Why Am I Eating a Pork Chop?

[LoveGodsWord]

The gentiles are non-Israelites, not people who are not sabbath adhering Christians (SDA).

According to Gods' Word it is the scriptures that bring the light of the truth of Gods' Word and it is Gods' Word that we are sanctified as we believe and follow it as shown in John 17:17. I believe John 3:19-21 is a fitting scripture here as it says [19] and this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. [20], For every one that does evil hates the light, neither comes to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. [21], But he that does truth comes to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are worked in God.

If we want to follow God's Word we should not be afraid of coming to the light of God's Word to discuss it if we believe we have the truth of God's Word. If we are afraid to discuss the scriptures it should be a red flag that perhaps there is something in our own lives that is keeping us away from following God and his Word.

This is why we are told in the scriptures in 2 Corinthians 13:5 to examine ourselves, whether we are in the faith or not; and to prove your own selves.... Now let's talk scripture and not seek to avoid it like many seek to do as shown through the scriptures provided here. Gentiles are unbelievers who do not believe and follow God's Word. This term can be applied to someone who is outside of God's church or even inside of Gods' Church. If we are gentiles in the sense of not believing and following God's Word we are gentiles who will not inherit God's Kingdom according to the scriptures *Hebrews 10:26-31.

If your talking about Gentile believers even this disappears in the new covenant based on better promises of Hebrews 8:1-6. Gods' Israel in the new covenant is not longer those of the Flesh but those of the Spirit that have been born again and given a new heart to love God and believe and follow His Word *John 3:3-7; 1 John 3:6-9; 1 John 2:3-4; Romans 13:8-10. According to the scriptures there is no more Jewish or gentile believers we are all one in Christ (Galatians 3:28-29; Colossians 3:11; Romans 10:11-13). If we are not a part of God's ISRAEL according to the scriptures we have no part in Gods' new covenant promises *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27 as gentiles are now grafted in according to Paul in Romans 11:13-27....

God's ISRAEL therefore in the new covenant are all those who believe and follow God's Word and those who are born of the Spirit and not of the flesh as Paul shows in Romans....

Romans 9:6-8 [6], FOR THEY ARE NOT ALL ISRAEL WHICH ARE OF ISRAEL,: [7], NEITHER, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM, ARE THEY ALL CHILDREN: but in Isaac shall thy seed be called <Christ> [8], That is, THEY WHICH ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH, THESE ARE NOT THE CHILDREN OF GOD: BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE <those who believe> ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED.

Romans 2:28-29 [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OUTWARDS IN THE FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; and CIRCUMCISION IS OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE LETTER; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Now what excuse do we now have not to believe and follow God's Word? - None. What is it in the scriptures that have been provided here that you disagree with?

Hope this is helpful my prayer is that you may receive Gods' Word in the Spirit it was given.. love.

 

[Religiot]

You are by far my favorite!

Why on earth do you think they use sheep for that rodeo event?

I liked you the first time I saw you! LOL!

PS: You'll find something better than this to try and twist, trust me; I'm pretty careless when it comes to posting, so if you just stick around long enough, I'm sure you'll find something. --Yeehaw!

 

[Religiot]

Missed this point? There’s at least 25 points in that quote. You appear to be attempting to drown out the message by covering it up with a boatload of scripture.

“For all who are of works of the Law are under a curse; for it is written: “CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO DOES NOT ABIDE BY ALL THE THINGS WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF THE LAW, TO DO THEM.” Now, that no one is justified by the Law before God is evident; for, “ THE RIGHTEOUS ONE WILL LIVE BY FAITH.” However, the Law is not of faith; on the contrary, “THE PERSON WHO PERFORMS THEM WILL LIVE BY THEM.””
‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:10-12‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

The message here is that Peter feared ridicule from the Jews for eating with the Gentiles who did not observe the Jewish dietary laws and Paul rebuked him because Peter was basically being a hypocrite by pretending not to be fraternizing with them. Now if these Gentiles were observing the dietary laws there would be no need for Peter to fear the persecution of the Jews for eating with them but they weren’t which is why he did fear the persecution of the Jews and yet neither Peter nor Paul ever mention the necessity of keeping the dietary laws. So if these Gentiles were expected to keep the dietary laws but they weren’t then Paul would have no reason to rebuke Peter for not continuing to have fellowship with them. Furthermore Paul would be obligated to rebuke the Gentile believers if they were expected to keep the dietary laws and were failing to do so. And out of all of Paul’s epistles to the Gentiles he never once mentions that they must observe any of the Jewish dietary laws. In fact he even tells them in 1 Corinthians 10 that they can eat anything including meat offered to idols which Jews were forbidden to do.

