Are there limits to what healing we can receive?

[jiminpa]

When has anyone said that Satan's bad is good?

When faithlessness is labeled faith and faith is called condemnation. I'm not sure you'll understand.

Jesus reprimanded the disciples for the lack of faith that is being help up as faithfulness in this "smarter than God" Christianity.

 

[Strong in Him]

There is the difference between our beliefs.

Are you saying God God always wants to heal everyone - either instantaneously or gradually??
But if he did, then he would.
And people like David Watson, who had hundreds of people praying for him, would have been made well. While Joni would not be in a wheelchair.

BTW thank you for being so patient with me and your well thought out replies.

Ditto. Thank you for being patient with me.
Having been told, more than once, by Christians that I would not be healed because I had no faith, and heard stories of others who've been told the same, I tend to get rather passionate about this subject.

I believe Salvation is the most important thing. Salvation was bought and paid for by Jesus Christ through His death, burial and resurrection.

Absolutely.

I believe it is God's will that all mankind would repent and come into Salvation - that is God's will on the earth - yet many will not.

It's his desire that all should be saved, certainly, 2 Peter 3:9.
But right from the beginning he gave us a choice. He did not force Adam to eat the fruit, and he did not
fence off the tree so it was physically impossible to get to it. Having chosen to allow us to choose, he is not going to force salvation on anyone.

The only issue is; has a person deliberately and freely rejected God? Or are they rejecting the church, or the ideas that they have picked up about him - eg "if you become a Christian you'll have to give up everything that you enjoy."
I fully believe that only God may know whether a person has deliberately, repeatedly and knowingly rejected him.

I believe that it is God's will that we, as His children, live righteous and holy lives - yet some do not.

I believe that it is God's will that we live in peace - yet some do not.

No, they don't; because sin is still in the world and we are not perfect.

So, keeping with the topic of healing - is there any instance in Scripture showing that the will of God was shown to heal people and they did not get healed?

Yes.

Luke 5:17 Now it happened on a certain day, as He was teaching, that there were Pharisees and teachers of the law sitting by, who had come out of every town of Galilee, Judea, and Jerusalem. And the power of the Lord was present to heal them.
​

Here is a house filled with people, the Word plainly states "the power of the Lord was present to heal them". The will of God was that they would be healed (that is why God's power was there), Jesus filled with the Holy Spirit was there and in fact healed a man right in the middle of them. Yet, not one of them was healed.

Forgive me, but that sounds as though you're leading up to saying that they did not get healed because they didn't have enough faith.
Firstly, healing is from God, about God and so that his glory may be seen. God has the power, not us; and that power is not limited by our faith.
Secondly, that is not true in the cases of David Watson, Joni, Jennifer Rees-Larcombe and many others - nor in my own case.
David had hundreds of people praying for him, from all over the world.
Joni told the doctors that God would heal her so she could walk again.
And I had faith that God would heal me. The only difference was that I knew it would be in his own time and own way.
I am certain that when I was told, on these forums, "you do not have faith", people meant "faith in WOF teachings." Which is not at all the same thing.

 

[Strong in Him]

When faithlessness is labeled faith and faith is called condemnation.

It depends on what you mean by faith.
Someone might pray, "Lord I ask for healing, I know you want me to be healed physically and that you will do as I ask", and tries hard to believe that that prayer will be answered.
That's not faith.
That's telling God what you want to happen and trying hard to believe that it will.

Faith is Job saying, "though he forsake me, I will trust him."
Or Shadrach, Meshack and Abednego saying, "Our God is able to rescue us - but if not ...."
Or Habakkuk saying "though there be no fruit on the vines - yet I will praise God." Habakkuk 3:17.
Or Peter, Paul and the others being thrown into prison, yet continuing to trust God.
Faith is people being given prophecies, none of them seeing them fulfilled or receiving what they were promised, but trusting anyway, Hebrew 11:39.

Jesus reprimanded the disciples for the lack of faith that is being help up as faithfulness in this "smarter than God" Christianity.

Yes, and God knows our hearts, so he knows whether a person has faith and if so, how much.

 

[ARBITER01]

I guess when there is no gifts of healings ministries active in the body, people must seek out GOD's mercy for healing.

The grace method is GOD operating through a person, just like The Father did through Jesus. His example is ours to follow.

 

[Scott Lary]

...
Is there scriptural support for the idea that we cannot be healed of some conditions?

Like, are there limits to what we can and cannot be healed of?

What is our response to people who genuinely ask for healing but do not receive it?

In my opinion, John 14:12 points towards the answer to your question:

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.”

