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The Sabbath is more than just a day of rest; it is the sign of God's covenant and His seal of authority over His people

BobRyan

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So why doesn’t this same passage also imply that WE MUST OBSERVE THE NEW MOON FEASTS AS WELL?
New moon Sabbath is not in the TEN which is included in the moral law of God included in the New Cov - as almost all denominations affirm even today.

Deut 5 says God spoke the TEN "and added no more" -- and from that we can see that what is in the TEN is supreme.

New Moon Sabbath is not in Gen 1-2:3 for all lmankind
New moon Sabbath is not in Mark 2:27 "made for mankind" at the "making of mankind" in Gen 1-2

At the time of the New Earth Rev 21 there are TWO Creation events - so having TWO creation memorial Sabbaths observed each month at that time is not an unreasonable reality to accept. In any case if you want to argue for New moon Sabbath prior to the New Earth of Is 66:22-23 feel free but my interest is in the Gen 2:1-3 Sabbath.
 
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Clare73

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Clean vs unclean is Gen 6 and 7 and 8 - long before priests or Jews or Moses
Does not alter what I said.
Gen 9 does not mention eating unclean ... rather it says "as the plants" are for food. And of course there are a great many plants that are not food for humans.
God gave them all among the plants and every moving thing that lives to be their food, no exceptions by God.
Gen 9 does not delete the clean-vs-unclean distinction already in place in chapters 8, and 7
Which was for sacrificial purposes, not for diet.
 
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trophy33

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New moon Sabbath is not in Mark 2:27 "made for mankind" at the "making of mankind" in Gen 1-2
I can see that you are still using your terrible private translation of Mark 2:27 and ignoring its context.
 
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BobRyan

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BobRyan said:
New moon Sabbath is not in Mark 2:27 "made for mankind" at the "making of mankind" in Gen 1-2
I can see that you are still using your terrible private translation of Mark 2:27 and ignoring its context.

Just like Matt 4:4 "mankind shall not live by bread alone but by every Word that proceeds from the mouth of God"

Or should that be "Jewish men shall not live by bread alone" in your translation??

IS 66:23 from one Sabbath to Sabbath, all (Jewish men?) mankind shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.”
 
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DamianWarS

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That is not how they said "Continual". There was the "continual burnt offering" Ex 29:38-46. But never is it "from Sabbath to Sabbath" or 'from year to year".
Exodus is legal, and Isaiah is prophetic. The genre is different, and we should expect different writing styles. I'm not sure what your point is, but I don't see how the passage doesn't champion continual worship.
 
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trophy33

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BobRyan said:
New moon Sabbath is not in Mark 2:27 "made for mankind" at the "making of mankind" in Gen 1-2
Terrible. Like a translation made by a machine. Have you ever learnt any foreign language?

Also, I notice you are not willing to quote the full logical piece, because the absurdity of your translation would be more obvious:

Then he said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. So (hóste) the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath.”
 
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BNR32FAN

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Jesus never taught anyone to eat unclean meat, He said it was an abomination. No where in Scripture does it says we should not keep our bodies healthy. Eating too much sugar causes lots of health problems and does defile our bodies which we are to keep holy as it is a dwelling place for the Holy Spirit.
Jesus said it’s not what goes into the body that defiles a person but what comes out that defiles him. Combine that with what Paul taught.

“Let no one seek his own good, but that of his neighbor. Eat anything that is sold in the meat market without asking questions for conscience’ sake; for the earth is the Lord’s, and all it contains. If one of the unbelievers invites you and you want to go, eat anything that is set before you without asking questions for conscience’ sake. But if anyone says to you, “This is meat sacrificed to idols,” do not eat it, for the sake of the one who informed you, and for conscience’ sake; I mean not your own conscience, but the other man’s; for why is my freedom judged by another’s conscience? If I partake with thankfulness, why am I slandered concerning that for which I give thanks?
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭10‬:‭24‬-‭30‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Gentiles meat markets contained all sorts of meats that were considered unclean according to the dietary laws including pork.

I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean. For if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died. Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil; for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. For he who in this way serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another. Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offense. It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine, or to do anything by which your brother stumbles. The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves. But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14‬:‭14‬-‭23‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭16‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Jesus said it’s not what goes into the body that defiles a person but what comes out that defiles him. Combine that with what Paul taught.

