Col 2:16 is about not judging others

[1stcenturylady]

You must have read my reply.

Now 'the Feast of Unleavened Bread. That was a High Sabbath' you say. Dead right!
It was called --WRITTEN IN LAW-- in the OT, "Feast"-- 'Feast' of ULB. Correct.
It is called --in Jesus' Last Passover-- in the NT, "That Day great ('High') day of sabbath" of Jesus' Last Passover of Yahweh Suffering of

1) Dying the death of death "on the first first day ye shall KILL the Passover ... on the fourteenth day of the First Month"; and

2) "on the first day seven days ULB ye shall EAT (swallow BURY) ... and burn with fire (return to earth BURY) that which remained"-- the body of Jesus : "Feast day is the fifteenth day of the First Month", "rest-day-sabbath" OF THE FIRST SHEAF --Jesus, "PROSTRATED IN STORE" in his grave on "That Day the Preparation"; and

3) "on the day AFTER the rest-day" of Jesus' body in the grave, "on the sixteenth day of the First Month (God) cleansed the Sanctuary" and He "RESTED HIM UP AGAIN HIS NAME, THE MOST HOLY PLACE!"

The exodus passover happened fifty days BEFORE GOD SPOKE BY THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST on the mountain and fifty three - 53 days BEFORE He gave Moses the Law! How can the word 'sabbath' of the first sheaf institutionalised, have referred to the Sabbath of the LORD 53 days before it was given through the Law?! It was not the Sabbath of the Fourth Commandment the Seventh Day of the week.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I already knew that the Feast of Unleavened Bread was a "High" Sabbath. The 14th, which is Passover Day is also the preparation day for that high Sabbath on the 15th. That week there was more than one "Sabbath." Matthew 28:1 in the original says "after the 'sabbaths'"

 

[BobRyan]

At the risk of bringing the thread back on topic...

=======================
As for Col 2 -- condemning the traditions and doctrines of man - and upholding the Word of God --

Col 2 is opposed to making up a rule and judging others of being guilty of sin because they differ with you, even if that invented rule is related to a Bible command.

But Col 2 is not an attempt by Paul to delete the scriptures. Rather Paul condemns the idea of making stuff up that is not in scripture at all - where the only source/authority is "man".

Col 2:18 Let no one keep defrauding you of your prize by delighting in self-abasement and the worship of the angels, taking his stand on visions he has seen, inflatedwithout cause by his fleshly mind,
19 and not holding fast to the head, from whom the entire body, being supplied and held together by the joints and ligaments, grows with a growth which is from God.


Col 2
20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men? 23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh. (KJV)

Col 2
20 If you have died with Christ to the elementary principles of the world, why, as if you were living in the world, do you submit yourself to decrees, such as,
21 “Do not handle, do not taste, do not touch!” 22 (which all refer to things destined to perish with use)—in accordance with the commandments and teachings of men?
23 These are matters which have, to be sure, the appearance of wisdom in self-made religion and self-abasement and severe treatment of the body, but are of no value against fleshly indulgence.(NASB)

 

[BABerean2]

At the risk of bringing the thread back on topic...

=======================
As for Col 2 -- condemning the traditions and doctrines of man - and upholding the Word of God --

Col 2 is opposed to making up a rule and judging others of being guilty of sin because they differ with you, even if that invented rule is related to a Bible command.

But Col 2 is not an attempt by Paul to delete the scriptures. Rather Paul condemns the idea of making stuff up that is not in scripture at all - where the only source/authority is "man".

Col 2:18 Let no one keep defrauding you of your prize by delighting in self-abasement and the worship of the angels, taking his stand on visions he has seen, inflatedwithout cause by his fleshly mind,
19 and not holding fast to the head, from whom the entire body, being supplied and held together by the joints and ligaments, grows with a growth which is from God.


