A new form of Holocaust denial.

Volos said:

TopCat posted:

HELLO Volos, you said:

The idea worship of the Roman emperor is a peculiar notion. He clearly was a human and it seems self-evident that no one could actually have thought him a god. And in fact it seems reasonably clear that no one did imagine that he was a god. The Roman emperors were not personally worshiped rather the genius of the emperor was offered tribute. The genius is something like a guiding spirit. Your statement that the early Christians were persecuted because of their refusal offer tribute to Ceaser’s genius just doesn’t’ hold water. Several religious groups were exempt from honoring the genius of Ceaser including the Jews. Early Christians were considered a radical sect of Judaism and as such were also exempt from participating in the state religion of Rome.

Apparently christians and Jews at the time of Ceaser, and not long after the death of Christ 95AD - 115AD Ceaser required all to go to the temple and burn incense as an acknowledgement of his Godhood. Christians and Jews who did not do this were arrested and given the choice to deny and curse Christ and burn incense to Ceaser or die. This includes an old guy at 80 who was burned alive. It all happened within the context of John's letter to the church in Smyrna: 'Don't be afraid of what you are about to suffer. The devil will throw some of you into prison and put you to the test...'rev 2v10. Our minister gave us a really good history lesson around this letter. I can get the references for you on sunday. Jesus did not cosey up to the romans no matter how respected they were in the Jerusalem or elsewhere. Neither did he cosey up to the pharisees, who also were highly respected.

The Dali Lama has never claimed to be God. His Holiness the Dali Lama was recognised at the age of two, in accordance with Tibetan tradition, as the reincarnation of his predecessor the 13th Dalai Lama and thus an incarnation Avalokitesvara, the Buddha of Compassion. The Dalai Lamas are the manifestations of the Bodhisattva (Buddha) of Compassion, who chose to reincarnate to serve the people.

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It does not matter that the Dali Lama has never claimed to be God, the fact is he is seen as a God, an incarnation of the Buddha of compassion, a Buddha is a God, a statue made of Gold, brass, or wood. God does not tolerate any other God especially idols which do not move or speak, and christians do not tolerate them either. Doesn't mean we're going to go about killing a whole bunch of Budists.

Another poster commented that Lidner didn't know anything about Budhism, whether he does or not I have no idea, but I do know a Budhist and he told me all about it, it centres on yourself, your own goodness, and not hurting others and if you concentrate on your own goodness enough it seems you may reach nirvana(true enlightenment). All this may well be true, but it focusses on the self for spiritual salvation. This is definately against christianity which accepts that grace saves us so that no-one can boast(even within themselves)our focus is Jesus and he is the only way to salvation and intercessor to God. If you want to believe other than that then fine, but don't expect me to say its right. If Lidner wants to not attend a meeting that the Dali Lama will be at then fine, i'd worry more about folk who kill for their faith, not get slandered for it.

Top Cat

Top Cat said:

It does not matter that the Dali Lama has never claimed to be God, the fact is he is seen as a God, an incarnation of the Buddha of compassion, a Buddha is a God, a statue made of Gold, brass, or wood. God does not tolerate any other God especially idols which do not move or speak, and christians do not tolerate them either. Doesn't mean we're going to go about killing a whole bunch of Budists.

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You might not, but God could. He's killed some newborns before now, so why doesn't he do that now? Or maybe he thinks Lindner is as big a jerk as most other people.

Another poster commented that Lidner didn't know anything about Budhism, whether he does or not I have no idea

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What I find so utterly bizarre is that every other non-Christian religion seems to have no positive aspects to it whatsoever to some people. They are so blinded by their own faith, that there seems to be nothing wrong with their own, yet the lives they lead and the views they express clearly contradict that which is laid down by your book. Further, they seem to want to ignore those who are different because of what? Fear? Did Jesus avoid people because he feared them? Not according to the Bible. Yet men like Lindner show themselves to be closed-minded, narrow-thinking individuals who express nothing positive or good about themselves or their faith.

Top Cat said:

It does not matter that the Dali Lama has never claimed to be God, the fact is he is seen as a God, an incarnation of the Buddha of compassion, a Buddha is a God, a statue made of Gold, brass, or wood. God does not tolerate any other God especially idols which do not move or speak, and christians do not tolerate them either. Doesn't mean we're going to go about killing a whole bunch of Budists.

