Am I guilty of temptation?

Life2Christ · Apr 18, 2013

Let's say some man is checking me out in obvious way, then starts flirting with me. I think he's cute and start flirting back; giving him obvious signs that I'm interested. What I do not know is that this man is married. Should I find out someone's status before I go giving them a green light to get to know me? Is that even realistic?

ezeric · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:
Let's say some man is checking me out in obvious way, then starts flirting with me. I think he's cute and start flirting back; giving him obvious signs that I'm interested. What I do not know is that this man is married. Should I find out someone's status before I go giving them a green light to get to know me? Is that even realistic?

Well I'm married and just found out (checked you out) that you are superior human being AKA (left handed)!

So are we in some sort of wrong??

Seriously though, how would you know, where a guy stands?
I think flirting is natural to a degree - some call it "being friendly."
I know, it can (like many things) go too far, but in this case, and many cases; I don't think its wrong.

-eric

seeingeyes · Apr 18, 2013

There are different levels of 'flirting' some may be appropriate, some not. If makes a difference what sub-culture you are in, too. (Gushing and hugs may be expected in one part of town, and loathed in the other.) So it's important to know your surroundings.

If you are very concerned with this, you might think of a way to bring your singleness into conversation early on (much the same way that married women bring up their husbands post-haste), perhaps by asking advice or mentioning something that only single folks do. Something like that.

Usually if you are transparent about your own status, the person you are talking to will be, too (creeps excepted). That might help you figure where the line needs to be drawn before you cross it.

God bless

ezeric · Apr 18, 2013

I would also like to add the 'male side of things' here.

We (males) have an obligation when married to include our wives in things, or at least make them aware (included) in the conversations and interactions we have.

For example.

I do quite a bit of ministry, and its not a surprise to have our phones ringing, with folks asking for prayer or encouragement.

Last night I was ministering to a lady for 2 hours on the phone, my wife finally went to bed.

But the next day, I explained who she was and her basic story, so we could pray for the lady, and if the lady were to call again and NOT get me, well my wife could (being led by the SPIRIT) carry the conversation, if need be.

Its wrong, if we lead people on, especially the married guys - because that is not love but self.

-eric

TheyCallMeDave · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:
Let's say some man is checking me out in obvious way, then starts flirting with me. I think he's cute and start flirting back; giving him obvious signs that I'm interested. What I do not know is that this man is married. Should I find out someone's status before I go giving them a green light to get to know me? Is that even realistic?

Its reckless behavior for a gal not to be sure the man is married first before initiating contact . God commands that ALL honor the marriage convenant between two Spouses ... and this command is appropriate to the issue you are raising.

Further...given our Sexual Perannah Culture today , it would behoove any Woman to be very cautious on how she dresses and conducts herself for that gives definite signals (one way or the other) to the general male population . Modesty has never been more important for the safety and wellbeing of women than the present times we are in . So, i would scale back the flirtation thing until you know quite a bit more about the Person remembering that if you use your sexuality/sensuality in an overt manner, then thats what the Male is going to be centered on ...and your inner (real) person will go on the backburner.

Hope that helps from a male perspective.

BFine · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:

Let's say some man is checking me out in obvious way, then starts flirting with me. I think he's cute and start flirting back; giving him obvious signs that I'm interested. What I do not know is that this man is married. Should I find out someone's status before I go giving them a green light to get to know me? Is that even realistic?

Click to expand...

*When I was single and if some guy flirted with me in an obvious way,
I would ask him if he's married-- more times than not, the guy(s) were
married...but they liked to try for something "on the side."

ezeric · Apr 18, 2013

BFine said:
*When I was single and if some guy flirted with me in an obvious way,
I would ask him if he's married-- more times than not, the guy(s) were
married...but they liked to try for something "on the side."

Bfine...I am surprised.

And NOT trying to 'question'/cross examine you here.

Are you saying that they were dishonest to try something "on the side" but honest enough to admit they were married?

Most of the guys I grew up with would lie on all accounts.

-eric

BFine · Apr 18, 2013

They were honest after I questioned them a bit on the matter.

Life2Christ · Apr 18, 2013

TheyCallMeDave said:
Its reckless behavior for a gal not to be sure the man is married first before initiating contact . God commands that ALL honor the marriage convenant between two Spouses ... and this command is appropriate to the issue you are raising.

