CAIR campaign to get Savage off the air

[DaisyDay]

Palin and her supporters are not subversives with alternative motives.

Alternative motives? Like if one doesn't work out they've got another up their sleeve?

But yeah, Palin and her supporters ("kill him!") border on the treasonous.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

In their new book, Gaubatz, a counter-terrorism investigator and former federal agent with vast experience in the Middle East, and Sperry, a veteran reporter on the war on terror and author of "Infiltration," document CAIR's role as a U.S. front for the Muslim Brotherhood's plan to transform America into an Islamic nation under the authority of the Quran.

What about the open conspiracy to Christianize America? Does that not warrant equal concern? Or are our biases showing again?

 

[The Lady Kate]

So if CAIR had gone after Al Franken, you'd feel the same way?

Yes, I would...and I did feel the same way about all the people who "went after" Howard Stern. "A bunch of kooks who don 't like such-and-such a person want him/her taken off the air."

Any reason I should feel any different?

Truth is, there's a bigger issue here. I guess you don't see it.

Truth is, there isn't a bigger issue here... it's just paranoia from some especially thin-skinned members of the Right.

 

[Ringo84]

Sounds like a nutty conspiracy to me. "The Muslims are going to 'infiltrate' America, turn us all into jihadists, and eat babies for breakfast!"
Ringo

 

[Saving Hawaii]

I don't exactly get the "conspiracy" part of Muslims trying to convert non-Muslims to their faith. If I'm not mistaken, just like their Christian brothers, they tend to be pretty straight-forward about the idea that they'd like to see more people take to their understanding of God. No?

Are you truly worried that our church and faith are so frail and weak that Americans are about to flock in droves to pray towards Mecca? What exactly does that say about Christianity?

 

[The Lady Kate]

I don't exactly get the "conspiracy" part of Muslims trying to convert non-Muslims to their faith. If I'm not mistaken, just like their Christian brothers, they tend to be pretty straight-forward about the idea that they'd like to see more people take to their understanding of God. No?

That's what has me puzzled as well... why is it that when we do it, it's Spreading the Gospel to the world, but if they do it, it's a subversive conspiracy that must be stopped?

Are you truly worried that our church and faith are so frail and weak that Americans are about to flock in droves to pray towards Mecca? What exactly does that say about Christianity?

Exactly... if you want to blame someone for people abandoning your faith, start with the mirror.

 

[rambot]

Hardly. That's not what this is about. Ultimately, I think you know that....you just want to be oppositional.

1) It's possible that this is not about that, but I can assure you that I don't know that (or believe it). I don't do things "just to be oppositional" (ie. troll). I try to represent what I think here. Regardless, as I summed up the situation, that seems a great representation of what is going on here. I mean, so long as you can identify what the "minority" and the "majority" are, it's pretty clear I'm not shooting in the dark with my statement.

Why of course! But the two can operate in tandem. Besides, it's only on the Left that you usually see these kinds of things. First, there's the omnipresent Fairness Doctrine to silence the Right and now we have subversive front organizations like CAIR trying to do it. Oh yeah, there's bigger issues here.

I highlighted the word "can" because what you are tending to do here is jumping from "can" (which connotes the possibility of something happenning) to "is".
I won't deny that CAIR spent that money to get someone off the air. It's their money that they've raised so it's their right; surely you agree with that yes?
Regarding the underlined section, I'm guessing you are saying that the left tends to be more political, vocal, and try to affect change? But FYI, that has nothing to do with "political takeover", it has to do with the responsibility of citizens in a democracy.
Lastly, regarding that, you base a hostile takeover of your culture (a multitrillion dollar economy) on a single "Doctrine" and a 160,000$ effort to get one journalist out of the public eye. How does that seem reasonable ?

You don't have to be paranoid to have a brain.

No but most people who employ their brain regularly and with great rationality, do not suffer from paranoia.

I guess you'll have to read the book! Besides, I did mention that there's been recently declassified FBI documents regarding CAIR's activities. I suspect though, that there would never be any amount of evidence that would impress you since CAIR's goals and activities don't bother you. In fact, am I right that you're ashamed and embarrassed at America's power and dominance and would like to see it rendered impotent?

1) Why would I read the book?
Article Details
2) Why should I have to read the book? You make the claim that CAIR is trying to islamize America so certainly you know enough evidence to make the claim sound legitimate to a thinking person.
3) CAIR's goals? Are they terrifying to you? I wonder if you have read what CAIR's goals are on their website or if you only know about CAIR's goals and activities because of this book? Because that wouldn't really be fair, don't you think???
That would be like me listening (and giving creedence) to what other poster's say about you instead of reading your posts and figuring it out for myself.
From what I understand from their website, they are trying to advance understanding of Islam because certain clinically braindead and disgustingly ignorant Americans are being given untrue information and believing it.
They have lobbyists on the hill, true enough. Of course the Christian Coalition (Focus on the Family) has more than a few people poking around up there too. So what's the issue? Could it be, again, that the majority (Christians) are scared that the minority (Muslims) may get a voice?
4) Embarrassed about America's power and dominance? Just in case you noticed, I'm not from the US...but besides that, I just don't see the US as powerful anymore and influential? Heck yes. Dominant? Sorry? Where on planet Earth have you been living?
You've got a lot of guns and weapons backing your politics, but honestly, that's it. You guys have a lot of rebuilding to do before I view the US as powerful again. (ps....I don't measure power by how much money people spend).

