A question about Job.

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

Interesting.....i'm not familiar with the history of Job or his possible time-line...i have read that it is possible that he lived in the same era as Moses or any of the other patriarchs. It is an interesting study. Thank you for mentioning it.

SG9 · Jan 25, 2014

brinny said:
Yes, i began this thread, as i was venturing a study into this book, that i had seriously avoided because it was painful to read. As i post in this thread, i am, for the most part, "thinkin' out loud", so to speak, as i delve into this book.

Now in reference to the end of the book, let's see....in chapter 42:12-16 it says this:

"So the LORD blessed the latter end of Job more than his beginning: for he had fourteen thousand sheep, and six thousand camels, and a thousand yoke of oxen, and a thousand she asses. He had also seven sons and three daughters. And he called the name of the first, Jemima; and the name of the second, Kezia; and the name of the third, Kerenhappuch. And in all the land were no women found so fair as the daughters of Job: and their father gave them inheritance among their brethren. After this lived Job an hundred and forty years, and saw his sons, and his sons' sons, even four generations."

Looks like literal children to me and then their children and their children after them and so on.

There it is, the end of Job was not as the beginning, he became a different man when God flipped him upright in mind. The seven sons and three daughters is an image of the Cross, and the Law of the Ten Commandments in their proper order, that was written in Job. This is both literal and spiritual in definition's, and the natural mind cannot see the spiritual imagery in this until it's pointed out to them and they believe.

The scriptures then confirm what I said to be accurate. The first seven commands in the Cross are an image of Christ, as he is the seven in this imagery, and the last three commandments are an image of the three daughters, whom, in this picture are kneeling before Christ on the Cross.

The Cross is a parallel to the human body, and the first three commandments are parallel to the head on top of the shoulders. I've been emphasizing this phenomenon in many threads because it's the key to understanding how the Law is written in mankind, and must be upright in the man so to be in proper "order". When Job was flipped upside-down, he was then thinking with his ten toes instead, and this is the form of a gentile mindset.

Those sons and daughters are then parallel to them whom Job raised upright for the Lord, and they became of the same and one family of God, and as Job's dear family in God. This might too, suggest that he might have remarried but not to a worldly woman. Thanks

And, the "Four" generations are a parallel to the Four temples in the quantum-x of the mind, the Four Corners as I believe it was Peter who saw the four corners come down on him, also. This is a complex system of the spiritual anatomy of man, and is written in a didactic language that the natural mind cannot understand but I do pray that some will.

The daughters, who were found fair are the females who lived in the proper Order, and without equating themselves with men as we today have done by the women's liberation movement in 1848, just 4 years after the great disappointment in 1844; the man was the head of the woman in Job's latter family, and they then became joint heirs in God's Kingdom, just as the world will have to do soon because we are in the same situation as Job was then when he was upside-down.

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

SG9 said:
There it is, the end of Job was not as the beginning, he became a different man when God flipped him upright in mind. The seven sons and three daughters is an image of the Cross, and the Law of the Ten Commandments in their proper order, that was written in Job. This is both literal and spiritual in definition's, and the natural mind cannot see the spiritual imagery in this until it's pointed out to them and they believe.

The scriptures then confirm what I said to be accurate. The first seven commands in the Cross are an image of Christ, as he is the seven in this imagery, and the last three commandments are an image of the three daughters, whom, in this picture are kneeling before Christ on the Cross.

The Cross is a parallel to the human body, and the first three commandments are parallel to the head on top of the shoulders. I've been emphasizing this phenomenon in many threads because it's the key to understanding how the Law is written in mankind, and must be upright in the man so to be in proper "order". When Job was flipped upside-down, he was then thinking with his ten toes instead, and this is the form of a gentile mindset.

Those sons and daughters are then parallel to them whom Job raised upright for the Lord, and they became of the same and one family of God, and as Job's dear family in God. This might too, suggest that he might have remarried but not to a worldly woman. Thanks

Did all of these events begin and continue happening like a domino effect, to "teach" Job anything, and/or was Job in "error" and this is why these catastrophies came upon him?

Thank you kindly.