Further...given our Sexual Perannah Culture today , it would behoove any Woman to be very cautious on how she dresses and conducts herself for that gives definite signals (one way or the other) to the general male population . Modesty has never been more important for the safety and wellbeing of women than the present times we are in . So, i would scale back the flirtation thing until you know quite a bit more about the Person remembering that if you use your sexuality/sensuality in an overt manner, then thats what the Male is going to be centered on ...and your inner (real) person will go on the backburner.

Hope that helps from a male perspective.

You touched on the safety aspect which is important too. Modesty is good for many things, not just the obvious.

TheyCallMeDave · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:
You touched on the safety aspect which is important too. Modesty is good for many things, not just the obvious.

Agreed.

quietpraiyze · Apr 18, 2013

What has always worked for me is to ask the man point blank if hes married or has a girlfriend. Then watch his kinetics (body language). What Ive found is when Im direct with people, it stops any potential confusion.

Also concerning the modesty thing, I'm just going to say this:

When I was 18 years old, I was attacked a block away from my mothers house on a Sunday afternoon. The guy was trying to pull me into a space where he rape me. By the grace of God, I got away. I was wearing a red turtleneck, blue jeans, tennis shoes, and a warm jacket. I had no make-up on and my hair was pulled back into a pony tail. I said that to say, a predator is a predator no matter what youre wearing. Sometimes without really understanding, some people will try and make a woman responsible for a mans bad behavior or sexual appetite. But IMO thats more of a socio-cultural thing that is actually not good for men. We as Believers are called to bring our OWN bodies under subjection. Nobody else is to do that for us whether were married or single...male or female. Also from what I know about men, theyll chase a woman even if shes wearing a burqa or a burlap sack.

I just dont think its good for men or women to make someone else responsible for their own behavior. That whole argument of women needing to be modest so that theyre not a temptation to men has never sat well with me.

Life2Christ · Apr 18, 2013

quietpraiyze said:
. That whole argument of women needing to be modest so that they’re not a temptation to men has never sat well with me.

I agree with you 100% that it doesn't matter how a woman dresses she can get raped wearing a potato sack. Rape is not about sex but about humiliation and submission.
But I also believe that modesty goes beyond dress and one's behavior and mental attitude would do well by being modest.

quietpraiyze · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:
I agree with you 100% that it doesn't matter how a woman dresses she can get raped wearing a potato sack. Rape is not about sex but about humiliation and submission.
But I also believe that modesty goes beyond dress and one's behavior and mental attitude would do well by being modest.

Modesty is not an issue for me. It's the "stuff" that some people try and attach to modesty. I don't know if you've ever had the experience of being in a legalistic "church". For you I hope not but I have. Modesty is a whole 'nother thing in that kind of system. It's a bondage especially for women unto itself. I had a sense of modesty before I was Saved just being raised a certain way. After I got Saved my modesty flows out of my relationship with Christ. It's about what's pleasing and honoring to HIM. If it's not through Christ, for me it's bondage. So I think we're on the same page.

seeingeyes · Apr 18, 2013

quietpraiyze said:
I just dont think its good for men or women to make someone else responsible for their own behavior. That whole argument of women needing to be modest so that theyre not a temptation to men has never sat well with me.

Amen. The Lord will have no more patience for those who blame their sins on others than He did for Adam and Eve.

We get no guarantees of physical safety in this world. Whether you're a hooker or Mother Theresa. Our safety is in the Lord alone.

quitespirit · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:
Let's say some man is checking me out in obvious way, then starts flirting with me. I think he's cute and start flirting back; giving him obvious signs that I'm interested. What I do not know is that this man is married. Should I find out someone's status before I go giving them a green light to get to know me? Is that even realistic?

I would advise you to reevaluate and reconsider your stance of flirtation. How do you flirt? What is your intention by flirting? What is the goal? Is your motive and actions pleasing to God? Should you be flirting with a man you know nothing about? Should you behave in a manner that could cross a moral line if the man is married, with someone you just met? Is flirting with a strange man becoming of a woman of God?

OntheHorizon · Apr 18, 2013

Life2Christ said:
Let's say some man is checking me out in obvious way, then starts flirting with me. I think he's cute and start flirting back; giving him obvious signs that I'm interested. What I do not know is that this man is married. Should I find out someone's status before I go giving them a green light to get to know me? Is that even realistic?

I am going to try to hold back my usual tirade on this issue and keep this short

The idea that women are commonly guilty of TEMPTING men is the stupidest thing a cruel, selfish, egotistical, self righteous, sexist man ever put on women.