Col 2
20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men? 23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body: not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh. (KJV)

Col 2
20 If you have died with Christ to the elementary principles of the world, why, as if you were living in the world, do you submit yourself to decrees, such as,
21 “Do not handle, do not taste, do not touch!” 22 (which all refer to things destined to perish with use)—in accordance with the commandments and teachings of men?
23 These are matters which have, to be sure, the appearance of wisdom in self-made religion and self-abasement and severe treatment of the body, but are of no value against fleshly indulgence.(NASB)

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

Gal 4:24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.


Gal 4:30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
Gal 4:31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

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[Joelthe vicious]

1stcenturylady said: ↑
He was raised the day after the Sabbath.

True. The Sabbath is the 7 day week of Creation.. there is "no week" of crucifixion or resurrection

The SDAC says No. not true. And this time the SDAC is right.

Then there is the passover week or seven days before "the day after the sabbath" of the passover a) from and including the "tenth day of the First Month" b) to and including "the day after the sabbath" of the passover -- also called the passover's Feast day. The "Feast" was "the fifteenth day you must EAT the flesh with ULB" during which day the first sheaf "rested" "prostrated" and was "kept in store". Leviticus 23:11A. John 19:31 calls THIS day, "That Day was great day of sabbath"
[ἦν γὰρ μεγάλη ἡ ἡμέρα ἐκείνου τοῦ σαββάτου·]
[for that sabbath day was an high day]

"The day after the sabbath" of passover was of course "the sixteenth day of the First Month" on whichever day of the week, and the first day "counted" to the "Fiftieth day", Pentecost. Therefore on whichever day of the week it was the passover sabbath, the fiftieth day after would fall on the same day of the week again.

 

[BABerean2]

1stcenturylady said: ↑
He was raised the day after the Sabbath.



The SDAC says No. not true. And this time the SDAC is right.

Then there is the passover week or seven days before "the day after the sabbath" of the passover a) from and including the "tenth day of the First Month" b) to and including "the day after the sabbath" of the passover -- also called the passover's Feast day. The "Feast" was "the fifteenth day you must EAT the flesh with ULB" during which day the first sheaf "rested" "prostrated" and was "kept in store". Leviticus 23:11A. John 19:31 calls THIS day, "That Day was great day of sabbath"
[ἦν γὰρ μεγάλη ἡ ἡμέρα ἐκείνου τοῦ σαββάτου·]
[for that sabbath day was an high day]

"The day after the sabbath" of passover was of course "the sixteenth day of the First Month" on whichever day of the week, and the first day "counted" to the "Fiftieth day", Pentecost. Therefore on whichever day of the week it was the passover sabbath, the fiftieth day after would fall on the same day of the week again.

Mat_28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.

Mar_16:2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.

Mar_16:9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Luk_24:1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

Joh_20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

Joh_20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Act_20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

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[Joelthe vicious]

I wonder if Paul was siding with the trouble makers when he compelled the Galatian believers to "cast out" the Sinai Covenant of "bondage" in Galatians 4:24-31 ?

Unrelated Scriptures and an irrelevant, arbitrary suggestion ('question').

Paul wrote about TWO 'covenants' about being "in bondage", both EARTHLY covenants. The only 'heavenly' covenant is of "Jerusalem above", the EVERLASTING Covenant of God's grace through Jesus Christ who is now, in heaven.

 

[Joelthe vicious]

Mat_28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre.

Mar_16:2 And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun.

Mar_16:9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Luk_24:1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

Joh_20:1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

Joh_20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Act_20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

Of all these texts only Matthew 28:1 recorded the events which "the angel answered and explained to the women", the events which accompanied Jesus' Resurrection, "In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week".

That Jesus' Resurrection had occurred "Late, in the Sabbath’s end(ing hours) as mid-afternoon daylight, it began to dawn toward the First Day of the week", is confirmed by the following facts afterwards...

