How to walk in the Spirit.

[Sidon]

"You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone." James 2:24

If you will study a little bit more, those verses in James, you will discover the context of your verse, you posted, as you don't understand it, yet.

Here is the context.

James speaking......>"i will show YOU YOU YOU my faith, by my works"..

So, that is the context of your verse........Its James showing the people who are watching him, his works, that prove his faith.

So, your verse, and the one i posted, are a context......They are all about fruit bearing in front of other people, as this is proof you dont have "dead faith".

James says.....>"i'll show YOU my works"..
And he does not say...."I'll show GOD my works".

So, your verse, is talking about public fruit bearing, as how else can anyone see your faith, if you have no fruit, no spiritual fruit, = no works.

 

[Sidon]

is obligated to obey the ten commandments,.

Well 2 things.

Paul the Apostle does not tell you to keep commandments or the law to try to get God to accept you or keep you.
He says that this teaching, is "dung", because it rejects the Blood of Jesus.

Also, its fine to keep the commandments, understanding that they can't save you, if you keep them.
The believers keep them, because they are a life saver. A moral boundary. And if you live outside them, your life will be destroyed.
So, we keep them, for that reason, but never to try to stay saved, or become righteous by keeping them.

 

[Sidon]

Ok, so that I understand your beliefs on this, one born again will never sin-the old man is gone and can never act up, can never sin, again.

If you understood what Paul is teaching, that im teaching, you would not be talking about Old Testament covenant Law, everytime you post to me.
So, you dont understand.

Also, the carnal mind, is the problem, that you are talking about.
The carnal mind is the natural mind and this is an enemy of God's Grace.
Its the enemy because is will always reject it, and try to impose self righteousness in place of God's Righteousness.
So,
a real believer has to get out of the mind of "self saving", to get into the mind that understands God's Grace.

 

[Sidon]

Yes, that is what quench means. Eventually full apostasy will prevail if one quenches His Spirit permanently.

Its what it means to you. "quenched"..
I get it.

However, if the holy Spirit is living in you, that is not going to change.
See, "Christ in you the hope of Glory", does not change because you have a bad day, or a temper tantrum.

God, who lives in us, because we are now his TEMPLE< if we are born again, remains, because we remain "One with God, and Christ".

How you feel, has no effect on the BLood Atonement.
how you act or behave, has no effect on God's Grace, once you have "the Gift of Salvation".
See, you can't stop being born again, because of a mood swing, or a hateful attitude.
"birth" cant be stopped by behavior that comes later.

Let say you take a gun and shoot your neighbor.
Well, do you stop being born of your mother because you did something horrible?

Its the same with the Spiritual Birth.
What you do in your body, does not end the spiritual birth.

You can never stop being born......and you can never stop being born again.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Its what it means to you. "quenched"..
I get it.

However, if the holy Spirit is living in you, that is not going to change.
See, "Christ in you the hope of Glory", does not change because you have a bad day, or a temper tantrum.

God, who lives in us, because we are now his TEMPLE< if we are born again, remains, because we remain "One with God, and Christ".

How you feel, has no effect on the BLood Atonement.
how you act or behave, has no effect on God's Grace, once you have "the Gift of Salvation".
See, you can't stop being born again, because of a mood swing, or a hateful attitude.
"birth" cant be stopped by behavior that comes later.

Let say you take a gun and shoot your neighbor.
Well, do you stop being born of your mother because you did something horrible?

Its the same with the Spiritual Birth.
What you do in your body, does not end the spiritual birth.

You can never stop being born......and you can never stop being born again.

Have you read Matthew 7:21-27? It’s an incredible passage that might interest you.

 

[fhansen]

If acting righteous was real righteousness, then all the unbelievers who act this way in Church on Sunday, just before they become the same carnal devil's again, Mon - Friday, would all be righteous.

So, we are not righteous because of what we do, we are righteous because of '""the gift of Righteousness'""", that has become who we are "in Christ".

The born again, are "the righteousness of GOD, in Christ".

Did you actually read my post? That's what I said-and have been saying. Acting righteous means nothing, being righteous means everything. And those made righteous, act righteously. As long as they remain in Him.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Did you actually read my post? That's what I said-and have been saying. Acting righteous means nothing, being righteous means everything. And those made righteous, act righteously. As long as they remain in Him.