“Eat anything that is sold in the meat market without asking questions, for the sake of conscience; FOR THE EARTH IS THE LORD’S, AND ALL IT CONTAINS. If one of the unbelievers invites you and you want to go, eat anything that is set before you without asking questions, for the sake of conscience. But if anyone says to you, “This is meat sacrificed to idols,” do not eat it, for the sake of that one who informed you and for the sake of conscience; Now by “conscience” I do not mean your own, but the other person’s; for why is my freedom judged by another’s conscience? If I partake with thankfulness, why am I slandered about that for which I give thanks?”
‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭10:25-30‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

Notice Paul doesn’t put any restrictions at all on what they are allowed to eat even tho he is speaking about eating with Gentiles who are well known for not observing the Jewish dietary laws. You’ll never find a verse in the New Testament encouraging Gentiles to observe the Jewish dietary laws because it was never expected of them. The dietary laws were not given to the Gentiles they were given to “the sons of Israel” aka the Jews.

C'mon man: how can you complain about me posting the full version of what Paul actually said? and then follow it up with a partial version soiled by your opinions?

C'mon!

Chapters two and three of Galatians are short, and easy to read, and the conclusion is spelled out by Paul himself!

You've only offered conjecture as the conclusion.

--I'm not trying to cover anything up with scripture: that's an absurd allegation, on several levels.

 

[Religiot]

I was raised in a legalistic Christian home with clearly-defined laws and rules which we tried to keep strictly. We were under the Law, not grace. Praise God that he delivered me from the bondage of the Law!

I was referring to God's laws, not your parents: the question still stands.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Religiot]

No because God did not specifically say that Noah could eat every plant.

That's my point.

He specified what plants were for human consumption and for animal consumption--all for animals, some for man: this is also how He gave Noah the animals to eat.

 

[prodromos]

You are by far my favorite!

Why on earth do you think they use sheep for that rodeo event?

I liked you the first time I saw you! LOL!

PS: You'll find something better than this to try and twist, trust me; I'm pretty careless when it comes to posting, so if you just stick around long enough, I'm sure you'll find something. --Yeehaw!

All I am doing is showing that sheep can be just as nasty as goats. I've been to a couple of sheep farms and they can be pretty intimidating when they want to be.

 

[bbbbbbb]

I was referring to God's laws, not your parents: the question still stands.

Thanks in advance.

I was referring to God's laws as enacted and enforced by my parents.

 

[Religiot]

All I am doing is showing that sheep can be just as nasty as goats. I've been to a couple of sheep farms and they can be pretty intimidating when they want to be.

That's the point, is that they are not, nor can they, for they are very different in temperament. --again, the comparison is between them, not about each, but both, as compared to each other.

By the way, they're both sanctified by God as food for man.

 

[Religiot]

I was referring to God's laws as enacted and enforced by my parents.

Yes, I understand, and by coincidence you stumbled on a key aspect to this whole argument:

Your parents were the administrators of God's laws--they were wrong.
Levi was the administrator of God's laws--he was cruel.
Christ is now the administrator of God's laws--He is the grace of God!

God's laws are holy, and cannot pass away, but the old covenant did pass away, along with all it's requirements, because they've all been fulfilled in Christ; therefore, through Christ, we are under the new covenant, and with the new administrator, this covenant is specifically the covenant of grace.

Example: I don't keep the Sabbath because of fear of stoning, but by the love God has instilled in me, by His grace.

 

[SamanthaAnastasia]

Hmm what? Who is talking EGW? I am only providing scripture so lets discuss the scriptures shall we? I must admit I find it quite amusing when people want to discuss EGW when they feel threatened with scripture. Yet it should not be that way. We should not be afraid to discuss God's Word as it is how we are to follow God and also shows how we should not follow God.

naw, fam. If you actually read what I wrote I brought up EGW because I don’t find anything the SDA says reliable. Including their interpretation of scripture. Because of EGW and her character. Even up until the end of her life.