“Let no one seek his own good, but that of his neighbor. Eat anything that is sold in the meat market without asking questions for conscience’ sake; for the earth is the Lord’s, and all it contains. If one of the unbelievers invites you and you want to go, eat anything that is set before you without asking questions for conscience’ sake. But if anyone says to you, “This is meat sacrificed to idols,” do not eat it, for the sake of the one who informed you, and for conscience’ sake; I mean not your own conscience, but the other man’s; for why is my freedom judged by another’s conscience? If I partake with thankfulness, why am I slandered concerning that for which I give thanks?
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭10‬:‭24‬-‭30‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Gentiles meat markets contained all sorts of meats that were considered unclean according to the dietary laws including pork.

I know and am convinced in the Lord Jesus that nothing is unclean in itself; but to him who thinks anything to be unclean, to him it is unclean. For if because of food your brother is hurt, you are no longer walking according to love. Do not destroy with your food him for whom Christ died. Therefore do not let what is for you a good thing be spoken of as evil; for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. For he who in this way serves Christ is acceptable to God and approved by men. So then we pursue the things which make for peace and the building up of one another. Do not tear down the work of God for the sake of food. All things indeed are clean, but they are evil for the man who eats and gives offense. It is good not to eat meat or to drink wine, or to do anything by which your brother stumbles. The faith which you have, have as your own conviction before God. Happy is he who does not condemn himself in what he approves. But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin.
‭‭Romans‬ ‭14‬:‭14‬-‭23‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day
‭‭Colossians‬ ‭2‬:‭16‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬
I think its important not to cut off the context. I am not going to discuss Col 2:16 because you refuse to bring in the context and we can make the bible say anything we want by not allowing it to interpret Itself. We can close our ears to it, but it doesn't take away God's Truth.

Was Jesus talking about food when He said "it’s not what goes into the body that defiles a person but what comes out that defiles him" or was He using it as an illustration and said plainly what He was referring to which was never about food. The premise was not washing your hands before eating and used food as a parable, that wasn't even about food as Jesus clearly states.

Mat 15:1 Then the scribes and Pharisees who were from Jerusalem came to Jesus, saying, 2 “Why do Your disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people [c]draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”
10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

15 Then Peter answered and said to Him, “Explain this parable to us.”

16 So Jesus said, “Are you also still without understanding? 17 Do you not yet understand that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and is eliminated? 18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile a man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies. 20 These are the things which defile a man, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile a man.”

If you're comfortable eating something God deemed an abomination until His Second Coming Isa 66:17, that's a decision once can make, its all about decisions.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I think its important not to cut off the context. I am not going to discuss Col 2:16 because you refuse to bring in the context and we can make the bible say anything we want by not allowing it to interpret Itself. We can close our ears to it, but it doesn't take away God's Truth.

Was Jesus talking about food when He said that or was He using it as an illustration and said plainly what He was referring to which was never about food. The premise was not washing your hands before eating and used food as a parable, that wasn't even about food as Jesus clearly states.

Mat 15:1 Then the scribes and Pharisees who were from Jerusalem came to Jesus, saying, 2 “Why do Your disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people [c]draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”
10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

15 Then Peter answered and said to Him, “Explain this parable to us.”

16 So Jesus said, “Are you also still without understanding? 17 Do you not yet understand that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and is eliminated? 18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile a man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies. 20 These are the things which defile a man, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile a man.”
No you’re going to ignore everything Paul wrote instead of adding it all together because it contradicts your theology. I quoted 3 different passages from Paul and you’re just going to ignore all three of them.
 
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trophy33

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I think its important not to cut off the context. I am not going to discuss Col 2:16 because you refuse to bring in the context and we can make the bible say anything we want by not allowing it to interpret Itself. We can close our ears to it, but it doesn't take away God's Truth.

Was Jesus talking about food when He said "it’s not what goes into the body that defiles a person but what comes out that defiles him" or was He using it as an illustration and said plainly what He was referring to which was never about food. The premise was not washing your hands before eating and used food as a parable, that wasn't even about food as Jesus clearly states.

