Can you really live by Sola Scriptura?

[fhansen]

According to scripture God wrote His laws in our hearts and minds Hebrews 8:10 and His church are made up of those who follow His teachings.

Exactly. And He established a Church by which we can have assurance of correctly knowing those teachings, as opposed to the many groups who disagree with each other based on Scripture alone. And the Spirit of the Law is fulfilled by Sunday observance now.

The ancient churches, east and west, have never been antinomian, as you probably know whereas those led by Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide often end up at that point, or confused on that matter of grace vs law.

And, no thanks on the Sabbath discussion-that's been beat to death, sometimes with some pretty wild claims from the SDA side: sun worship et al.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Exactly. And He established a Church by which we can have assurance of correctly knowing those teachings, as opposed to the many groups who disagree with each other based on Scripture alone. And the Spirit of the Law is fulfilled by Sunday observance now.

The ancient churches, east and west, have never been antinomian, as you probably know whereas those led by Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide often end up at that point, or confused on that matter of grace vs law.

God did establish a church and what does scripture say about His church….

Let’s look at the words of Jesus Himself…

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”

Jesus has the authority of His Church and it is based on obeying what He commanded, not man. Our church should be modeled after the teachings of Jesus on what He commanded. The scripture is the authority.

In Revelation before Jesus is revealed to the World at His Second Coming we have this:

This is one clue about God’s end time Church.

• They are a remnant (a small amount of the original- unchanged)
• They keep the commandments of God
• They have the testimony of Jesus Christ which is the Spirit of Prophecy Revelation 19:10

Revelation 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Here is another clue

Revelation 12:14 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

According to scripture we will be judge on God’s Ten Commandments James 2:10-12, Revelation 11:19 and I am pretty sure it will be God’s version that He wrote with His own finger, not what was changed by man that scripture warns us about. Daniel 7:25

We should worship Jesus in Truth and Spirit John 4:23-24 and I pray that each of us will be there to meet our loving Savior and reign with Him forever. God bless

 

[fhansen]

Jesus has the authority of His Church and it is based on obeying what He commanded, not man.

Yes, and we know what He commanded whereas, going by Scripture alone, error is all too common, resulting in obeying man, his/her opinions.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Yes, and we know what He commanded whereas, going by Scripture alone, error is all too common, resulting in obeying man.

Scripture tells us very clearly something different:

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree. Thanks for the discussion and God bless.

 

[fhansen]

Scripture tells us very clearly something different:

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Looks like we will have to agree to disagree. Thanks for the discussion and God bless.

Ok, have a nice Lord's Day . Sorry. And thanks for the civil tone either way.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Here are three witnesses concerning tradition:

Out of context. The verse you allude to here refers to two or three living breathing witnesses that the judge can interrogate. Not three verses, no matter they be from the Bible.

A warning about relying on the tradition of men.

Which would be just fine IF you also bothered to quote some of the verses favorable to tradition rather than try to imply that the Bible is only and always against tradition.

So here's Paul:

1 Cor 11:2 Hold fast to the traditions I handed on to you.

2 Thess 2:15 Hold fast to traditions, whether oral or by letter

2 Thess 3:6 Shun those acting not in accord with tradition.

2 Tim 2:2 What you have heard, entrust to faithful men.

​

Peter had some things to say about private interpretation:

2 Peter 1:20 No prophecy is a matter for private interpretation.

2 Peter 3:15-16 Paul's letters can be difficult to interpret.

1 Peter 1:25 God's eternal word is the word preached to you​

We can then safely say that scripture tells us not to rely on the tradition of men, and to keep the commandments of God.

Problem is that you have equated 'tradition' with the 'tradition of men' and that is not quite true. So your whole edifice built on attacking tradition is itself a crumbling old tradition of men. One we shouldn't be relying on. So instead of the half-council of God with respect to tradition, you need more. More from Paul. More from Peter. More from all over the Bible. You have labored to produce ... a tradition of men that says valid traditions should be set aside. And setting the tradition of the Church aside has damaged your own belief structure for missing out on parts of the truth. It's a methodological thing.

