America is Mystery Babylon/Babylon the Great of the End Times

Warrior4ChristAL · Jul 11, 2006

inhisdebt said:
Since when did this discussion become a personal attack based on assumptions

I base MY WALK WITH CHRIST on faith, manifesation, truth and revelation.

If you feel "attacked" because I defend myself and my beliefs, then I'm sorry you are so easily offended.

You apparently have an issue with me saying I haven't "assumed anything" as you have accused me of.

If you have a problem with me or what I believe, take it up with God, who taught me what I believe.

LittleLambofJesus · Jul 11, 2006

Rev. 17:16 - We see lovers will strip her, this is seen happening to Jerusalem in EZ 16:37.

Rev. 18: 4 - In addition, God called for “MY PEOPLE” to come out of this city and not be partakers of her sins. This reference is to those you will keep the commandments his people Israel.

Rev. 18:6 – This woman is rewarded double for her iniquity. This “double” punishment is seen to Jerusalem in Isaiah 4:2 and Jer. 16:18, 17:18.

If someone believes that the Bible are merely stories and allegories rather than absolutes and facts given from God to man, then they must only be "figuratively" saved not literally saved.

Well, I believe both of you are wrong in your interpretations

.

Jesus and God both condemned the Priesthood/Rulers in Jerusalem. Why the heck do you think God had the Temple/Sanctuary destroyed?

Ezekiel 7:1 Moreover the word of the LORD came to me, saying, 2 "And you, son of man, thus says the Lord GOD to the land of Israel: 'An end! The end has come upon the four corners of the land. 3 Now the end [has come] upon you, And I will send My anger against you; I will judge you according to your ways, And I will repay you for all your abominations.

You mean the Millennial Temple of Rev. 11 also described in Ezek. 40-48?? Coincidence that both were "measured"?? Nobody will have to be "trained" for service in it.

Are you still struggling with the houses of Judah vs. Israel?

Why should I struggle with it? Both Nations are in revelation aren't they? Daniel concerns Daniel's people, the JEWS [Judah] , not the house of Israel.

Daniel 12:1 "At that time Michael shall stand up, The great prince who stands [watch] over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation [Judah], [Even] to that time. And at that time your people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book. [Reve 7]

Revelation 11:1:And given to me a reed like unto [a] staff saying: Be Ye Arousing! and Measure Ye! the Sanctuary/Naos of the God, and the Altar and the Ones worshipping in it 2 And the Court [#833], the one within/without[#2081] the Sanctuary/Naos [#3485] be Casting- Out! [#1544] Out-side [#1854] and ye should not be measuring it/her, because it/she was given to the nations/gentiles, and the city, the holy, they shall be treading [#3961] for 40 and 2 months.

Zadok7000 · Jul 11, 2006

LittleLambofJesus said:
Why should I struggle with it? Both Nations are in revelation aren't they? Daniel concerns Daniel's people, the JEWS [Judah] , not the house of Israel.

First off, only 12:1 specifies that, not the entire book. Secondly, "Thy people" is Israel.
Dan, 1:3 And the king spake unto Ashpenaz the master of his eunuchs, that he should bring certain of the children of Israel, and of the king's seed, and of the princes;

Coincidence that "princes" is here and "great prince" is in 12:1? I don't think so.

Yes, Daniel was of Judah, but the prophecies are for both houses.

Daniel 12:1 "At that time Michael shall stand up, The great prince who stands [watch] over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation [Judah], [Even] to that time. And at that time your people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book. [Reve 7]

"Time of trouble" ring a bell? Dan. 21:1 = Jer. 30:4-7
And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. For thus saith the LORD; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness? Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

Warrior4ChristAL · Jul 11, 2006

Mystery Babylon is the lone Global Superpower-

Revelation 17:1, "...the great prostitute, who sits on many waters."

Revelation 17:15, "The waters you saw, where the prostitute sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages."

Revelation 17:18, "The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth."

Revelation 18:7, "In her heart she boasts, 'I sit as queen; I am not a widow, and I will never mourn.'"

Economic Superpower-

Revelation 18:3, "...and the merchants of the earth grew rich from her excessive luxuries."

Revelation 18:11, "The merchants of the earth will weep and mourn over her because no one buys their cargoes any more..."

Revelation 18:15, "The merchants who sold these things and gained their wealth from her will stand far off, terrified at her torment..."

Revelation 18:23, "...Your merchants were the world's great men. By your magic spell all the nations were led astray."

Military Superpower-

Jeremiah 50:23, "How broken and shattered is the hammer of the whole earth!"

Jeremiah 51:20, "You are my war club, my weapon for battle- with you I shatter nations, with you I destroy kingdoms,"

Isaiah 14:4-6, "...How the oppressor has come to an end! How his fury has ended! The Lord has broken the rod of the wicked, the scepter of the rulers, which in anger struck down peoples with unceasing blows, and in fury subdued nations with relentless aggression."

Political Superpower-

Jeremiah 51:44, "...The nations will no longer stream to him..."