 

[Veritas]

What about the open conspiracy to Christianize America? Does that not warrant equal concern? Or are our biases showing again?

America IS a Christian country.

1) It's possible that this is not about that, but I can assure you that I don't know that (or believe it). I don't do things "just to be oppositional" (ie. troll). I try to represent what I think here. Regardless, as I summed up the situation, that seems a great representation of what is going on here. I mean, so long as you can identify what the "minority" and the "majority" are, it's pretty clear I'm not shooting in the dark with my statement.

I highlighted the word "can" because what you are tending to do here is jumping from "can" (which connotes the possibility of something happenning) to "is".
I won't deny that CAIR spent that money to get someone off the air. It's their money that they've raised so it's their right; surely you agree with that yes?
Regarding the underlined section, I'm guessing you are saying that the left tends to be more political, vocal, and try to affect change? But FYI, that has nothing to do with "political takeover", it has to do with the responsibility of citizens in a democracy.
Lastly, regarding that, you base a hostile takeover of your culture (a multitrillion dollar economy) on a single "Doctrine" and a 160,000$ effort to get one journalist out of the public eye. How does that seem reasonable ?

No but most people who employ their brain regularly and with great rationality, do not suffer from paranoia.


1) Why would I read the book?
Article Details
2) Why should I have to read the book? You make the claim that CAIR is trying to islamize America so certainly you know enough evidence to make the claim sound legitimate to a thinking person.
3) CAIR's goals? Are they terrifying to you? I wonder if you have read what CAIR's goals are on their website or if you only know about CAIR's goals and activities because of this book? Because that wouldn't really be fair, don't you think???
That would be like me listening (and giving creedence) to what other poster's say about you instead of reading your posts and figuring it out for myself.
From what I understand from their website, they are trying to advance understanding of Islam because certain clinically braindead and disgustingly ignorant Americans are being given untrue information and believing it.
They have lobbyists on the hill, true enough. Of course the Christian Coalition (Focus on the Family) has more than a few people poking around up there too. So what's the issue? Could it be, again, that the majority (Christians) are scared that the minority (Muslims) may get a voice?
4) Embarrassed about America's power and dominance? Just in case you noticed, I'm not from the US...but besides that, I just don't see the US as powerful anymore and influential? Heck yes. Dominant? Sorry? Where on planet Earth have you been living?
You've got a lot of guns and weapons backing your politics, but honestly, that's it. You guys have a lot of rebuilding to do before I view the US as powerful again. (ps....I don't measure power by how much money people spend).

Gaining your approval is not something I'm interested in. Are you interested in my view of your country?

 

[rambot]

Gaining your approval is not something I'm interested in. Are you interested in my view of your country?

I'm not asking for your approval. I'd be content if you actually engaged in a discussion on what I had to say. Anything at all. I posted a lot; choose anything there. For example, what have you read about CAIR that was actually published by CAIR?

If you want to start up a thread about Canada, go right ahead. But I'm not sure what your opinion of Canada has to do with anything when this thread is about CAIR trying to take over America.... I will say this in advance: If you say the CAIR-Can is trying to take over Canada, I'll do little more than post a cute picture of a kitty.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

America IS a Christian country.

Then why should Atheists, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and Buddists pay taxes to a Christian nation? A Christian nation would not represent them. No taxation without representation.

The Treaty of Tripoli is a clear indication that the US is not a Christian Nation.

Besides which, I don't care if you proclaim that yours is a 'Christian Nation'. It is 'Christian' only in name. I am far more concerned with its character and conduct and whether these are Christian in nature rather than in name.

 

[Archaeopteryx]

Then why should Atheists, Muslims, Jews, Hindus and Buddists pay taxes to a Christian nation? A Christian nation would not represent them. No taxation without representation.

The Treaty of Tripoli is a clear indication that the US is not a Christian Nation.

Besides which, I don't care if you proclaim that yours is a 'Christian Nation'. It is 'Christian' only in name. I am far more concerned with its character and conduct and whether these are Christian in nature rather than in name.

That said, in a pluralist society (as the US was founded to be) no religious faction is supposed to stand above another in the eyes of the Government (the principle of State Neutrality). To proclaim that the US is a Christian Nation is to violate this principle, and in doing so undermine the pluralism that the Founders considered when constructing the institutional architecture of the American Nation.

