Jesus Magnified the Ten Commandments

[Bob S]

Bob at the end, to follow what God said to follow is your choice.

Deu 4:2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

Deu 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.

Deu 4:40 Thou shalt keep therefore his statutes, and his commandments, which I command thee this day, that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee, and that thou mayest prolong thy days upon the earth, which the LORD thy God giveth thee, for ever.

Deu 5:10 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments.

Deu 5:29 O that there were such an heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep all my commandments always, that it might be well with them, and with their children for ever!

I have a few questions for your consideration JFF:

Did God give the Israelites commands in the Book of the Law? If you answer yes, then in Deut 5:29 God could only be well with them if they KEPT ALL OF THEM.

Why then are you only concerned with only ten of them?

Who has given you the authority to cull the commands in the book of the Law?

How did the Book of the Law earn a place on the Ark of the Covenant if it was not part of the covenant?

What is/was your reasoning for not believing the Book of the Law was not part of the Covenant?

Could my reasoning be correct?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Oh mine, what a work again, blurring waters. Let us keep it simple. Where are the two greatest commandments located? Outside of the ten commandments.

They are not in the ten and they are certainly not a citation from the ten "verbatim".

Scripture says otherwise ....


Rom 13:9 For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.


Where exactly do these commandments come from that make up the Second Greatest commandment to love our neighbor? Paul quoted directly from the Ten Commandments that deals with love to our neighbor.

Exo 20:13-17
13 “You shall not murder.
14 “You shall not commit adultery.
15 “You shall not steal.
16 “You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
17 “You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

Your argument appears to be with the Text.

The bible also defined the Greatest Commandment to love God with all our heart which comes from this same unit as demonstrated by Scripture. Thats what I love about the Scriptures, it really does define itself if one allows it to and why God told us not to lean on our own understanding, but in all ways, He will direct our path Pro 3:5-6 which He does through His word Psa 119:105.

If you have Scripture that proves otherwise, you are free to post instead of repeating that you don't agree, which is not a biblical argument.

 

[JesusFollowerForever]

I have a few questions for your consideration JFF:

Did God give the Israelites commands in the Book of the Law? If you answer yes, then in Deut 5:29 God could only be well with them if they KEPT ALL OF THEM.

yes! but here were talking about the gentiles, especially here on this forum where a majority think the commandments null and Obsolete.

Why then are you only concerned with only ten of them?

Because I have to start somewhere, and I am certain all ten have to be followed like I said before not to follow the letter of the Law written on the table of stone bu God Himself but because we Love God and want to. it is a choice people have to make.

Who has given you the authority to cull the commands in the book of the Law?

Who have given you the authority to say the ten commandments, the covenant is no more and obsolete?

I never culled the rest of the law of Moses but explained the differences and why. if I did push any part of the Law of Moses people would not listen so I go with the essentials.

How did the Book of the Law earn a place on the Ark of the Covenant if it was not part of the covenant?

it was not in or on the ark like I said before before the rest of the laws of Moses were placed beside the ark it means close to it but NOT INSIDE. "Take this Book of the Law and place it beside the Ark of the Covenant of the Lord your God. There it will remain as a witness against you." These laws complemented the ten commandments and were essential for the exiled israelites in the desert that used to be slaves in Egypt and worshipped false gods. these laws were put close to the ark, this is what it means, it was not attached to it.

What is/was your reasoning for not believing the Book of the Law was not part of the Covenant?

it was, and complemented it and some parts of it ( except all sacrificial laws) could certainly be obeyed many of them are still valid today. I have not made for myself a list but in essence I know witch ones and I will not discuss here at this time, but could later if some are interested.

Could my reasoning be correct?

For some parts yes!

 

[childeye 2]

yes! but here were talking about the gentiles, especially here on this forum where a majority think the commandments null and Obsolete.

The letter kills but the Spirit gives life. I think this would have something to do with the letter of the law being fulfilled by the Spirit of Christ and why the letter would be obsolete as a form of righteousness to a believer.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

The letter kills but the Spirit gives life. I think this would have something to do with the letter of the law being fulfilled by the Spirit of Christ and why the letter would be obsolete as a form of righteousness to a believer.