Revelation 17:18, "The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth."

Revelation 18:9-10, "When the kings of the earth... see the smoke of her burning... they will stand far off and cry: 'Woe! Woe, O great city, O Babylon, city of power! In one hour your doom has come!"

Major Port City-

Revelation 18:17-19, "...all who travel by ship... and all who earn their living from the sea, will stand far off... and with weeping and mourning cry out: 'Woe! Woe, O great city, where all who had ships on the sea became rich through her wealth!' "

Greatest and Wealthiest city the world has ever seen-

Revelation 18:18, "When they see the smoke of her burning, they will exclaim, 'Was there ever a city like this great city?' "

Revelation 18:16, "Woe! Woe, O great city, dressed in fine linen, purple and scarlet, and glittering with gold, precious stones and pearls! In one hour such great wealth has been brought to ruin!"

Revelation 18:14, "The fruit you longed for is gone from you. All your riches and splendor have vanished..."
Isaiah 13:19, "Babylon, the jewel of kingdoms, the glory of the Babylonians pride..."

Jeremiah 51:13, "You who live by many waters and are rich in treasures, your end has come..."

Home to a largest population of Jewish People-

Jeremiah 51:45, "Come out of her, my people! Run for your lives! Run from the fierce anger of the Lord."

Revelation 18:4, "Come out of her my people, so that you will not share in her sins, so that you will not receive any of her plagues,"

Zechariah 2:7, "Come, O Zion! Escape, you who live in the Daughter of Babylon!"

Mystery Babylon is represented by a Woman-

Revelation 17:1, "...I will show you the punishment of the great prostitute, who sits on many waters... ...the waters you saw, where the prostitute sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations and languages."

Revelation 17:18, "The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth."

Mystery Babylon is dressed in expensive garments-

Revelation 18:16, "Woe! Woe, O great city, dressed in fine linen, purple and scarlet..."

I offer Bible - I say, let the Holy Spirit make it revelation to you.

Do not believe me.

Do not believe Zadok.

Just believe God!!

LittleLambofJesus · Jul 11, 2006

You mean the Millennial Temple of Rev. 11 also described in Ezek. 40-48?? Coincidence that both were "measured"?? Nobody will have to be "trained" for service in it.

Are you still struggling with the houses of Judah vs. Israel?

Why do you have the Santuary in Rev 11 as the "millenim" one

Daniel 12:1 "At that time Michael shall stand up, The great prince who stands [watch] over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation [Judah], [Even] to that time. And at that time your people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book. [Reve 7]

"Time of trouble" ring a bell? Dan. 21:1 = Jer. 30:4-7
And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. For thus saith the LORD; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? wherefore do I see every man with his hands on his loins, as a woman in travail, and all faces are turned into paleness? Alas! for that day is great, so that none is like it: it is even the time of Jacob's trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.

Yep. 40 and 2 months doesn't equal 2000 yrs.

Luke 21:24 "And they will fall by mouth of the sword, and be being led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

Revelation 11:1:And given to me a reed like unto [a] staff saying: Be Ye Arousing! and Measure Ye! the Sanctuary/Naos of the God, and the Altar and the Ones worshipping in it 2 And the Court [#833], the one within/without[#2081] the Sanctuary/Naos [#3485] be Casting- Out! [#1544] Out-side [#1854] and ye should not be measuring it/her, because it/she was given to the nations/gentiles, and the city, the holy, they shall be treading [#3961] for 40 and 2 months.

Jesus and God both condemned the Priesthood/Rulers in Jerusalem. Why the heck do you think God had the Temple/Sanctuary destroyed?

Ezekiel 7:1 Moreover the word of the LORD came to me, saying, 2 "And you, son of man, thus says the Lord GOD to the land of Israel: 'An end! The end has come upon the four corners of the land. 3 Now the end [has come] upon you, And I will send My anger against you; I will judge you according to your ways, And I will repay you for all your abominations.

Zadok7000 · Jul 11, 2006

LittleLambofJesus said:
Yep. 40 and 2 months doesn't equal 2000 yrs.

Who said they did? Not I.
Luke 21:6-32 hasn't happened yet.

And as some spake of the temple, how it was adorned with goodly stones and gifts, he said, As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down. And they asked him, saying, Master, but when shall these things be? and what sign will there be when these things shall come to pass?

The Western Wall still stands.

But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

The "times of the Gentiles" have not yet begun. The Beast has not yet risen. His locust army is not yet surrounding Jerusalem.

Rev. 11's temple is the Millennial one - just like the more detailed description in Ezekiel - the "court which is without the temple" is just that - outside. IE on earth before the Return. It cannot be measured until the True Christ returns to Jerusalem.

LittleLambofJesus · Jul 11, 2006

The Western Wall still stands

The western wall wasn't a "building" either. Jesus mentioned the buildings inside the Temple complex, which included the Sanctuary.
Matthew 24:1 Then Jesus went out and departed from the temple, and His disciples came up to show Him the buildings of the temple [#2411].