1) "The First Day of the week comes Mary Magdalene unto the sepulchre being early of dark still and sees the stone taken away from the sepulchre; then runs back." John 20:1

2) Now upon the First Day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them. And they found the stone rolled away..." as Mary must have told them in John 20:1 further, "...but entering in, they found not the body of Jesus" as they must have hoped to. Luke 24:1,2,3.

3) "Very early in the morning before sunrise the First Day of the week, the women came unto the sepulchre , and again looked at the stone (but) fled for fear and told no one anything." Mark 16:2

4A) "Mary supposing Jesus to be the gardener" arriving in the garden to start work, "says to Him, Sir, if you have taken Him away, tell me... Jesus says to her, Mary!"
This, fifteen hours after He Resurrected, was Jesus' first APPEARANCE...
4B) "Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, He appeared first to Mary Magdalene." Mark 16:9.

So how can John 20:19 or Acts 20:7, as you claim, prove that Jesus rose on the First Day of the week?!

 

[Joelthe vicious]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I already knew that the Feast of Unleavened Bread was a "High" Sabbath. The 14th, which is Passover Day is also the preparation day for that high Sabbath on the 15th. That week there was more than one "Sabbath." Matthew 28:1 in the original says "after the 'sabbaths'"

Agreement with you from your "Sorry to...", to your, "...more than one "Sabbath."". But thereafter, no agreement with your, stress, YOUR, "Matthew 28:1 in the original says "after the 'sabbaths'"". Which is not the Scripture or God's Matthew 28:1.

 

[1stcenturylady]

Agreement with you from your "Sorry to...", to your, "...more than one "Sabbath."". But thereafter, no agreement with your, stress, YOUR, "Matthew 28:1 in the original says "after the 'sabbaths'"". Which is not the Scripture or God's Matthew 28:1.

Of course it is in the original. Here is the literal translation:

Matthew 28:1 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
28 And on the eve of the sabbaths, at the dawn, toward the first of the sabbaths, came Mary the Magdalene, and the other Mary, to see the sepulchre,

 

[BABerean2]

So how can John 20:19 or Acts 20:7, as you claim, prove that Jesus rose on the First Day of the week?!

I did not claim anything.
I merely posted the scripture.

We do know that during the time of Christ the Jewish Sabbath begins and ends at sundown, instead of sunrise.

You seem to think that meeting on the first day of the week is somehow wicked, but the scripture below proves your error.

Joh_20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Act_20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

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[Joelthe vicious]

Of course it is in the original. Here is the literal translation:

Matthew 28:1 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
28 And on the eve of the sabbaths, at the dawn, toward the first of the sabbaths, came Mary the Magdalene, and the other Mary, to see the sepulchre,

Beautiful. Of course you have compared this with ALL English translations from Tyndale up to the start of the twentieth century and the best in the twentieth century EVEN TWENTY FIRST century, including modern Greek translations; they ALL say "Late on the Sabbath / Late in the Sabbath" and so on and never, not even one, "After the Sabbath on the First day of the week" like the fraudulently corrupted NIV and NKJV sort of quasi translations say.

And still no translation is ‘the original’. So here is the original, while you may assuredly know there are ZERO variants yet discovered.

‘opse’ - “late”, “slow hours”, “fullness”;
‘sabbatohn’ - “Sabbath’s”, “of the Sabbath”, “in the Sabbath”, “Sabbath’s-time”;
‘tehi epiphohskousehi’ - “in the center - light - being”
‘epi’ - “very middle”, “centre-inclining towards”, ‘emphatically over’, ‘on’, ‘upon’;
‘phohs’ - “light”, “day”, “shine / shining”;
‘ousas’ - “being”, “while is”, “actually is”;
‘ousehi’ - “in the being”, “while verily”.
‘sabbatohn tehi epiphohskousehi’ “SABBATH’S in the being mid-afternoon”;
‘eis’ - “towards”, “beginning in the direction of”, “before”;
‘mian (hehmeran)’ “First Day” in itself being an Accusative: “towards the First Day”;
‘sabbatohn’ - “of the week”.

