Flat Earth And Christianity

[prodromos]

Whose avatar pic? Mine is a picture of my grandson at his first birthday party, and I can assure you he was unarmed.

Those disposable nappies can be easily weaponized!
(and the armed avatar was Paulos23)

 

[Mark Quayle]

Apparently my sense of humor isn't shared by some folks.

Maybe there's something going on between that blood drinking cult in India, and Indiana Jones.

 

[Jipsah]

Maybe there's something going on between that blood drinking cult in India, and Indiana Jones.

I do belong to a blood drinking cult. "I would rather have pure blood with the Pope, than drink mere wine with the Enthusiasts. " Martin Luther

 

[ViaCrucis]

To quote the often-quoted good doctor,

"Usually, even a non-believer knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other elements of this world, about the motion and orbit of the stars and even their size and relative positions, about the predictable eclipses of the sun and moon, the cycles of the years and the seasons, about the kinds of animals, shrubs, stones, and so forth, and this knowledge he holds as being certain from reason and experience.

Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for a non-believer to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn. The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scriptures are criticized as unlearned men.

If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think the pages are full of falsehoods and on facts which they themselves have learned from experience and the light of reason? Reckless and incompetent expounders of Holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although 'they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion.'" - St. Augustine of Hippo, De Genesi ad Literam

-CryptoLutheran

 

[FireDragon76]

To quote the often-quoted good doctor,

"Usually, even a non-believer knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other elements of this world, about the motion and orbit of the stars and even their size and relative positions, about the predictable eclipses of the sun and moon, the cycles of the years and the seasons, about the kinds of animals, shrubs, stones, and so forth, and this knowledge he holds as being certain from reason and experience.

Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for a non-believer to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking nonsense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn. The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scriptures are criticized as unlearned men.

If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think the pages are full of falsehoods and on facts which they themselves have learned from experience and the light of reason? Reckless and incompetent expounders of Holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although 'they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion.'" - St. Augustine of Hippo, De Genesi ad Literam

-CryptoLutheran

I am convinced this is one of the single most important things Augustine every wrote. And it's more pertinent now than ever. So many controversies could be avoided, if we didn't insist on weaponizing religion against science.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

"The MOTION And Orbit Of The STARS" - St. Augustine of Hippo, De Genesi ad Literam

It's Literally Right There, Clear As Day.

 

[ViaCrucis]

It's Literally Right There, Clear As Day.

I'd expect Augustine to speak about the motion and orbit of the stars because while Augustine knew the earth was round, what he didn't know is that the earth orbited the sun, spinning upon its axis, and thus the motion of the stars was, primarily, only apparent motion.

Moreover, Augustine was not actually wrong to speak of stars as having motion and orbits--because they in fact do. Only the earth isn't the center point of their motion or orbit. Rather all the stars in our galaxy move relative to one another, and most importantly, orbit around the galactic center. And this is repeated throughout the many galaxies of our material universe--and these galaxies themselves are in motion and relative to one another.

Augustine, of course, lived at a time when he couldn't know almost any of that. However the wisdom expressed in his words are clear as day: When the plainness of evidence is staring you right in the face, don't try and use Scripture to go against observable objective reality, you aren't doing Scripture a service, you are making Scripture look stupid and unreliable; and it doesn't do Christianity any service, because it only brings Christianity--and literally billions of believers all over the world--under a mockery. Not a mockery on account of Christ, oh no, that would be blessed; but rather mockery because the ignorance of some Faithful becomes associated with all the Faithful.

This is self-evident, for Christians in the 21st century, viewed through the lens of popular culture, is that of science-denying bigots who are willing to toss our most sacred principles and values into the fire at a moment's notice, and that we are known not by our love as disciples of Jesus, but as a people who look as far from Christ as day is to night. So much so that, one of the foremost moral philosophers of the 20th century, Mahatma Gandhi could say, "I like your Christ, but I do not like your Christians; your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

When we have received, as the word of God, the utmost commandment to love and be known by our love, and that through our love we should be known as the people of Jesus, and that we claim to worship, and follow, the God who made all things, both things above and things below; and yet we deny the work of His hands, calling Him a liar, and misrepresent Him over and again. And worse, "true religion" becomes a Pharisaical farce of hypocrisy and pietistic theater.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

I'd expect Augustine to speak about the motion and orbit of the stars because while Augustine knew the earth was round, what he didn't know is that the earth orbited the sun, spinning upon its axis, and thus the motion of the stars was, primarily, only apparent motion.

