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YEC is physically impossible

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Roderick Spode

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Only when taught to advance the cause of a sectarian religion or as science, which it is not. You can teach about it all you want. Just like you can teach about any other religion, including Christianity.
And which sectarian religion exactly would ID represent?
Nothing wrong with that, either although such a discussion would generally be too advanced for all but a few high school students.
No. ID cannot be taught in a Philosophy class at a public school/
It won't cause it--that part's up to you--but my point was it would not necessarily impede it, either. Christian mystics meditate and apparently find it useful.
If we juggle things around enough, teaching ID in a public school class might cause someone to become an atheist. There are people who believe we were created in alien labs. Superior biological entities.
No doubt. Looks like it should be done with training and knowledgeable supervision.
Yeah. Prayer is obviously a lot safer than meditation.
 
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Roderick Spode

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That bit of weirdness is all you've gotten out of
my careful explaining that there was no flood?
No. I didn't see anything new in your post to respond to.

Since science neither confirms or denies a creator, what is your take on creation via ex-nihilo?
 
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Roderick Spode

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Are you seriously saying that the famous biblical creationist authors (such as Dean Kenyon) of Of Pandas and People were referring to something other than biblical creation when they used the term "creationists", which they only changed to "design proponents" after the teaching of creationism in public schools was ruled unconstitutional in Edwards v. Aguilard by the US Supreme Court? That's just laughable, and that particular part of the ID scam was so transparently ludicrous that the judge in the Dover decision had no problem ruling against it.
Here's a big problem right off the bat!

Are you saying the word they used in the book that was eventually changed was creationists?
 
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Roderick Spode

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Of course it didn't -- THAT WAS THE WHOLE POINT of "Of Pandas and People" -- To hide their intent and source material under the guise of "science".
Sorry. I don't buy it. A woman is hired to meticulously scan over the book looking for evidence of religious agenda. Finds a word with a broad definition that had been changed to a term deemed more appropriate (a term that wasn't even used at the time of the original writing) to avoid confusion. And then claims it's smoking gun evidence.

If it was so obvious it was religious in nature, why the need to hire a philo vigilante to place it under a microscope?


[stuff snipped because the plot is lost. I'm not sure what it was replying to without digging backward on other pages.]

ID itself isn't unconstitutional. Teaching it as science in a public school is because it is religion which has no place being taught in a public school.
Thus the trial that was basically a circus. It's such a mess that the accusers are not sure if it's a constitutional issue, science issue, science class issue, or a public school issue in general.
 
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sjastro

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Are you aware that academia's attempt to introduce decimal time helped spark the French Revolution?
Citation please.
The French revolution began in 1789 and the implementation of the metric system in 1799.

If this is another one of your academic bashing attempts inspired by your pathological hatred of them, I'm sure you will take comfort that many academics perished during the revolution.
 
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d taylor

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Are you aware that academia's attempt to introduce decimal time helped spark the French Revolution?
-
AV1611VET,
You spend a lot of time around these science/Bible threads. Do these science christians who do not believe a literal reading of The Bible. Do they believe people like Noah, etc were real people or were just a figurative metaphor for the these stories.
 
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Astrid

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No. I didn't see anything new in your forpost to respond to.

Since science neither confirms or denies a creator, what is your take on creation via ex-nihilo?
For clarity, you believe in flood even though it:
is disproved? That is a matter of intellectual
dishonesy. Is that where you leave it?

As for your q., Ted Tegmarks ideas about a
mathmatical unuverse are intriguing.

But i dont concern myself much w theoretical
astropnysics.
 
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Astrid

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Citation please.
The French revolution began in 1789 and the implementation of the metric system in 1799.

If this is another one of your academic bashing attempts inspired by your pathological hatred of them, I'm sure you will take comfort that many academics perished during the revolution.
The poor hate the rich, the ugly hate the
beautiful, and theres those who hate the educated.
 
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Astrid

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Sorry. I don't buy it. A woman is hired to meticulously scan over the book looking for evidence of religious agenda. Finds a word with a broad definition that had been changed to a term deemed more appropriate (a term that wasn't even used at the time of the original writing) to avoid confusion. And then claims it's smoking gun evidence.