Mat 15:1 Then the scribes and Pharisees who were from Jerusalem came to Jesus, saying, 2 “Why do Your disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread.”

3 He answered and said to them, “Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, ‘Honor your father and your mother’; and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.’ 5 But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is a gift to God”— 6 then he need not honor his father [a]or mother.’ Thus you have made the [b]commandment of God of no effect by your tradition. 7 Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:

8 ‘These people [c]draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’ ”
10 When He had called the multitude to Himself, He said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man.”

12 Then His disciples came and said to Him, “Do You know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?”

13 But He answered and said, “Every plant which My heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted. 14 Let them alone. They are blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind leads the blind, both will fall into a ditch.”

15 Then Peter answered and said to Him, “Explain this parable to us.”

16 So Jesus said, “Are you also still without understanding? 17 Do you not yet understand that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and is eliminated? 18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile a man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies. 20 These are the things which defile a man, but to eat with unwashed hands does not defile a man.”

If you're comfortable eating something God deemed an abomination until His Second Coming Isa 66:17, that's a decision once can make, its all about decisions.
As happens quite frequently, synoptic gospels are not too consistent with the points they try to make. That is why it is useful to read it in all gospels. For example Mark interprets the passage as "all food is clean":

Mk 7:19 "For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)

You may or may not believe this note of the writer is inspired, but it is there.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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As happens quite frequently, synoptic gospels are not too consistent with the points they try to make. That is why it is useful to read it in all gospels. For example Mark interprets the passage as "all food is clean":

Mk 7:19 For it doesn’t go into their heart but into their stomach, and then out of the body.” (In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean.)

You may believe this note of the writer is inspired or not, but it is there.
That was not in the original Text, adding to Scripture will have some serious consequences when Jesus comes.
 
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trophy33

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That was not in the original Text, adding to Scripture will have some serious consequences when Jesus comes.
Who has the original text, you do? And who decides when is the text of Scripture finished and forbidden from adding? Most of the OT texts you refer to are actually compositions and editions through centuries, not written at once as a whole.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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No you’re going to ignore everything Paul wrote instead of adding it all together because it contradicts your theology.
Is Paul going to be your judge or is Christ? I can see why we have the stern warning with misunderstanding Paul.

Isa 66:17 “Those who sanctify themselves and purify themselves,
To go to the gardens
[a]After an idol in the midst,
Eating swine’s flesh and the abomination and the mouse,
Shall [b]be consumed together,” says the Lord.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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Who has the original text, you do?
Look in the Greek, it's not there it was added by new translations. They took the liberty of doing this and adding other things as well. Its not going to work out so well for them come Judgement Day Revelation 22:19 Pro 30:5-6
 
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trophy33

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Look in the Greek, it's not there it was added by new translations. They took the liberty of doing this and adding other things as well. Its not going to work out so well for them come Judgement Day Revelation 22:19 Pro 30:5-6
And who decides when is the text of Scripture finished and forbidden from adding? Most of the OT texts you refer to are actually compositions and editions through centuries, not written at once as a whole.
 
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BNR32FAN

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That was not in the original Text, adding to Scripture will have some serious consequences when Jesus comes.
I agree that there were texts that didn’t have that statement in them but the statement itself is supported by what Jesus said in conjunction to what Paul wrote as well.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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And who decides when is the text of Scripture finished and forbidden from adding? Most of the OT texts you refer to are actually compositions and editions through centuries, not written at once as a whole.
If its not in the transcript it was added by man.
 
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SabbathBlessings

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I agree that there were texts that didn’t have that statement in them but the statement itself is supported by what Jesus said in conjunction to what Paul wrote as well.
I guess we will find out soon enough.
 
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trophy33

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If its not in the transcript it was added by man.
That was not my question. My question was:

And who decides when is the text of Scripture finished and forbidden from adding? Most of the OT texts you refer to are actually compositions and editions through centuries, not written at once as a whole.
 
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BNR32FAN

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I guess we will find out soon enough.
Right so you’re still going to ignore the three passages I quoted from Paul in the meantime, right? There’s no parentheses in those passages.
 
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