Another poster commented that Lidner didn't know anything about Budhism, whether he does or not I have no idea, but I do know a Budhist and he told me all about it, it centres on yourself, your own goodness, and not hurting others and if you concentrate on your own goodness enough it seems you may reach nirvana(true enlightenment). All this may well be true, but it focusses on the self for spiritual salvation. This is definately against christianity which accepts that grace saves us so that no-one can boast(even within themselves)our focus is Jesus and he is the only way to salvation and intercessor to God. If you want to believe other than that then fine, but don't expect me to say its right. If Lidner wants to not attend a meeting that the Dali Lama will be at then fine, i'd worry more about folk who kill for their faith, not get slandered for it.

Top Cat

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Namaste Top Cat,

thank you for the post.

this is incorrect. the Buddha was not a God, he was a regular man. it can be said, in a certain sense, that a metaphysical aspect has engendered itself into certain aspects of Buddhism but it would be incorrect to assert that is a fact of the practice.

by the by... Buddhists do not hold the concept of "salvation" in any form either personal or impersonal or transpersonal. "salvation" is being saved, and there is nothing, from the Buddhist position, that one need be saved from.. and more specifically, that one can be saved from.

if your Buddhist friend explained Buddhism in the manner in which you are describing it, please ask him to visit the Sangha again for a refresher.

vajradhara said:

Namaste Top Cat,

thank you for the post.

this is incorrect. the Buddha was not a God, he was a regular man. it can be said, in a certain sense, that a metaphysical aspect has engendered itself into certain aspects of Buddhism but it would be incorrect to assert that is a fact of the practice.

by the by... Buddhists do not hold the concept of "salvation" in any form either personal or impersonal or transpersonal. "salvation" is being saved, and there is nothing, from the Buddhist position, that one need be saved from.. and more specifically, that one can be saved from.

if your Buddhist friend explained Buddhism in the manner in which you are describing it, please ask him to visit the Sangha again for a refresher.

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Hi vajradhara(cor wot a mouthful)
I am no longer in contact with my Budhist friend who I knew when I lived in London, but we had many interesting discussions. He told me what Budhism was all about which to him was to go through your life living it the best you can without hurting any living creature or any living person. To that I say that it is what most people try to do anyway but again I say it is by grace we are saved, not by works.
I believed Buddha to be a God simply because he had an image of it on his room, some candles before it and a mat also which he told me he sat on to meditate. You say the Buddha was not a God but a man, he may well have been but the little wooden figure sure is the epitome of what is known as an idol or false God as is interpreted by the bible. Hence my belief that he was a God. Also the comments of a previous poster acknowleding a 'Buddha of Compassion'. I have never heard of anything or anyone known in such terms except Gods i.e. Artemis God of Love or Neptune God of the sea(i'm a big fan of Jason and the Argonauts if anyone remembers that film). He may have been a man but his image in such a context was an idol. I am also aware of Nirvana which is the highest ground a Buddha can achieve though I was not sure about the salvation part of it, every religion seems to have a plan of salvation, so I guess their Nirvana is their salvation as it is the highest point they can reach(as far as I know)but their 'salvation' is based on what is human.

To the poster who commented that no religion is positive to others because they are so rooted in their own I would have to say that is untrue for when you look at all the major religions, they all appear to have what is good about them, they advocate good morals and living a good life. Unfortunately living a good life will not get us to God for all our good deeds are as filthy rags to him because we are so proud of them. Our pride is based on an illusion as our good deeds and lives are not examined thoroughly but often compared to the deeds of others i.e. 'i'm not perfect but at least i'm better, nicer, more generous than such and such who lives next door'. Hence they are like the pharisee who prays in public a thanks that they are not like other men. They will be humbled. But those who look at their deeds and pray to God for mercy will be exalted. Many people refer to being a good person as being a good 'christian'. We have so dilluted christianity that as our pastor says it has become 'soft, spongy and spineless'. What does being a christian, or Buddhist, or Jew or Muslim or Hindu actually mean? when it comes down to it all have some book or code on life and how to live it, but the difference with Christianity is that God came to earth in the form of a man, he took on all our sin and was judged guilty and died a painful and humiliating death. If you want to go follow a bunch of rules and regulations to get to heaven then you are welcome to do so but it has been tried and failed, hence Jesus' coming to supply grace and his holy spirit to help us live life as he wanted. Religion is rules, but Jesus is mercy. He still doesn't tolerate other Gods though.

Top Cat