THE RULE OF FAITH AND PRACTICE IS ALWAYS SCRIPTURE "ALONE" 2

[Carl Emerson]

Really?

Lets look carefully at your quote...

Question.

"If the scriptures teach us that "faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God" (Romans 10:17) and we are saved by God's grace through faith that comes from Gods' Word (Ephesians 2:8-9) and again whatsoever is not of faith is sin according to Gods' Word (Romans 14:23) and again without faith that comes from Gods' Word it is impossible to please God (Hebrews 11:6) how can we have Gods' salvation and how can the scriptures not be the only rule of faith when our faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God?"

Romans 10:7

"Faith comes from hearing the Word of Christ..."

This may come via the Bible or it may not.

Plenty of folks hear God's Spirit drawing them before they get their hands on a Bible.

It is wrong to interpret that verse as - Faith comes from reading the Bible.

Faith comes from hearing Jesus.

Ephesians 2 8,9

No problem.

Romans 14:23 again your use of God's Word refers to Scripture, but His Grace is much broader than that.

Hebrews 11:6 - same problem and you have created a circular argument by defining the Bible as the Word of God instead of the word of God. I have said many times - the Bible without the Spirit is dead or worse.

So by defining the Bible this way, there is no room for God to speak any other way. God uses the scripture and it is an absolute reference to weighing what is God's Word but it clearly does not include the full council of God. Adequate yes, but not exhaustive.

You are convinced that the Church lost the plot in early church days and you need a modern day prophet to get us all back on track. This negates the promises of God to be faithful to His Church and inspire its leaders.

Please refrain from saying I have no arguments. I raise serious issues.

Strange when you lean so heavily on the words of a latter day prophet for interpretation to claim the Bible alone is the only rule of faith. Your presentation of 'truth' is consistently through the filter of E G White.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Really?

Lets look carefully at your quote...



Romans 10:7

"Faith comes from hearing the Word of Christ..."

This may come via the Bible or it may not.

Plenty of folks hear God's Spirit drawing them before they get their hands on a Bible.

It is wrong to interpret that verse as - Faith comes from reading the Bible.

Faith comes from hearing Jesus.

Ephesians 2 8,9

No problem.

Romans 14:23 again your use of God's Word refers to Scripture, but His Grace is much broader than that.

Hebrews 11:6 - same problem and you have created a circular argument by defining the Bible as the Word of God instead of the word of God. I have said many times - the Bible without the Spirit is dead or worse.

So by defining the Bible this way, there is no room for God to speak any other way. God uses the scripture and it is an absolute reference to weighing what is God's Word but it clearly does not include the full council of God. Adequate yes, but not exhaustive.

You are convinced that the Church lost the plot in early church days and you need a modern day prophet to get us all back on track. This negates the promises of God to be faithful to His Church and inspire its leaders.

Please refrain from saying I have no arguments. I raise serious issues.

Strange when you lean so heavily on the words of a latter day prophet for interpretation to claim the Bible alone is the only rule of faith. Your presentation of 'truth' is consistently through the filter of E G White.

How do we hear Jesus today Carl and how do you know that voice or Spirit is from God or not from God? There is indeed the spoken Word of God which is today given to us as the written Word of God (scripture). There is also not a single scripture you have provided in your post that disagrees with a single thing that I have been sharing here. If you disagree let's look at the detail as you have not provided any accept to provide scriptures that agree with what I have already been posting in the OP and that is the scriptures are the only rule of faith.

According to the scriptures Gods' Spirit works through the Word of God (scripture) not separate from it according to John 6:63 and if the Spirit that is talking to you is in disagreement with Gods' Word it is not God's Spirit. Which is the reason why we are to test the Spirit to see if they are of God or not (John 4:1; 1 John 2:3-4) which is why the scriptures are the only test and rule of faith and the very topic of this OP because if what you believe is the Spirit of God leads you away from faith and obedience to Gods' Word then that is not Gods' Spirit which is why scripture is the only rule of faith. If you do not want to answer the questions in the OP just say so. No need to make arguments no one is talking about.

..................

Question.

"If the scriptures teach us that "faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God" (Romans 10:17) and we are saved by God's grace through faith that comes from Gods' Word (Ephesians 2:8-9) and again whatsoever is not of faith is sin according to Gods' Word (Romans 14:23) and again without faith that comes from Gods' Word it is impossible to please God (Hebrews 11:6) how can we have Gods' salvation and how can the scriptures not be the only rule of faith when our faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God?"

