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Dear Major1:
After praying and thinking about it some more with Scripture, the way I see the Atonement is like this:
1. Christ died for the sins of the entire world (minus those who worship the beast - see Revelation 13:8, Revelation 17:8). Jesus was our substitute on the cross for us. He bore our sins within his body and paid the price for the majority of the world's sins. He died in our place. His blood washes away most of all of the world's sins.
2. Christ knocks on the door of everyone's heart (minus those who worship the beast) so as to come in (so He can give them his free love gift - which is Himself).
3. When a man or woman receives Christ (asking for His forgiveness and believing that He died and was risen on their behalf) they are then abiding in Christ (i.e. the spirit portion of Jesus). Christ who dwells in this person is then connected to Christ's physical body in Heaven who paid for their sins. For his physical body and his blood brings atonement and life for men (according to what He said during the Lord's supper). Jesus is able to apply the redemption to a person's life personally by their abiding in Him. An exchange is taking place. Substitutionary Atonement. A person dwelling in Christ gets the benefits (personally) of what He accomplished on the cross for them.
4. If they continue to abide in Christ, they will walk with Christ, and they are going to let the light of Christ shine in their life (i.e. They will obey the Lord's commandments) and they will have continued access to Christ's redemption or body up in Heaven. Their sin will continue to be cleansed personally in their life by Christ's one time sacrifice that was in the past.
Please take note that 1 John 1:7 says that we have to walk in the light of Christ to have all of our sin cleansed and it does not talk about having a belief alone.
By this thinking Jason 1 sin and you are lost. For 1 sin and you are guilty of all.
Please take note that 1 John 1:7 says that we have to walk in the light of Christ to have all of our sin cleansed and it does not talk about having a belief alone.
"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;" (Colossians 2:14).
14 "For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:" (Ephesians 2:14-16).
Jesus's atonement satisfies the legal requirement of the Law (condemning sin in the flesh), so that the righteousness of the Law might be fulfilled in us by our walking after the Spirit (and not after the flesh, i.e. sin).
3 "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." (Romans 9:3-4).
Major1:
I was doing some reading today, and I came across this verse.
"Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered." (Romans 4:7).
That is a false assumption and a dim view on behalf of the power of God and believers in the faith.
Jesus said with man this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.
This would include obedience.
There are many verses on how the believer can walk uprightly and overcome sin.
To ignore them one would have to take a pair of scissors and cut them out of one's Bible.
Today, unbelievers can overcome the sin of alcoholism.
Imagine how much more what a believer can do if they allow Jesus to do the good work in their life?
For Romans 13:14 says put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh.
Also, Revelation 14:3-5 says the 144,000 were found without fault before the throne of God.
I am very glad that you are working to lean and grow in knowledge. Allow me to help you.
You said...........
"He bore our sins within his body and paid the price for the majority of the world's sins."
Now that is incorrect my brother.
You said:1 Peter 3:18........
"For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit".
You said:You are trying to tell us that Jesus did not die for unbelief, but that can't be true because there are plenty of people who did not believe in Jesus but then did believe later. If it was unforgivable, then anyone who did not believe in Jesus could ever later be saved.
You said:Then you said..........
"If they continue to abide in Christ, they will walk with Christ, and they are going to let the light of Christ shine in their life (i.e. They will obey the Lord's commandments)".
That is also Biblically incorrect. By saying that "we will obey the Lord's commandments" in order to be saved means that WE re then responsible for staying saved.
I will agree with you that obedience to God proves our love for Him (1 John 5:2-3), and it demonstrates our faithfulness to Him (1 John 2:3-6), it glorifies Him in the world (1 Peter 2:12), and opens avenues of blessing for us (John 13:17).
Also, faith is necessary to please God (Hebrews 11:6), and if our faith is genuine and true, we will live a lifestyle characterized by righteousness, modeling the example set for us by Jesus Christ. We will want to and should strive to obey His commands, not because we have to, but because we want to, because we love Him.
However, when we fail to obey a command or sin in our everyday walk that does not mean we LOSE OUR SALVATION which is what you are trying to say.
If we haven’t been living for Him, if we haven’t been following His commandments, if we’ve been living in and for the world, or we commit a sin, we can be transformed by the blood of Jesus Christ.
As believers we can ask God for forgiveness, and He will give it. And He will choose to forget the sin, just as if we had never committed it in the first place. God is glorified when He extends forgiveness, because it is written in Hebrews 10:16-7..........
“I will put my laws in their hearts, and I will write them on their minds. . . . Their sins and lawless acts I will remember no more”.
I’ve heard nothing of the testimony which is the basis of Christian living you know about the candle under a bushel.
Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house. Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven. Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Matthew 5:15-17
James 2:10
For whoever keeps the whole (Mosaic) Law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all.
This is a perfect example why I have suggested to you to get into a Bible believing Bible study my brother.
You said:Romans 4:7 - 8 is a quote of Psalms 32:1-2 when Israel was under the law and sin was dealt with at the Mercy Seat by the application of a blood sacrifice that COVERED mans sin.
It does not apply to us today as we are under grace instead of the Law and sin is washed away and not covered.
Jason, In this lifetime, we will never be perfectly victorious over sin according to 1 John 1:8, but that should still be our goal. With God’s help, and by following the principles of His Word, we can progressively deal with sin and become more and more like Christ.
All of that is true Jason. However, again, "Walking after the Spirit" does not in any way mean that we must keep the commandments to stay saved.
You said:You psted the wrong Scripture under #3.
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