Biden and Trump in pictures and numbers - Age

[Reasonably Sane]

Here are two very uncharitable pictures that illustrate the point.
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I think the Trump picture was intentionally posed by Trump and, frankly, makes him appear extremely lucid.

 

[tz620q]

Pence isn't going to be on the ticket this go around. Until the former president names his VP there is nothing to contrast Harris to.

You are correct; but Harris could become President if Biden cannot finish a second term. That, to me, is a very scary thought. During Trump's first term, I often thought that Pence acted more Presidential than Trump.

 

[Desk trauma]

OTOH, Harris does set a mighty low bar.

This is US politics, we can an will always go lower.

 

[tz620q]

I think the Trump picture was intentionally posed by Trump and, frankly, makes him appear extremely lucid.

Well at least Trump's picture here shows an awareness of what was happening to him.

 

[rambot]

To which I have only one word: Trudeau.

I was referring to their age. I disagree with Trudeau on a lot and don't really like him (betrayal for some important promises not kept from his first election), but yes, I would rather have a 50 year old head of state than an octogenarian.

 

[tz620q]

I agree. Reagan was showing decline in his second term, and Biden was showing decline well before he was elected. At least, IMO. Trump seems to be doing fine - so far at least.

My mother-in-law slipped further and further into dementia of some sort as she aged. One of the first signs I saw was a mixing up of numbers. She would say 300 instead of 3000. I noticed this same sign when Biden was campaigning in 2020.

Last time Biden could hide his drooping mouth behind a Covid mask. It will be great theater in the next couple of months with how the Democrats will hide him in the middle of a Presidential campaign. My gut feel is that most of the campaigning will be done by Barack and Michelle Obama, Kamala Harris, and other Democratic stalwarts.

 

[rambot]

Truthfully, I am concerned about the vice president candidates. With an aging President, there is a real possibility of them becoming President. If we look at the last two Vice Presidents, we have Mike Pence and Kamala Harris. I rate people in public office based on how well they serve the country and not their own political ambitions. If viewed in this light, there is simply no comparison between Mike Pence and Kamala Harris.

Mike Pence assumed the role of White House Corona Virus Task Force chair, which was a tough job, without a complaint. Kamala Harris has done little to lessen the crisis at our southern border and has stated her frustration that the task was given her to at all.

When faced with Trump pressuring Pence to seat illegitimate electors, Pence effectively killed his chances of going further in the Republican party by holding to his conscience and certifying the election. During the Vice Presidential debate when asked if she would take the corona virus vaccine if it was approved by the Trump administration, Harris replied that she would not take it if Trump told her too, but she would if the medical establishment did. Yet by September of 2021, Biden and Harris were requiring federal employees to get the vaccine or lose their jobs. Nothing changed in the way the vaccine was approved; but Harris flopped on allowing a President to tell people to get the vaccine from when Trump was President to when Biden was President. This to me shows a stark contrast in core values between Pence and Harris.

I'm sorry to point this out, but, I think we should remember the date the the vaccines were OFFICIALLY given approval for use? I am 99% sure that all of these conversations happened before the vaccines were actually permitted and approved for public use.

Also, I remember that quote from Harris. Personally, I thought it was 100% a dig at Trump specifically; not a policy position.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

Obviously, but there is a reason it's (35 yoa) in the constitution. I imagine it has to do with maturity. Old age can offer reasons also, e.g., cognitive decline or immanent death. It's unreasonable to assume we shouldn't take age into consideration. Should we elect a President who is 99 yoa?

O, heck. I agree with you. But I guess it needs to be up to the voters. How foolish of us to nominate these guys.

 

[rambot]

My mother-in-law slipped further and further into dementia of some sort as she aged. One of the first signs I saw was a mixing up of numbers. She would say 300 instead of 3000. I noticed this same sign when Biden was campaigning in 2020.

It's amazing to me how someone can take a SINGLE instance of mixing up numbers, and think "Well, could only be dementia". I'll make 2 or 3 mistakes like this in a single 45 minute lesson. It happens.
Humans be humming.
Given the fact that there are cameras ALL OVER him for 70% of the day and he's mic'ed up for a good portion of that, rest assured that there would be wheelbarrows of evidence of dementia.

I'll counter with the fact that Trump frequently resembles an individual high on prescription medication but this is not about him and his lack of fitness for president. I will start another thread if needed.

Last time Biden could hide his drooping mouth behind a Covid mask.