It is based on the idea that these pure, holy, good men just can't help their self, that you in your dark ways, with your swaying hips and devilish good looks just overpowered them and that YOU are responsible for their lust.

This idea is sown by incompetent selfish men who think women are objects to be desired and that they owe no responsibility for their own decisions or desires.

When Paul was talking about being kind to other Christians in their weakness he was talking about not offending them by doing what they think is sin... he wasn't saying that a woman is to blame for a man's lust, that you in your womanly power have control over a man, that you just tear his control away and make him sin. That such an idea is relevant comes from a culture of men who dis-value and dishonor women. Making them sexual objects, and passing the responsibility or blame of their own holiness onto the sexual object.

That anything this married man does or wants is your fault is absurd, it's total madness.

znr · Apr 18, 2013

Hoo yah

I do agree with this.

OntheHorizon said:
I am going to try to hold back my usual tirade on this issue and keep this short

The idea that women are commonly guilty of TEMPTING men is the stupidest thing a cruel, selfish, egotistical, self righteous, sexist man ever put on women.

It is based on the idea that these pure, holy, good men just can't help their self, that you in your dark ways, with your swaying hips and devilish good looks just overpowered them and that YOU are responsible for their lust.

This idea is sown by incompetent selfish men who think women are objects to be desired and that they owe no responsibility for their own decisions or desires.

When Paul was talking about being kind to other Christians in their weakness he was talking about not offending them by doing what they think is sin... he wasn't saying that a woman is to blame for a man's lust, that you in your womanly power have control over a man, that you just tear his control away and make him sin. That such an idea is relevant comes from a culture of men who dis-value and dishonor women. Making them sexual objects, and passing the responsibility or blame of their own holiness onto the sexual object.

That anything this married man does or wants is your fault is absurd, it's total madness.

OntheHorizon · Apr 18, 2013

The sad thing is a lot of women believe that junk... it's the same thing that makes people ask "well what was she wearing" after a woman is brutally raped. We think a woman with big knockers and beautiful lips is just asking to get violated if she doesn't cover it all up with really thick, fluffy, and poofie dresses from kneck to toe.

It's a very subtle idea that men are inherently good and women are inherently bad, that the woman is to blame when a man falls into sin. Granted that's almost exactly what Paul told Timothy in 1 Tim 2 but I won't go there. Blame the harlot... not the obviously righteous man who wanted to do her every way imaginable and couldn't see her as a human being.

OntheHorizon · Apr 18, 2013

quietpraiyze said:
What has always worked for me is to ask the man point blank if he’s married or has a girlfriend. Then watch his kinetics (body language). What I’ve found is when I’m direct with people, it stops any potential confusion.

Also concerning the modesty thing, I'm just going to say this:

When I was 18 years old, I was attacked a block away from my mother’s house on a Sunday afternoon. The guy was trying to pull me into a space where he rape me. By the grace of God, I got away. I was wearing a red turtleneck, blue jeans, tennis shoes, and a warm jacket. I had no make-up on and my hair was pulled back into a pony tail. I said that to say, a predator is a predator no matter what you’re wearing. Sometimes without really understanding, some people will try and make a woman responsible for a man’s bad behavior or sexual appetite. But IMO that’s more of a socio-cultural thing that is actually not good for men. We as Believers are called to bring our OWN bodies under subjection. Nobody else is to do that for us whether we‘re married or single...male or female. Also from what I know about men, they’ll chase a woman even if she’s wearing a burqa or a burlap sack.

I just don’t think it’s good for men or women to make someone else responsible for their own behavior. That whole argument of women needing to be modest so that they’re not a temptation to men has never sat well with me.

I absolutely agree. Where is the Christian theme for men to dress modestly and not cause temptation? Are men so inherently pure that such a thing doesn't need to be said? It's the women who have to be caged and covered, puffed, padded and layered to keep them good and not allow them to bring sin into the camp?

The idea that sin and temptation has become almost a permanent part of the female person or body only displays the impurity inside the heads of men and that we have made it the women's job to fix only displays the lack of real concern over this, men's willingness to demean and dishonor women, the lack any real pursuit of inner goodness and purity. Hypocrisy at it's best, trying to look clean when you aren't willing to put in the work to be clean.

Girder of Loins · Apr 18, 2013

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Am I guilty of temptation?

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