Now what excuse do we now have not to believe and follow God's Word? - None. What is it in the scriptures that have been provided here that you disagree with?

Hope this is helpful my prayer is that you may receive Gods' Word in the Spirit it was given.. love.

again, bro. I don’t agree with the SDA’s interpretation of scripture because their entire denomination was built on a fault.

thanks for your prayer. God bless.

 

[LoveGodsWord]

naw, fam. If you actually read what I wrote I brought up EGW because I don’t find anything the SDA says reliable. Including their interpretation of scripture. Because of EGW and her character. Even up until the end of her life. again, bro. I don’t agree with the SDA’s interpretation of scripture because their entire denomination was built on a fault. thanks for your prayer. God bless.

Yet here you are not able to discuss the scripture with me wanting to talk about anything else but scripture seeking to change subject matter to that which no one is discussing. You cannot even tell me what you disagree with and why can you because this would lead back to the scriptures. This is quite telling in my view. For me it is written he who God sends speaks the Word of God and only God's Word is true and we should believe and follow them. You of course are free to believe anything you wish. We will have to agree to disagree. We should not be afraid to discuss the scriptures if we believe we know and have the truth of God's Word. The scriptures only verify this.

 

[Leaf473]

I'll go ahead and repeat my first sentence to the statement I made, that you responded to, I'll also put it in all caps, and underline some things, etc., just for emphasis:

NOTHING THAT CAN ENTER ME CAN DEFILE ME, PERIOD.

Please explain what you misunderstood about that sentence, thanks.

PS: Also, please bear with me, as I try to cut through the ocean of confusion on such a small boat. Thanks in advance!

Hi Religiot,
Did you see my post #751 in answer to your post here?

It's fine if you saw it and don't want to respond. I messed up the quoting system when I first posted it, so you may not have gotten a notification.

Peace be with you!

 

[HIM]

The wording in the Greek can be understood two ways...

"Created to be received with thanks" can refer to all foods not just supposed 'clean' foods.

But it is not. Just like Romans 14 is not about unclean animals.

I can't recall the last time that I posted in disagreement and the person I was posting against agreed with the post which was in opposition to them. So to clarify....

Since you are a student of the Greek then you know that the Greek word Broma translated meat does not necessarily mean meat which comes from animals, but means food in general. And also you know that ktisma which is translated creature actually means creation.

But then maybe that is why you said what you said when you said, "can refer to all foods not just supposed 'clean' foods."

The context should be noted. Forbidding to marry sets the context to be mandates which were not of the Pentateuch. When that is noted one must conclude that the abstaining from meats must also be of a mandate that was given outside of the Pentateuch.

With the above considered and the fact that God did not create certain animals to be received. One must conclude that these verses are not speaking of the animals God created unclean.

1Tim 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1Tim 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1Tim 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Tim 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:

Rom 14:20
Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean...

Food would be those which God created to be received?

As a student of the Greek you also know that there are not to many translations which translate verse 14 correctly. Here is one that does.

Rom 14:14 I know, and have been persuaded in Lord Jesus, that nothing common through itself, if not to him regarding anything common to be, to him common;


So there was animals considered common or profane? Besides those which God made unclean?

Yes. Peter's vision attests to this. Peter never ate anything Common or unclean. The word "or" is translated from the Greek word ἤ. This word makes a distinction between the two.
It should also be noted that God never said He cleansed the unclean. He only mentions cleansing the common.

Acts 10:14 But Peter said, Not so, Lord; for I have never eaten any thing that is common or unclean.
Acts 10:15 And the voice spake unto him again the second time, What God hath cleansed, that call not thou common.
Acts 10:16 This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up again into heaven.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Yes, I understand, and by coincidence you stumbled on a key aspect to this whole argument:

Your parents were the administrators of God's laws--they were wrong.
Levi was the administrator of God's laws--he was cruel.
Christ is now the administrator of God's laws--He is the grace of God!

God's laws are holy, and cannot pass away, but the old covenant did pass away, along with all it's requirements, because they've all been fulfilled in Christ; therefore, through Christ, we are under the new covenant, and with the new administrator, this covenant is specifically the covenant of grace.

Example: I don't keep the Sabbath because of fear of stoning, but by the love God has instilled in me, by His grace.

Parents are specifically commanded to raise their children in the fear and admonition of the Lord and children are commanded to obey their parents. Parents who fail in their duty and children who fail in their duty are sinning against God.