Moreover, Augustine was not actually wrong to speak of stars as having motion and orbits--because they in fact do. Only the earth isn't the center point of their motion or orbit. Rather all the stars in our galaxy move relative to one another, and most importantly, orbit around the galactic center. And this is repeated throughout the many galaxies of our material universe--and these galaxies themselves are in motion and relative to one another.

Augustine, of course, lived at a time when he couldn't know almost any of that. However the wisdom expressed in his words are clear as day: When the plainness of evidence is staring you right in the face, don't try and use Scripture to go against observable objective reality, you aren't doing Scripture a service, you are making Scripture look stupid and unreliable; and it doesn't do Christianity any service, because it only brings Christianity--and literally billions of believers all over the world--under a mockery. Not a mockery on account of Christ, oh no, that would be blessed; but rather mockery because the ignorance of some Faithful becomes associated with all the Faithful.

This is self-evident, for Christians in the 21st century, viewed through the lens of popular culture, is that of science-denying bigots who are willing to toss our most sacred principles and values into the fire at a moment's notice, and that we are known not by our love as disciples of Jesus, but as a people who look as far from Christ as day is to night. So much so that, one of the foremost moral philosophers of the 20th century, Mahatma Gandhi could say, "I like your Christ, but I do not like your Christians; your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

When we have received, as the word of God, the utmost commandment to love and be known by our love, and that through our love we should be known as the people of Jesus, and that we claim to worship, and follow, the God who made all things, both things above and things below; and yet we deny the work of His hands, calling Him a liar, and misrepresent Him over and again. And worse, "true religion" becomes a Pharisaical farce of hypocrisy and pietistic theater.

-CryptoLutheran

The Stars ARE Moving.

There is no other explanation or wall of text needed

 

[Paulos23]

The Stars ARE Moving.

There is no other explanation or wall of text needed

Relative to what though?

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

Relative to what though?

The Star are moving not the earth.

 

[Paulos23]

The Star are moving not the earth

Both are moving. If the earth is not than many of those stars are moving faster than the speed of light to explain their movements in the sky based on how far off they are based off of parallax.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax&ved=2ahUKEwiiypH2iYeBAxU_J0QIHbGBDHIQFnoECA4QAQ&usg=AOvVaw3ORPgIc3FUb7M9OcC5b89G

 

[Hans Blaster]

The Stars ARE Moving.

There is no other explanation or wall of text needed

Astronomers are well aware that stars are moving, but the patterns that are easily detectable to ancient and medieval peoples (like those mentioned in this thread) arise from the motion of the Earth (rotation and orbital motion) and the motion of stars relative to each other require sophisticated measurements.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

Heliocentrism Is A Lie.

Why is the guy in your avatar making the "Hidden Hand Gesture" ?

Hmmm ... I wonder what group would want the general populous to believe that they are spinning around the sun ...

 

[Lost4words]

Amazing to think that in these modern, scientific times, people actually believe that the earth is flat while everything else in the universe is a sphere!!!!

 

[Hans Blaster]

Heliocentrism Is A Lie.

It is outdated. The Sun is not the center of the Universe and we know that now, but it is the center of the Solar system.

Why is the guy in your avatar making the "Hidden Hand Gesture" ?

I assume you are talking to me because of this reference.

1. If you reply to a particular person, use the "quote" feature at the bottom of the post you are replying to. It is standard courtesy online.

2. If you don't know who "the Guy" is you should get a better understanding of US history. Alternatively, we can have him come back and give your town the "Atlanta treatment".

3. It was a common way to pose for photographs.

Hmmm ... I wonder what group would want the general populous to believe that they are spinning around the sun ...

People who like facts.

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

People who like facts.

You mean Satanic Illuminists and Freemasons ?

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

scientific times

 

[Paulos23]

Conspiracy theories do not add to your argument @Jude1:3Contendforthefaith, they are a distraction. What evidence do you have for the Earth not moving?

 

[Jude1:3Contendforthefaith]

"He set The Earth on it's foundations, Never To Be Moved."
• Psalm 104:5


Hmmm... I wonder who exactly would want us to believe that the earth is moving...

"the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, Who Deceives The Whole World; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."
• Revelation 12:9

 

[The Hour IS AT HAND]

"He set The Earth on it's foundations, Never To Be Moved."
• Psalm 104:5


Hmmm... I wonder who exactly would want us to believe that the earth is moving...

"the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, Who Deceives The Whole World; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."
• Revelation 12:9

You got to remember man, only 8 people were saved before the flood. Narrow is the gate.
1Pe 3:20 because they formerly did not obey, when God's patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water.