Notice how the Jews both wept and had joy at the start of the second one.This appears to be happening in revelation after the destruction of the 2nd one [or future one].

Ezra 3: 12 But many of the priests and Levites and heads of the fathers' [houses,] old men who had seen the first temple, wept with a loud voice when the foundation of this temple was laid before their eyes. Yet many shouted aloud for joy, 13 so that the people could not discern the noise of the shout of Joy from the noise of the Weeping of the people, for the people shouted with a loud shout, and the sound was heard afar off.

Rev. 11's temple is the Millennial one - just like the more detailed description in Ezekiel - the "court which is without the temple" is just that - outside. IE on earth before the Return. It cannot be measured until the True Christ returns to Jerusalem.

It is not the Temple being measured, but the Sanctuary. Big difference.

The court of the Priest was outside the Sanctuary but inside the Temple [#2411]] complex. But hey, if that is your interpretation through the "spirit" and Scriptures, go with it. Don't know if the Jews or Muslims would "buy" it though. :wave:

Matthew 26:3 Then the chief priests, the scribes, and the elders of the people assembled at the palace [#833] of the high priest, who was called Caiaphas,

Matthew 8:12 "But the sons [#5207] of the kingdom [#932] shall be being "cast out" [#1544] into outer [#1857] darkness.

Mark 15:38 and the veil of the sanctuary/naos [#3485] was rent in two, from top to bottom,

Revelation 11:1:And given to me a reed like unto [a] staff saying: Be Ye Arousing! and Measure Ye! the Sanctuary/Naos of the God, and the Altar and the Ones worshipping in it 2 And the Court [#833], the one within/without[#2081] the Sanctuary/Naos [#3485] be Casting- Out! [#1544] Out-side [#1854] and ye should not be measuring it/her, because it/she was given to the nations/gentiles, and the city, the holy, they shall be treading [#3961] for 40 and 2 months.

Luke 21:24 "And they will fall by mouth of the sword, and be being led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.

inhisdebt · Jul 11, 2006

Warrior4ChristAL said:
YES . . . that's the point. It MUST change. However, only a tremendous disaster will change it THAT drastically for the U.S.

We are the youngest nation on the planet and the leader of all global economics and world trade. Even the United Nations are located in N.Y.

What could be more drastic to usher in the anti-Christ than the greatest power on the planet is destroyed.

And . . . I don't ASSUME anything.

It's called BIBLE!! It's called HOLY SPIRIT.

I don't need to "assume" anything. I just have to get out of the flesh and get into the Spirit where God dwells.

I find it amazing that those who are in step with Holy Spirit are currently preaching and teaching about the 2nd Coming, the Tribulation, signs of the end, etc. You can see it on every major Christian TV or radio station.

Everytime I turn on the radio I'm hearing preachers from all over the Nation preaching the same thing.

The false prophets on TBN, however, are preaching "peace and prosperity" as if we need to be richer, have more houses and money, money, money rather than have a pure and contrite heart before God.

I know that is a concept that most Christians aren't into anymore. But I rely on Holy Spirit to interpret the Word of God and I study under teacher and instructors that also believe in the Holy Spirit, rather than man's ways.

Do you not know spiritually what season we are in? Or are you just wandering around in the dark from day to day? Does God talk to you?

"You have not because you ask not".

If you are not asking and seeking God but rather are just going to church and hanging out with Christian folk and "playing church", then perhaps you don't have a clue as to what is going on in the spirit realm and why God is stirring up His Spirit to make proclaimations in these last days.

I believe in an in-your-face relationship with Almighty God. I don't believe in merely existing until Jesus comes back but rather being obedient to Him in His daily direction for my life.

I'm sorry you feel so "out-of-touch" with the spiritual reality going on at this time, not just in this nation but around the world.

I am one of MANY saying the same things and moving in the same direction.

"For the spirit shall bear witness with the spirit".

Pardion me but this is a personal attack, based on assumptions, you dont know me, you dont know how i selrve God, and have no idea of my personal relationship with him.

LittleLambofJesus · Jul 11, 2006

What could be more drastic to usher in the anti-Christ than the greatest power on the planet is destroyed.

May have to just live on bread and water for awhile. Besides, God will always provide for those that love Him and we, gulp, may just have to "die". Just have Faith. :wave:

John 4:32 But He said to them, "I have food to eat of which you do not know." 33 Therefore the disciples said to one another, "Has anyone brought Him [anything] to eat?" 34 Jesus said to them, "My food is to do the will of Him who sent Me, and to finish His work.

