Anyone up for a chat thread?

[RileyG]

That's a matter of diocesan policy, and would vary greatly. In most dioceses, more wealthy parishes would pay a higher proportion, and struggling parishes would pay less, or perhaps even receive support.

It also depends on how big a diocese is (as in, how many parishes); how wealthy in terms of land holdings and endowments; and so on.

Ah, that makes sense.

 

[Paidiske]

Oh, I've done it this week.

There are two elderly ladies - sisters-in-law with the same surname - who both have connections in the parish, despite neither worshipping here in recent years. I got a phone call early Tuesday morning (like, I was still in my pyjamas and clearly hadn't had enough caffeine yet, early), from the daughter of one lady to tell me she'd died, and begin discussions of a funeral.

I don't know whether I misheard, or wasn't quite awake yet, or what quite happened in my brain, but I was firmly convinced, and yesterday in church I announced, that the wrong sister-in-law had died. Cue much confusion and consternation.

Now the lady who is alive, (but whose death I announced) is upset with me for upsetting all her friends and setting the gossip network on fire. The children of the lady who died are upset (very understandably) because their mother's death has turned into a circus of "Oh, isn't it a relief that [sister-in-law] isn't really dead!" rather than "Condolences on the loss of your mother." And my parishioners are, in their well-meaning attempts to make sure everyone is thoroughly informed about who is and isn't dead, only making things worse.

It's one of those days where I think, "If they were making a sitcom, they'd get a whole episode out of this."

 

[Deegie]

Oh my goodness. I'm so sorry. That's one of my literal nightmare scenarios! The other one is similar: asking a parishioner how so-and-so is doing (e.g. a spouse, parent, etc.) and then having to be reminded that they'd died a while ago.

 

[The Liturgist]

Oh, I've done it this week.

There are two elderly ladies - sisters-in-law with the same surname - who both have connections in the parish, despite neither worshipping here in recent years. I got a phone call early Tuesday morning (like, I was still in my pyjamas and clearly hadn't had enough caffeine yet, early), from the daughter of one lady to tell me she'd died, and begin discussions of a funeral.

I don't know whether I misheard, or wasn't quite awake yet, or what quite happened in my brain, but I was firmly convinced, and yesterday in church I announced, that the wrong sister-in-law had died. Cue much confusion and consternation.

Now the lady who is alive, (but whose death I announced) is upset with me for upsetting all her friends and setting the gossip network on fire. The children of the lady who died are upset (very understandably) because their mother's death has turned into a circus of "Oh, isn't it a relief that [sister-in-law] isn't really dead!" rather than "Condolences on the loss of your mother." And my parishioners are, in their well-meaning attempts to make sure everyone is thoroughly informed about who is and isn't dead, only making things worse.

It's one of those days where I think, "If they were making a sitcom, they'd get a whole episode out of this."

That was an honest mistake and I’m very sorry you experienced that.

 

[RamiC]

I have three churches, and two of them are quite old (in Australian terms). The more recent is about fifty years old.

But in Australia, even fifty years ago, I think air conditioning was seen as something of a luxury. (In fact, I don't think any church I've worked in has had air conditioning). And when you have churches which are anxious about spending any money, it's easy to decide that you can get by with opening the windows or turning on a fan for an hour.

It is more enovironmentally friendly to go without AC, but more risky in terms of sanity.

 

[RamiC]

It's one of those days where I think, "If they were making a sitcom, they'd get a whole episode out of this."

Praying for you...you are a human being, we all make mistakes.

 

[RileyG]

Oh, I've done it this week.

There are two elderly ladies - sisters-in-law with the same surname - who both have connections in the parish, despite neither worshipping here in recent years. I got a phone call early Tuesday morning (like, I was still in my pyjamas and clearly hadn't had enough caffeine yet, early), from the daughter of one lady to tell me she'd died, and begin discussions of a funeral.

I don't know whether I misheard, or wasn't quite awake yet, or what quite happened in my brain, but I was firmly convinced, and yesterday in church I announced, that the wrong sister-in-law had died. Cue much confusion and consternation.

Now the lady who is alive, (but whose death I announced) is upset with me for upsetting all her friends and setting the gossip network on fire. The children of the lady who died are upset (very understandably) because their mother's death has turned into a circus of "Oh, isn't it a relief that [sister-in-law] isn't really dead!" rather than "Condolences on the loss of your mother." And my parishioners are, in their well-meaning attempts to make sure everyone is thoroughly informed about who is and isn't dead, only making things worse.

It's one of those days where I think, "If they were making a sitcom, they'd get a whole episode out of this."

God bless you.