Can you please elaborate what you mean by the letter of the law. Many interpret this as we no longer need to keep God's law how it reads i.e. thou shalt have no other gods before Me, thou shalt not murder or breaking any of them literally etc. I can never see how this would be obsolete as a form of righteousness to a believer when it is God's righteousness Psa 119:172 Rom 7:12 (His version of right and wrong) for a believer, so we are not depending on our own version of righteousness (right and wrong), which is as fifthly rags..

The Spirit of Christ leads us to obey His commandments but its conditional through our love to Him and cooperation with Him

John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another [e]Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

God's Spirit leads us to God's Truth, not away

Jesus is the Truth John 14:6
All His commandments are Truth Psa 119:151
His Word is Truth John 17:17

1 John 3:24 Now he who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

 

[HIM]

You said there were no differences and I just showed through Scripture lots of differences, Moses is not God, so that's a difference.

God told Moses what to write.

I am going to have to go by why the Scriptures says in regards to the Ten Commandments, not being the law of Moses.

As if no one else is? Comments like yours quoted here are superficial and mean nothing in discussions like this when two parties are discussing Scripture or a point derived from faith. They should be avoided because they are inciteful due to implying the one you are speaking to is not.

And as was said never said the Ten were the Law of Moses

Never said it was.

"And there is no difference between God's Law and the Law of Moses" is what was said. NOT, the Ten Commandments, are the law of Moses."

God told Moses what to write because Israel requested Moses to speak lest they die. It is ALL God's Law, His Word, of His Spirit.

Also for the record, most Adventist do not teach only the Ten Commandments was placed in our hearts in the NC,

That is not true. Just heard Doug say the Ten were in one of his sermons. I believe it was in his recent series on David. He said nothing else other than the Ten. His silence speaks. It wasn't the first time either nor was he the only one. And if I may, I set and have sat in many Sabbath Schools and through many sermons and the same thing is proclaimed without any further information. Silence speaks.....

As a matter fact the Adventist church I go to now guest Speaker Tim Rumsey said it or someone did last night. Incidentally it is an ongoing series which started on Revelation and Daniel last night if you or any is interested.

Here is the presentation. Not sure when he said it. But he or someone last night during the broadcast did.

other laws added in addition, but the law God placed in our hearts and minds absolutely includes all Ten, just the way God wrote and spoke them, without the edits of man.

God said through Moses that His Word, His commandments and statutes contained in the Book of the Law that we are to keep was in our hearts and mouths so that we do it. This encapsulates so much more than just the Ten.

And as you know, He also said through Jeremiah that He would put His Law in our hearts and in our minds. The use of the word Law here is not just referring to the Ten given on Sinia. It is referring to the Book of the Law which would include the Ten. This is proven by what has already been established by Moses in Deuteronomy 30:10-14 as shared above. By the mouth of two or three wittnesses must a thing be established. And with that being known, here is the third. Ezekiel 36:27 says, "And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them."

With all this we see that it is God that works in us both to will and do His Good pleasure. This would include the Ten and His commandments and Statutes contained in the Book of the Law through His Spirit in our hearts and minds through Christ, and SO MUCH MORE.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

God told Moses what to write.

Of course He did, no one is disputing this, but human handwriting is not the same as God personally and supernaturally writing His own personal Testimony Exo 31:18 that no more was added Deut 5:22

As if no one else is? Comments like yours quoted here are superficial and mean nothing in discussions like this when two parties are discussing Scripture or a point derived from faith. They should be avoided because they are inciteful due to implying the one you are speaking to is not.

And as was said never said the Ten were the Law of Moses

"And there is no difference between God's Law and the Law of Moses" is what was said. NOT, the Ten Commandments, are the law of Moses."

God told Moses what to write because Israel requested Moses to speak lest they die. It is ALL God's Law, His Word, of His Spirit.

That is not true. Just heard Doug say the Ten were in one of his sermons. I believe it was in his recent series on David. He said nothing else other than the Ten. His silence speaks. It wasn't the first time either nor was he the only one. And if I may, I set and have sat in many Sabbath Schools and through many sermons and the same thing is proclaimed without any further information. Silence speaks.....

As a matter fact the Adventist church I go to now guest Speaker Tim Rumsey said it or someone did last night. Incidentally it is an ongoing series which started on Revelation and Daniel last night if you or any is interested.

Here is the presentation. Not sure when he said it. But he or someone last night during the broadcast did.