Paul clearly has a place for tradition. And that faith comes by hearing the tradition handed on to faithful men, not just what is between the covers of the KJV. Peter puts a damper on the idea of private interpretation, which is exactly what Sola Scriptura is for most Sola Scriptura adherents, the idea that no man and no tradition can get between you and what you think your Bible is telling you. He expects that the preaching of the gospel will be an oral transferal from apostles and apostolic delegates and bishops to new believers, a conveyance of tradition

I keep bringing up that almost forgotten line from Judges 21:25. Everyone did whatever seemed right in their own eyes. Problem with that was lots of people did lots of different things that were not right in the eyes of the Lord. It was an anarchy, which is just fine if everybody is all lined up to actually know and do the right thing. Problem is when they don't know or don't do the right thing. Which is what we have with the Sola Scriptura crowd that rejects wise counsel and cooks up whatever interpretation they want to cook up. No wonder Paul insisted on following tradition. No wonder Peter was against private interpretation and cautioned against go it alone interpretations.

Are there 'traditions of men'? Yup. And one of the biggest of those is an unbiblical meta-dogma called Sola Scriptura. It supposedly speaks against 'traditions of men' but instead speaks against apostolic traditions. It encourages division every time two people have a difference of interpretation as they have no authority to arbitrate their difference, just the text they cannot agree on. It encourages people to be very selective on their use of scripture, ignoring parts they can't integrate into their pet theology. And it's prideful. Scripture is incredibly complex. For someone to say they have it all figured out is impossible. It's difficult enough for the whole Church. For one guy and his Bible it just makes no sense. But, at least in the more common ways of understanding Sola Scriptura, it IS one man and his Bible.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Out of context. The verse you allude to here refers to two or three living breathing witnesses that the judge can interrogate. Not three verses, no matter they be from the Bible.

Which would be just fine IF you also bothered to quote some of the verses favorable to tradition rather than try to imply that the Bible is only and always against tradition.

So here's Paul:

1 Cor 11:2 Hold fast to the traditions I handed on to you.

2 Thess 2:15 Hold fast to traditions, whether oral or by letter

2 Thess 3:6 Shun those acting not in accord with tradition.

2 Tim 2:2 What you have heard, entrust to faithful men.

​

Peter had some things to say about private interpretation:

2 Peter 1:20 No prophecy is a matter for private interpretation.

2 Peter 3:15-16 Paul's letters can be difficult to interpret.

1 Peter 1:25 God's eternal word is the word preached to you​

Problem is that you have equated 'tradition' with the 'tradition of men' and that is not quite true. So your whole edifice built on attacking tradition is itself a crumbling old tradition of men. One we shouldn't be relying on. So instead of the half-council of God with respect to tradition, you need more. More from Paul. More from Peter. More from all over the Bible. You have labored to produce ... a tradition of men that says valid traditions should be set aside. And setting the tradition of the Church aside has damaged your own belief structure for missing out on parts of the truth. It's a methodological thing.

Paul clearly has a place for tradition. And that faith comes by hearing the tradition handed on to faithful men, not just what is between the covers of the KJV. Peter puts a damper on the idea of private interpretation, which is exactly what Sola Scriptura is for most Sola Scriptura adherents, the idea that no man and no tradition can get between you and what you think your Bible is telling you. He expects that the preaching of the gospel will be an oral transferal from apostles and apostolic delegates and bishops to new believers, a conveyance of tradition

I keep bringing up that almost forgotten line from Judges 21:25. Everyone did whatever seemed right in their own eyes. Problem with that was lots of people did lots of different things that were not right in the eyes of the Lord. It was an anarchy, which is just fine if everybody is all lined up to actually know and do the right thing. Problem is when they don't know or don't do the right thing. Which is what we have with the Sola Scriptura crowd that rejects wise counsel and cooks up whatever interpretation they want to cook up. No wonder Paul insisted on following tradition. No wonder Peter was against private interpretation and cautioned against go it alone interpretations.

