legends, what we call myths, people putting down on paper what they saw and experienced to be misunderstood by future generations.
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Both Evolution and Christianity?
- Thread starter MZS
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fuji
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Could "let there be light" be the big bang on how Moses saw the visions that God gave him to write Genesis?
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It is the supernatural power of God that created the natural.
Since no man was there and knows anything about the supernatural that took place to create the natural, then you have the only true witness that is the Genesis account.
However today prophesying Christians unwittingly deny the past, present and future supernatural power of God by trying to apply naturalistic causality to what was immaterial to begin with.
God is Spirit (John 4:24) and is omnipresent and when his Holy Spirit put into action the natural processes that operate as clock work yesterday, today and tomorrow, then we need to agree that the immaterial brought about the material. So if the immaterial brought about the material how then can you use the material equation of naturalistic and deterministic approach to arrive at the truth of the matter?
It is obvious the material, naturalistic view that is dependant on a deterministic approach cannot not venture into explaining what is immaterial, because as far as the naturalistic equation is concerned the immaterial does not exist if it cannot be weighted and quantified according to atoms, molecules and sub molecular particles.
Therefore to deny the Genesis account is to unwittingly deny God's past, present and future power and to side with the materialists.
This is a wake up call to awaken the senses to the futile direction materialists are heading with this deterministic approach to God's supernatural power that created the heavens, stars, earth, beast and man.
Next thing they are going to say is God created everything using evolution. This is a lie!
You can't use the equation for a circle to prove a square.
The affirmation of creation according to the Genesis account is conveyed clearly by Christ.
If Christ says that male and female were made AT the beginning then there is no significant time gap between when the earth was formed supernaturally to when the first man and women were created. Simply they were made AT the beginning and not some millions of years after in a primal evolved state requiring millions of years to be perfected.
Every day that God creates something it is confirmed with a good meaning perfect for it required no perfecting with time as the equation of material evolution suggests.
The fact is that the world is deteriorating and not evolving as we see mass extinctions around the world before our eyes. Are the evolutionist scientists going to come up with devolution. Notice both EVILution and DEVILution have one thing in common they originate from the author of evil, the father of lies, Satan.
Since no man was there and knows anything about the supernatural that took place to create the natural, then you have the only true witness that is the Genesis account.
However today prophesying Christians unwittingly deny the past, present and future supernatural power of God by trying to apply naturalistic causality to what was immaterial to begin with.
God is Spirit (John 4:24) and is omnipresent and when his Holy Spirit put into action the natural processes that operate as clock work yesterday, today and tomorrow, then we need to agree that the immaterial brought about the material. So if the immaterial brought about the material how then can you use the material equation of naturalistic and deterministic approach to arrive at the truth of the matter?
It is obvious the material, naturalistic view that is dependant on a deterministic approach cannot not venture into explaining what is immaterial, because as far as the naturalistic equation is concerned the immaterial does not exist if it cannot be weighted and quantified according to atoms, molecules and sub molecular particles.
Therefore to deny the Genesis account is to unwittingly deny God's past, present and future power and to side with the materialists.
This is a wake up call to awaken the senses to the futile direction materialists are heading with this deterministic approach to God's supernatural power that created the heavens, stars, earth, beast and man.
Next thing they are going to say is God created everything using evolution. This is a lie!
You can't use the equation for a circle to prove a square.
The affirmation of creation according to the Genesis account is conveyed clearly by Christ.
If Christ says that male and female were made AT the beginning then there is no significant time gap between when the earth was formed supernaturally to when the first man and women were created. Simply they were made AT the beginning and not some millions of years after in a primal evolved state requiring millions of years to be perfected.
Every day that God creates something it is confirmed with a good meaning perfect for it required no perfecting with time as the equation of material evolution suggests.
The fact is that the world is deteriorating and not evolving as we see mass extinctions around the world before our eyes. Are the evolutionist scientists going to come up with devolution. Notice both EVILution and DEVILution have one thing in common they originate from the author of evil, the father of lies, Satan.
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Why, Moses wasn't there? Or whoever wrote down the two different creation accounts.
In other words, science is useless.
The immaterial doesn't exist as far as science is concerned. Science only deals with what we can measure.
How so?
Oh?
It is?
Jesus also cast "demons" out of people that were most likely just mental illnesses or epilepsy. Not demons.
Really?
So all of science is wrong and somehow your story is right? Ok.
Life IS evolving. The only thing that is deteriorating, is that one day, many billions of years from now, this universe may eventually die off, shrink, have a Big Crunch or some such thing. But that is well beyond many thousands of life times.
Yes, scientists are all demonic. Good God.
And people wonder why I act so hostile towards christians on here.
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Satan has found his way into our schools by educating our children to worship the naturalistic material world called MOTHER NATURE rather than FATHER GOD who created the heavens, stars, earth, man and beast.