Take Care Carl

 

[Carl Emerson]

Sadly I can only conclude that you are either unwilling to engage with me about the matters I raise or are unable to understand.

As I have pointed out in the past James says the Wisdom from Above is reasonable (able to be discussed) Sadly you refuse to discuss anything that isn't a literal quote from scripture so this limits our exchange and potentially frustrates His Wisdom.

So all I can do is to warn the readers that your offering from a latter day 'prophet' effectively condemns Billions of believers who don't worship on Saturday.

You ask..

How do we hear Jesus today Carl and how do you know that voice or Spirit is from God or not from God?

Why do you ask?

Are you unsure how to ascertain when He speaks?

If you are genuinely asking my help I can certainly give you some pointers.

Hearing God is a huge part of my walk with Him.

That is a strange question from someone claiming to have a hotline to God...

You quote John 6:63 as evidence that the Holy Spirit only speaks through scripture....

63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh provides no benefit; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit, and are life.

Using this scripture to prove God only speaks through scripture is drawing a very long bow - the passage is not referring to scripture at all. It is speaking about the very words of God Himself, many of which are not recorded in Scripture. Scripture testifies about this itself.

Your agenda is to get folks to accept that the Bible is the last word on truth, then introduce a later day legalistic interpretation to guilt them into Saturday Sabbath keeping. Readers beware.

Anyone claiming to be hearing a different interpretation is considered deceived.

I have raised many issues that other readers understand are critical to the discussion - I am sorry that you refuse to engage and give credence to your position.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Sorry I am not willing to engage in arguments no one is arguing about or talking about. Please stop trying to claim I am saying things I have never said. Please re-read the OP and let's discuss it.

Thanks.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Sadly I can only conclude that you are either unwilling to engage with me about the matters I raise or are unable to understand.

How can you conclude that I am unwilling to engage with you when all you have done is to simply ignore most of my post you are quoting from while seeking to make arguments no one is arguing about while ignoring the OP?

As I have pointed out in the past James says the Wisdom from Above is reasonable (able to be discussed) Sadly you refuse to discuss anything that isn't a literal quote from scripture so this limits our exchange and potentially frustrates His Wisdom.

According to the scriptures Gods Word is wisdom (2 Timothy 3:15). I made the OP asked the questions your the one not answering them and seeking to talk about things no one is arguing about and refusing to talk about the questions in the OP and ignore my post to you. Perhaps you need to consider the beam that your not seeing before considering the splinters of others?

So all I can do is to warn the readers that your offering from a latter day 'prophet' effectively condemns Billions of believers who don't worship on Saturday.[

Believe and do whatever you wish. According to the scriptures there is nothing hidden that shall not be revealed (Matthew 10:26). It is the Words of God we accept or reject that will become our judge come judgement day *John 12:47-48. Sadly for the many it will be too late at that time according to Jesus *Matthew 7:21-23.

Why do you ask? Are you unsure how to ascertain when He speaks? If you are genuinely asking my help I can certainly give you some pointers. Hearing God is a huge part of my walk with Him. That is a strange question from someone claiming to have a hotline to God.

I was not asking the question I asked you for me dear friend. I asked you the question "How do we hear Jesus today and how do you know that voice or Spirit is from God or not from God?" as a help to you. The rest of the post you do not want to respond to answers the question for you by saying, according to the scriptures Gods' Spirit works through the Word of God (scripture) not separate from it in John 6:63 and if the Spirit that is talking to you is in disagreement with Gods' Word it is not God's Spirit. Which is the reason why we are to test the Spirit to see if they are of God or not (John 4:1; 1 John 2:3-4) which is why the scriptures are the only test and rule of faith and the very topic of this OP because if what you believe is the Spirit of God leads you away from faith and obedience to Gods' Word then that is not Gods' Spirit which is why scripture is the only rule of faith. If you do not want to answer the questions in the OP just say so. No need to make arguments no one is talking about.

You quote John 6:63 as evidence that the Holy Spirit only speaks through scripture....63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh provides no benefit; the words that I have spoken to you are spirit, and are life. Using this scripture to prove God only speaks through scripture is drawing a very long bow - the passage is not referring to scripture at all. It is speaking about the very words of God Himself, many of which are not recorded in Scripture. Scripture testifies about this itself.