Phoenix · Jul 11, 2006

I'm going to bow out of this discussion. I will still read and comment if compelled but as i said before i just dont have the heart to do these much anymore -

I'll submit these links for reading. There's some here i agree and disagree with. But i like the approach. There's a lot of good stuff here. The first is a commentary on Revelation the second on Babylon. One of many, many, commentaries on both subjects. Both are pretty well grounded and good to read.

http://www.apocalipsis.org/malcolmsmith11.htm

http://www.apocalipsis.org/Rev-II-Tape-2.htm

LittleLambofJesus · Jul 11, 2006

Phoenix said:
I'm going to bow out of this discussion. I will still read and comment if compelled but as i said before i just dont have the heart to do these much anymore -

I'll submit these links for reading. There's some here i agree and disagree with. But i like the approach. There's a lot of good stuff here. The first is a commentary on Revelation the second on Babylon. One of many, many, commentaries on both subjects. Both are pretty well grounded and good to read.

http://www.apocalipsis.org/malcolmsmith11.htm

http://www.apocalipsis.org/Rev-II-Tape-2.htm

This is about the view I had of the Dragon, representing the OC Priesthood in some ways. Never thought anyone else viewed it that way but me LOL.

http://www.apocalipsis.org/Rev-I-Tape-6.htm

The Bible says in I Cor 15 that the strength of sin is the law. I think some of you who have not fully seen the finished work of Jesus might even cringe before the law yet. You look at that law and you say ‘I am unworthy, unworthy, unworthy’ And the Devil says, you should belong to me, and you say, Right. The strength of sin is the law, but now he is cast down, and so the Scripture says that they overcame him because of the blood of the Lamb and because of the Word of their testimony and they did not love their life until the death.

Daniel 2:35 "Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver, and the gold were crushed together, and became like chaff from the summer threshing floors; the wind carried them away so that no trace of them was found. And the stone that struck the image became a great mountain and filled the whole earth.

Warrior4ChristAL · Jul 12, 2006

inhisdebt said:
Pardion me but this is a personal attack, based on assumptions, you dont know me, you dont know how i selrve God, and have no idea of my personal relationship with him.

You don't know me either however you have also done some assuming regarding me as well.

It would be nice if you contributed to the thread rather than just calling me a liar then walking on. That doesn't contribute that is critical and judgmental. If you don't believe the scriptures you read or its interpretation, then just say that.

Keep your personal opinions to yourself. You come on the thread and just start attacking me and my beliefs, you better believe I am going to defend myself. I don't see you contributing anything substantial.

I may not agree with Zadok7000 but at least he is just as convicted on his position as I am mine and he bases that on Scripture.

I find your posts quite offensive in my direction as well. You don't know me no more than I know you so quite attacking me personally and you will get the same from me.

brother daniel · Jul 12, 2006

LittleLambofJesus said:
This is about the view I had of the Dragon, representing the OC Priesthood in some ways. Never thought anyone else viewed it that way but me LOL.

The ancient "Order of the Lizerd" has no where to hide.
Picture the legless reptile slithering across the sand etching with its belly its story in its the land.

Its fiting that our study of the The United States of America, as MYSTERY BABYLON should focus on The priest hood of Baylon.

Without superstition, the priesthood, is the Butchers and Grocers guild. The scribe meaning scrivener is the Surgion Guild of Barbors and bloodletters. Married to the butchers guild is the CutlersGuild.

It is the Cutlers and scribes with their teeth of pointed, diamond edged steel that dictate the the cutting edge of LAW.

The UNITED SATATES OF AMERICA was created to fall, It is Mystery Babylon the Great, Mother of Harlots and abominations of Earth.

The feet of clay mixed with iron is a very popular, synthetic government or REPUBLIC, BEAST.

At the time of the John who wrote the Revelation of Jesus Christ, Greek was the language of educated disciples.

The Greeks were a cultavated, self indulgent sociaty of sea going merchants who considered all gods fictional.
Hence there is no native GREEK RELIGION. There is only a collection of Myths and fables, about demigods of the long ago past who meet on a high holy mountain.

The scribes Of Greece who codified the phonetic language of the Black sea, Scythians, into a phonecian cursive script, were, Aramaic, EGYPTIANs. This script was developed to mark and count goods and persons.

The Scythians of the Hellinistic period were called Parthians and their scribes were Persian Jews or persons who called themselves Jews because they were not of the house of David.

The Royal Scythians = Goths, became Aryian Christians as it gave more latatude for their Old testament,TORAH, view of law and individual rights as they killed for god and country..

From these Aschanazi Scythians was developed the Suivi economic cult league of Saxon Germany and northern Europe.

The point is it can be proved that the hidden agenda, of the Lawyers Cult, of Temple Bar in London and the Bar assocation of the United States of America, is that of a secret and deadly priesthood, that controls and enforces contracts with police power, called the rule of Law.

According to them
THERE IS NO GOD but US
THE FORCE OF LAW IS GOD
With love in Christ
brother daniel

inhisdebt · Jul 12, 2006

Warrior4ChristAL said:
You cannot take merely one or two texts of Scripture to voice your argument.

Either you take God literally in the prophetic descriptions or you don't.

If you don't then you assume that God has wasted paper in giving such descriptions which mean nothing to the overall picture of Babylon's identification.

World Trade is ONE of the descriptions that cannot be ignored.

