Atheist morality.

[selfinflikted]

So Christians don´t do better, but they do better?

I think you got it, now.

 

[Davian]

I'm not sure about that. That seems to be more along the lines of being crazy if anything. The bible says do not tempt God.
Matthew 4:7
Jesus answered him, "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"

Proving God through putting him to the test is more about a lack of faith and placing God in some box. It speaks more about a man made means of proof and a skeptical attitude and not trusting God. God does not prove himself so that people can believe. It is by believing that we are saved the other way around. But God has and will do great things to save people and will look after us if we trust and believe in him. But asking for this type of test is bring things down to mans way of thinking and proving things which is putting God down and lowering him to our level.

Or, the the writers of the bible, knowing that these tests would fail, simply added the "do not test" clause. That is far more parsimonious

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWyCCJ6B2WE

 

[Cute Tink]

I think that the part some of us are missing is the disconnect between the idea that believing in the Christian God and that Jesus is His son and that through Jesus people are saved is what makes one "Christian" (at least that's what I've been told by very many Christians over the years) and this idea that behaving oneself is what makes one Christian.

I'm not about to pop into someone's head to decide whether they truly believe in God/Jesus or are just giving lip service to the idea, because I can't do that.

 

[Cearbhall]

No its more than objectivity. Thats why people are outed and religious people are busted for being hypocrites. Because they dont practice what they preach and are not who they say they are. It can be proven and exposed. Non Christians just want to change the goal posts so they can attribute all these non christian behaviors to them and bring down the status of the righteous and worthy God who is the same always and can stand undisputed among all. Man is the one who adds his own interpretation and behaviors to religion.

You've pretty much got it if you take out the sinister undertones of the agenda. But you're wrong about objectivity. This is exactly what objectivity is. You have to look at it from the standpoint of someone who doesn't have a preference for any religion. From such a standpoint, every religion is just a man-made institution, meaning that the opinions and values of the current members of a religion are just as valid and as representative of the institution as the ideas of its founders. Now, we generally allow certain goalposts to remain when we're talking about institutions such as political parties and religions just so that the names of these institutions retain some level of meaning, which is why we use terms such as "radical Islam" and the "Religious Right." These goalposts are probably more rigid than they should be, but we all know that allowing the radicals to be called the same thing as the rest of a group only serves to subject all of the members to prejudice and violence.

I'm sorry if you don't like that objectivity doesn't privilege your religion. That's kind of the point.

Subjectivity is when you say "God started Christianity and made the rules of this religion, so anyone who isn't following these certain rules isn't a Christian, even though none of us can actually agree on what all of the rules are."

 

[cerad]

No did Christ think he was superior to others even though he was the son of God. No he was humble and even went to the point of washing the feet of his disciples. This was done before a meal and was done by the lowest of servants. He was showing his humility and that he was an obedient servant to God the fathers will.

I know this is perhaps off-topic but are you seriously suggesting that Christ was a Christian?

 

[Robban]

I know this is perhaps off-topic but are you seriously suggesting that Christ was a Christian?

A Rabbi called out to the heavens in utterly shatteredness,
he cried out ,"Help me O Merciful one, my son has become a Christian."

A voice came back and said, "Yeah, it happened to Me too."

 

[Cearbhall]

I think I know how to research after 40 plus years of life and study.

I would hope so, but you don't seem to understand or value objectivity. You can't personally decide who's Christian and who's not and claim to be conducting valid research.

If you want to know what attributes Christ had and teaches us in how we can inherit the kingdom of heaven then the New testament is full of them. Specifically the sermon on the Mount and the
beatitudes.
THE EIGHT BEATITUDES OF JESUS

I'm in my sixteenth year of Catholic education. I'm good. And as I've already said, this is irrelevant to objective demographic research.

 

[stevevw]

I would hope so, but you don't seem to understand or value objectivity. You can't personally decide who's Christian and who's not and claim to be conducting valid research.

I'm in my sixteenth year of Catholic education. I'm good. And as I've already said, this is irrelevant to objective demographic research.

I dont think you are being objective though. You are wanting to say that a christian is determined by whatever someone says they are. You could get 10 different interpretations as to what they think a Christian is. I am saying if you want to know what a Christian is then you go to the book that is written on Christianity. You refer to the leader of Christianity Jesus Christ. If you want to know the criteria of Jehovah witness you go to the governing principles and mission statement of Jehovah witness. You dont rely on individuals giving their person opinion. All a demographic survey will show is x amount of people have identified with belonging to a religion. It doesn't tell you that they practice that religion. Many people put on forms they fill out that they are catholic because thats what they were born into. But they havnt been near a catholic church for years.

 

[pyramid33]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

 

[madaz]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

What on Earth is an atheistic belief?

 

[quatona]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

Well, people notice they have to find a way to get along with each other while they are alive. So, apparently unlike you, they do care.

 

[Eudaimonist]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

Morality matters to oneself while one is alive. Life exists right now.

It's true that morality won't matter to oneself after one is dead because one won't exist at that time. That doesn't mean that morality doesn't matter right now.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Gadarene]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

Well it is perhaps fortunate for the people around you, then, that you are not an atheist.

 

[Syd the Human]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

Is the only reason you are decent to others is to avoid hell? Do you not actually care about your friends, family, neighbors, and coworkers?

 

[Nithavela]

Is the only reason you are decent to others is to avoid hell? Do you not actually care about your friends, family, neighbors, and coworkers?

Of course he doesn't, because Jesus said you should hate your family.

Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them, “If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. (Luke 14:25-27 ESV)

 

[Syd the Human]

Of course he doesn't, because Jesus said you should hate your family.

Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them, “If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. (Luke 14:25-27 ESV)

I have always taken that as he did not literally want you to hate your family, but to love god so much that it would seem that way.

But if he did mean it literally than it is another example of how sadistic god is. To demand that you hate the people closest to you to worship himself is evil.

 

[Nithavela]

I guess it depends on the morality of the reading person what God actually meant. Just like everything else in the bible (do not murder, stone adulterers, kill disobedient children, love your neighbour like yourself, hate yourself, hate your family, never appear before me empty handed, give everything you have to the poor...)

Reading the bible as a christian is the art of thinking that 2+2=5 in the right historical context.

 

[selfinflikted]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

Then you haven't looked hard enough.

 

[Cute Tink]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

I'm glad you aren't holding an "atheistic belief" then. I find plenty to care about and I don't need a god to tell me that people are worth caring about.

 

[Belk]

I still find no use for morality in an atheistic belief. Life won't exist, so who care's?

That explains why you have such a hard time understanding where we are coming from.