But many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ. Amen?

 

[fhansen]

If you understood what Paul is teaching, that im teaching, you would not be talking about Old Testament covenant Law, everytime you post to me.
So, you dont understand.

Also, the carnal mind, is the problem, that you are talking about.
The carnal mind is the natural mind and this is an enemy of God's Grace.
Its the enemy because is will always reject it, and try to impose self righteousness in place of God's Righteousness.
So,
a real believer has to get out of the mind of "self saving", to get into the mind that understands God's Grace.

Since you managed to avoid the question I won't rephrase it:
Ok, so that I understand your beliefs on this, one born again will never sin-the old man is gone and can never act up, can never sin, again?

It's quite straight forward.

 

[fhansen]

But many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ. Amen?

Amen

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Its what it means to you. "quenched"..
I get it.

However, if the holy Spirit is living in you, that is not going to change.
See, "Christ in you the hope of Glory", does not change because you have a bad day, or a temper tantrum.

God, who lives in us, because we are now his TEMPLE< if we are born again, remains, because we remain "One with God, and Christ".

How you feel, has no effect on the BLood Atonement.
how you act or behave, has no effect on God's Grace, once you have "the Gift of Salvation".
See, you can't stop being born again, because of a mood swing, or a hateful attitude.
"birth" cant be stopped by behavior that comes later.

Let say you take a gun and shoot your neighbor.
Well, do you stop being born of your mother because you did something horrible?

Its the same with the Spiritual Birth.
What you do in your body, does not end the spiritual birth.

You can never stop being born......and you can never stop being born again.

I am not one who believes in once saved always saved, no matter what. You can say "they were never saved to begin with" however this is not scriptural.
People do apostisize after recieving the truth and have tasted the power of the Holy Spirit.

 

[pescador]

But many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ. Amen?

Jesus said that He wouldn't lose any that the Father has given Him.

"For I have come down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of the one who sent me. Now this is the will of the one who sent me—that I should not lose one person of every one he has given me, but raise them all up at the last day. For this is the will of my Father—for everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him to have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.” John 6:38-40

This directly contradicts your saying that many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ.

 

[fhansen]

Jesus said that He wouldn't lose any that the Father has given Him.

"For I have come down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of the one who sent me. Now this is the will of the one who sent me—that I should not lose one person of every one he has given me, but raise them all up at the last day. For this is the will of my Father—for everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him to have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.” John 6:38-40

This directly contradicts your saying that many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ.

Losing ones justified state is as simple as forfeiting it by living very unjustly, returning to the flesh and persisting in sin so grave or serious as to oppose love of God and neighbor-and oppose and destroy love in us. Deadly sin, "sin that leads to death" (John 5:16) The wages of sin is still death under the New Covenant but to the extent that we remain in Him we're "set free from sin and have become slaves to righteousness." Rom 6:18

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Jesus said that He wouldn't lose any that the Father has given Him.

"For I have come down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of the one who sent me. Now this is the will of the one who sent me—that I should not lose one person of every one he has given me, but raise them all up at the last day. For this is the will of my Father—for everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him to have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.” John 6:38-40

This directly contradicts your saying that many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ.

The Father gave Judas to Jesus but He lost Him. I will follow up with scripture.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Jesus said that He wouldn't lose any that the Father has given Him.

"For I have come down from heaven not to do my own will but the will of the one who sent me. Now this is the will of the one who sent me—that I should not lose one person of every one he has given me, but raise them all up at the last day. For this is the will of my Father—for everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him to have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day.” John 6:38-40

This directly contradicts your saying that many who have been justified will stumble in sin and must repent in order to remain in Christ.

John 17
.10 And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15 I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. 18 As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also may be sanctified by the truth.

 

[pescador]

John 17
.10 And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them. 11 Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are. 12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. 13 But now I come to You, and these things I speak in the world, that they may have My joy fulfilled in themselves. 14 I have given them Your word; and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 15 I do not pray that You should take them out of the world, but that You should keep them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. 17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. 18 As You sent Me into the world, I also have sent them into the world. 19 And for their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they also may be sanctified by the truth.