How do you know what words Jesus spoke today? Yep scripture which is the only rule of faith because it is God's Word. Do you really want to try and make an argument here that the bible is not God's recorded written Word given to the world when the scriptures say all scripture is "God breathed"? Sorry dear friend but you are free to believe whatever you wish. I prefer Gods' Word (scripture) which is the only rule of faith.

Your agenda is to get folks to accept that the Bible is the last word on truth, then introduce a later day legalistic interpretation to guilt them into Saturday Sabbath keeping. Readers beware.

Not really dear friend. I have no agenda other to share Gods' Word (scripture) which is the only rule of faith which for some reason your unwilling to discuss here preferring false claims and accusations while making arguments no one is arguing about. Did you want to discuss the OP now and the questions asked there?

Take care Carl

 

[Leaf473]

Because you are mixing up two definitions of 'God's Word'.

Building on what you're saying,

Luke says In the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar,
when Pontius Pilate was governor of Judea, Herod tetrarch of Galilee, his brother Philip tetrarch of Iturea and Traconitis, and Lysanias tetrarch of Abilene,
during the high-priesthood of Annas and Caiaphas,
the word of God came to John son of Zechariah.

I don't think John the Baptist suddenly knew every genealogy in Chronicles or the personal greetings in the New Testament epistles.

Word of God there means a message or communication from God.

So faith definitely comes when people hear from God.

That can be the scriptures, some part of the scriptures, or something not included in the scriptures.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Building on what you're saying,

Luke says In the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar,
when Pontius Pilate was governor of Judea, Herod tetrarch of Galilee, his brother Philip tetrarch of Iturea and Traconitis, and Lysanias tetrarch of Abilene,
during the high-priesthood of Annas and Caiaphas,
the word of God came to John son of Zechariah.

I don't think John the Baptist suddenly knew every genealogy in Chronicles or the personal greetings in the New Testament epistles.

Word of God there means a message or communication from God.

So faith definitely comes when people hear from God.

That can be the scriptures, some part of the scriptures, or something not included in the scriptures.

Then we have Gods' Word that disagrees with your words that says. 2 Timothy 3:16 [16], All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. Now if faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God (Romans 10:17) and our salvation is by Gods' grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8), how can you have salvation without believing Gods' Word (John 3:36) when whatsoever is not of faith (unbelief) is sin *Romans 14:23 and without faith in Gods' Word it is impossible to please God (Hebrews 11:6)? If your trying to make an argument that only some of the scriptures are Gods' inspired Word then we are in disagreement according to the scriptures which say that all scriptures is given by inspiration of God.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Please...

John the Baptist being spoken to by the Holy Spirit doesn't contradict scripture in any way.

The fact is IN scripture - so what is the problem?

 

[pescador]

Please...

John the Baptist being spoken to by the Holy Spirit doesn't contradict scripture in any way.

The fact is IN scripture - so what is the problem?

Luke 1:11-17, "Then an angel of the Lord appeared to him [Zechariah], standing at the right side of the altar of incense. When Zechariah saw him, he was startled and was gripped with fear. But the angel said to him: “Do not be afraid, Zechariah; your prayer has been heard. Your wife Elizabeth will bear you a son, and you are to call him John. He will be a joy and delight to you, and many will rejoice because of his birth, for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even before he is born. He will bring back many of the people of Israel to the Lord their God. And he will go on before the Lord, in the spirit and power of Elijah, to turn the hearts of the parents to their children and the disobedient to the wisdom of the righteous—to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.”

There is no basis for disagreement. He was filled with the Holy Spirit in the womb. He wasn't the first prophet to be spoken to by the Holy Spirit. In fact, all God's true prophets were spoken to by the Holy Spirit.

 

[Carl Emerson]

LGW would claim his latter day 'prophet' E G White was spoken to direct as well - so why insist that God's only channel of communication is through scripture?

Scripture itself does not agree with this.

The Apostles were spoken to direct.

What is the problem?

 

[Leaf473]

Please...

John the Baptist being spoken to by the Holy Spirit doesn't contradict scripture in any way.

The fact is IN scripture - so what is the problem?

I agree with what Carl said.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Please...John the Baptist being spoken to by the Holy Spirit doesn't contradict scripture in any way.The fact is IN scripture - so what is the problem?

