Absolute proof.. can't deny.. the earth is flat

[d taylor]

The same as to FE adherents who have not accepted Christ. "Science" has enabled you to contribute to this forum, even though your contribution is to the pointless debate over the shape of the earth. Science is neither good nor evil in itself. It's what is done with science that is the issue. FE has nothing to do with science, so that point is moot. 2+2=4. The earth is a globe. Get over it.

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Noting about accepting, not a single verse in The Bible states accepting Christ gives a person God's free gift of Eternal Life. The Bible plainly states to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life a person must believe in Jesus.

 

[Aussie Pete]

But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God

You do not believe that "receive" and "accept" are the same thing? OK Mr Semantic, receiving Christ is salvation. No one can receive Christ without believing but many believe without receiving. And in any case, baptism is not stated as a condition.

 

[d taylor]

But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God

You do not believe that "receive" and "accept" are the same thing? OK Mr Semantic, receiving Christ is salvation. No one can receive Christ without believing but many believe without receiving. And in any case, baptism is not stated as a condition.

Look at the verse you posted the verse plainly states, to those who believed in His name. What does that mean people who believed that Jesus is who He said He is, The promised Messiah/Son of God, the resurrection and the life. They are given the right to become children of God, that is they are born again.

 

[d taylor]

But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God

You do not believe that "receive" and "accept" are the same thing? OK Mr Semantic, receiving Christ is salvation. No one can receive Christ without believing but many believe without receiving. And in any case, baptism is not stated as a condition.

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My point in addressing the language in your post of using the word accept, is a comparison. Just as using the word accept is a modern idea injected into telling people about salvation. Instead of using The Bible's language of believe/belief in Jesus for salvation.

Injecting the idea that God's creation is a globe earth floating in an outer space, is also foreign to the creation account and descriptive verses in The Bible about God's creation. That is not supported by just one mistranslated verse Job 26:7. Which when translated the way it has been translated, has absolutely no supporting Biblical verses.

 

[prodromos]

Injecting the idea that God's creation is a globe earth floating in an outer space, is also foreign to the creation account and descriptive verses in The Bible about God's creation.

The creation account is described in terms which would have been readily accepted by the people in the time it was recorded. The Genesis account has a cultural and historical context which no longer exists today. It has a great deal in common with many of the pagan creation myths and as I've pointed out before, severely limits the ability of God if you continue to interpret the Genesis account literally.
A literal interpretation posits a limited God who basically creates nothing more than a giant snow globe. A poetic interpretation is free to recognise the almost infinite majesty of creation by an infinite and all powerful God.
I'm going with an all powerful God who deigns to meet His creation at their level, whether that be His becoming man or His revealing things in a manner that the time and culture is able to accept. We know that the creation account is not literal because everything we observe runs counter to that. We know there is no dome because we have regularly sent craft deep into space. We know the moon orbits the earth because we have successfully sent craft there. We know the earth orbits the sun because we have placed spacecraft in the Lagrange points where the gravitational and centripetal forces cancel out, such as the Deep Space Climate Observatory and the James Webb Space Telescope.
All the things we observe are explained by the globe earth and its orbit around the sun. The seasons, the 24hr sunlight in the Antarctic Summer, the Coriolis Effect, the tides, the rotation of the night sky and the different stars visible in the Northern and Southern Hemispheres, solar and lunar eclipses, sunrise and sunset, ships disappearing over the horizon from the bottom up. All the above can be explained by the one model, while flat earthers cannot produce a single model which can explain all those different things. Rather they have one model to explain one thing and another model to explain another thing, but the different models conflict. Also, when people have written simulations based on flat earth claims, then nothing matches what we actually observe.
All flat earth claims are based on a deeply flawed understanding of Genesis.

 

[d taylor]

The creation account is described in terms which would have been readily accepted by the people in the time it was recorded. The Genesis account has a cultural and historical context which no longer exists today. It has a great deal in common with many of the pagan creation myths and as I've pointed out before, severely limits the ability of God if you continue to interpret the Genesis account literally.
A literal interpretation posits a limited God who basically creates nothing more than a giant snow globe. A poetic interpretation is free to recognise the almost infinite majesty of creation by an infinite and all powerful God.
I'm going with an all powerful God who deigns to meet His creation at their level, whether that be His becoming man or His revealing things in a manner that the time and culture is able to accept. We know that the creation account is not literal because everything we observe runs counter to that. We know there is no dome because we have regularly sent craft deep into space. We know the moon orbits the earth because we have successfully sent craft there. We know the earth orbits the sun because we have placed spacecraft in the Lagrange points where the gravitational and centripetal forces cancel out, such as the Deep Space Climate Observatory and the James Webb Space Telescope.
All the things we observe are explained by the globe earth and its orbit around the sun. The seasons, the 24hr sunlight in the Antarctic Summer, the Coriolis Effect, the tides, the rotation of the night sky and the different stars visible in the Northern and Southern Hemispheres, solar and lunar eclipses, sunrise and sunset, ships disappearing over the horizon from the bottom up. All the above can be explained by the one model, while flat earthers cannot produce a single model which can explain all those different things. Rather they have one model to explain one thing and another model to explain another thing, but the different models conflict. Also, when people have written simulations based on flat earth claims, then nothing matches what we actually observe.
All flat earth claims are based on a deeply flawed understanding of Genesis.

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No a limited God is one who creates a creation that man can figure out, explore and offer explanations to its origins outside of a Biblical account. One that allows for other pagan/secular theories on how this creation came about without a God creator (scientific atheist big bang, evolution, etc..). Which is what a globe earth allows and actually promotes and encourages.