America is the biggest importer and exporter of goods, including franchise business.

Now, do we see an Iraqi resturant in every nation? How about Israeli / Jewish Cuisine?

Yet, America has so surrounded the globe with McDonalds and Mickey Mouse. The U.S. has factories all over the globe as well. You cannot say this about Israel or Iraq.

Babylon is also known for its trading of many commodities. We see a massive list of commodities for which Mystery Babylon is famous for its trade and for being the World Leader in this trading.

Among those traits are:

Wood or Lumber -- Revelation 18:12
Grains -- Revelation 18:13
Livestock -- Revelation 18:13
Transportation -- Revelation 18:13

To believe in the "prophetic" is to accept that these "visions" were laid out in detail before the prophets. In their own language and understanding they listed such things. While perhaps Jeremiah, Isaiah & John couldn't know or understand a CAR, they did understand that a CHARIOT is a transportation vehicle, and thus, they used a description that THEY were familiar with.

If you cannot comprehend that our modern day chariots are AUTOMOBILES, then you have no common sense whatsoever.

My main point is, I am not "grasping" at anything. It's called REVELATION from the HOLY SPIRIT.

I am so sorry for those who find that they are supernatural in themselves and can interpret the Bible with their intellect rather than with the Holy Spirit, who inspired the prophets to WRITE THE VISION.

I will say this. I can thank God that I no longer walk in blindness to the Scriptures and that my feet are planted on the ROCK of MY SALVATION.

There are those who know and believe, but only because God, the Father wills us to "come into the knowledge of the truth".

I do not stand alone and I will continue to proclaim the truth, regardless of who it rocks.

I don't get my theology from a newspaper, that is the biggest insult to my walk with Christ.

I do, however, understand and can SEE the signs of the times and be able to prophetically line world events with Biblical prophecy. So sorry for those who live in such darkness that they cannot see what is right before their eyes.

For those who merely look at the posts and not the original post with Scriptures that BACK UP WHAT I AND THOUSANDS OF US BELIEVE TO BE THE IDENTIFICATION OF BABYLON, then you are the one's grasping at straws in your arguments.

You cannot ignore the truth of the Scripture. If Israel cannot fit ALL the descriptions, then Babylon cannot be Israel.

If Iraq cannot fit ALL the descriptions, then Iraq cannot be the end-time Babylon either.

While I will admit that we can have a "babylonian" ideology in our individual lives, Babylon's description is both CITY & NATION in the prophetic passages.

And yes, I believe God said what He meant and meant what He said. Yes, I DARE to believe God's Word as both figurative a literal.

Why would the prophets have a vision of something that doesn't exist? They had a VISION, not just a "thought". They SAW something that gave them the descriptions.

If someone believes that the Bible are merely stories and allegories rather than absolutes and facts given from God to man, then they must only be "figuratively" saved not literally saved.

Jesus didn't die on a figurative cross and shed figurative blood.

While some can be enslaved by the mind, will and emotions, even by demonic powers, the children of Israel WERE SLAVES OF A REAL EGYPT, not a figurative one.

My challenge to those who really desire to know the truth, God's Truth, should not take ANYONE'S WORD FOR IT, but rather SEEK GOD ALONE for clarification and revelation.

While Zadok makes good argument, his argument doesn't line up with sound Biblical doctrine based on 4 prophets who offered tremendous detailed descriptions of the End-Time Babylon.

Again, if Iraq or Israel were truly in the running for it, they would be able to fall into EVERY CATAGORY of the prophesies and they just don't.

Never the less you can not just dispose of or ignore those one or two verses that do not fit your theores, for it to be true all scripture must fit or your theories are incorrect, because the scripture is not,

brother daniel · Jul 12, 2006

brother daniel said:
The ancient "Order of the Lizerd" has no where to hide.
Picture the legless reptile slithering across the sand etching with its belly its story in its the land.

Its fiting that our study of the The United States of America, as MYSTERY BABYLON should focus on The priest hood of Baylon.

Without superstition, the priesthood, is the Butchers and Grocers guild. The scribe meaning scrivener is the Surgion Guild of Barbors and bloodletters. Married to the butchers guild is the CutlersGuild.

It is the Cutlers and scribes with their teeth of pointed, diamond edged steel that dictate the the cutting edge of LAW.

The UNITED SATATES OF AMERICA was created to fall, It is Mystery Babylon the Great, Mother of Harlots and abominations of Earth.

The feet of clay mixed with iron is a very popular, synthetic government or REPUBLIC, BEAST.

At the time of the John who wrote the Revelation of Jesus Christ, Greek was the language of educated disciples.

The Greeks were a cultavated, self indulgent sociaty of sea going merchants who considered all gods fictional.
Hence there is no native GREEK RELIGION. There is only a collection of Myths and fables, about demigods of the long ago past who meet on a high holy mountain.

The scribes Of Greece who codified the phonetic language of the Black sea, Scythians, into a phonecian cursive script, were, Aramaic, EGYPTIANs. This script was developed to mark and count goods and persons.