 

[pescador]

Parents are specifically commanded to raise their children in the fear and admonition of the Lord and children are commanded to obey their parents. Parents who fail in their duty and children who fail in their duty are sinning against God.

What does this have to do with the OP? Should children be eating pork chops?

 

[Carl Emerson]

With the above considered and the fact that God did not create certain animals to be received. One must conclude that these verses are not speaking of the animals God created unclean.

This is the pivot point...

I do not believe that God created certain animals to be unclean.

God created everything good.

Pigs entered the Ark along with all other species.

However God placed restrictions on Israel because after the curse of the fall, sickness and disease, that would potentially harm the consumer, took hold more in some species than others.

The Gentiles were not under the same restrictions and suffered for it because at that time in History food hygiene and disease control was unknown.

However by the time of the Jerusalem council no such restrictions were placed on the Gentiles coming to faith.

In modern times we can eat pork without risk because He has enabled our scientists to understand how to regulate the preparation of the meat so it is safe to eat.

In this sense His grace through science now serves to protect us - not food laws.

 

[bbbbbbb]

What does this have to do with the OP? Should children be eating pork chops?

I was responding to Religiot and I suggest that you address your question to him.

 

[bbbbbbb]

This is the pivot point...

I do not believe that God created certain animals to be unclean.

God created everything good.

Pigs entered the Ark along with all other species.

However God placed restrictions on Israel because after the curse of the fall, sickness and disease, that would potentially harm the consumer, took hold more in some species than others.

The Gentiles were not under the same restrictions and suffered for it because at that time in History food hygiene and disease control was unknown.

However by the time of the Jerusalem council no such restrictions were placed on the Gentiles coming to faith.

In modern times we can eat pork without risk because He has enabled our scientists to understand how to regulate the preparation of the meat so it is safe to eat.

In this sense His grace through science now serves to protect us - not food laws.

The implication from the assertion that God specifically created some animals as unclean is that God created sinful animals and, therefore, God is the author of sin. It is similar to freeing Adam and Eve from the responsibility for their choice to eat of the forbidden tree in the Garden.

 

[Religiot]

Hi Religiot,
Did you see my post #751 in answer to your post here?

It's fine if you saw it and don't want to respond. I messed up the quoting system when I first posted it, so you may not have gotten a notification.

Peace be with you!

Yes, I did see it.

It suffers from the same logic I first responded to, save only that you're now equating pork itself with rebellion in your argument...

My response, therefore, remains the same, word for word.

--I cannot realize anything for you: realization can only come from you, thus, I cannot continue with you, until, for yourself, you do realize, that NOTHING entering a man can make him unclean, save that which comes out of a man, namely, in this case, rebellion. --Realize, if God says don't, but you do, then you've made yourself unclean: this is applicable to EVERYTHING.

 

[Freth]

This is the pivot point...

I do not believe that God created certain animals to be unclean.

God created everything good.

Pigs entered the Ark along with all other species.

However God placed restrictions on Israel because after the curse of the fall, sickness and disease, that would potentially harm the consumer, took hold more in some species than others.

The Gentiles were not under the same restrictions and suffered for it because at that time in History food hygiene and disease control was unknown.

However by the time of the Jerusalem council no such restrictions were placed on the Gentiles coming to faith.

In modern times we can eat pork without risk because He has enabled our scientists to understand how to regulate the preparation of the meat so it is safe to eat.

In this sense His grace through science now serves to protect us - not food laws.

I agree with much of what you said. My main differing opinion is that despite our ability to be as safe as possible with pigs, for instance, they are still unclean animals that wallow in the mud and eat anything you put in front of them and have potential for parasites. By their nature and what they're capable of eating, if given the chance to do so (even sight unseen, despite our best efforts), puts them squarely in the "unclean by design" category that God intended for as long as sin reigns on the earth.

I also think there's a correlation, a parallel, between unclean meat and the sin of the flesh that should be drawn here. Both are harmful, one to the physical body, one to the spiritual body.

I believe that God's design for the curse of the fall is binding until sin is no more and all is made anew. That all that He has said, that He has given to us, is for our own benefit and that none should be dismissed as done away with; aside from the obvious (the tearing of the veil, etc.)

I would also point

Those are my thoughts. All are free to disagree.