 

[Shane R]

I was both honoured and relieved recently. One of the Lutheran deans who books me has a multi-site parish that is preparing to call an interim pastor. Without really consulting me about how I felt about the project, he told them, "You know, the Anglican priest is the best one I've got on the roster." They really wanted the seminarian who is even younger than me but he is off to Texas for a year to do that unusual American Lutheran internship that is called 'vicarage.' They did not want me, and frankly I did not want them.

I don't know, or really care, who they picked but they cancelled my last booking which was the last Sunday of this month. The Dean was explaining all of this to me and he told me he is going to instruct them to pay me anyway. I expect they'll leave out the mileage and only pay me for the services I was supposed to do because these people are incredibly cheap but whatever. Anything is good.

 

[RileyG]

I was both honoured and relieved recently. One of the Lutheran deans who books me has a multi-site parish that is preparing to call an interim pastor. Without really consulting me about how I felt about the project, he told them, "You know, the Anglican priest is the best one I've got on the roster." They really wanted the seminarian who is even younger than me but he is off to Texas for a year to do that unusual American Lutheran internship that is called 'vicarage.' They did not want me, and frankly I did not want them.

I don't know, or really care, who they picked but they cancelled my last booking which was the last Sunday of this month. The Dean was explaining all of this to me and he told me he is going to instruct them to pay me anyway. I expect they'll leave out the mileage and only pay me for the services I was supposed to do because these people are incredibly cheap but whatever. Anything is good.

God bless you. Hope you have a wonderful Holy Week.

 

[Deegie]

I was both honoured and relieved recently. One of the Lutheran deans who books me has a multi-site parish that is preparing to call an interim pastor. Without really consulting me about how I felt about the project, he told them, "You know, the Anglican priest is the best one I've got on the roster." They really wanted the seminarian who is even younger than me but he is off to Texas for a year to do that unusual American Lutheran internship that is called 'vicarage.' They did not want me, and frankly I did not want them.

I don't know, or really care, who they picked but they cancelled my last booking which was the last Sunday of this month. The Dean was explaining all of this to me and he told me he is going to instruct them to pay me anyway. I expect they'll leave out the mileage and only pay me for the services I was supposed to do because these people are incredibly cheap but whatever. Anything is good.

I expect you're right about the mileage. But at least the dean's remarks are flattering!

Are you mostly doing supply work just now or is that on top of a settled position with a congregation?

 

[Shane R]

I expect you're right about the mileage. But at least the dean's remarks are flattering!

Are you mostly doing supply work just now or is that on top of a settled position with a congregation?

I do all supply. Mostly for Lutherans. I do some catechism and Bible study and sometimes Evening Prayer in my home chapel. The local Orthodox priest referred some of his folk to me for Saturday Vespers purposes, hence the Evening Prayer. And I recently got connected to the local homeschool co-op through the jiu jitsue studio my daughter attends. They are starting to use me as their religion teacher. I find many ways to be useful, which is what the bishop asked of me when the mission I was leading was shut down, but do few Anglican services.

 

[The Liturgist]

Thanks to your prayers and the prayers of my other friends my health recovered and I was able to, for the first time this Lent, attend a presanctified liturgy at an Orthodox convent which I had not visited. It is the last monastery in the area - there used to be an Anglican monastery of the Benedictine Order of the Holy Cross, which I greatly admire, which was destroyed in a wildfire, and which moved into an Anglican convent in Santa Barbara, but due to poor health of the monks it was closed in 2021. I would love to see it reopened and perhaps with the increase in conversions, if it generates an increase in vocations, which I hope it does, that might happen.

 

[The Liturgist]

I do all supply. Mostly for Lutherans. I do some catechism and Bible study and sometimes Evening Prayer in my home chapel. The local Orthodox priest referred some of his folk to me for Saturday Vespers purposes, hence the Evening Prayer. And I recently got connected to the local homeschool co-op through the jiu jitsue studio my daughter attends. They are starting to use me as their religion teacher. I find many ways to be useful, which is what the bishop asked of me when the mission I was leading was shut down, but do few Anglican services.

I really admire everything you are doing, and pray you get to do more Anglican services.

 

[Shane R]

I really admire everything you are doing, and pray you get to do more Anglican services.

I recently learned there is an ACNA chap trying to launch a mission one county over from me. I've been trying to get in touch with this bloke and he won't return an email nor a phone call. He's a military chaplain though and I think I know where he works during the day. I still have a military ID and can get on a base. I might just drop in on him and make him acknowledge me. Whether we hit it off or not is another matter.