God said through Moses that His Word, His commandments and statutes contained in the Book of the Law that we are to keep was in our hearts and mouths so that we do it. This encapsulates so much more than just the Ten.

And as you know, He also said through Jeremiah that He would put His Law in our hearts and in our minds. The use of the word Law here is not just referring to the Ten given on Sinia. It is referring to the Book of the Law which would include the Ten. This is proven by what has already been established by Moses in Deuteronomy 30:10-14 as shared above. By the mouth of two or three wittnesses must a thing be established. And with that being known, here is the third. Ezekiel 36:27 says, "And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them."

With all this we see that it is God that works in us both to will and do His Good pleasure. This would include the Ten and His commandments and Statutes contained in the Book of the Law through His Spirit in our hearts and minds through Christ, and SO MUCH MORE.

I have watched about every sermon of Doug Batchelor's starting from the 90's he was my personal pastor for many years, I know what he preaches. He is one pastor of many pastors, I don't know of any SDA pastor that says there are no other laws aside from the Ten Commandments-but we do make a distinction between the two laws i.e. Ten Commandments and the law of Moses because God did. Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28 Exo 20:6 Deut 31:24-26. I am sorry if you think its mean that I believe these verses the way they read, its what I believe, I was referring to what I believe and I stand by it, not to be mean, it because I believe these verses are so clear. There is a distinction, but the law of Moses includes the Ten Commandments, no doubt as God's law is for all people and started way before the law of Moses.

Even the NT makes this same distinction, you will not find the Ten Commandments being called the law of Moses.

Jesus quoted from the Ten Commandments calling them the commandments of God

Mat 15:3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

The law of Moses is different

1 Cor 9:9 For it is written in the law of Moses, “You shall not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain.” Is it oxen God is concerned about?

There is nothing about muzzling an ox in the Ten Commandments. This along with every other law except for the Ten Commandments was handwritten by Moses placed beside the ark of the covenant, not inside the ark that was personally written by God.

 

[HIM]

Of course He did, no one is disputing this, but human handwriting is not the same as God personally and supernaturally writing His own personal Testimony Exo 31:18 that no more was added Deut 5:22

Love thy neighbor was added. Do not lay with animals was added. Do not fornicate was added. Man is not to lay with man as one would with woman was added. Do not eat unclean animals was added. Take care of our defecation properly was added. Shall we continue?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

other laws added in addition, but the law God placed in our hearts and minds absolutely includes all Ten, just the way God wrote and spoke them, without the edits of man.

Includes does not mean only

Love thy neighbor was added. Do not lay with animals was added. Do not fornicate was added. Man is not to lay with man as one would with woman was added. Do not eat unclean animals was added. Take care of our defecation properly was added. Shall we continue?

And as you know, He also said through Jeremiah that He would put His Law in our hearts and in our minds. The use of the word Law here is not just referring to the Ten given on Sinia. It is referring to the Book of the Law which would include the Ten. This is proven by what has already been established by Moses in Deuteronomy 30:10-14 as shared above. By the mouth of two or three wittnesses must a thing be established. And with that being known, here is the third. Ezekiel 36:27 says, "And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them."

With all this we see that it is God that works in us both to will and do His Good pleasure. This would include the Ten and His commandments and Statutes contained in the Book of the Law through His Spirit in our hearts and minds through Christ, and SO MUCH MORE.

But where was the Book of the law compared to the Ten Commandments? A distinction by design.

Deut 31: 24 So it was, when Moses had completed writing the words of this law in a book, when they were finished, 25 that Moses commanded the Levites, who bore the ark of the covenant of the Lord, saying: 26 “Take this Book of the Law, and put it beside the ark of the covenant of the Lord your God, that it may be there as a witness against you;

Ten Commandments under God's mercy seat inside the ark, not outside

Exo 40:20 He took the Testimony and put it into the ark, inserted the poles through the rings of the ark, and put the mercy seat on top of the ark.

Exo 20:6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

If everyone was obeying the Ten Commandments the way Jesus taught, , there would be no need for the law of Moses. If everyone was keeping the first commandment of the Ten, no one would break any law or place anything above our Creator and we would be living in harmony with His will. .

Why this distinction is so important, among other reasons, because there is a law that is temporary Gal 3:19 and a law that not a jot or tittle can pass Mat 5:18-19, because God said He would not alter His Words.