The Scythians of the Hellinistic period were called Parthians and their scribes were Persian Jews or persons who called themselves Jews because they were not of the house of David.

The Royal Scythians = Goths, became Aryian Christians as it gave more latatude for their Old testament,TORAH, view of law and individual rights as they killed for god and country..

From these Aschanazi Scythians was developed the Suivi economic cult league of Saxon Germany and northern Europe.

The point is it can be proved that the hidden agenda, of the Lawyers Cult, of Temple Bar in London and the Bar assocation of the United States of America, is that of a secret and deadly priesthood, that controls and enforces contracts with police power, called the rule of Law.

According to them
THERE IS NO GOD but US
THE FORCE OF LAW IS GOD
With love in Christ
brother daniel

I hate this subject but for the sake of the brethren who come here it must be addressed.

We are on the field of battle now and we shall each answer for every vain word.
The internet is a weapon and with it we are each living a bloody trail. I pray that all will know that it is the blood of Jesus and the prophets that crys out to us today.

With love in Christ
brother daniel

Warrior4ChristAL · Jul 12, 2006

inhisdebt said:
Never the less you can not just dispose of or ignore those one or two verses that do not fit your theores, for it to be true all scripture must fit or your theories are incorrect, because the scripture is not,

Do you even hear yourself?

They are not MY THEORIES.

I am merely sharing them.

You again "assume" quite a few things about me as well. I do not "ignore" anyone. I just do not agree.

It really is that simple. You have turned it into a personal vendetta, not me.

I really BELIEVE what I preach. So no, their argument will not sway me either. Because you cannot go back to "no knowing" once you have been exposed to the truth.

It is the Holy Spirit's job to convict a person of wrong doctrine. That's not YOUR place in the Body of Christ.

I offer evidence WITH Scripture. You, so far, have offered only argument.

Zadok7000 · Jul 12, 2006

Confusion about Babylon? How ironic...

Rev. 18:24
And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Lam. 4:12-13
The kings of the earth, and all the inhabitants of the world, would not have believed that the adversary and the enemy should have entered into the gates of Jerusalem. For the sins of her prophets, and the iniquities of her priests, that have shed the blood of the just in the midst of her

Matt. 23:30-38
And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Luke 11:47-52
Woe unto you! for ye build the sepulchres of the prophets, and your fathers killed them. Truly ye bear witness that ye allow the deeds of your fathers: for they indeed killed them, and ye build their sepulchres. Therefore also said the wisdom of God, I will send them prophets and apostles, and [some] of them they shall slay and persecute: That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this generation; From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, which perished between the altar and the temple: verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation. Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.

To summarize:
And in her was found the blood of prophets
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets

Also consider:

2Kings 9:7
And thou shalt smite the house of Ahab thy master, that I may avenge the blood of my servants the prophets, and the blood of all the servants of the LORD, at the hand of Jezebel.

Rev. 2:20-22
Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

Warrior4ChristAL · Jul 12, 2006

Zadok7000 said:
Confusion about Babylon? How ironic...

Rev. 18:24
And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Lam. 4:12-13
The kings of the earth, and all the inhabitants of the world, would not have believed that the adversary and the enemy should have entered into the gates of Jerusalem. For the sins of her prophets, and the iniquities of her priests, that have shed the blood of the just in the midst of her

Matt. 23:30-38
And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Luke 11:47-52
Woe unto you! for ye build the sepulchres of the prophets, and your fathers killed them. Truly ye bear witness that ye allow the deeds of your fathers: for they indeed killed them, and ye build their sepulchres. Therefore also said the wisdom of God, I will send them prophets and apostles, and [some] of them they shall slay and persecute: That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this generation; From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, which perished between the altar and the temple: verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation. Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.

To summarize:
And in her was found the blood of prophets
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets

Also consider:

2Kings 9:7
And thou shalt smite the house of Ahab thy master, that I may avenge the blood of my servants the prophets, and the blood of all the servants of the LORD, at the hand of Jezebel.

Rev. 2:20-22
Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

Confusion?

The Spirit of the Living God brings clarification.

Does anyone ever seek God's face?

I'm not confused and am totally at peace in my spirit with the knowledge and revelation I have.

I'm sorry if this thread has caused confusion. My challenge was not only to offer Scripture but also to challenge those who desire to know truth to SEEK THE ONE THAT IS TRUTH.

Neither Zadok nor myself is the Way, the Truth or the Life. Only Jesus holds that position.

inhisdebt · Jul 12, 2006

Warrior4ChristAL said:
Do you even hear yourself?

They are not MY THEORIES.

I am merely sharing them.

You again "assume" quite a few things about me as well. I do not "ignore" anyone. I just do not agree.

It really is that simple. You have turned it into a personal vendetta, not me.

I really BELIEVE what I preach. So no, their argument will not sway me either. Because you cannot go back to "no knowing" once you have been exposed to the truth.