(i'll get back to Job literally having more children a little later)

SG9 · Jan 25, 2014

brinny said:
Did all of these events begin and continue happening like a domino effect, to "teach" Job anything, and/or was Job in "error" and this is why these catastrophies came upin him?

Thank you kindly.

(i'll get back to Job literally having more children later)

If I understand you correctly, it was God's way to flip Job upright. The man first had to lose his worldly possessions in order to be humbled before God, and it is this "humbling" that is the essence of the beginning of knowledge of God, and the proper fear for God. Today, the world doesn't fear God, nor do they know how. The world is full of exalted beings that must be humbled like Job in order to then be resurrected in Glory. Job was then obviously Glorified in Christ in order to be what he became in the end.

What appears to be only short time frames in scripture might be many years of Job's life written in a few sentences. Job had to learn much from God so that he may live abundantly and for God. It also seems to me that the animals represent also people whom Job saved for God, and to become joint heirs with him. In another image, Job was just like Christ as he too is a Son of Man. There are many Sons, and more than daughters in this picture. This proportion also is a parallel to the weight of man compared to the woman in the Yoke of the Law, which is a parallel to the horizontal beam of the Cross, that points east and to west. There's too much to write in this post so I'll rest it here.

I have edited my previous post so please re-read it for the part that I first overlooked, sorry. Thanks, again

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

SG9 said:
If I understand you correctly, it was God's way to flip Job upright. The man first had to lose his worldly possessions in order to be humbled before God, and it is this "humbling" that is the essence of the beginning of knowledge of God, and the proper fear for God. Today, the world doesn't fear God, nor do they know how. The world is full of exalted beings that must be humbled like Job in order to then be resurrected in Glory. Job was then obviously Glorified in Christ in order to be what he became in the end.

What appears to be only short time frames in scripture might be many years of Job's life written in a few sentences. Job had to learn much from God so that he may live abundantly and for God. It also seems to me that the animals represent also people whom Job saved for God, and to become joint heirs with him. In another image, Job was just like Christ as he too is a Son of Man. There are many Sons, and more than daughters in this picture. This proportion also is a parallel to the weight of man compared to the woman in the Yoke of the Law, which is a parallel to the horizontal beam of the Cross, that points east and to west. There's too much to write in this post so I'll rest it here.

I have edited my previous post so please re-read it for the part that I first overlooked, sorry. Thanks, again

How did God describe Job in Job 1:1?

MJohn7 · Jan 25, 2014

I agree with brinny, Job wasn't afflicted because was needing corrected more than others do. The apostles and early Christians were persecuted and killed. The world and satan hates Gods people, so they try to destroy them. But all things work for our good, regardless.

MJohn7 · Jan 25, 2014

And in Jobs day obtaining wealth was not even a factor, just as in Abraham's day. But we have something better than wealth, we have faith in Christ

Mt 13:16 But blessed are your eyes for they see, and your ears for they hear; 17 for assuredly, I say to you that many prophets and righteous men desired to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.

The Parable of the Sower Explained

18 “Therefore hear the parable of the sower: 19 When anyone hears the word of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received seed by the wayside. 20 But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles. 22 Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful. 23 But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

MJohn7 said:
I agree with brinny, Job wasn't afflicted because was needing corrected more than others do. The apostles and early Christians were persecuted and killed. The world and satan hates Gods people, so they try to destroy them. But all things work for our good, regardless.

Thank you. This reading of Job is intriguing to me....it is a blessing reading it now, and yes, persecution happens because Jesus reminds us that the world hated Him and therefore will hate those who are in the Body of Christ.

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

It was only after i listened to this very wise teaching of this 3rd chapter of the Book of Job that i understood why this quote fit.

“Oh, the comfort,
the inexpressible comfort
of feeling safe with a person;
having neither to weigh thoughts
nor measure words,
but to pour them all out,
just as they are,
chaff and grain together,
knowing that a faithful hand
will take and sift them,
keep what is worth keeping,
and then, with the breath of kindness,
blow the rest away.”
~George Eliot

Job chapter 3.

Wisdom for the Heart

SG9 · Jan 25, 2014

brinny said:
How did God describe Job in Job 1:1?

It reads like this:

Job 1
King James Version (KJV)
1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

2 And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters.

3 His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east.

4 And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them.

5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

It helps to include the rest of the story so that we can see that it says Job cursed God continually, or am I reading this wrong?