My ‘interpretation’? Literal, sterile, dictionary ‘Greek usage’!

 

[Joelthe vicious]

Of course it is in the original. Here is the literal translation:

Matthew 28:1 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
28 And on the eve of the sabbaths, at the dawn, toward the first of the sabbaths, came Mary the Magdalene, and the other Mary, to see the sepulchre,

But wait a bit; have you not posted the following,
1stcenturylady said: ↑
Q~Not the Feast of Unleavened Bread. That was a High Sabbath. He rose after the weekly Sabbath, according to scripture and which is what I've been saying.~Q

Is there then more than one Q~weekly Sabbath~Q, namely more than one 'sabbaths', 'at the dawn of which' or 'toward' which, Q~came Mary the Magdalene'~Q?! Which is what you, have been saying, supposedly 'according to scripture'?!

 

[Joelthe vicious]

I did not claim anything.
I merely posted the scripture.

We do know that during the time of Christ the Jewish Sabbath begins and ends at sundown, instead of sunrise.

You seem to think that meeting on the first day of the week is somehow wicked, but the scripture below proves your error.

Joh_20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

Act_20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

Having placed 'Mat_28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre' in line and together with 'Mar_16:2' and '' and 'Mar_16:9' and 'Luk_24:1' and 'Joh_20:1' you have done what all Sunday-resurrectionists try to do, to 'prove' Jesus resurrected 'on the First day of the week'. Excuses do not help; only make your situation more awkward and precarious than it already is. You did not 'merely post the scripture.' You made one heck of a witches' cauldron of them.

Don't try your other trick, to change the subject of contention by 'merely quoting' 'Joh_20:19' and 'Act_20:7' which have nothing to do with Colossians 2. I don't merely 'think', but for certain know, that 'meeting on the first day of the week', is NOHOW 'the scripture', but 'wicked' perversion of the Scripture. But that is for another discussion.

 

[1stcenturylady]

But wait a bit; have you not posted the following,
1stcenturylady said: ↑
Q~Not the Feast of Unleavened Bread. That was a High Sabbath. He rose after the weekly Sabbath, according to scripture and which is what I've been saying.~Q

Is there then more than one Q~weekly Sabbath~Q, namely more than one 'sabbaths', 'at the dawn of which' or 'toward' which, Q~came Mary the Magdalene'~Q?! Which is what you, have been saying, supposedly 'according to scripture'?!

There was only one weekly Sabbath, every week on Saturday; however at Passover there were more than one holy convocations that week. I'm not sure what your point is.

 

[Joelthe vicious]

What a testimony for Sunday apologists, that it ALWAYS MUST be ex-SDA who is / are your master/s! No Reformer matches any of them; what a shame!

Dale Ratzlaff nowadays being the great anti-Sabbath Professor either hides behind the frock of old women or fancy nicknames. His videos allow him only, to speak. And he has the time and setting perfect for drawing unopposed comparisons and strange analogies and interpretations of Scripture.

I won't answer videos because I am not technically equipped to. But whatever of or by Dale Ratzlaff I find written on these internet pages, I will expose for the deception it is. God is my help.

 

[1stcenturylady]

What a testimony for Sunday apologists, that it ALWAYS MUST be ex-SDA who is / are your master/s! No Reformer matches any of them; what a shame!

Dale Ratzlaff nowadays being the great anti-Sabbath Professor either hides behind the frock of old women or fancy nicknames. His videos allow him only, to speak. And he has the time and setting perfect for drawing unopposed comparisons and strange analogies and interpretations of Scripture.

I won't answer videos because I am not technically equipped to. But whatever of or by Dale Ratzlaff I find written on these internet pages, I will expose for the deception it is. God is my help.

Are you SDA? Your profile could say so if you are.