It is the Holy Spirit's job to convict a person of wrong doctrine. That's not YOUR place in the Body of Christ.

I offer evidence WITH Scripture. You, so far, have offered only argument.

I,ve posted this on this subject in the past you should spend some time studing Jerimiah 50- 52 in particular This is were these revelations started to begin with
Jer 50v45 Therefore hear ye the counsel of the LORD, that he hath taken against Babylon; and his purposes, that he hath purposed against the land of the Chaldeans: Surely the least of the flock shall draw them out: surely he shall make their habitation desolate with them.
46 At the noise of the taking of Babylon the earth is moved, and the cry is heard among the nations

Jerimiah51v33 For thus saith the LORD of hosts, the God of Israel; The daughter of Babylon is like a threshingfloor, it is time to thresh her: yet a little while, and the time of her harvest shall come.
34 Nebuchadrezzar the king of Babylon hath devoured me, he hath crushed me, he hath made me an empty vessel, he hath swallowed me up like a dragon, he hath filled his belly with my delicates, he hath cast me out.
35 The violence done to me and to my flesh be upon Babylon, shall the inhabitant of Zion say; and my blood upon the inhabitants of Chaldea, shall Jerusalem say.
36 Therefore thus saith the LORD; Behold, I will plead thy cause, and take vengeance for thee; and I will dry up her sea, and make her springs dry.
37 And Babylon shall become heaps, a dwellingplace for dragons, an astonishment, and an hissing, without an inhabitant.
38 They shall roar together like lions: they shall yell as lions' whelps.
39 In their heat I will make their feasts, and I will make them drunken, that they may rejoice, and sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the LORD.
40 I will bring them down like lambs to the slaughter, like rams with he goats.
41 How is Sheshach taken! and how is the praise of the whole earth surprised! how is Babylon become an astonishment among the nations!
42 The sea is come up upon Babylon: she is covered with the multitude of the waves thereof.
43 Her cities are a desolation, a dry land, and a wilderness, a land wherein no man dwelleth, neither doth any son of man pass thereby.
44 And I will punish Bel in Babylon, and I will bring forth out of his mouth that which he hath swallowed up: and the nations shall not flow together any more unto him: yea, the wall of Babylon shall fall.
45 My people, go ye out of the midst of her, and deliver ye every man his soul from the fierce anger of the LORD.
46 And lest your heart faint, and ye fear for the rumour that shall be heard in the land; a rumour shall both come one year, and after that in another year shall come a rumour, and violence in the land, ruler against ruler.
47 Therefore, behold, the days come, that I will do judgment upon the graven images of Babylon: and her whole land shall be confounded, and all her slain shall fall in the midst of her.
48 Then the heaven and the earth, and all that is therein, shall sing for Babylon: for the spoilers shall come unto her from the north, saith the LORD.
49 As Babylon hath caused the slain of Israel to fall, so at Babylon shall fall the slain of all the earth
50 Ye that have escaped the sword, go away, stand not still: remember the LORD afar off, and let Jerusalem come into your mind.
51 We are confounded, because we have heard reproach: shame hath covered our faces: for strangers are come into the sanctuaries of the LORD's house.
52 Wherefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will do judgment upon her graven images: and through all her land the wounded shall groan.
53 Though Babylon should mount up to heaven, and though she should fortify the height of her strength, yet from me shall spoilers come unto her, saith the LORD.
54 A sound of a cry cometh from Babylon, and great destruction from the land of the Chaldeans:
55 Because the LORD hath spoiled Babylon, and destroyed out of her the great voice; when her waves do roar like great waters, a noise of their voice is uttered:
56 Because the spoiler is come upon her, even upon Babylon, and her mighty men are taken, every one of their bows is broken: for the LORD God of recompences shall surely requite.
57 And I will make drunk her princes, and her wise men, her captains, and her rulers, and her mighty men: and they shall sleep a perpetual sleep, and not wake, saith the King, whose name is the LORD of hosts.
58 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; The broad walls of Babylon shall be utterly broken, and her high gates shall be burned with fire; and the people shall labour in vain, and the folk in the fire, and they shall be weary.
59 The word which Jeremiah the prophet commanded Seraiah the son of Neriah, the son of Maaseiah, when he went with Zedekiah the king of Judah into Babylon in the fourth year of his reign. And this Seraiah was a quiet prince.
60 So Jeremiah wrote in a book all the evil that should come upon Babylon, even all these words that are written against Babylon.
61 And Jeremiah said to Seraiah, When thou comest to Babylon, and shalt see, and shalt read all these words;
62 Then shalt thou say, O LORD, thou hast spoken against this place, to cut it off, that none shall remain in it, neither man nor beast, but that it shall be desolate for ever.
63 And it shall be, when thou hast made an end of reading this book, that thou shalt bind a stone to it, and cast it into the midst of Euphrates:
64 And thou shalt say, Thus shall Babylon sink, and shall not rise from the evil that I will bring upon her: and they shall be weary. Thus far are the words of Jeremiah.

brother daniel · Jul 12, 2006

Zadok7000 said:
Confusion about Babylon? How ironic...

