Christian Homophobia

[dawnsday]

Ok, that's nice. Could you point out those stats that prove your assertions:

If only gay people committed such crimes you may have a basis for your argument, but the fact that HETEROsexual men--fathers, brothers, dates, commi these crimes against women is evidence to the contrary. If your thesis were correct then being straight would be why men rape women.

The point is that men do this to women. women do this to men. men do this to men. women do this to women. thus showing that sexual orientation is NOT a contributing factor in a person committing a crime.

 

[hithesh]

Aids for one. Two- A tendency to involve minors.
Before I was 16 years of age I had been propositioned 4-5 times by different middle-aged homosexuals. Fortunately in a public place each time. I know a few who were forced. The long-term ramifications of those acts are pretty bad. Usually worse then a heterosexual rape.

Never once got propositioned by an older woman looking to make my day.

Hum, possibly because men are more inclined to be child molesters, than woman, this is irregardless if the male is homosexual or heterosexual.

Ask a woman how many time she's been propositioned by an older men.

In fact figure out the stats, that show how many woman have been molested and raped by men.

I knew a girl who was raped twice by two different men before she was ten.

I assume they were homosexuals huh?

What willful ignorance.

 

[LoG]

Some of what you said I agree with. I must STRONGLY disagree with you when it comes to sexuality.

That doesn't surprise me. In my drinking and drugging days I also didn't think I had a "choice" and you know what? I didn't. That's how I know exactly why you think there isn't a choice in your lifestyle. There is a verse in the bible that mentions how when we get into sinful lifestyles, "God will turn us over to our lusts". Anyone with a major addiction will at that point no longer have a "choice" because that power was taken away by God Himself and therefore He is the only one who can remove it when we honestly seek Him out to do so.

The other issues you list are addictions and they can be helped but NEVER cured. Drugs, alcohol, prostitution, etc..are lifestyles. Sexuality is not.

Are you saying that God lacks the power to do the same for Homosexuals? The One who created you, cannot undo (as you seem to think) the "genetic" that make you lust after your own gender?

Problem is that studies and testimonies of ex-gays disagree with your stance. Therefore it would appear you are trying to justify your continuing in the lifestyle you are in, even though there is potential for recovery.

God does NOT make junk. God DOES make homosexuals. I know MANY and I know many who are as God fearing and religious as the next "Christian".

Since God doesn't create junk and creates everything perfect in its own way then it is impossible for Him to create someone gay because by His own decrees anyone who is gay is subject to being stoned to death. This does not compute, Will Robinson.

"Tendancies picked up along the way"...doesn't make one a homosexual. That is just childish thinking. I do find it utterly offensive to say there is hope for homosexuals if they seek out "sexaholics anonomyous?" Are you for real???

Why you find it offensive? Don't like the idea that you are willingly continuing in a lifestyle that God forbids when He has made it possible to recover from the homosexual tendencies?
The fact that you choose to continue in it is your business. You're a big boy and can make your own choices and suffer the consequences for it like we all will if we continue in the sinful things we do. However do not compound the issue by doing your utmost to dissuade another from seeking out help.

Some sites contradicting your viewpoint:

http://www.jefflindsay.com/gays.html
People Can Change- Book
MisterSF.com
Catholic Viewpoint
Homosexuality: Seeing Past the Propaganda

 

[dawnsday]

http://www.traditionalvalues.org/urban/one.php

Actually you might find this interesting. It is an urban legend that there are more heterosexual child molestations than homosexual.

getting infor from there is like taking abortion infor from planned parenthood or a prolife site. they are sites with agenedas and generally spin the truth to supprt their cause if not outright lie. IMO.

I don't know if that is true or not, but I knowmore people who are gay doing it, if that is true, does not mean it is becaus they are are gay anymore then more black men commiting murders having anything to do with them being black. One has nothing to do with another.

 

[dawnsday]

Who ever said no one loves you?
Disagreement isn't equal to hate.


Maybe you havent yet found out what love really involves..

I know that I've "changed my mind", 'been in error' before.. MANY times.
Maybe you are too.
Could happen...

1 Corinthians 13:4-8
4 Love is patient,
love is kind.
It does not envy,
it does not boast,
it is not proud.
5 It is not rude,
it is not self-seeking,
it is not easily angered,
it keeps no record of wrongs.
6 Love does not delight in evil
but rejoices with the truth.
7 It always protects,
always trusts,
always hopes,
always perseveres.
8 Love never fails.