It is a form of idolatry on a global scale. This is Satan's doing and those who support evolution and do not believe on faith alone the Genesis account, then how can they believe the remaining witnesses testimony from God in all of the Old and New Testament scripture.
It flies in the face of truth that only a hypocritical mind would believe the contents of a book and any book in that matter published by an author without believing in its introduction.
How could a prophesying Christian in their rightful mind NOT ENDORSE THE GENESIS ONE ACCOUNT as the introduction to the SUPERNATURAL author of the book called the Holy Bible.
It is a hypocritical lie in believing the content of the book but not the INTRODUCTION OF THE SUPERNATURAL author, God the Father, that authored it. The statement that is unwittingly been made by a growing number of prophesying Christians is that we do not believe to the truth of the GENESIS one account on faith value alone, but we believe the content of the Holy Bible thereafter.
If you can't believe what God who is the author of Genesis account testified of himself, then how can you believe the contents of the remainder of the Holy book that is written by the same SUPERNATURAL author. What a confused and mixed up society this Luke warm Christian generation has become in not giving credit to where it counts and that is to God who made the heaven, and the stars, and the earth, man and beast.
No wonder the end day point of contention will be the QUESTION OF WORSHIP:
It is a form of idolatry on a global scale. This is Satan's doing and those who support evolution and do not believe on faith alone the Genesis account, then how can they believe the remaining witnesses testimony from God in all of the Old and New Testament scripture.
It flies in the face of truth that only a hypocritical mind would believe the contents of a book and any book in that matter published by an author without believing in its introduction.
How could a prophesying Christian in their rightful mind NOT ENDORSE THE GENESIS ONE ACCOUNT as the introduction to the SUPERNATURAL author of the book called the Holy Bible.
It is a hypocritical lie in believing the content of the book but not the INTRODUCTION OF THE SUPERNATURAL author, God the Father, that authored it. The statement that is unwittingly been made by a growing number of prophesying Christians is that we do not believe to the truth of the GENESIS one account on faith value alone, but we believe the content of the Holy Bible thereafter.
If you can't believe what God who is the author of Genesis account testified of himself, then how can you believe the contents of the remainder of the Holy book that is written by the same SUPERNATURAL author. What a confused and mixed up society this Luke warm Christian generation has become in not giving credit to where it counts and that is to God who made the heaven, and the stars, and the earth, man and beast.
No wonder the end day point of contention will be the QUESTION OF WORSHIP:
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Who is teaching you guys how to use a computer? I wish they'd stop it.
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Can science prove the supernatural?
No and you will see why.
True Science is a system that can measure and quantify a closed loop system exerpriment of a repeatable process within a naturalistic deterministic equation that it is modelled after.
Can science prove the miracles that Jesus did by healing the lepers, the blind, the crippled, demon possessed and raising the dead?
Is there a measurable and quantifiable closed loop process that is repeatable within a naturalistic determistic equation, that can be used to model all these miracles?
Absolutely not, because science is only a small area of knowledge within the confines of the natural, like language and arts that are all bound by the natural. As soon as you venture out toward the supernatural you no longer can use natural means to interpret the process nor outcome.
So the real question is, do prophesying Christians believe that God created the heavens, stars, earth, man and beast supernatural or naturally?
If you say naturally then you have confined God who is supernatural to the natural realm and if you read scripture throughout you will discover that God is not dictated by the natural. In that regard you will have to reject all the supernatural miracles by virtue of your naturalistic approach.
So Christians who advocate such naturalistic explanation to the supernatural Genesis One account are chasing their own tails until they release the long beaten road that they are following a self contradictory path.
Is evolution science?
No it isn't and this is the misconception held by a few scientists that say evolution is science. Evolution is a theory that cannot be proven not disproven because of the premises that it makes to safe guard its theory from those who try to disprove it.
Let me give you an example:
I can come up with a theory to say that if I throw a ball in the air it will not come back down.
Everyone says rubbish it will come back down because of gravity.
Then I assert my claim by a premiss that can not be refuted by saying if I chucked it an infinite number of times, let us say millions and millions, billions and billions of times it will cease to become a ball.
That is the theory of evolution, set your premise so that your theory cannot be refuted.
There is a field in science that is called the unproven science called a theory. What it states is that if a theory cannot be proven nor disproven then that is a valid scientific theory.
However friends it does not make this theory science nor does it make it truth.
I can come up with a 1001 theories setting premises that no one can disprove and that too can become a valid scientific theory.
Those who support the theory of how the world was created cannot use science because what they have found is that what is found in the natural disproves their claim but not their theory because it sets a premise that cannot be disproven.
No and you will see why.
True Science is a system that can measure and quantify a closed loop system exerpriment of a repeatable process within a naturalistic deterministic equation that it is modelled after.