Rev. 18:24
And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Lam. 4:12-13
The kings of the earth, and all the inhabitants of the world, would not have believed that the adversary and the enemy should have entered into the gates of Jerusalem. For the sins of her prophets, and the iniquities of her priests, that have shed the blood of the just in the midst of her

Matt. 23:30-38
And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell? Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Luke 11:47-52
Woe unto you! for ye build the sepulchres of the prophets, and your fathers killed them. Truly ye bear witness that ye allow the deeds of your fathers: for they indeed killed them, and ye build their sepulchres. Therefore also said the wisdom of God, I will send them prophets and apostles, and [some] of them they shall slay and persecute: That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the foundation of the world, may be required of this generation; From the blood of Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, which perished between the altar and the temple: verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation. Woe unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered.

To summarize:
And in her was found the blood of prophets
O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets

Also consider:

2Kings 9:7
And thou shalt smite the house of Ahab thy master, that I may avenge the blood of my servants the prophets, and the blood of all the servants of the LORD, at the hand of Jezebel.

Rev. 2:20-22
Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.

Jun 07, 2005

Private property (cont'd.)

1 Kings 21 tells the story of King Ahab and Naboth's vineyard. Ahab is sort of the archetypal Bad King in the Old Testament. His wife, Jezebel, is even worse. "There was never a man like Ahab," the writer of 1 Kings says, "who sold himself to do evil in the eyes of the Lord, urged on by Jezebel his wife." (You'll never, ever, meet anyone named after these two horrible people.)
A man named Naboth owned a vineyard near Ahab's palace, and the king proposed a trade. "Let me have your vineyard to use for a vegetable garden," Ahab said, "In exchange I will give you a better vineyard or, if you prefer, I will pay you whatever it is worth."
That seems like a reasonable offer, and not an unfair one. But Naboth isn't selling. "The Lord forbid that I should give you the inheritance of my fathers," Naboth says, sending Ahab home to pout and sulk.
As king of Samaria, Ahab apparently did not have the sweeping powers of eminent domain enjoyed today by potentates in, for example, Arlington, Texas. When Arlington coveted 13 acres for a new ballpark and the owners refused to sell, city officials swiftly acted on behalf of their cronies in the partnership that owned the Texas Rangers. The city condemned the properties, evicting the former owners and seizing all 13 acres for the city-subsidized ballpark (see also this handy timeline).
Jezebel decided upon a more direct course of action. "Command and do not beg," she told her husband. Then she hired a couple flunkies to testify that Naboth had cursed God and the king -- crimes punishable by death. The sentence was quickly carried out. Naboth and his sons were stoned for his supposed blasphemy and his vineyard was seized for his supposed treachery. With Naboth out of the way, Ahab "got up and went down to take possession of Naboth's vineyard."
God sends the prophet Elijah to inform the king that God was not pleased by any of this: "I am going to bring disaster on you. I will consume your descendants and cut off from Ahab every last male in Israel. ... Dogs will devour Jezebel by the wall of Jezreel. Dogs will eat those belonging to Ahab who die in the city, and the birds of the air will feed on those who die in the country."
Throughout history this story has informed the Christian understanding of the role of the state. As the Geneva commentary puts it, "This example of monstrous cruelty the Holy Spirit leaves to us, to the intent that we should abhor all tyranny."
Ahab and Jezebel were tyrants because they acted as though their power had no limit. This story suggests that Ahab, at least, knew better -- he seemed to recognize that his power as king was limited by, among other things, Naboth's right to private property.
In the terms of our not-quite-achieved disagreement in the previous post, this supports some of what Scott has been saying: the right to private property is a vital check against the possibility of tyranny.
But it is not the only, nor the most important, such check. Nor is it the only, or the most important, human right. Like the power of the state, the right to private property is limited by the rule of law, by the competing claims of other rights, by custom, by morals and by a host of other factors implicit and explicit.
Naboth is not some Hayekian free-market enthusiast. He refuses to sell his vineyard because it is "the inheritance of my fathers." As such, it was his to sell, but only until the next year of Jubilee, when this tribal allotment would be restored to his family. The Jubilee law limited Naboth's right to "private" property as surely as it limited Ahab's royal power. To be a landowner or a king was really only a matter of stewardship. Neither the landowner nor the king is God. Naboth rejects the idea that his ownership of the vineyard is absolute, regarding that notion as a blasphemy worse than the false charge for which he is later condemned.

Posted by Fred Clark on Jun 07, 2005 at 10:49 AM | Permalink

So here in the United States of America, Jewish Kabalistic Jesuits, and Baptist Free Masons have lawyered their way into the control of a counterfit Jerusalem. MYSTERY BABYLON THE GREAT.
Well thats the way it looks to me.
With love in Christ
brother daniel

America is Mystery Babylon/Babylon the Great of the End Times

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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