In the midst of our angry argument, of which we are all guilty of regardless or our reasons...in the midst of us going after each other....

this girl relects Christ's spirit of Love. She finds the real message in all of this. way to go.

 

[Libre]

Try the stats from this site:

http://www.crisisconnectioninc.org/sexualassault/pedophilia_and_child_sexual_mole.htm

Libre

 

[Adventist Dissident]

"Brainwashing" as in "ex gay therapy"?? What do you mean by 'reversing the issue'? Doesn't make sense to me...sorry.

this is were my life experiance comes in.

Starting in about 1989 there was a concerted effort by the Gay community. Nationally to come up with terms for there critics. "Homophobia" was the name given to those who objected to the lifestyle for what ever reason. They just started accusing anyone and everyone who disagreed with them as "homophobe". They acted as if everyone who disagreed with them was paranoid. there mantra is proceed as if under attack and attack first and change the social preception. that is what they have done. they have acted as if they are being "oppressed" and "abused" that there is wide spread persecution and there is not. they get people to think that they are being hurt then it creates sympathy for them and change the precipitation that they are the good guy and any one who opposes them is bad.

 

[UnitedInChrist]

That doesn't surprise me. In my drinking and drugging days I also didn't think I had a "choice" and you know what? I didn't. That's how I know exactly why you think there isn't a choice in your lifestyle. There is a verse in the bible that mentions how when we get into sinful lifestyles, "God will turn us over to our lusts". Anyone with a major addiction will at that point no longer have a "choice" because that power was taken away by God Himself and therefore He is the only one who can remove it when we honestly seek Him out to do so.



Are you saying that God lacks the power to do the same for Homosexuals? The One who created you, cannot undo (as you seem to think) the "genetic" that make you lust after your own gender?

Problem is that studies and testimonies of ex-gays disagree with your stance. Therefore it would appear you are trying to justify your continuing in the lifestyle you are in, even though there is potential for recovery.

Trust me...if you want to get into the hypocrisy of EX GAY Ministry, I will go face to face with you on that topic. I'm not sure if you're up for it, but I'll share with you the FACTs based on my experience of those that participated. I need not justify myself, nor must I "recover" from something that is not a disease to begin with. Thanks for your concern though. Oh, and for the record, there has been NO recovery from people going through ex-gay "therapy"...it doesn't work, hence it doesn't get ZERO support from the 466K+ APA organizations on the planet. Convert a straight person to becoming gay, and then we'll talk.


Since God doesn't create junk and creates everything perfect in its own way then it is impossible for Him to create someone gay because by His own decrees anyone who is gay is subject to being stoned to death. This does not compute, Will Robinson.
Why you find it offensive? Don't like the idea that you are willingly continuing in a lifestyle that God forbids when He has made it possible to recover from the homosexual tendencies?
The fact that you choose to continue in it is your business. You're a big boy and can make your own choices and suffer the consequences for it like we all will if we continue in the sinful things we do. However do not compound the issue by doing your utmost to dissuade another from seeking out help.

Some sites contradicting your viewpoint:

http://www.jefflindsay.com/gays.html
People Can Change- Book
MisterSF.com
Catholic Viewpoint
Homosexuality: Seeing Past the Propaganda

Oh, and in case you haven't noticed...every single "contradicting viewpoint" you've posted is faithbased ministry. I'll stick to the science rather than the minister when it comes to sexuality. I need not do my "utmost" to persuade anyone to do anything. You keep referring to sexuality as a disease, or sickness that requires "cure" and "help" . We aren't talking about a medical condition my friend. Once you realize that, perhaps you won't be so judgemental about something you either know nothing about, or perhaps running from yourself.

 

[Dave01]

It does me GREAT justice in front of other Christians because that is what Christianity is...welcomes EVERYONE!!!

If you are born again Spiritually. Without that you will not enter the narrow door.