 

[nvxplorer]

First, there's the omnipresent Fairness Doctrine to silence the Right...

It's amazing how rumors are believed as truth. The Fairness Doctrine is not omnipresent. It's not even used at all, anywhere, at any time. It hasn't been in effect for ages. It's best to check your facts before spreading false rumors.

 

[DaisyDay]

It's amazing how rumors are believed as truth. The Fairness Doctrine is not omnipresent. It's not even used at all, anywhere, at any time. It hasn't been in effect for ages. It's best to check your facts before spreading false rumors.

Wasn't it nullified back in the 80s? It never silenced anyone anyway; it just gave a daily three-minute platform to opposing views, be they left, right, center or off the wall.

 

[The Lady Kate]

But you didn't see her or anyone else funnel hundreds of thousands of dollars into blacklisting Letterman, did you? CAIR did just that to Savage.

Why aren't they allowed to? Would the world stop spinning if Savage was canned?

 

[Gawron]

No. But it would be one less voice crying in the wilderness.

 

[LUColt27]

That said, in a pluralist society (as the US was founded to be) no religious faction is supposed to stand above another in the eyes of the Government (the principle of State Neutrality). To proclaim that the US is a Christian Nation is to violate this principle, and in doing so undermine the pluralism that the Founders considered when constructing the institutional architecture of the American Nation.

The US isn't a Christian nation. True, it was started to be a place of religious freedom, and many of the settlers that arrived were Christian, and quite a few of the Founding Fathers were as well, but they did not want to set up a theocracy, as is evidenced by the Constitution. However, they did apparently want the Bible taught in schools to help kids see where their legal, moral, and ethical code had many of its origins.

Now that I've typed all of that, I can see that we're evidently in agreement. Well, if nothing else, we've established that.

 

[DaisyDay]

It was quite stupid, if that's what they did. I have trouble believing anything anyone on the left says about Palin these days.

But you believe what WND has to say about CAIR? Ok.

But you didn't see her or anyone else funnel hundreds of thousands of dollars into blacklisting Letterman, did you? CAIR did just that to Savage.

According to the WND article, Savage sued CAIR first over a fair-use recording and lost but the attorney fees CAIR spent to defend itself - are the a part of the $160,00 (somewhat less "hundreds of thousands of dollars") that this piece is referring to? Furthermore, Letterman apologized to Palin and her daughters. Has Savage ever apologized to any Muslim or other of his targets?

CAIR's campaign, Hate Hurts America, is anti-bigotry, which I thought all good Americans favored.

I didn't know that Savage was refused entry into the UK. That's interesting.

Sixteen people banned from entering the UK were "named and shamed" by the Home Office today.

Home Secretary Jacqui Smith said she decided to make public the names of 16 people banned since October so others could better understand what sort of behaviour Britain was not prepared to tolerate.

The list includes hate preachers, anti-gay protesters and a far- right US talk show host.

<snip>

"Coming to this country is a privilege. If you can't live by the rules that we live by, the standards and the values that we live by, we should exclude you from this country and, what's more, now we will make public those people that we have excluded....

... "This is someone who has fallen into the category of fomenting hatred, of such extreme views and expressing them in such a way that it is actually likely to cause inter-community tension or even violence if that person were allowed into the country," Ms Smith told BBC Breakfast.

Also named are American Baptist pastor Fred Waldron Phelps Snr and his daughter Shirley Phelps-Roper, who have picketed the funerals of Aids victims and claimed the deaths of US soldiers are a punishment for US tolerance of homosexuality....

... Hamas MP Yunis Al-Astal, Jewish extremist Mike Guzovsky, former Ku Klux Klan grand wizard Stephen Donald Black and neo-Nazi Erich Gliebe are also on the list released today.

Artur Ryno and Pavel Skachevsky, the former leaders of a violent Russian skinhead gang which committed 20 racially motivated murders, are also banned from coming to Britain. Both are currently in prison.

Making up the rest of the 16 named by the Home Office today are preachers Wadgy Abd El Hamied Mohamed Ghoneim, Abdullah Qadri Al Ahdal, Safwat Hijazi and Amir Siddique, Muslim activist Abdul Ali Musa (previously Clarence Reams), murderer and Hezbollah terrorist Samir Al Quntar and Kashmiri terror group leader Nasr Javed.

Linkie

Cry me a river.

 

[The Lady Kate]

No. But it would be one less voice crying in the wilderness.

One less crybaby... this is a bad thing?

 

[LUColt27]

One less crybaby... this is a bad thing?

Depends. Both sides have crybabies. I, for one, would like them all to shut up and try actually working with one another, but I know too much about politicians to actually think that would ever happen.

 

[jamesrwright3]

Savage is the 3rd most listened to show on radio. He is not on any side-actually thinks that both parties leave a lot to be desired and have become one in the same-corporatists.