conclusion is that Aionios describes something that endures the age. That may mean it possesses a different quality in order to do so but in any case, it never speaks to how long it endures pass the age boundary - but that is significant in my opinion because I believe it causes you to HERALD the next age when we hear of Aionios Life. I then immediately see it as speak of LIFE that endures the existing age into the Next Age. Therefore, My FOCUS is immediately attentive to that NEXT age which we all know is the Age when our Lord Jesus Christ will take over dominion of this world.

 

[Der Alte]

I would disagree with his analysis of the word. I see no way in which this term would ever be applied to God if it were of a limited duration. I've studied this subject so intensely, I would have to bet I did so than more than many scholars. I looked at LENNEP on this subject and agreed with Rev Goodwin's analysis if LENNEP on this more. I went back and did a concordant analysis of the scriptures with every occurrence and not limited to just those in the NT but used the LXX as well. Most ETers don't really debate from the LXX side of things but I got tools that pull the words out from all those text as well and analyzed them all. My current conclusion is that Aionios describes something that endures the age. That may mean it possesses a different quality in order to do so but in any case, it never speaks to how long it endures pass the age boundary - but that is significant in my opinion because I believe it causes you to HERALD the next age when we hear of Aionios Life. I then immediately see it as speak of LIFE that endures the existing age into the Next Age. Therefore, My FOCUS is immediately attentive to that NEXT age which we all know is the Age when our Lord Jesus Christ will take over dominion of this world.

When you have earned a graduate degree with a ThD or PhD after your name and have published a peer reviewed dissertation referencing 80 or more historical sources from which you have reached your conclusions then your opinion might have some relevance. I just googled LENNEP, zip.
…..Some people claim that “αιων/aion never means "eternity" and αιωνιος/aionios never means eternal,” because a few times they refer to something which are not eternal e.g., “world.”
However, neither word is ever defined/described, by adjectives or descriptive phrases, as meaning a period less than eternal, as in the following NT verses.

John 3:15
(15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [aionion] life.
John 3:16
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [aionion] life. ​

In these two verses Jesus parallels “aionion life” with “should not perish,” twice. Believers could eventually perish in a finite age, by definition “aionion life” here means eternal or everlasting life.

John 10:28
(28) I give them eternal [aionios] life, and they shall never [aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.​

In this verse Jesus parallels “aionios” and “aion” with “[not] snatch them out of my hand”, and “never perish.” If “aion” means “age(s), a finite age,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’/never perish” “Aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”
…..Paul used the word “aionios” eighteen [18] times. It is correctly translated “eternal/everlasting” 16 times and world only 2 times. In the following verses Paul defines/describes “aionios” as eternal.

Romans 1:20
(20) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal [αιδιος/aidios] power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Romans 16:26
(26) But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting [αιωνιος/aionios] God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:​

In Rom 1:20, above, Paul refers to God’s power and Godhead as “aidios.”
Scholars unanimously agree “aidios” means eternal, everlasting, for ever etc.
In Rom 16:26, Paul, the same writer, in the same writing, refers to God as “aionios.”
aidios power and Godhead/aionios God, Paul has used “aionios” synonymous with “aidios.” By definition, “aionios” means eternal, everlasting etc.

 

[Deafsilence]

Still a great resource on this subject -

https://www.tentmaker.org/books/HansonsFourWorks.pdf

Of course many of you universalist know this work already and it is pretty exhaustive. But it pretty much destroys all the arrows of the ETers. But again, I think the limited duration idea is wrong and my idea of it not answering to the duration is the correct position on Aionios.

 

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For those that want the original writing link -

https://tile.loc.gov/storage-servic...aioniosexcur00hans/aionaioniosexcur00hans.pdf

 

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I'm amazed at how many ETers always have their right hand:

Mat_5:30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Am I the only universalist that sees the hypocrisy?