A flat stationary earth can only be explained by a creator (God) and limits man and his understanding of this great God created creation. To only what the God creator wants sinful man to know at this point in time.

 

[d taylor]

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Funny how humanity has become more technological advanced, the further away it gets from The Biblical God. I am not including in this, actual born again children of God, who may be at a all time low. But just the average person who states they believe in The God of The Bible.

 

[prodromos]

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No a limited God is one who creates a creation that man can figure out, explore and offer explanations to its origins outside of a Biblical account. One that allows for other pagan/secular theories on how this creation came about without a God creator (scientific atheist big bang, evolution, etc..). Which is what a globe earth allows and actually promotes and encourages.

A flat stationary earth can only be explained by a creator (God) and limits man and his understanding of this great God created creation. To only what the God creator wants sinful man to know at this point in time.

LOL, no.
God is unfathomable. His creation is not.

 

[Bradskii]

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Which is what a globe earth allows...

And apparently allows me to fly to Santiago via L.A. quicker than I can fly directly to L.A.

I fly Tardis Air!

 

[Aussie Pete]

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My point in addressing the language in your post of using the word accept, is a comparison. Just as using the word accept is a modern idea injected into telling people about salvation. Instead of using The Bible's language of believe/belief in Jesus for salvation.

Injecting the idea that God's creation is a globe earth floating in an outer space, is also foreign to the creation account and descriptive verses in The Bible about God's creation. That is not supported by just one mistranslated verse Job 26:7. Which when translated the way it has been translated, has absolutely no supporting Biblical verses.

Whatever. The fact is that the earth is a rotating sphere, in space. Go stand by a river. Let me know when you see it clapping its hands. There is symbolism in God's word. FE people base an obviously false belief on symbolic statements.

John 1:12 says "receive", not just believe. I believed Jesus was a real person and that God was existed long before I was born again. There are many "believers" in hell. And I see no difference in meaning in accept or receive.

 

[d taylor]

Whatever. The fact is that the earth is a rotating sphere, in space. Go stand by a river. Let me know when you see it clapping its hands. There is symbolism in God's word. FE people base an obviously false belief on symbolic statements.

John 1:12 says "receive", not just believe. I believed Jesus was a real person and that God was existed long before I was born again. There are many "believers" in hell. And I see no difference in meaning in accept or receive.

You say There are many "believers" in hell.*

That statement* completely explains why you believe in a globe earth. With out a single example from The Bible of a believer being in hell, that does not stop you from formulating and believing this belief. Same way with a globe another belief you have formed, without Biblical support.

 

[Aussie Pete]

You say There are many "believers" in hell.*

That statement* completely explains why you believe in a globe earth. With out a single example from The Bible of a believer being in hell, that does not stop you from formulating and believing this belief. Same way with a globe another belief you have formed, without Biblical support.

How you get that from anything I've said? James says pretty much what I've said. Demons believe, they are not found in heaven. I have not formed a belief regarding the shape of the earth. The sky is blue. That is not a belief, it is a fact. Water is wet, that is a fact. The earth is a globe, that is a fact. My only question regarding the shape of the earth is how anyone could believe that it is flat.

 

[returntosender]

Does it really matter if it's flat or round?

 

[returntosender]

But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God

You do not believe that "receive" and "accept" are the same thing? OK Mr Semantic, receiving Christ is salvation. No one can receive Christ without believing but many believe without receiving. And in any case, baptism is not stated as a condition.

You can receive something and not accept it.

 

[d taylor]

How you get that from anything I've said? James says pretty much what I've said. Demons believe, they are not found in heaven. I have not formed a belief regarding the shape of the earth. The sky is blue. That is not a belief, it is a fact. Water is wet, that is a fact. The earth is a globe, that is a fact. My only question regarding the shape of the earth is how anyone could believe that it is flat.

Interesting how you equate demons, who are from the seed of satan, to humans who are from the seed of Adam. And tie their belief of God being one, to human belief in Jesus for God's free gift of Eternal Life. And from this you say believers are in hell.

How do you work a globe earth into God's promise to Hezekiah. Who stated as a sign that God would extend Hezekiah's life. God would have the shadow on the sundial return the ten steps it had gone down, where The Bible states So the sun returned ten degrees on the dial by which it had gone down.

From my observations you must view God as a very poor communicator as to His creation accounts in The Bible. So much so that you have to turn to pagan science for creation information.

 

[prodromos]

So the sun returned ten degrees on the dial by which it had gone down.

I don't understand why you think we don't believe God has complete control over His creation and is able to suspend the physical laws He has written into His creation.

 

[d taylor]

I don't understand why you think we don't believe God has complete control over His creation and is able to suspend the physical laws He has written into His creation.

Because you do not believe in The Biblical creation account given in The Bible. You believe in the creation account given by pagan science, that had to discovered and revealed by man.

 

[prodromos]

So much so that you have to turn to pagan science for creation information.

There is nothing pagan about science, since at its core it is the study of God's creation, and many of the founders of the various scientific disciplines were Christians

Then God blessed them, and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth"​

Science is part and parcel of God's command to "subdue the earth", so it does not belong to the pagans.

 

[prodromos]

Because you do not believe in The Biblical creation account given in The Bible.

We do, just not your hyper-literal interpretation of the same, because that would mean the Scriptures were false.

You believe in the creation account given by pagan science, that had to discovered and revealed by man.

Nope.

 

[d taylor]

There is nothing pagan about science, since at its core it is the study of God's creation, and many of the founders of the various scientific disciplines were Christians

Then God blessed them, and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth"​

Science is part and parcel of God's command to "subdue the earth", so it does not belong to the pagans.

The origins of the practice of science began in pagan societies, Egyptians, Greeks, etc,,