So to accept "limits" would be to imply Jesus had limits. Perhaps asking for healing isn't the right way to think about it. Maybe deliverance from the issue is a better way to look at it. Jesus wasn't taken down from the cross and "healed," he was delivered from death.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Forgive me, but that sounds as though you're leading up to saying that they did not get healed because they didn't have enough faith.

Have I said anything outside scripture?

Did I say why I thought they were not healed, or just pointed out that they weren’t even though it was clearly Gods will to heal them.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Are you saying God God always wants to heal everyone - either instantaneously or gradually??
But if he did, then he would.

Yes, I am.

Does God want everyone saved?

if He does, why isn’t everyone saved?

Remember what we call the Lord’s Prayer.

You will be done on earth as it is in heaven.

Are there sick in heaven?

 

[jiminpa]

It depends on what you mean by faith.
Someone might pray, "Lord I ask for healing, I know you want me to be healed physically and that you will do as I ask", and tries hard to believe that that prayer will be answered.
That's not faith.
That's telling God what you want to happen and trying hard to believe that it will.

Faith is Job saying, "though he forsake me, I will trust him."
Or Shadrach, Meshack and Abednego saying, "Our God is able to rescue us - but if not ...."
Or Habakkuk saying "though there be no fruit on the vines - yet I will praise God." Habakkuk 3:17.
Or Peter, Paul and the others being thrown into prison, yet continuing to trust God.
Faith is people being given prophecies, none of them seeing them fulfilled or receiving what they were promised, but trusting anyway, Hebrew 11:39.



Yes, and God knows our hearts, so he knows whether a person has faith and if so, how much.

God reprimanded Job.

None of those other things were illness.

I'm tired of walking on eggshells to be polite. What is so wrong with showing the same compassion that Jesus showed and identify the same problems that Jesus did? The only times Jesus wasn't able to minister miraculously was due to unbelief. The disciples weren't able to heal due to unbelief. That's it. Jesus often said, "your faith has made you well." It's not compassion to tell someone mired in sickness and unbelief that it must just be God's will for them to live and die in pain.

I have physical issues myself. The Bible says God heals those things. I have my doubts that God is good to me. That is sin to be repented of, and I'm working on that.

 

[mourningdove~]

It depends on what you mean by faith.
Someone might pray, "Lord I ask for healing, I know you want me to be healed physically and that you will do as I ask", and tries hard to believe that that prayer will be answered.
That's not faith.
That's telling God what you want to happen and trying hard to believe that it will.

Yep

Yes, and God knows our hearts, so he knows whether a person has faith and if so, how much.

Yep

 

[Strong in Him]

I'm tired of walking on eggshells to be polite. What is so wrong with showing the same compassion that Jesus showed

Nothing at all; that is what we should do.

The only times Jesus wasn't able to minister miraculously was due to unbelief.

But that doesn't mean that is still true today.
How is saying, "you haven't been healed because you haven't got enough faith", showing compassion?
People in Jesus' day could see him and they didn't believe.
We can't see him - yet we trust in him, have received him as our Saviour, read his word, believe he answers our prayers and so on. Those who go forward for prayer at healing services believe - as do the people who pray for them.

Yet, not everyone is physically healed.

It's not compassion to tell someone mired in sickness and unbelief that it must just be God's will for them to live and die in pain.

I don't know of anyone who does that.
Certainly of no one who uses those words; why would they?

I have physical issues myself.

Me too.

The Bible says God heals those things.

The Bible says that God heals. The timing and method are down to him.
It is still a fact that Christians die from cancer, heart problems, in car accidents etc.

I have my doubts that God is good to me.

I used to think that the way for God to show his love for me was by removing my physical illnesses.
He didn't do that, when I was a teenager, so I concluded he didn't love me.
I was so wrong. The cross shows God's love for me. 1 John 3:16, "THIS is how we know what love is; Jesus gave his life for us.""

 

[Strong in Him]

Yes, I am.

Does God want everyone saved?

if He does, why isn’t everyone saved?

Because he has given us the ability to choose.
Jesus said, "come to me ...", "follow me" - not, "I have done all this for you and you will follow me whether you like it or not."
It's the same with any relationship. It's a two way thing; it cannot exist, or develop, unless both/all people want it to.

 

[Strong in Him]

Have I said anything outside scripture?

Did I say why I thought they were not healed, or just pointed out that they weren’t even though it was clearly Gods will to heal them.

Like I said to Jim, I don't believe it's the same today.
They were standing right in front of Jesus, yet they didn't believe. Maybe they didn't even accept that he was who he said that he was.
Today, we Christians cannot see Jesus; yet we do believe, have put our faith in him and have a relationship with him.
We have faith that when we pray, he listens and will answer that prayer. If someone goes forward for healing at a service of healing, there is not only their faith, but that of those who are praying.
I don't feel that any of us has the right to say that another person does not have enough faith - only God knows that.