 

[Deegie]

I do all supply. Mostly for Lutherans. I do some catechism and Bible study and sometimes Evening Prayer in my home chapel. The local Orthodox priest referred some of his folk to me for Saturday Vespers purposes, hence the Evening Prayer. And I recently got connected to the local homeschool co-op through the jiu jitsue studio my daughter attends. They are starting to use me as their religion teacher. I find many ways to be useful, which is what the bishop asked of me when the mission I was leading was shut down, but do few Anglican services.

There's something that feels really refreshing with this idea of Christianity not yoked to an institution. I'll be praying for your ministry today.

 

[The Liturgist]

There's something that feels really refreshing with this idea of Christianity not yoked to an institution. I'll be praying for your ministry today.

As will I, fervently.
By the way once I finish my current project, a Paschalion revision for an Oriental Orthodox jurisdiction, I am really looking forward to having an in-depth discussion with you about Eucharistic Prayers. I have one book in my library I think you might really enjoy, which is specifically about the history of the Epiclesis, called The Eucharistic Epiclesis, by John H. McKenna, CM. Another work I reccommend, edited by Paul F. Bradshaw who we both admire, is Essays on Early Eastern Eucharistic Prayers, which includes some thrilling work on the Divine Liturgy of St. Basil and the Divine Liturgy of St. James. His colleague Maxwell Johnson did another book I really like, Issues in Eucharistic Praying, East and West. These are both anthologies by up and coming liturgiologists, and where I feel bradshaw and Johnson are at their best is as editors and compilers of liturgiological anthologies.

 

[Shane R]

There's something that feels really refreshing with this idea of Christianity not yoked to an institution. I'll be praying for your ministry today.

One of my best friends in the area was raised Eastern Catholic. In his 20s he fell into the Charismatic movement and eventually went to a Rhema ministry school and was ordained by that Pentecostal church. He appreciates liturgy though. He mostly does Methodist services. We are the two oddballs working outside our normal boundaries. We go to eat together and have great conversations.

 

[Deegie]

As will I, fervently.
By the way once I finish my current project, a Paschalion revision for an Oriental Orthodox jurisdiction, I am really looking forward to having an in-depth discussion with you about Eucharistic Prayers. I have one book in my library I think you might really enjoy, which is specifically about the history of the Epiclesis, called The Eucharistic Epiclesis, by John H. McKenna, CM. Another work I reccommend, edited by Paul F. Bradshaw who we both admire, is Essays on Early Eastern Eucharistic Prayers, which includes some thrilling work on the Divine Liturgy of St. Basil and the Divine Liturgy of St. James. His colleague Maxwell Johnson did another book I really like, Issues in Eucharistic Praying, East and West. These are both anthologies by up and coming liturgiologists, and where I feel bradshaw and Johnson are at their best is as editors and compilers of liturgiological anthologies.

Thanks for the suggestions. I have two of the three in my library. I don't know the McKenna book but I have a bit of a weird fascination with epicleses, so I'll have to check it out. BTW, Johnson edited a relatively new follow-up called Further Issues in Eucharistic Praying in East and West. It was very expensive when it was released but I see the price has come down now, so I may have to pick it up.

 

[The Liturgist]

I don't know the McKenna book but I have a bit of a weird fascination with epicleses, so I'll have to check it out

Me too. I love the epiclesis and what it represents. My main frustration with Lutheran liturgics is they have a tendency to omit them, even though the presence of an epiclesis need not contradict their belief that the words of institution are consecratory.

I believe I shared with you the unusual belief of Theodore of Mopsuestia concerning the epiclesis and what it does.

BTW, Johnson edited a relatively new follow-up called Further Issues in Eucharistic Praying in East and West. It was very expensive when it was released but I see the price has come down now, so I may have to pick it up.

Definitely.

 

[Paidiske]

he told them, "You know, the Anglican priest is the best one I've got on the roster."

That's the bit to hold onto, out of that story!

We are the two oddballs working outside our normal boundaries. We go to eat together and have great conversations.

When I did CPE, (in my last year before ordination), there was a Zen monk in the group. Through a convoluted set of circumstances, he was the only Zen monk in our city, so without a community. We became very good friends, and when I was a curate and he became a hospital chaplain right near the parish, we used to often go and have lunch together. We were very much the odd couple, me in my collar and he in his robes!

Just back home today from Hawaii, by the way. It was lovely, but I think I've decided it's too far to be worth the travel unless you stay quite a long amount of time. For only a few days, I'd look for somewhere similar closer to home (Fiji, perhaps?) because twelve hours on the plane each way (with a brief stopover somewhere to break it up, but only enough to make you dash from one terminal to another) is just punishing (and then we lost the first day, really, because it had been an overnight flight and none of us had slept...)