Can science prove the miracles that Jesus did by healing the lepers, the blind, the crippled, demon possessed and raising the dead?
Is there a measurable and quantifiable closed loop process that is repeatable within a naturalistic determistic equation, that can be used to model all these miracles?
Absolutely not, because science is only a small area of knowledge within the confines of the natural, like language and arts that are all bound by the natural. As soon as you venture out toward the supernatural you no longer can use natural means to interpret the process nor outcome.
So the real question is, do prophesying Christians believe that God created the heavens, stars, earth, man and beast supernatural or naturally?
If you say naturally then you have confined God who is supernatural to the natural realm and if you read scripture throughout you will discover that God is not dictated by the natural. In that regard you will have to reject all the supernatural miracles by virtue of your naturalistic approach.
So Christians who advocate such naturalistic explanation to the supernatural Genesis One account are chasing their own tails until they release the long beaten road that they are following a self contradictory path.
Is evolution science?
No it isn't and this is the misconception held by a few scientists that say evolution is science. Evolution is a theory that cannot be proven not disproven because of the premises that it makes to safe guard its theory from those who try to disprove it.
Let me give you an example:
I can come up with a theory to say that if I throw a ball in the air it will not come back down.
Everyone says rubbish it will come back down because of gravity.
Then I assert my claim by a premiss that can not be refuted by saying if I chucked it an infinite number of times, let us say millions and millions, billions and billions of times it will cease to become a ball.
That is the theory of evolution, set your premise so that your theory cannot be refuted.
There is a field in science that is called the unproven science called a theory. What it states is that if a theory cannot be proven nor disproven then that is a valid scientific theory.
However friends it does not make this theory science nor does it make it truth.
I can come up with a 1001 theories setting premises that no one can disprove and that too can become a valid scientific theory.
Those who support the theory of how the world was created cannot use science because what they have found is that what is found in the natural disproves their claim but not their theory because it sets a premise that cannot be disproven.
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K
kellhus
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You can buy this book or probably find it at your local library.
The Language of Science and Faith: Straight Answers to Genuine Questions: Karl W. Giberson, Francis S. Collins: 9780830838295: Amazon.com: Books
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kellhus
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Yes, it is.
It is a theory held by the virtual entirety of the educated scientific professionals the world over.
Evolution can be disproven, the same as the germ theory of disease can be disproven. The fact that it is exceedingly unlikely that this will ever happen has no bearing on the fact that evolution and germ theory is falsifiable. You should try and educate yourself on the basics of scientific methodology before commenting.
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It's sad, most people on here don't even know how the scientific method even operates. If anything, it is creationism which cannot be disproven and is therefore, unscientific.
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It's always good to hear from people who have seriously looked at the issue from both sides. As you suggest, science is really on the side of creation. For those who are interested I also offer the 2 vids, below. In the 2nd one, most especially,
you can see evolutionists themselves admitting they have no real evidence for their theory.
It is impossible to believe in evolution and the Bible. The Bible says, for just one thing, that the sun was created after the plants! Further Messiah upheld all of the "Old" Testament. He spoke of Adam & Eve, Noah, Soddom & Gommorah as actual facts. This world is being fooled by evolutionary theory (and I was once also) but He is the One we should be looking at and listening to.
The Fossil Record - Dr. Don Patton - YouTube
Thermodynamic Arguments for Creation - Dr. Thomas Kindell - YouTube
The book that got me out of matrix-think to start, though I've studied this issue for years, was Creation Facts of Life. It is written by a scientist, one who used to teach evolution as fact at the college level. He got challenged on evolutionary assumptions which actually have no data to back them up. Then he turned 180 degrees around.
Evolutionary literature is based on dataless assumptions presented as absolute scientific fact, and many logical fallacies, especially Correlation Does Not Imply Causation. It historically, and this certainly includes today, has included outright lies both visual and verbal. You don't have to give up science, only pseudo science, to ditch politcally correct, self protective, pseudo scientific NeoDarwinism.
Praying for you that you will be an instrument, with protection, of the Father's eternal truths.
Oh, just thought of another fun vid. Do you know that blood cells and soft tissues have been found in dino bones since early last century? In fact, just last year they found such things in triceratops horns. Evolutionists have all sorts of disclaimers for that, none of which, as always, have anything but dataless conjecture and no real data to back them up. If forensic science says such things can't possibly last that long, no problem, they will tell you forensic science must be wrong, because obviously evolution can't be the one that is wrong!
There are also many art works around the world, and accounts from ancient hstorians, strongly indicating that men and dinosaurs once lived together.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXfKCnDCf50
http://www.genesispark.com/exhibits/evidence/historical/ancient/dinosaur/
you can see evolutionists themselves admitting they have no real evidence for their theory.