Would the law that would not pass come from the law handwritten by Moses placed outside the ark, not under the mercy seat of Christ set as a witness against or would it be the law the God of the Universe personally wrote, personally spoke placed where it is shielded under His mercy seat, His own personal Testimony Exo 31:18

Common sense should tell us, but in Scripture the sacrifices ended coming from the law of Moses, so something did pass form this law so not what Mat 5:18-19 Deut 4:2 Psa 89:34 is referring to which leaves the Ten Commandments written on the Authority of our Maker.

 

[HIM]

I have watched about every sermon of Doug Batchelor's starting from the 90's he was my personal pastor for many years, I know what he preaches. He is one pastor of many pastors, I don't know of any SDA pastor that says there are no other laws aside from the Ten Commandments-but we do make a distinction between the two laws i.e. Ten Commandments and the law of Moses because God did. Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28 Exo 20:6 Deut 31:24-26

Even the NT makes this same distinction, you will not find the Ten Commandments being called the law of Moses.

You did it again. NEVER SAID ,"the Ten Commandments are called the law of Moses." The post you responded to shows this from the other post. Please read what is being said to you. You do stuff like this a lot. Which is ironic when you claim you never heard Doug say this or that.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

You did it again. NEVER SAID ,"the Ten Commandments are called the law of Moses." The post you responded to shows this from the other post. Please read what is being said to you. You do stuff like this a lot. Which is ironic when you claim you never heard Doug say this or that.

HIM: And there is no difference between God's Law and the Law of Moses.

If there are no differences, there wouldn't be so many distinctions between the two in Scripture including the Ten Commandments, not being called the law of Moses, which you seem to agree.

I hope you have a nice Sabbath.

God bless.

 

[JesusFollowerForever]

Love thy neighbor was added. Do not lay with animals was added. Do not fornicate was added. Man is not to lay with man as one would with woman was added. Do not eat unclean animals was added. Take care of our defecation properly was added. Shall we continue?

Imagine 600000 israelites without these laws wandering in the desert for 40 years with little water, no instructions whatsoever, these laws had to be given and for different reasons.

 

[HIM]

Imagine 600000 israelites without these laws wandering in the desert for 40 years with little water, no instructions whatsoever, these laws had to be given and for different reasons.

Your point in saying this is lost to me due to the context of the conversation with SB

 

[JesusFollowerForever]

@HIM

I expanded a bit for more clarity;
The Law of Moses includes many rules and instructions that God gave to the people of Israel through Moses, but at the center of all these laws are the Ten Commandments. These Ten Commandments were spoken by God Himself and written by His own finger on stone. They are the foundation, the heart of the covenant, showing God’s values, how to love Him and how to live with others. These laws are detailed throughout the Torah. All the other laws grow out of these Ten Commandments and help people understand how to follow them in real life at that particular time.

This was especially important because the Israelites, around 600,000 men not counting women and children, had just come out of slavery in Egypt. They were in the desert for 40 years, and they had no proper education or instruction. They didn’t know how to live as a free and holy people. God had to teach them from the beginning, showing them what was right and what was wrong, how to treat each other, and how to worship Him properly.

For example, one of the Ten Commandments says, “Do not steal.” From this, the Law of Moses gave detailed rules like what to do if someone stole an animal or property, and how to make things right. This helped people understand how to apply that command in their daily lives.
Another command says, “Do not murder.” The Law of Moses explains the difference between killing by accident and killing on purpose, and what to do in each case. This taught the people to value life and act justly. The command to “Honor your father and mother” is expanded through rules about respecting elders, listening to parents, and caring for them. The law even gave warnings about the punishment for children who disrespected or hurt their parents. There were also many laws given for health and cleanliness, which were needed because the people were living together in camps in the desert. They had no hospitals or clean water systems like we have today. So God gave them instructions like washing after touching a dead body, staying outside the camp when sick, burning infected clothing, and how to handle food and waste. These laws were for their protection, keeping the community safe from disease and teaching them to live in a clean and orderly way.

So the Law of Moses didn’t replace the Ten Commandments, it explained them and built on them. It helped a large, untrained group of people learn how to live as God’s people, guided by His values of love, justice, truth, and holiness. The laws were a way to train their hearts and minds, to prepare them to be a nation set apart for God.

Happy Sabbath.