It is not faith to say, "You WILL heal me, physically, right now; I'm telling you that this is your will for me."
It shows more faith to say, "I will still believe, rejoice and trust in God even though I cannot see what he is doing. I believe God will heal, even if it takes several years."

 

[SavedByGrace3]

I believe everything is included in the atonement, including healing and health.
If you pray in the name of Jesus, you receive because of what Jesus did in the atonement. What other way is there to receive from God? All the promises, those that benefit us, we receive in His suffering, death, burial, resurrection, and enthronement in heaven with the Father.

 

[Guojing]

Nothing at all; that is what we should do.



But that doesn't mean that is still true today.
How is saying, "you haven't been healed because you haven't got enough faith", showing compassion?
People in Jesus' day could see him and they didn't believe.
We can't see him - yet we trust in him, have received him as our Saviour, read his word, believe he answers our prayers and so on. Those who go forward for prayer at healing services believe - as do the people who pray for them.

Yet, not everyone is physically healed.



I don't know of anyone who does that.
Certainly of no one who uses those words; why would they?


Me too.



The Bible says that God heals. The timing and method are down to him.
It is still a fact that Christians die from cancer, heart problems, in car accidents etc.



I used to think that the way for God to show his love for me was by removing my physical illnesses.
He didn't do that, when I was a teenager, so I concluded he didn't love me.
I was so wrong. The cross shows God's love for me. 1 John 3:16, "THIS is how we know what love is; Jesus gave his life for us.""

Not rightly dividing the word of truth lead to all these misunderstandings of why Jesus healed so much in his first coming to Israel.

Everyone just assumed that the main reason he healed was because he was being kind and compassionate.

 

[spiritfilledjm]

How has this post gone on this long? If the question is regarding a limitation of God's power, the answer is always no, because there is no limit to God's power and what He can do.

 

[Strong in Him]

I believe everything is included in the atonement, including healing and health.
If you pray in the name of Jesus, you receive because of what Jesus did in the atonement. What other way is there to receive from God? All the promises, those that benefit us, we receive in His suffering, death, burial, resurrection, and enthronement in heaven with the Father.

But the problem is that thousands of Christians believe in the cross, pray in Jesus' name and are not physically healed.
If it was absolutely guaranteed, everyone would receive it; first time every time.

 

[Always in His Presence]

But the problem is that thousands of Christians believe in the cross, pray in Jesus' name and are not physically healed.
If it was absolutely guaranteed, everyone would receive it; first time every time.

You keep repeating that -

But it did not happen in scripture with Jesus' own ministry as shown in Luke 5 -

The will of God was that they would be healed
The power of God was there specifically to heal them
Jesus was there and healed a man in front of them

Not one of them got healed -

The blind man did not receive his healing first time.

Salvation is also absolutely guaranteed - yet a person's personal beliefs can prevent it.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

But the problem is that thousands of Christians believe in the cross, pray in Jesus' name and are not physically healed.
If it was absolutely guaranteed, everyone would receive it; first time every time.

The receiving is not as important as the believing. The last part of Hebrews 11 is about people who believed for something and never received it... and yet it was counted to them as righteousness. The worst thing we can do is believe the word and then deny it because of what may or may not happen. IOWs, they judge the word of God by their own experience. They count their own faith as true and the word of God as false. "I did not fail; God's word must not be true."
See it all the time.
We hold fast to the profession of our faith, regardless of what may or may not happen. It is God and His word that are faithful... not us.

 

[ARBITER01]

How has this post gone on this long? If the question is regarding a limitation of God's power, the answer is always no, because there is no limit to God's power and what He can do.

I don't think that is really the question though.

It seems people are questioning how GOD manifests His power from eternity into time down here. It's sort of a battle between The Holy Spirit's teachings and man's teachings, the tree of life and the knowledge of good and evil, meat and milk,... etc.

 

[Strong in Him]

You keep repeating that -

But it did not happen in scripture with Jesus' own ministry as shown in Luke 5 -

The will of God was that they would be healed
The power of God was there specifically to heal them
Jesus was there and healed a man in front of them

Not one of them got healed -

The blind man did not receive his healing first time.

Salvation is also absolutely guaranteed - yet a person's personal beliefs can prevent it.

Ok then; scrap the "first time, every time." It would happen.
I would have been healed of M.E the first time I prayed. And if I did not have "enough faith", I would have been healed when members of various healing teams prayed for me.
But God knew what he was doing. He healed in his time, not ours.

And David Watson would have been healed with the 100s of people praying for him.
Yes, he was released from pain, sickness and became whole. But he was not physically healed and restored to his family.