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Featured 100% going to heaven vs sometimes doubtful of it. Who is the correct person?

Discussion in '"My Two Cents Worth"' started by NothingIsImpossible, May 3, 2019.

  1. GodsGrace101

    GodsGrace101 Well-Known Member Supporter

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  2. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Technically, of course, we will always sin, but as I always see these things, it's like the parent watching a child that is trying to do good, when they slip up with just a technical sin, the parent grins and thinks nothing of it. So, having a certain amount of understanding how this works, thus control that wasn't there at first, and as long as my sin is at a minimum, yes, I'm definitively more relaxed with things than when I first began.

    I suppose it's like a new job, once we finally settle in, we are much more secure than at first.
     
  3. bcbsr

    bcbsr Newbie

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    Your comment implies that you feel your salvation is contingent upon how perfect you are. That's kind of putting faith in yourself rather than in Christ. In contrast there are those who are confident of their fate because they don't put faith in themselves but rather in Christ who is trustworthy.

    Putting faith in yourself is along the lines of justification by law. It doesn't work because you are imperfect and as such you have reason to doubt. Furthermore it really doesn't work because it's not the gospel. Saving faith puts faith in Christ in not in oneself.

    "to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness." Rom 4:5

    "I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life." John 5:24
     
  4. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    2 Questions:

    Do we have to do good in order to get to heaven? And do you believe everything Jesus tells us is true?
     
  5. GodsGrace101

    GodsGrace101 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Romans 4:5 is speaking about works OF THE LAW.
    Paul is just saying that we're saved by grace through the instrument of faith.

    He is NOT saying that works are not necessary to remain saved.


    1. Galatians 6:9-10

      Let us not lose heart in doing good, for in due time we will reap if we do not grow weary. So then, while we have opportunity, let us do good to all people, and especially to those who are of the household of the faith.



      Luke 6:27-36

      "But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. "Whoever hits you on the cheek, offer him the other also; and whoever takes away your coat, do not withhold your shirt from him either.


      Psalm 34:12-16

      Who is the man who desires life And loves length of days that he may see good? Keep your tongue from evil And your lips from speaking deceit. Depart from evil and do good; Seek peace and pursue it.


      Hebrews 13:16

      And do not neglect doing good and sharing, for with such sacrifices God is pleased.


      John 5:28-29

      "Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.



      Luke 6:35

      "But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil men.




      Romans 2:5-11

      But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who WILL RENDER TO EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS: to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;




      1 Timothy 6:17-19

      Instruct those who are rich in this present world not to be conceited or to fix their hope on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly supplies us with all things to enjoy. Instruct them to do good, to be rich in good works, to be generous and ready to share, storing up for themselves the treasure of a good foundation for the future, so that they may take hold of that which is life indeed.


      James 2:14-21

      What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and be filled," and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that?


      James 3:13

      Who among you is wise and understanding? Let him show by his good behavior his deeds in the gentleness of wisdom.


      2 Corinthians 9:8

      And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that always having all sufficiency in everything, you may have an abundance for every good deed;


      Acts 9:36

      Now in Joppa there was a disciple named Tabitha (which translated in Greek is called Dorcas); this woman was abounding with deeds of kindness and charity which she continually did.


      Philippians 2:12-13

      So then, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your salvation with fear and trembling; for it is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure.


      Colossians 1:10-12

      so that you will walk in a manner worthy of the Lord, to please Him in all respects, bearing fruit in every good work and increasing in the knowledge of God; strengthened with all power, according to His glorious might, for the attaining of all steadfastness and patience; joyously giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light.

      Ephesians 2:10

      For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.


      And many more......

      1. Works are part of our salvation.





    John 5:24 is Jesus stating that whoever hears His word and BELIEVES him will have eternal life. Those who do NOT hear His words, will not be saved.

    Mathew 7:24-27
    24“Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.
    25“And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and yet it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock.
    26“Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
    27“The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell—and great was its fall.”
     
  6. PaulCyp1

    PaulCyp1 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If a person is truly following God's law and living according to His will, that person can be sure they are ready to go to Heaven at this time. But no-one can be certain of the future. Some who were faithful to God for a long time end up falling away later in life.
     