Sorry? Drooping mouth? That's a kind of hyperbole

His smile is becoming uneven in his aging. But yeah.
I'd argue he looks pretty good for his age.

It will be great theater in the next couple of months with how the Democrats will hide him in the middle of a Presidential campaign. My gut feel is that most of the campaigning will be done by Barack and Michelle Obama, Kamala Harris, and other Democratic stalwarts.

Why hide that guy? He looks perfectly capable.

I would love to put up a body picture of Trump in terrible physical shape but I'm not excited to body shame the guy. I'm only engaging in this discussion to reiterate how hollow a criticism of Biden sounds given who others will eventually vote for.

 

[Reasonably Sane]

You are correct; but Harris could become President if Biden cannot finish a second term. That, to me, is a very scary thought. During Trump's first term, I often thought that Pence acted more Presidential than Trump.

FWIW, I was against Trump for president, but once he became president I loved what he actually did. And your last sentence describes part of what I liked about him. I will never again vote for a career politician for president. All done.

 

[Reasonably Sane]

Well at least Trump's picture here shows an awareness of what was happening to him.

Yes. And the reason his supporters like the picture is that it shows the face of a man who is ready for a fight. One of the things that disgusts them about republicans is that they don't fight. If some other republican had been president, the Kavanaugh nomination would have been withdrawn when Blasey-Ford came out with that ridiculous story. Trump didn't flinch. And Kavanaugh was confirmed.

 

[JustOneWay]

I think the Trump picture was intentionally posed by Trump and, frankly, makes him appear extremely lucid.

Lucid? He took that photo and plastered it on shirts and coffee mugs and sold them to pay for his legal defense. He is also selling pieces of the suit in the mugshot. Imagine buying a mugshot from a man arrested over and over? I can't think of anything more lucid than purposefully selling mugshot of yourself breaking the law.

This photo would have been a more comparable one. Trump staring at an eclipse.

 

[Hans Blaster]

I think it should be taken into consideration. Why is it important the US President be at least 35? Is it age discrimination to not allow 20 year olds be President? If age at that end matters, why not the other?

It requires a candidate to have their own personal history of accomplishments to signal merit for office. It's a protection against the rise of the unaccomplished sons of prominent men. (aristocracy)

 

[Reasonably Sane]

Lucid? He took that photo and plastered it on shirts and coffee mugs and sold them to pay for his legal defense. He is also selling pieces of the suit in the mugshot. Imagine buying a mugshot from a man arrested over and over? I can't think of anything more lucid than purposefully selling mugshot of yourself breaking the law.

I don't think you understand the thinking of his supporters, including me. It's a sort of "judge a man by the enemies he makes" thing. To use an analogy, he's like a jew being arrested over and over in Nazi Germany. It's a badge of honor.

And the funeral walk of the House democrats taking the letters of impeachment to the Senate was high comedy. Seriously. As one reporter said a few months ago, trump is just one indictment away of winning the presidency.

 

[iluvatar5150]

I don't think you understand the thinking of his supporters, including me. It's a sort of "judge a man by the enemies he makes" thing.

We understand that this is the dynamic. We just don't understand the dynamic itself. Magadonians take umbrage at being looked down upon, while openly and proudly adopting an approach that's asinine at best and arguably self-destructive. If you're deliberately being worse, how do you expect people to perceive you?

To use an analogy, he's like a jew being arrested over and over in Nazi Germany. It's a badge of honor.

If that Jew were being arrested for exposing himself to little kids, then the problem in that scenario wouldn't be the Nazis.

 

[Reasonably Sane]

If that Jew were being arrested for exposing himself to little kids, then the problem in that scenario wouldn't be the Nazis.

I certainly can't disagree with that, but I'm not seeing the relevance here. Part of this may be that I used to work with real estate developers in a large city back in the 80's. The charges I'm seeing against trump, on all fronts, is like a man being pulled over for doing 71 in a 70 on one of America's freeways in flyover country. i.e. he's being singled out because the "cop" has a vendetta against him.

 

[Reasonably Sane]

We understand that this is the dynamic. We just don't understand the dynamic itself. Magadonians take umbrage at being looked down upon, while openly and proudly adopting an approach that's asinine at best and arguably self-destructive. If you're deliberately being worse, how do you expect people to perceive you?

I'm missing your point. And what is a magadonian?