 

[Joelthe vicious]

There was only one weekly Sabbath, every week on Saturday; however at Passover there were more than one holy convocations that week. I'm not sure what your point is.

Obviously you are not sure of what you said yourself, lady. In the one place you insist on "the day after the sabbath" of the passover must be the day after the only Seventh Day Sabbath of the week; in the next place you 'use' Tyndale who wrote "sabbaths" more than one supposedly to mean 'the day after every week on Saturday'. (And you, coloured it red?) Is it the day after the one day of the week, the Seventh Day Sabbath of the week, or is it more than one days after some more than one 'sabbaths' -- 'sabbaths' of the week, or, of what? It can't be both because it was just "the day (singular) after the sabbath"!

 

[Joelthe vicious]

Are you SDA? Your profile could say so if you are.

It's got nothing to do with the discussion. But I'll tell you whatever my 'profile' it's only possible I am 'Sabbaths' Feast of Christ Home Assemblies Reformed Protestant Faith' so help me God.

 

[BABerean2]

Having placed 'Mat_28:1 In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre' in line and together with 'Mar_16:2' and '' and 'Mar_16:9' and 'Luk_24:1' and 'Joh_20:1' you have done what all Sunday-resurrectionists try to do, to 'prove' Jesus resurrected 'on the First day of the week'. Excuses do not help; only make your situation more awkward and precarious than it already is. You did not 'merely post the scripture.' You made one heck of a witches' cauldron of them.

Don't try your other trick, to change the subject of contention by 'merely quoting' 'Joh_20:19' and 'Act_20:7' which have nothing to do with Colossians 2. I don't merely 'think', but for certain know, that 'meeting on the first day of the week', is NOHOW 'the scripture', but 'wicked' perversion of the Scripture. But that is for another discussion.

Yes, it would be quite confusing for your followers to see that Christ appeared to His disciples on that wicked first day of the week or that Paul preached on that same wicked day.

Also, make sure none of your followers know that the Jewish Sabbath begins at Sundown.
We would not want to confuse them with wicked perversions of the truth.

Ellen G. White would be very proud of your efforts here.


Ellen G. White and the Shut Door Question

Is the door shut or open?

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[Joelthe vicious]

Here is the crux of all Sunday contentions...
Look at BABerean2's picture of the cross.
See that it portrays an empty cross with the sun about to set.
Well, THAT IS IT, the most satanic deception this world has in its existence witnessed and has swallowed whole for the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Billions times billions of people have carried and every second of every day are cherishing the LIE of the empty cross around the neck on their heart. The head of the Christian Church and every one of his worshippers make the token of this LIE of CRUCIFYING THE LORD JESUS CHRIST ANEW AND EVER ANEW UNTIL Jesus Christ shall put a stop to the abominable doctrine when He shall come again and shall not delay the destruction of its practice, the abomination of this Tau cultist ritual.

God shall restore his Written Word that until the last halve of the last century used to obstruct this viral plague to shoot its roots in the minds of ALL Christians.
Mark 15:42 Matthew 27:57 John 19:31 and Luke 23:50 show the TRUE picture of that cross WITH Jesus ON IT UNTIL "EVENING HAD COME since That Day the Preparation had begun", and "after these things" only, when only Joseph arrived and began to negotiate with Pilate over Jesus' body, DEAD for at least three hours plus and STILL HANGING on that cross AFTER the sun had set.

Only by starting with these texts to reverse the time of day Jesus was BURIED, back onto the day He was crucified, can and must the day on which He rose from the dead be advanced from "on the Sabbath before the First Day of the week" onto 'after the Sabbath on the First Day of the week', Sunday, in Matthew 28:1.

So noticed they it, and changed they, the Written Word of God according to what they, have noticed, and they, succeeded in, in obtaining all honour and dignity belonging to Jesus' RESURRECTION "on the Sabbath", for the FALSE day of the Christians' worship, Sunday.