Are there 'traditions of men'? Yup. And one of the biggest of those is an unbiblical meta-dogma called Sola Scriptura. It supposedly speaks against 'traditions of men' but instead speaks against apostolic traditions. It encourages division every time two people have a difference of interpretation as they have no authority to arbitrate their difference, just the text they cannot agree on. It encourages people to be very selective on their use of scripture, ignoring parts they can't integrate into their pet theology. And it's prideful. Scripture is incredibly complex. For someone to say they have it all figured out is impossible. It's difficult enough for the whole Church. For one guy and his Bible it just makes no sense. But, at least in the more common ways of understanding Sola Scriptura, it IS one man and his Bible.

There is nothing wrong with some traditions, but we should never keep traditions in place of the commandments of God as Jesus stated with His own words. Matthew 15:3-9, Mark 7:6-8.

The apostles agree and tell us: We ought to obey God rather than men. Acts 5:29

Scripture is incredibly complex. For someone to say they have it all figured out is impossible. It's difficult enough for the whole Church. For one guy and his Bible it just makes no sense. But, at least in the more common ways of understanding Sola Scriptura, it IS one man and his Bible.

This seems to be the exact opposite of what scripture tells us. No one can understand the scripture without the guidance of Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit promises to teach us all things.

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26

However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. John 16:13

The Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.

John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

Acts 5:32 We are witnesses of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Ok, have a nice Lord's Day . Sorry. And thanks for the civil tone either way.

God gives us free will and I pray for our religious freedom.

Regardless, I appreciate your civil tone too.

 

[chevyontheriver]

There is nothing wrong with some traditions, but we should never keep traditions in place of the commandments of God as Jesus stated with His own words. Matthew 15:3-9, Mark 7:6-8.

The apostles agree and tell us: We ought to obey God rather than men. Acts 5:29

As long as you can separate out the traditions Paul was talking about as opposed to something having to do with things that are not true ....

I wonder how you manage with the Church Fathers then?

This seems to be the exact opposite of what scripture tells us. No one can understand the scripture without the guidance of Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit promises to teach us all things.

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26

However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. John 16:13

The Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.

You misunderstand me. I wasn't clear enough. My point was that for us to think we have a comprehensive understanding of Scripture is hubris. We don't. We might have a barely adequate understanding, we might have an understanding advanced enough to teach a bit, but the complexities are such that if we say we totally understand then we are deceiving ourselves and others.

What we do understand is because we have been on our knees, and the understanding is given to us by the Holy Spirit. And yet the understanding of all things was not promised to any one individual, let alone all individuals. It was promised to the Church as a whole. And here is where neither you nor I can comprehend it all but we can explore the works of multiple others, whose understandings have been honed by others who reach all the way back to the apostles, and to Jesus himself. That is why we submit our limited understandings to the Church, to all of those interpreters on top of interpreters that are available to us to check and improve our wimpy understandings.

 

[boughtwithaprice]

There is nothing wrong with some traditions, but we should never keep traditions in place of the commandments of God as Jesus stated with His own words. Matthew 15:3-9, Mark 7:6-8.

The apostles agree and tell us: We ought to obey God rather than men. Acts 5:29



This seems to be the exact opposite of what scripture tells us. No one can understand the scripture without the guidance of Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit promises to teach us all things.

But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26

However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. John 16:13

The Holy Spirit is given to those who obey.

John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

Acts 5:32 We are witnesses of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.