If it was so obvious it was religious in nature, why the need to hire a philo vigilante to place it under a microscope?



Thus the trial that was basically a circus. It's such a mess that the accusers are not sure if it's a constitutional issue, science issue, science class issue, or a public school issue in general.
Of course everything was studied and prepared
carefully.

You know that due diligence is the
duty and obligation of attorneys. Of course they
fine- tooth.

And if there is figurative " tape on lock at the
Watergate" they will find it. And the loser
says it wasnt fair. :D


You deny that ID, as it exists today is christian fundy creationism in thin disguise?
It sure isnt science.
It utterly false to pretend it is.
Why would you support it?

If someone ever discovers, say, one fact showing
design, then, its on its was to being science.

But so far, as with every other sorry attempt to back yec with science there isnt and never has been even one fact.

Lost, ten thousand to zero.

Complain that the referee wasnt fair.

Its embarrassing to behold.
 
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Astrid

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The art of science (dealing with creation) will give people their opinions and beliefs rename it evidence and present this with confidence and people believe it.
Actually there is no science
in creationism but otherwise
the description is correct. If
by "people" you mean creatioists.

Though in general they need faith, not
evidence.
And some of the more astute realize
there never will be any.
 
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BCP1928

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Except that Belgium doesn't have separation of church and state.
What difference does that make?
So something with religious implications was confirmed to be science?
Sure, why not? Of course, Le Maitre started by pitching his idea to other scientists, rather than trying to teach it to schoolchildren first,
 
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BCP1928

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And which sectarian religion exactly would ID represent?
Who knows what they would claim for themselves? Protestant certainly, they appear to be some sort of radical Calvinists.
No. ID cannot be taught in a Philosophy class at a public school/
Do you understand the difference between being taught and being taught about.?
If we juggle things around enough, teaching ID in a public school class might cause someone to become an atheist. There are people who believe we were created in alien labs. Superior biological entities.

Teaching ID is not likely to turn believers into atheists as long as they have been well trained in their own faith. But it's clear that you have never taught high school kids. They are smarter than you evidently take them for and trying to push such blatantly bogus science on them is not likely to warm them up to the God idea.
Yeah. Prayer is obviously a lot safer than meditation.
And sometimes indistinguishable from it.
 
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BCP1928

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BCP1928

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AV1611VET,
You spend a lot of time around these science/Bible threads. Do these science christians who do not believe a literal reading of The Bible. Do they believe people like Noah, etc were real people or were just a figurative metaphor for the these stories.
You should ask one yourself. I don't think AV knows or cares much about theology other than his own.
 
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sesquiterpene

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Here's a big problem right off the bat!

Are you saying the word they used in the book that was eventually changed was creationists?
Why yes I do. Here is a list of edits of the book, clearly showing the word creationists was changed to cdesign proponentsists in a mangled cut-and-paste. What exactly is the big problem that you thought existed?
 
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Astrid

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Why yes I do. Here is a list of edits of the book, clearly showing the word creationists was changed to cdesign proponentsists in a mangled cut-and-paste. What exactly is the big problem that you thought existed?
Darn those lawyers and scientists!

Always ferreting out the exact details!
 
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AV1611VET

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The French revolution began in 1789 and the implementation of the metric system in 1799.

French Revolutionary Time officially began on November 24, 1793 although conceptual work around the system had been going on since the 1750s. The French manufactured clocks and watches showing both decimal time and standard time on their faces (allowing for both conversion and confusion). These clock faces were spectacularly weird.

SOURCE
 
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AV1611VET

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AV1611VET,

You spend a lot of time around these science/Bible threads. Do these science christians who do not believe a literal reading of The Bible. Do they believe people like Noah, etc were real people or were just a figurative metaphor for the these stories.

Real people.
 
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AV1611VET

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For clarity, you believe in flood even though it: is disproved? That is a matter of intellectual dishonesty.

I don't think intellectual honesty should be based on the findings of science.

Was Galileo placed on house arrest because of "intellectual dishonesty"?
 
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