  7. NothingIsImpossible

    NothingIsImpossible Well-Known Member

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    Well the question wasn't meant as a salvation issues, it was meant to be which person is safer in their thoughts. Point being the first person is arrogant and "holier then thou" and thinks no matter what they do, they will go to heaven. Which while it may be true, it doesn't mean God won't knock you down and back into reality about your arrogance when you act better then others.

    Where as the second person knows they are going to heaven to, but in their strive to live as perfect as possible (in these bodies), they are normal and sometimes worry as most do during trials.

    Now granted if the second person constantly worries, then that can be an issue of course.
     
  8. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    No, we are on guard, and keeping our house in good order so we don't have to constantly worry, but if we do worry, it's merely an alarm to tell us something needs to change. "Worry", regardless of the situation that causes it, is something that always needs to be stopped in order to make ourselves comfortable, yet is serves a critical purpose.

    Only those who choose to think they don't have to worry about being obedient to God need to worry. They, in their minds don't have to worry about keeping their lamps full at all times because even though the bible says we must, they have convinced themselves otherwise. Why? Because they have to do something in order to keep their lamps full, and they don't want to do that, just that simple.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
  9. Peter J Barban

    Peter J Barban Well-Known Member

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    Basically, God wants the ones who are saved to be confident of their salvation, but he doesn't want unsaved ones to have such confidence.
     
  10. samwise gamgee

    samwise gamgee Member Supporter

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    It would depend on whether the person is actually going to Heaven. If a person is saved it is best that he know without a doubt that he is going to Heaven so he can focus on serving God and not be distracted by worries about his salvation. Unfortunately sometimes people make a profession of faith isn't real but they are convinced that they are saved. If they are convinced they are going to Heaven their conviction will keep them from actually experiencing salvation.

    The correct view is for each one to know the state of his soul and his relationship with God.
     
  11. SamsonXX

    SamsonXX New Member

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    I'm lost there and don't agree with it.


    I'm totally confused.
     
  12. SamsonXX

    SamsonXX New Member

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    Psalm 103:10-14

    I don't Fear God, I wish to serve Him.

    More than likely, that's My falling from Grace.
     
  13. SamsonXX

    SamsonXX New Member

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  14. SamsonXX

    SamsonXX New Member

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  15. GodsGrace101

    GodsGrace101 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    So am I.
    In catholicism absolution is being forgiven by a priest for sins confessed to him...
    In protestantism, I don't know.

    Maybe someone could advise us?
     
  16. samwise gamgee

    samwise gamgee Member Supporter

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    Only God can forgive our sins.
     
  17. GodsGrace101

    GodsGrace101 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Of course.
    But Absolution means something specific in the catholic faith...that's what I was explaining.
     
  18. KyleSpringer

    KyleSpringer Member

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    IMO, both accounts are dangerous, as one may lead to pride and the other, unbelief. I opt for neither, but I suppose if I had to choose, I’d rather be sure that I’m going to heaven. Here’s why.

    We were given a promise, and because of Jesus we indeed have reconciliation with God.

    Here’s the caveat.

    “Take up your cross and follow me.”

    Jesus lived the example of the verse “do not only be hearers of the word but doers also”. Our doing doesn’t validate our salvation but is our way of honoring and obeying God, but submitting to His authority, and that does not happen until the Holy Spirit has taken residence in your heart. Therefore, we must be transformed in order to have confidence of salvation.

    This is the “flight on eagles wings” of our spiritual walk, which can, and has, filled some with pride. Maybe people feel like their convictions are more pure or in line with biblical truths, thus they become Pharisaical in the way they view their performance of religious tradition and/or liberties. You know, those who never forget to tithe. I digress, there are down sides to both, if drawn away by the lust of the flesh, but God has a special place in his heart for those who know who he is and how his heart longs to have us to himself.

    So to sum up my thoughts, I think that Gods grace is sufficient for us to live our lives in a way that will not only please him, but will also give him Glory. I don’t see that being done in someone who will have a tendency to doubt, OR someone who has a tendency to prefer stature, that is unless they are transformed.

    Great question!
     
  19. usexpat97

    usexpat97 kewlness

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    You're either 100% sure or you're not.
     
  20. KyleSpringer

    KyleSpringer Member

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    The context in 2 Cor 6:2 is our God saying “you needed me and I came to you, now I want you, so come to me.” This is not saying that your future standing is uncertain, although we are commanded to work out our salvation with fear and trembling. Why is that?
     
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