Simon_Templar
Not all who wander are lost
People do use the garbage dump idea to argue that hell is not literal, not eternal etc... but thats just bad reasoning.
The idea that Gehenna was a garbage dump that was perpetually burning could conceivably support the annihilationist view, however, it can just as easily support the traditional view.
In order for it to be 'evidence' either way it needs to conclusively support one and not the other. Since it really doesn't support the annhilationist view any more strongly or logically, it is at best an interesting bit of trivia and a possible source for the term "lake of fire".
If it isn't true, then it is one of hundreds supposed facts that get tossed around all the time without real historical basis. I'm willing to bet that if you annalysed the anecdotal style 'historical facts' used by sermons across the country a high percentage of them would prove to be without real basis or support.
I thought I made it clear in my post that the Jewish association of the Valley of Hinnom with the idea of the underworld/hell was seperate from, and predated the supposed garbage dump association. Perhaps I didn't make it clear or explicit enough in my post.
As to the 2nd part of my argument, which is invalid... I'm really not sure what your even referring to.
As I never addressed the word sheol at all or made any correlation between it an gehenna (positive or negative).
I must assume you are referring to my assertion that there are two places, possibly three which are referred to that we lump together under the term hell (hades).
In Jewish conception (and the bible) it is very clear that sheol was regarded as the place where all of the dead went to wait. Both the righteous and the unrighteous went to Sheol.
Sheol the word means grave and it usually translated as the grave. However, this is a metaphorical reference as the way sheol is described clearly shows it not to be a mere grave, but rather the residing place of the souls of the dead.
In the Jewish conception this place was divided between a part in which the wicked were kept, and a part in which the righteous were kept. The part where the righteous were kept was euphamisticly and metaphorically referred to as abraham's bosom in the sense that people who where there were said have gone to Abraham's bosom.
Further in ancient Jewish conception there were seven heavens, the 3rd out of the seven was divided between a garden paradise, and another area which was tormented by extremes of both hot and cold. I can't catagorically say that this is sheol/hades, but I do believe that it is referring to the same thing, the same place.
Further, I believe this is what Jesus was referring to when he said "this day you will be with me in paradise" and it is also clearly what Paul was talking about when he said he knew a man (probably himself) who was caught up to 3rd heaven, which he then refers to as 'Paradise'.
I have no doubt that Hades/Sheol/Gehenna are all interchangable terms in the ancient Jewish conception. I also don't see how that invalidates anything I have said above. Perhaps I didn't communicate this clearly in my original post.
The idea of the third place, as far as I know, is somewhat unique to me. It may exist in the ancient Jewish views, I don't know. I've never really heard anyone else teach it however.
The idea comes simply from the observation in scripture that there is no cleare evidence of fallen angels that are imprisoned, being imprisoned in the same place where human souls go to await judgement.
It could be, and if it is I certainly won't lose any sleep over it, that this 'third place' is simply part of hades/sheol/gehenna. In fact it may be more likely that it is yet another division within hades, rather than an entirely seperate place.
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