 

[iluvatar5150]

I certainly can't disagree with that, but I'm not seeing the relevance here. Part of this may be that I used to work with real estate developers in a large city back in the 80's. The charges I'm seeing against trump, on all fronts, is like a man being pulled over for doing 71 in a 70 on one of America's freeways in flyover country. i.e. he's being singled out because the "cop" has a vendetta against him.

I struggle to see how any honest, rational, serious person would see Trump's travails as being due merely to the other side having a vendetta against him. There are lots of Republicans, but none of them have engendered the same sort of prosecutorial attention as Trump. Few other Republicans have the long history of fraudulent activities that he does; none (that I'm aware of) have tried to hide documents from the National Archives; none have tried to steal an election. He faces more blowback because he acts more criminally than other Republicans. Of his ongoing legal battles, only the one regarding real estate valuations comes close to being as pedantic as your analog of doing 71 in a 70. With regards to the documents, he was given a lot of slack and opportunities to comply and still refused. With regards to the Stormy Daniels affair, he'd hardly be the first politician indicted for paying hush money to hide an affair. With regards to the prosecutions over his attempt to steal the 2020 election, HE TRIED TO STEAL AN ELECTION.

For all of the hand-wringing you guys do over voter fraud, your guy perpetrated a fraud that fomented an insurrection, and you guys just handwave it away as if it were nothing. do you actually care about election integrity or not?

I'm missing your point. And what is a magadonian?

It's a self-adopted moniker for Trump supporters:

Donald Trump Ruthlessly Mocked for Boasting About 'Magadonia'

In the world of former President Donald Trump, things can get a little weird on social media. The former POTUS has been known to post some bizarre things

celebmagazine.com

 

[Reasonably Sane]

I struggle to see how any honest, rational, serious person would see Trump's travails as being due merely to the other side having a vendetta against him. There are lots of Republicans, but none of them have engendered the same sort of prosecutorial attention as Trump. Few other Republicans have the long history of fraudulent activities that he does; none (that I'm aware of) have tried to hide documents from the National Archives; none have tried to steal an election. He faces more blowback because he acts more criminally than other Republicans. Of his ongoing legal battles, only the one regarding real estate valuations comes close to being as pedantic as your analog of doing 71 in a 70. With regards to the documents, he was given a lot of slack and opportunities to comply and still refused. With regards to the Stormy Daniels affair, he'd hardly be the first politician indicted for paying hush money to hide an affair. With regards to the prosecutions over his attempt to steal the 2020 election, HE TRIED TO STEAL AN ELECTION.

For all of the hand-wringing you guys do over voter fraud, your guy perpetrated a fraud that fomented an insurrection, and you guys just handwave it away as if it were nothing. do you actually care about election integrity or not?


It's a self-adopted moniker for Trump supporters:

Donald Trump Ruthlessly Mocked for Boasting About 'Magadonia'

In the world of former President Donald Trump, things can get a little weird on social media. The former POTUS has been known to post some bizarre things

celebmagazine.com

Trump is not just the enemy of the Democrats. He's the enemy of the republican party as well. I was a lifelong republican (I'm now 70) and left the party back in dubya's second term. It took me a long time to realize we are being played by both parties. It's just a "good cop, bad cop" thing going on. Trump is no republican. He just had to join one of the parties in order to have a chance of winning, and at least he agrees the most with their "platform" if not what they actually do.

And regarding fraudulent activities, I disagree strongly. How do lifelong politicians get so disgustingly wealthy on the salary they receive? But it's not really about money for them. It's about power. I do think trump made some missteps early in his first term since he was used to being CEO and doing what he thought best. When president you have to follow more rules. And it's not lost on my that often Trump would lose in the lower courts but win in the higher courts. Do I think he's corrupt and guilty of fraud? Yep. But in the same way that the guy doing 71 in a 70 was guilty of speeding. And both parties (the uniparty, or "deep state") are after him. Say what you will about him, I loved what he accomplished when president. And I look forward to another four years. And to be clear, I was no fan before he was elected. I didn't vote for Hillary in 2016, but I didn't vote "for" trump either. I voted enthusiastically for him in 2020 and will again in 2024, even if I have to write his name in. He's nowhere near perfect, but he's way ahead of everyone else that aspires for the job.

 

[rambot]

. Magadonians take umbrage at being looked down upon, while openly and proudly adopting an approach that's asinine at best and arguably self-destructive. If you're deliberately being worse, how do you expect people to perceive you?

This is an important question that I'd like to hear thr answer to.