As for the bible...to take it seriously..you do NOT take it literally. If you chose to be a literalist, then so be it. The bible is more than that for me. The bible is written by man, and is as fallible as anything else that has been translated a billion times in thousands of languages over 2000+ years. It is a book made up of letters from numerous individuals and not God himself sitting at a desk and writing it. So yes, I respect the bible..I've read the bible, and continue to go to bible study every Sunday. You can chose to read the bible with your interpretation. You can pick your Leviticus, Roman, etc..scriptures to support what you don't like, and say "the bible said it"..."Christians" have done that with slavery, they've done that with segregation, and currently do it with homosexuality. The bible NEVER speaks to sexuality...MAN has taken scriptures and turned it that way. Reading any of the original text, you will see that any reference to sex in the bible was based on idol worshipping, prostitution, and the raping of men in order to take possession of what belonged to others. Even the story of Soddom and Gommorah was MORE about the unwelcoming of guests and the sin of not opening your doors to others, than it ever was of sex. Even so, no one seems to care about Lot throwing his daughters to the angels to be raped and be made "women". So, instead of sitting in judgement of me for who I am, and who isn't like you and felt the need to state "i don't know the way, and don't know the bible, and that I do no justice to the Christians here"...I say you are wrong..for I do know God and He has shown me the way...and part of that way is to use my voice to say I am a child of his just like you and everyone else is and his purpose for me, like everyone else, is different than what his purpose for you is. I also state that I DO know the bible...the bibe that I take as a WHOLE and do not destroy it's meaning by taking scriputures to support hatreds for God would not have created a book used to condemn. God has used LOVE as his basis for EVERYTHING!!! As my church doors say "God never turned anyone away...either do we"...so to you my brother I ask..."If God can love me...why can't you"?
(No need to answer that...that's just for you to dwell on)

You can claim that Jesus loves you all you want.

You can claim that Jesus died for your sins all you want.

But that don't mean anything if you are not a new creation of His, if you are not born from above from Him.

14 (LIT) Eagerly pursue peace and holiness with all, without which no one will see the Lord,

You can make all sorts of claims that GOD didn't write the bible, and that it is just as fallible as man is, but it will be what judges you in the end, and what refuses you entrance into heaven for your sins.

You don't have to believe me, what GOD does is not dependant on what I say, it is dependant on what HE has already said, and will do.

 

[LoG]

Oh, and in case you haven't noticed...every single "contradicting viewpoint" you've posted is faithbased ministry. I'll stick to the science rather than the minister when it comes to sexuality.

Why would you rely on science when you say:

We aren't talking about a medical condition my friend.

Once you realize that, perhaps you won't be so judgemental about something you either know nothing about, or perhaps running from yourself.

From the way you contradict your self in your post, I think you do not have any idea of why you are gay.
If it isn't a medical condition how is science going to help you?
Don't fool yourself, I know very well what it takes to overcome a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. Running from myself is not the way to overcome. We all have the ability to turn gay. It's because I have seen the ability to be one that I also know that it isn't something that one is born with and even if that were so, God has the power to change it. You try to hard to feed us a crock based on your own lack of experience of honestly trying to overcome it through God's aid.

Trust me...if you want to get into the hypocrisy of EX GAY Ministry, I will go face to face with you on that topic. I'm not sure if you're up for it, but I'll share with you the FACTs based on my experience of those that participated.

I have no experience with Ex Gay Ministries although from doing a Google search on them, your claim of no recoveries is highly exaggerated. Add to that you have no personal experience with it, your viewpoint is based on second hand information from those who failed.

The link I supplied was for a 12 Step based program. They have a proven track record for many different issues.

I need not justify myself, nor must I "recover" from something that is not a disease to begin with. Thanks for your concern though.

Your welcome. No you do not need to justify yourself. If you are ok with your "orientation" that's up to you. That doesn't make you an expert on another's ability or desire to recover from it.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

Percentage wise homosexuals are at a much higher risk. Historically Aids got a foothold through the gay community. Do the research.

Only if you think America equals the rest of the world.

Nope, AIDS is a much larger problem for heterosexuals than for homosexuals.

 

[Murdock]

I think it's really sad how homophobic many Christians are. Whether or not you believe that the practise is right or not, why must many Christians treat them like their less of people, and call them such derogatory names and such? I think that Jesus would treat them the same as any other sinner (which is everybody), and so should we.

I also find it weird that when people are seen doing other things that are sinful, they go unnoticed, but when attention is drawn to the fact that someone is gay, people seem to go out of their way to say rude things about them, more so then any other "type" of sinner.

When we Christians sin, we call it sin. When homosexuals sin, they don't call it sin. And that's the difference between Christians and non-Christians. None of us is God, so we will all sin. The difference is that Christians don't condone sin and ask God to help us and non-Christians don't call it sin and instead, try to justify it.

 

[Dave01]

When we Christians sin, we call it sin. When homosexuals sin, they don't call it sin. And that's the difference between Christians and non-Christians. None of us is God, so we will all sin. The difference is that Christians don't condone sin and ask God to help us and non-Christians don't call it sin and instead, try to justify it.