MJohn7 · Jan 25, 2014

SG9 said:
It reads like this:

Job 1
King James Version (KJV)
1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

2 And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters.

3 His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east.

4 And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them.

5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

It helps to include the rest of the story so that we can see that it says Job cursed God continually, or am I reading this wrong?

Job didnt curse God continually, instead he continually made burnt offerings, because of his children.

SG9 · Jan 25, 2014

MJohn7 said:
Job didnt curse God continually, instead he continually offered burnt offerings, according to the number of them all

That's not what it's saying, IMO. It appears that they did away with the feasts like we have, and the sons invited the daughters to eat with them, this is describing their violation of the Order of the law, they equated the women with themselves, the sons, and then it says that Job did continually.

If it were concerning the burnt offerings then, that statement would have come right after that passage but instead, it does not.

Job was flipped upside down by God and for his violations of the law, or else God would have no reason to do it. The world today is too, upside down and we are cursed just as Job was before being restored. God gave Job the treasures in the beginning but afterwards, and after being restored as a Son of God, he then became even more blessed with a greater multitude of believers like himself. Thanks

MJohn7 · Jan 25, 2014

SG9 said:
That's not what it's saying, IMO. It appears that they did away with the feasts like we have, and the sons invited the daughters to eat with them, this is describing their violation of the Order of the law, they equated the women with themselves, the sons, and then it says that Job did continually.

If it were concerning the burnt offerings then, that statement would have come right after that passage but instead, it does not.

Job was flipped upside down by God and for his violations of the law, or else God would have no reason to do it. The world today is too, upside down and we are cursed just as Job was before being restored. God gave Job the treasures in the beginning but afterwards, and after being restored as a Son of God, he then became even more blessed with a greater multitude of believers like himself. Thanks

I disagree. And you're welcome.

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

Originally Posted by brinny View Post
How did God describe Job in Job 1:1?

SG9 said:
It reads like this:

Job 1
King James Version (KJV)
1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

2 And there were born unto him seven sons and three daughters.

3 His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east.

4 And his sons went and feasted in their houses, every one his day; and sent and called for their three sisters to eat and to drink with them.

5 And it was so, when the days of their feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually.

It helps to include the rest of the story so that we can see that it says Job cursed God continually, or am I reading this wrong?

Read it again, brother. Read also a little further where it tells us how God describes Job again, and to whom God gives His description of Job.

Thank you kindly.

SG9 · Jan 25, 2014

brinny said:
Read it again, brother. Read also a little further where it tells us how God describes Job again, and to whom God gives His description of Job.

Thank you kindly.

If I'm out of order here then, why don't you spell it out so that others might know too? Let's hear your side of this, please? I have read it and I am not changing a single thing that I have written. Thanks

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

Originally Posted by brinny View Post
Read it again, brother. Read also a little further where it tells us how God describes Job again, and to whom God gives His description of Job.

Thank you kindly.

SG9 said:
If I'm out of order here then, why don't you spell it out so that others might know too? Let's hear your side of this, please? I have read it and I am not changing a single thing that I have written. Thanks

I'd rather delve into what the Bible says about this conversation God had about Job and to whom God had this conversation with. It would help me immensely referencing the Bible verses, since THIS is the key, right here in these verses to understanding the entire Book of Job.

Thank you kindly.

And no, you're not out of order. I appreciate all of our sharing about this most treasure of a Book, that i'm beginning to embrace more and more.

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

LittleLambofJesus said:
We can only speculate on that, as the story evolves around Job as a type/figure of Christ and Christians today and how we also will go thru test and trials in our walk with YAHWEH and our Lord and Savior, Jesus the Christ.

Kindgdom Bible Studies Job
JOB

*snip*

In one tragic day all Job's earthly wealth and glory had vanished as a mist before the rising sun.
But did Job curse God for all this calamity? Did he even curse the Devil? Was he a fair weather saint without spiritual understanding?
No, indeed! He rent his mantle, shaved his head, and falling upon the ground, he WORSHIPPED GOD with the unmistakable words of reverence, "Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: THE LORD GAVE, AND THE LORD HAS TAKEN AWAY; BLESSED BE THE NAME OF THE LORD!" (Job 1:22).