 

[childeye 2]

Can you please elaborate what you mean by the letter of the law. Many interpret this as we no longer need to keep God's law how it reads i.e. thou shalt have no other gods before Me, thou shalt not murder or breaking any of them literally etc. I can never see how this would be obsolete as a form of righteousness to a believer when it is God's righteousness Psa 119:172 Rom 7:12 (His version of right and wrong) for a believer, so we are not depending on our own version of righteousness (right and wrong), which is as fifthly rags..

The Spirit of Christ leads us to obey His commandments but its conditional through our love to Him and cooperation with Him

In response to the question above ---> What I mean is that the righteousness of the letter without the Spirit is a witness against us ---> that we all have sin, a disability in the flesh. I believe it's important to understand that the Spirit that fulfills the letter of the law comes by grace through faith. In this way God has made it so that we acknowledge God's Spirit as our only goodness and that we are not good of ourselves. Hence, we worship God in truth when we are thankful for His Spirit.

2 Corinthians 4:7
But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
Hebrews 8:13
13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

 

[trophy33]

Can you please elaborate what you mean by the letter of the law. Many interpret this as we no longer need to keep God's law how it reads i.e. thou shalt have no other gods before Me, thou shalt not murder or breaking any of them literally etc.

I do not believe you are really misunderstanding it so badly. But if it is really the case, then I will explain it to you: We keep "you shall not murder, you will have no other gods before me" etc, but not because it is in the Mosaic Law. That is all.

The Mosaic Law:
1) has ended
2) has never been given to Gentile Christians or to Gentiles as such

 

[SabbathBlessings]

In response to the question above ---> What I mean is that the righteousness of the letter without the Spirit is a witness against us ---> that we all have sin, a disability in the flesh. I believe it's important to understand that the Spirit that fulfills the letter of the law comes by grace through faith. In this way God has made it so that we acknowledge God's Spirit as our only goodness and that we are not good of ourselves. Hence, we worship God in truth when we are thankful for His Spirit.

2 Corinthians 4:7
But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.

Thank you for the response, but that didn't answer the question.

Is the spirit you speak of teaching us to keep God's law or is one being led away from keeping it. In the end is thou shalt not worship other gods, the letter of God's law being kept or not kept or any of these commandments Jesus speaks of not breaking the least of Mat 5:19 being kept or not kept by this spirit you speak of.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I do not believe you are really misunderstanding it so badly. But if it is really the case, then I will explain it to you: We keep "you shall not murder, you will have no other gods before me" etc, but not because it is in the Mosaic Law. That is all.

The Mosaic Law:
1) has ended
2) has never been given to Gentile Christians or to Gentiles as such

Can you please find one Scripture that says the first commandment in the Ten Commandments is the Mosaic law and not God's law. Because God claimed this unit of Ten Commandments as His Exo 31:18 Exo 20:6 Deut 4:13, not Moses. Moses is not God, never was never will be. He was an important prophet and was a type of Christ, but he was the creation, just as you and I are compared to the God of the Universe who never left it for man to write His holy and eternal law, His personal Testimony Exo 31:18.. God gave His Ten Commandments to His Church which is represented in Israel. God then wrote His law in our hearts and minds- still given to Israel, Heb 8:10 His church and we are grafted in by faith, not about Jew or Gentile, but about our faith Gal 3:26-29 those who have faith keep God's commandments, Rev 14:12 Just as Jesus did who if we abide in Him we will keep His commandments John 15:10 following in His footsteps 1 John 2:6

Since we have been through this before I probably won't respond further unless you provide and interesting Scripture I would like to comment on. Otherwise you be well.

 

[childeye 2]

Thank you for the response, but that didn't answer the question.

Is the spirit you speak of teaching us to keep God's law or are is one being led away from keeping it.

The question I answered was underlined in bold, and I answered it. Obviously, the Spirit that is God would not teach someone to sin. The Spirit would also not be teaching we can keep it apart from Him.

 

[trophy33]

Can you please find one Scripture that says the first commandment in the Ten Commandments is the Mosaic law and not God's law. Because God claimed this unit of Ten Commandments as His Exo 31:18 Exo 20:6 Deut 4:13, not Moses...

The whole book of Exodus you are taking it from is a part of the Mosaic Law. Genesis to Deuteronomy is Mosaic Law.

If you do not believe me, you can google it.