The Holy Spirit was promised to the Church, not each individual believer. The Holy Spirit will lead each person as they submit to the teaching of the Church. It was the Church that Christ promised the gates of hell would not prevail against, not individual believers. The first few centuries of the Church was full of individuals that thought they had sola
Scriptura rebelled against the Church and taught error.
We have Arians, Adoptionism, Apollinarianism, Arabici, Collyridianism, Docetism, Luciferians, Pneumatomachians, Melchisedechians, Monarchianism, Monophysitism, Monothelitism, Nestorianism,
Patripassiansism, psilanthropism, Sabellianism, Tritheism.
All used scripture to propose their positions, all declared heretical by the Church. The Holy Spirit was guarding the Church, not individuals.
Many sects have tried to use scripture against the Church, all have failed. What makes you different?
Heresy is difficult to give up, I’ll give you that. I know, because I used to be one. I was so convinced that I was right, and other people just did not understand scripture. I believed sola scriptura and did that whole take Jesus as your savior line, but I could not give up sin and was constantly falling. I was arguing with some Catholics when it hit me, there is nothing in the Catholic faith that is against the Bible, just my understanding of the Bible. It took a long time as I still had a rebellious nature and a doubtful conscience, but after 20 years of Protestantism, and sixteen years tentatively back in the Catholic Church, I submitted to her full authority and vowed to repent. It was a miracle for me; the sin that so easily beset me was gone, I actually have joy and the peace that passes understanding. The things of this world don’t mean much. I just want to please God. He has had such incredible mercy on me that I can’t believe that I was the person that I used to be. I can’t believe that I am not in hell. (I know you don’t believe in hell or an afterlife until the resurrection, but it is real)
I sing of God’s mercy and will tell anyone willing to listen.
You can keep sola scriptura, I’ll take the Church. The Bible has been studied for millennia and the Church has been around for two millennia. I have been alive for 58 years.
Why would I decline to drive a fully finished Rolls Royce, so I can go and reinvent the wheel on my own? No, I don’t need sola scriptura, I am going to Church where the grace of God flows through the sacraments. It is the power of God to save. Grace cleanses us from sin, not just forgives sin

 

[chevyontheriver]

The Holy Spirit was promised to the Church, not each individual believer. The Holy Spirit will lead each person as they submit to the teaching of the Church. It was the Church that Christ promised the gates of hell would not prevail against, not individual believers. The first few centuries of the Church was full of individuals that thought they had sola
Scriptura rebelled against the Church and taught error.
We have Arians, Adoptionism, Apollinarianism, Arabici, Collyridianism, Docetism, Luciferians, Pneumatomachians, Melchisedechians, Monarchianism, Monophysitism, Monothelitism, Nestorianism,
Patripassiansism, psilanthropism, Sabellianism, Tritheism.
All used scripture to propose their positions, all declared heretical by the Church. The Holy Spirit was guarding the Church, not individuals.
Many sects have tried to use scripture against the Church, all have failed. What makes you different?
Heresy is difficult to give up, I’ll give you that. I know, because I used to be one. I was so convinced that I was right, and other people just did not understand scripture. I believed sola scriptura and did that whole take Jesus as your savior line, but I could not give up sin and was constantly falling. I was arguing with some Catholics when it hit me, there is nothing in the Catholic faith that is against the Bible, just my understanding of the Bible. It took a long time as I still had a rebellious nature and a doubtful conscience, but after 20 years of Protestantism, and sixteen years tentatively back in the Catholic Church, I submitted to her full authority and vowed to repent. It was a miracle for me; the sin that so easily beset me was gone, I actually have joy and the peace that passes understanding. The things of this world don’t mean much. I just want to please God. He has had such incredible mercy on me that I can’t believe that I was the person that I used to be. I can’t believe that I am not in hell. (I know you don’t believe in hell or an afterlife until the resurrection, but it is real)
I sing of God’s mercy and will tell anyone willing to listen.
You can keep sola scriptura, I’ll take the Church. The Bible has been studied for millennia and the Church has been around for two millennia. I have been alive for 58 years.
Why would I decline to drive a fully finished Rolls Royce, so I can go and reinvent the wheel on my own? No, I don’t need sola scriptura, I am going to Church where the grace of God flows through the sacraments. It is the power of God to save. Grace cleanses us from sin, not just forgives sin