It is impossible to believe in evolution and the Bible. The Bible says, for just one thing, that the sun was created after the plants! Further Messiah upheld all of the "Old" Testament. He spoke of Adam & Eve, Noah, Soddom & Gommorah as actual facts. This world is being fooled by evolutionary theory (and I was once also) but He is the One we should be looking at and listening to.
The Fossil Record - Dr. Don Patton - YouTube
Thermodynamic Arguments for Creation - Dr. Thomas Kindell - YouTube
The book that got me out of matrix-think to start, though I've studied this issue for years, was Creation Facts of Life. It is written by a scientist, one who used to teach evolution as fact at the college level. He got challenged on evolutionary assumptions which actually have no data to back them up. Then he turned 180 degrees around.
Evolutionary literature is based on dataless assumptions presented as absolute scientific fact, and many logical fallacies, especially Correlation Does Not Imply Causation. It historically, and this certainly includes today, has included outright lies both visual and verbal. You don't have to give up science, only pseudo science, to ditch politcally correct, self protective, pseudo scientific NeoDarwinism.
Praying for you that you will be an instrument, with protection, of the Father's eternal truths.
Oh, just thought of another fun vid. Do you know that blood cells and soft tissues have been found in dino bones since early last century? In fact, just last year they found such things in triceratops horns. Evolutionists have all sorts of disclaimers for that, none of which, as always, have anything but dataless conjecture and no real data to back them up. If forensic science says such things can't possibly last that long, no problem, they will tell you forensic science must be wrong, because obviously evolution can't be the one that is wrong!
There are also many art works around the world, and accounts from ancient hstorians, strongly indicating that men and dinosaurs once lived together.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXfKCnDCf50
http://www.genesispark.com/exhibits/evidence/historical/ancient/dinosaur/
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When you've already decided you're going to believe a story over anything else, there's nothing else to be said. That is the very definition of being "close-minded." You've closed your mind. You're right, the rest of the world is wrong. What can you say to that?
People did the same with flat earth theory or with believing the sun went around the earth.
When you've already decided in advance what you want to believe, you're done. It also doesn't help make the christian religion any more palatable for anyone else, since you're promoting a worldview that is not consistent with reality. I am going to start a new meme involving unicorns on the moon. It is entirely inconsistent with reality but I will insist it's true. I would look foolish. This is how christians appear to everyone else.
People did the same with flat earth theory or with believing the sun went around the earth.
When you've already decided in advance what you want to believe, you're done. It also doesn't help make the christian religion any more palatable for anyone else, since you're promoting a worldview that is not consistent with reality. I am going to start a new meme involving unicorns on the moon. It is entirely inconsistent with reality but I will insist it's true. I would look foolish. This is how christians appear to everyone else.
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Philpy1976
Junior Member
Adaptation is how things change and is scientifically observable.
Too many evolutionists (or believers in the 'time fairys'* as i call them) try to use adaptation to prove evolution.
* Time fairy = nothing can become something all on it's own (despite the fact it doesn't yet exist) if you just wait long enough.....
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Adaptation is how things change and is scientifically observable.
Too many evolutionists (or believers in the 'time fairys'* as i call them) try to use adaptation to prove evolution.
* Time fairy = nothing can become something all on it's own (despite the fact it doesn't yet exist) if you just wait long enough.....
Scientifically, evolution has already been displayed. Creationism, however, has never been and actually contradicts the evidence. The onus is on the creationists to put forth some evidence for their ideas.
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Philpy1976
Junior Member
It all boils down to who you want to place your faith in.
I choose God (and therefor His word).
He is either always right, or He doesn't exist at all.
If Genesis is not correct, Exodus might be wrong too, how about Leviticus......
Occultists back in the time of Moses were able to many things to nature, why should I trust anything that contradicts my Lord God today?
I choose God (and therefor His word).
He is either always right, or He doesn't exist at all.
If Genesis is not correct, Exodus might be wrong too, how about Leviticus......
Occultists back in the time of Moses were able to many things to nature, why should I trust anything that contradicts my Lord God today?
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Philpy1976
Junior Member
15 “Look at Behemoth,
which I made along with you
and which feeds on grass like an ox.
16 What strength it has in its loins,
what power in the muscles of its belly!
17 Its tail sways like a cedar;
the sinews of its thighs are close-knit.
18 Its bones are tubes of bronze,
its limbs like rods of iron. - Job 40:15-18
What huge creature is being described here?
A herbivore for sure.
Big and strong.
Tail like cedar.
Cedar trees in the middle east grow up to 130 ft and have a diameter of over 7 ft. So we can rule out Elephants or Hippos.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jtz4Tzr9WJk
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Exactly.
You're closed to everything already, so there is no point in even talking to you.
I love fundamentalists like you.
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