Whether you realise it or not Murdock, you stumbled upon the driving force of homosexuality,...the spirit of perversion.

In the Hebrew, "the spirit of perversion" is associated with the corruption of truth. Not the idea that one thinks of perversion in the world currently, but of twisting the truth somehow. It ultimately twist's GOD's word and GOD's creation to mean or be something different that it is somehow. And if you keep that in mind and look back through threads, you will see this sort of denial or twisting of GOD's word throughout them.

 

[MelissaShae]

Whether you realise it or not Murdock, you stumbled upon the driving force of homosexuality,...the spirit of perversion.

In the Hebrew, "the spirit of perversion" is associated with the corruption of truth. Not the idea that one thinks of perversion in the world currently, but of twisting the truth somehow. It ultimately twist's GOD's word and GOD's creation to mean or be something different that it is somehow. And if you keep that in mind and look back through threads, you will see this sort of denial or twisting of GOD's word throughout them.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

When we Christians sin, we call it sin. When homosexuals sin, they don't call it sin. And that's the difference between Christians and non-Christians. None of us is God, so we will all sin. The difference is that Christians don't condone sin and ask God to help us and non-Christians don't call it sin and instead, try to justify it.

It doesn't require justification, there is nothing sinful about it

 

[MelissaShae]

It doesn't require justification, there is nothing sinful about it

in your opinion....but if you are going by the bible then yes it is a sin, it is not the only sin, but is a sin.

Just because you don't agree with it being a sin does not mean that it isn't. Picking and choosing bible verses to believe and then disregarding the rest is not very practical or christian like. The bible is truth and we have to do our best to live by God's word. Either believe the bible or don't, can't have it both ways.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

in your opinion....but if you are going by the bible then yes it is a sin, it is not the only sin, but is a sin.

Just because you don't agree with it being a sin does not mean that it isn't. Picking and choosing bible verses to believe and then disregarding the rest is not very practical or christian like. The bible is truth and we have to do our best to live by God's word. Either believe the bible or don't, can't have it both ways.

Nope. If you go by the Bible, it isn't a sin.

As for picking Bible verses... if you are wearing underpants with an elastic band as we speak.. then you are guilty of picking and choosing Bibleverses yourself

 

[MelissaShae]

When we Christians sin, we call it sin. When homosexuals sin, they don't call it sin. And that's the difference between Christians and non-Christians. None of us is God, so we will all sin. The difference is that Christians don't condone sin and ask God to help us and non-Christians don't call it sin and instead, try to justify it.

Then they would have to admit they are indeed sinning when they engage in homosexual behavior and that they are giving into pleasures of the flesh instead of following the word of God.

God has already said the homosexuality is a sin in the bible but even if he came down today and told them to their face that it was wrong, they would find a way to twist his words as they do about the bible and still say that it is not a sin.

Brothers, if someone is caught in a sin, you who are spiritual should restore him gently. But watch yourself, or you also may be tempted.
Galatians 6:1

 

[MelissaShae]

Nope. If you go by the Bible, it isn't a sin.

As for picking Bible verses... if you are wearing underpants with an elastic band as we speak.. then you are guilty of picking and choosing Bibleverses yourself

you crack me up......this is the only bible verse that you ever seem to use as a back up to your statements about homosexuality not being a sin.


So please show me exact verses where God says that homosexuality is okay and that it is not a sin.....I won't hold my breath waiting.

And it seems that you did not know one important thing.....those who are saved by the blood of Jesus Christ and reborn again do not have to follow the laws of Leviticus. (notice I said those who are reborn, not those who continue to live in sin and disobey God's word).

 

[Dave01]

you crack me up......this is the only bible verse that you ever seem to use as a back up to your statements about homosexuality not being a sin.


So please show me exact verses where God says that homosexuality is okay and that it is not a sin.....I won't hold my breath waiting.

And it seems that you did not know one important thing.....those who are saved by the blood of Jesus Christ and reborn again do not have to follow the laws of Leviticus. (notice I said those who are reborn, not those who continue to live in sin and disobey God's word).

She will have a hard time doing that when the word is very obvious,..

9 ¶ (LIT) Or do you not know that unjust ones will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be led astray, neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor abusers, nor homosexuals,

10 (LIT) nor thieves, nor covetous ones, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor plunderers shall inherit the kingdom of God.