Arianism in particular was a proto sola Scriptura movement. What stopped it was a Church Council, the council of Nicaea. And what the council used for the critical definition against the Arian position was a word never used in the Bible. The Bible did not stop the Arians. It was the grandmothers of Alexandria saying that Arius had nothing to do with the faith they were taught as children. It was St. Athanasius relentlessly resisting. And bishops standing up for truth over the clever Biblical interpretations of Arius. If Sola Scriptura was a thing back then we would all be Arians today.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The Holy Spirit was promised to the Church, not each individual believer. The Holy Spirit will lead each person as they submit to the teaching of the Church. It was the Church that Christ promised the gates of hell would not prevail against, not individual believers. The first few centuries of the Church was full of individuals that thought they had sola
Scriptura rebelled against the Church and taught error.
We have Arians, Adoptionism, Apollinarianism, Arabici, Collyridianism, Docetism, Luciferians, Pneumatomachians, Melchisedechians, Monarchianism, Monophysitism, Monothelitism, Nestorianism,
Patripassiansism, psilanthropism, Sabellianism, Tritheism.
All used scripture to propose their positions, all declared heretical by the Church. The Holy Spirit was guarding the Church, not individuals.
Many sects have tried to use scripture against the Church, all have failed. What makes you different?
Heresy is difficult to give up, I’ll give you that. I know, because I used to be one. I was so convinced that I was right, and other people just did not understand scripture. I believed sola scriptura and did that whole take Jesus as your savior line, but I could not give up sin and was constantly falling. I was arguing with some Catholics when it hit me, there is nothing in the Catholic faith that is against the Bible, just my understanding of the Bible. It took a long time as I still had a rebellious nature and a doubtful conscience, but after 20 years of Protestantism, and sixteen years tentatively back in the Catholic Church, I submitted to her full authority and vowed to repent. It was a miracle for me; the sin that so easily beset me was gone, I actually have joy and the peace that passes understanding. The things of this world don’t mean much. I just want to please God. He has had such incredible mercy on me that I can’t believe that I was the person that I used to be. I can’t believe that I am not in hell. (I know you don’t believe in hell or an afterlife until the resurrection, but it is real)
I sing of God’s mercy and will tell anyone willing to listen.
You can keep sola scriptura, I’ll take the Church. The Bible has been studied for millennia and the Church has been around for two millennia. I have been alive for 58 years.
Why would I decline to drive a fully finished Rolls Royce, so I can go and reinvent the wheel on my own? No, I don’t need sola scriptura, I am going to Church where the grace of God flows through the sacraments. It is the power of God to save. Grace cleanses us from sin, not just forgives sin

Hmmm, I don’t see the scripture that says God only gives His Holy Spirit to the Church and specifically the Catholic Church, I noticed no scripture was quoted either.

I think we should stick with the scriptures and the scriptures show clearly:

The Holy Spirit comes to those who have not harden their hearts to convict us of our sins John 16:8 Hebrews 3:7

We are warned not to grieve away the Holy Spirit- the unpardonable sin. Ephesians 4:30

The Holy Spirit is promised to be given when we have turned from sin (repent) and are baptized Acts 2:38

Sanctification comes from the Holy Spirit Titus 3:5

The Holy Spirit comes to those(individuals) who obey God. Acts 5:32, John 14:15-18

The love of God is poured out by the Holy Spirit Romans 5:5

The Holy Spirit will teach us all things John 14:26 1 Corinthians 2:13 1 Thessalonians 1:6

Our bodies are a dwelling place for the Holy Spirit which is why we could keep them clean 1 Corinthians 6:19 2 Timothy 1:14

Not one of these scriptures tell us we receive the Holy Spirit through the church. God talks to each of us through His Spirit for those who have not harden their hearts. You keep pointing people to your church when we should be pointing to Jesus.

1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,

 

[chevyontheriver]

Hmmm, I don’t see the scripture that says God only gives His Holy Spirit to the Church and specifically the Catholic Church, I noticed no scripture was quoted either.

I think we should stick with the scriptures and the scriptures show clearly:

The Holy Spirit comes to those who have not harden their hearts to convict us of our sins John 16:8 Hebrews 3:7

We are warned not to grieve away the Holy Spirit- the unpardonable sin. Ephesians 4:30

The Holy Spirit is promised to be given when we have turned from sin (repent) and are baptized Acts 2:38

Sanctification comes from the Holy Spirit Titus 3:5

The Holy Spirit comes to those(individuals) who obey God. Acts 5:32, John 14:15-18

The love of God is poured out by the Holy Spirit Romans 5:5

The Holy Spirit will teach us all things John 14:26 1 Corinthians 2:13 1 Thessalonians 1:6

Our bodies are a dwelling place for the Holy Spirit which is why we could keep them clean 1 Corinthians 6:19 2 Timothy 1:14

Not one of these scriptures tell us we receive the Holy Spirit through the church. God talks to each of us through His Spirit for those who have not harden their hearts. You keep pointing people to your church when we should be pointing to Jesus.