You see, beloved, all external evidence shouted aloud that God did not love Job, that God had forsaken him, that God did not see him, that God was not concerned about what happened to him, and that God wasn't just. It seemed that God had now revealed Himself to be the opposite of all Job had experienced and known of Him.

But, praise God! Job knew God! He therefore knew that in spite of all the apparent external evidence, in spite of how terrible and hopeless things appeared, God had not forsaken him, God did love him, God did see him, God was concerned about what happened to him, God was in control of everything, and God was just.

.

.

This hits on some key points to keep in mind when reading Job. They (what is mentioned above) are amongst the "keys" and "anchors" if you will, to staying grounded in the entire point of the Book of Job. Thank you for posting this.

A major "key", amongst others:

Job "knew" God.

TillICollapse · Jan 25, 2014

brinny said:
It was only after i listened to this very wise teaching of this 3rd chapter of the Book of Job that i understood why this quote fit.

Oh, the comfort,
the inexpressible comfort
of feeling safe with a person;
having neither to weigh thoughts
nor measure words,
but to pour them all out,
just as they are,
chaff and grain together,
knowing that a faithful hand
will take and sift them,
keep what is worth keeping,
and then, with the breath of kindness,
blow the rest away.
~George Eliot

What a profound quote.

I experienced this type of relationship with a person once, like that quote describes.

Interestingly enough, it was with a person who claimed to be an atheist ... and there was something about our relationship, the way it was fueled and sparked ... that I got to the point of where I believed that if this person were to go to "hell", or some place of suffering, that I would go with them and be with them there. Even if it meant trying to "trade places" so they could go free.

It was the first person I felt this way about, and in actuality, it was the first time I had ever considered what truly "standing in the gap" for someone meant. Previously, I had thought it meant being a "willing vessel" to be used by God. But now, it took on a different meaning ... the idea of standing with someone in hell, and trying to trade places with them ... brought a dimension to my faith I hadn't realized before. Offering yourself as a living sacrifice. I understand Paul's words about his anguish over the Israelites even, and how he wished he were cursed and cut off from Christ for the sake of his own people.

I suddenly saw a way to not just love this person, but others as well whom were under curses, and suffering, whose destination was "unknown" not just in possible afterlife, but THIS life etc. And so I basically did just that ... I began to sort of "trade places" with others.

It was there I saw the most beautiful aspect of Jesus yet, and actually, it was the first time I realized to what lengths love actually goes for someone ... as I saw past law for the FIRST time, and right into grace, and realized there was no place grace could not go

brinny · Jan 25, 2014

...as i read what you wrote, and before i got to the end of it, what materialized for me was the same word....."grace", inexplicable grace and what sheer depths this grace must reach....

what you wrote also reminded me of what i put on a t shirt once "There are no heroes in hell." This, is something i would want to go into depth about to dig into what i possibly would mean by such a quote.

You've added some inexplicably brilliant strokes to this tapestry of this beautiful Book of many layers.

Thank you.

TillICollapse · Jan 25, 2014

brinny said:
...as i read what you wrote, and before i got to the end of it, what materialized for me was the same word....."grace", inexplicable grace and what sheer depths this grace must reach....

Hmmm ..... that's awesome

what you wrote also reminded me of what i put on a t shirt once "There are no heroes in hell." This, is something i would want to go into depth about to dig into what i possibly would mean by such a quote.

That's also profound ... lots of depth there.

I don't think it's my place to necessarily speak TO it, but I would want to say one thing about it:

It's as though there are no heroes in hell, because heroes don't STAY there. If a hero goes there, they are not abandoned there And also, when a light shines in the darkness, it is no longer dark where that light is shining.

You've added some inexplicably brilliant strokes to this tapestry of this beautiful Book of many layers.

Thank you.

Thanks for your words

Also, I thought it added an angle to the idea of what Job was doing, and some of what he suffered, because we see him trying to stand in the gap for his own family continually. It's not an exact parallel, but there is something there.

Anyways, thanks again for your kind words and sharing that you kept seeing "grace"

A question about Job.

everlovin' shiner of light in dark places

SG9

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