Exactly. Judas' death was all part of God's plan. John wrote, "Those whom You gave Me I have kept and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled." Judas death was required by God to fulfill His plan. None of the rest were lost.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Exactly. Judas' death was all part of God's plan. John wrote, "Those whom You gave Me I have kept and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled." Judas death was required by God to fulfill His plan. None of the rest were lost.

I agree however there are many who will fall into perdition and apostisize, those that " fall away" who were once in the Body.

2 Thessalonians
Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

 

[Goodhuman]

God does not make anyone righteous by the law, as "by the law is the KNOWLEDGE OF SIN."
The Law and Commandments, can offer you no righteousness.
This is why God "found FAULT" with them, Hebrews 8:7., and created the NEW Testament and NEW Covenant.
The Law came by MOSES.
So, if you want to be an old testament saint, "under the law", then chase Moses.
But "Grace and Truth came by Jesus Christ", so, if you want to be born again, and go to heaven, then you go to the Cross for Righteousness, as there is no other way to receive it.
Righteousness comes by JESUS's Blood, as Jesus is THE WAY.
John 14:6

Proverbs 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

 

[Servus]

Have you read Matthew 7:21-27? It’s an incredible passage that might interest you.

Sidon addressed it here: #24

That's not true.
Let me show you why.

Jesus said, "depart from me, i never knew you". And these people were casting out devils, "in Jesus name". They were doing Christian works. They were disciples.
Problem is, they are not born again.
They are RELIGIOUS but Lost.
The Reason that Jesus said of these fakirs, "I never knew you", is because He was never IN THEM.
See, if Jesus is in you, then He KNOWS YOU.
But If He is not in you, then that is a spiritual situation where you are not "in Christ" or "One with GOD", and so, you are not Known.......you are not BORN AGAIN.

There are plenty like this, who play church, speak christianese, and do good works, and are as lost as the Devil can lead them.
The are RELIGIOUS, but not born again.
Jesus said...>"You MUST be born again", as that is the only reason you will go to heaven.
Lawkeeping, and commandment keeping, and good works.....need not apply.
God accepts you only based on being "Made Righteous", or you will not remain in heaven, you will only be judged having "died in your sins" for the one sin of Christ Rejection.
That's the one that damns you.

 

[fhansen]

Well 2 things.

Paul the Apostle does not tell you to keep commandments or the law to try to get God to accept you or keep you.
He says that this teaching, is "dung", because it rejects the Blood of Jesus.

Also, its fine to keep the commandments, understanding that they can't save you, if you keep them.
The believers keep them, because they are a life saver. A moral boundary. And if you live outside them, your life will be destroyed.
So, we keep them, for that reason, but never to try to stay saved, or become righteous by keeping them.

No, since the believer, even, isn’t yet perfected in love (the true mark of perfection and righteousness for man), the law still continues to serve as a guide, as a light that shows us when we fail even though it cannot, of itself, possibly justify and save us. But breaking the law still earns us death. You ignore the fact that it’s been insisted that only a born again person is equipped to obey the law, because of the blood of Jesus. You ignore such verses as,

“Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.” Rom 8:12-13

 

[Sidon]

As an advocate for “Pauline theology” you might find this verse of his interesting.

“It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;

Not at all.

You are reading the verse, as if its a dictionary, but its not.

So, look at this...

"if we die with him"


So, when a person has a theology that is "im saving myself", "im keeping myself saved",, then they read this, "if we die with Him" and they see it in the natural mind and think.....>"oh, that means i have to die as a MARYTR"....
See it?
That is how you misunderstand the verse, and the rest of them you quote, as you are reading them LITERALLY, and not discerning them spiritually.

See, if all the born again have to DIE as MARTYRS, as that verse suggests, if you dont discern it, but only read it like its a phone book, then you better get busy playing the martyr for REAL, as that is what happens when you do not rightly divide the word, and instead read it as if its a NOVEL.

And the same goes for how you are only READING the rest of the verses, not discerning them, but only seeming them as literal.
See, this is why there are 40,000 denominations that all DISAGREE.
Its because people read the bible, but do not discern the verses, and then they run off and create another CULT.