1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,

You are half right. Or mostly right. The Holy Spirit indwells in us at baptism just as the Father and the Son do. Of course. And all of what follows from that.

But the promise to be taught ALL things by the Holy Spirit was not given to all Christians individually. It was given to the Church. Which is why the Church has bishops and is not an anarchistic free for all. Bishops were part of the Scriptural mandate for the Church. Collectively they hold the teachings revealed by the Holy Spirit. Search the Scriptures to see that this is true.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

You are half right. Or mostly right. The Holy Spirit indwells in us at baptism just as the Father and the Son do. Of course. And all of what follows from that.

But the promise to be taught ALL things by the Holy Spirit was not given to all Christians individually. It was given to the Church. Which is why the Church has bishops and is not an anarchistic free for all. Bishops were part of the Scriptural mandate for the Church. Collectively they hold the teachings revealed by the Holy Spirit. Search the Scriptures to see that this is true.

Please provide that scripture that the Holy Spirit is given only to the church (Catholic) and that we need a mediator.

 

[enoob57]

I was wondering since there are so many denominations claiming Sola Scriptura, what does that actually mean, and how is it different from the scenario presented in this video?

Are you governed by sola scriptura or is sola scriptura governed by you or those in authority over you?

The understanding- if absolute truth is dictated by the objective truth of Scripture
in which written format is to be taken in a hermeneutic process to arrive at thus sayeth The Lord... God has already told us where the truth lies

John 17:17 (KJV)
[17] Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

Thus what I have said previous sets one on the right path to knowing truth! The study is work and obedience to God

2 Timothy 2:15 (KJV)
[15] Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

2 Timothy 3:15 (KJV)
[15] And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
[16] All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
[17] That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

 

[BPPLEE]

The doctrine of Sola Scriptura is garbage theology, foisted upon the world by the Reformers who needed an authority besides the Church by which to determine Christian truth. But it doesn’t work, at least to any sufficient degree.

The Catholic Church teaches that the Bible is the word of God, inerrant regarding that which He wants us to know pertaining to our salvation. But once authority to interpret revelation is taken out of the hands of that Church which Christ established and gave that same revelation to in the beginning, then in actuality every reader becomes their own private authority. And this results in the disagreement and confusion and conflict between those who adhere to Sola Scriptura that we witness by the formation of different denominations as well as, for example, the sharp disagreements we continuously observe on these very forums, generally with conflicting, while each yet plausible, differing interpretations.

So we should all let the Catholic Church interpret scripture for us?

 

[chevyontheriver]

So we should all let the Catholic Church interpret scripture for us?

It would be an actual improvement.

 

[enoob57]

Exactly. And He established a Church by which we can have assurance of correctly knowing those teachings, as opposed to the many groups who disagree with each other based on Scripture alone. And the Spirit of the Law is fulfilled by Sunday observance now.

The ancient churches, east and west, have never been antinomian, as you probably know whereas those led by Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide often end up at that point, or confused on that matter of grace vs law.

And, no thanks on the Sabbath discussion-that's been beat to death, sometimes with some pretty wild claims from the SDA side: sun worship et al.

The Catholic church is easily seen in it's departure from Scripture... so those that remain in it are willfully blinded by tradition and faith in the organization not Scripture!

 

[BPPLEE]

OK so what of the person who attends a revival, understands who Jesus, what Jesus did, and believes in his heart that Jesus is his savior. If that person then accepts Jesus as his savior based on the faith of what he now understands and just learned, is he not just as saved as the person who can recite the bible verse by verse? And in fact if he never reads a word of scripture or hears the word again but maintains his faith in Jesus, is he not just as saved as anyone?
I think you have just introduced works into salvation, salvation is not based on how much of God's word you have read or know, it is based on your faith in Jesus. If we look back in Church history there were many people who were saved but knew very little scripture. "What must I do to be saved "“Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved—you and your household.” Acts 16:30-31

Yes but they are doing what scripture says when they believe.

 

[BPPLEE]

It would be an actual improvement.

I don't think so. I don't find in scripture where it says to pray to Mary or to people the Church has deemed saints or anything about purgatory. Not to argue against anyone's beliefs just that they're not found in the Bible