Please.... Who said to you that John the Baptist being spoken to by the Holy Spirit contradict scripture in any way? If no one has ever said to you that the Holy Spirit speaking to John the Baptist contradicts the scripture why are you pretending that they have? If we are all in agreement that the Holy Spirit speaking to John the Baptist is not a contradiction of the scriptures then what is your argument and who are you arguing with? - You have no argument because no one is in disagreement. What your not considering however is who is "John the Baptist" He was a Jew and his parents were the Priest Zechariah and Elizabeth at the time *Luke 1:5-6. Now let's be honest. Do you think that John the Baptist might have been taught the scriptures from his Jewish parents who were blameless in God's eye? What you may also want to consider is that God only gives His Spirit to those who obey His Word *Acts of the Apostles 5:32. How do you know about John the Baptist today or anything from the old and new testament Carl? *see Romans 10:17. Also how do we know how to obey God?

Take Care.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Your responce to Leaf's post #166 was as follows...

Then we have Gods' Word that disagrees with your words

What exactly that Leaf wrote do you claim is unscriptural?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

Your responce to Leaf's post #166 was as follows...What exactly that Leaf wrote do you claim is unscriptural?

See post # 167 linked.

 

[Leaf473]

@LoveGodsWord,

I'm at a loss to see which part of my post you were disagreeing with.

Were you disagreeing with this part?

I don't think John the Baptist suddenly knew every genealogy in Chronicles or the personal greetings in the New Testament epistles.

(I'm heading for bed now, I plan to check back in the morning. Peace be with you all.)

 

[LoveGodsWord]

@LoveGodsWord,

I'm at a loss to see which part of my post you were disagreeing with.

Were you disagreeing with this part?


(I'm heading for bed now, I plan to check back in the morning. Peace be with you all.)

Maybe it is late your time. See post # 167 linked. I said in the linked post that if your trying to make an argument that only some of the scriptures are Gods' inspired Word then we are in disagreement. According to the scriptures all scriptures is given by inspiration of God (2 Timothy 3:16).

 

[LoveGodsWord]

LGW would claim his latter day 'prophet' E G White was spoken to direct as well - so why insist that God's only channel of communication is through scripture?

Scripture itself does not agree with this.

The Apostles were spoken to direct.

What is the problem?

Why pretend I am saying things I have never said or believe again? I never once insisted that the scriptures are Gods' only channel of communication. Your post here only shows you did not read the OP. Please read the OP. What is being discussed here is that scripture is the only rule of faith. It is the test to know if someone is from God or not from God *1 John 4:1; 1 John 2:3-4. There was some questions asked of you in post # 172 linked. Did you want to have a go at answering those?

 

[Carl Emerson]

Why pretend I am saying things I have never said or believe again? I never once insisted that the scriptures are Gods' only channel of communication. Your post here only shows you did not read the OP. Please read the OP. What is being discussed here is that scripture is the only rule of faith. It is the test to know if someone is from God or not from God *1 John 4:1; 1 John 2:3-4. There was some questions asked of you in post # 172 linked. Did you want to have a go at answering those?

I don't pretend thank you...

I quote you...

According to the scriptures Gods' Spirit works through the Word of God (scripture) not separate from it according to John 6:63

...

What part of Leaf's post #166 do you claim is unscriptural?

 

[LoveGodsWord]

I don't pretend thank you...

Yes you did your making posts pretending I am saying things I have never said then try and build arguments no one is arguing about. I have pointed this out to you more than once now.

I quote you...

Me saying "According to the scriptures Gods' Spirit works through the Word of God (scripture) not separate from it according to John 6:63" is quoting scripture which is Gods Word not my words. That disagree with your words that are not Gods' Word. This has nothing to do with you pretending I say things I have never said then try and build arguments no one is arguing about.

What part of Leaf's post #166 do you claim is unscriptural?

See post # 176 linked

Take Care Carl

 

[Carl Emerson]

John 6:63 does not mean what you claim - it doesn't even mention the scripture.

You said...

According to the scriptures Gods' Spirit works through the Word of God (scripture) not separate from it according to John 6:63

You added the word 'Scripture' which is not in the text. Adding to the words of scripture is a serious issue.

I am not pretending anything. I am quoting your argument which is false.

Please answer plainly...

What part of leaf's post #166 was not biblical ??????