Visualizing "Fire from Heaven" (Rev 20:9)

[Erik Nelson]

What will the "fire from Heaven" (Revelation 20:9) look like ?

 

[ewq1938]

Possibly will look like fire from heaven but I am only guessing.

 

[keras]

What will the "fire from Heaven" (Revelation 20:9) look like ?

This fire will be a carefully directed fire to burn up; totally cremate the huge army of attackers against Jesus and His holy people. Then comes the Great White Throne Judgment and Eternity.

However; there will be a terrible fire sent by the Lord, which will destroy the enemies that will attack Israel in the near future. We see the lead up to this today, as Iran and its proxies threaten Israel with annihilation.
This fire will come from the sun, as Isaiah 30:26a states. It will literally fulfil all the graphic prophesies about this terrible Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath. The whole world will be affected. Zephaniah 3:8, Isaiah 66:15-17, Revelation 6:12-17, +

 

[timewerx]

Probably something a little bigger than this

 

[BABerean2]

This is what men have done.

Now, try to imagine what God can do...

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[Erik Nelson]

Thanks for everyone's replies ​

First, is it true that the Bible does prophesy the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple (Daniel 9:27), even if that fact may surprise those who are in Jerusalem, believing themselves to be righteous, at the time ?

Next, is it true that the Bible does prophesy the destruction of Earth and all the works on it (Revelation 20:9 = 2 Peter 3:10), even if that fact may surprise those who are on Earth, at the time ?

Might "fire from Heaven" resemble the following ?

​

 

[DavidPT]

What will the "fire from Heaven" (Revelation 20:9) look like ?

If I am at least going to try and be intellectually honest about it, I can see it maybe fitting the following.

Zechariah 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

I would of course need to abandon Premil if it is indeed the same events, the fact this verse would be proving that Amils are correct that the thousand years precede the 2nd coming, not follow it instead. Out of curiosity then, do any Amils connect Revelation 20:9 with that of Zechariah 14:12? And if yes, I would be interested to to hear more about their thinking on this.

 

[BABerean2]

Out of curiosity then, do any Amils connect Revelation 20:9 with that of Zechariah 14:12? And if yes, I would be interested to to hear more about their thinking on this.

It would be Paul who connects them in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, when he said Christ returns "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God. The fire comes at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

It would be Paul who connects them in 2 Timothy 4:1, when he said Christ judges both the living and the dead at His appearing.
The judgment is found at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

It would be Peter who connects them in 2 Peter 3:10-13, when he said the fire comes on "the day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". The fire comes at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

Welcome to the Amill understanding David.

.

 

[Erik Nelson]

If I am at least going to try and be intellectually honest about it, I can see it maybe fitting the following.

Zechariah 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

I would of course need to abandon Premil if it is indeed the same events, the fact this verse would be proving that Amils are correct that the thousand years precede the 2nd coming, not follow it instead. Out of curiosity then, do any Amils connect Revelation 20:9 with that of Zechariah 14:12? And if yes, I would be interested to to hear more about their thinking on this.

Orthodox Study Bible ​

Zechariah 14:1-21 The prophet foresees the nations gathered in battle against Jerusalem, God's delivery of His people, and the establishment of a secure, peaceful land (see Is 66:15–23; Ezk 38–40; Joel 4:9–21; Mk 13:7–27; Rev 20–22). In the New Testament, this is to be accomplished at the Second Coming of Christ and the last battle between God and Satan.​

Resembles reports of vaporization, as in a nuclear blast ?

 

[Erik Nelson]

It would be Paul who connects them in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, when he said Christ returns "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God. The fire comes at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

It would be Paul who connects them in 2 Timothy 4:1, when he said Christ judges both the living and the dead at His appearing.
The judgment is found at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

It would be Peter who connects them in 2 Peter 3:10-13, when he said the fire comes on "the day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". The fire comes at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

Welcome to the Amill understanding David.

.

Pre-mil interprets the "Christly conquering figure" of Rev 19 as Jesus Christ Himself

If you re-interpret the same image as the Church, "the body of Christ on earth", then it simply symbolizes the spiritually victory of the Church over-coming the persecutions of the "Beast"

Pre-mil is correct, insofar as Christ returns through His Church -- that's why the Saints can "reign with Christ" in the next chapter

Yet, the 2C of JC His-own-self = FJ = Rev 20:9+ (?)

 

[DavidPT]

It would be Paul who connects them in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, when he said Christ returns "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God. The fire comes at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

It would be Paul who connects them in 2 Timothy 4:1, when he said Christ judges both the living and the dead at His appearing.
The judgment is found at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

It would be Peter who connects them in 2 Peter 3:10-13, when he said the fire comes on "the day of the Lord", when He "comes as a thief". The fire comes at the end of Revelation chapter 20.

Welcome to the Amill understanding David.

.

I'm not convinced of Amil based on those 3 passages alone you brought up, unless they have the support of Zechariah 14:12 as well.

Revelation 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

The beloved city is obviously referring to Jerusalem, but in what sense though? In the literal sense, or some other sense? Jerusalem is obviously being surrounded in that verse. In Zechariah 14 Jerusalem is being surrounded there as well.

Zechariah 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

IMO this clearly depicts being devoured via the source the LORD chooses to use. Maybe Zechariah 14:12 can fit within Revelation 20:9 like such then?

And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[DavidPT]

Pre-mil is correct, insofar as Christ returns through His Church -- that's why the Saints can "reign with Christ" in the next chapter

Even though there is perhaps a possibility that Zechariah 14:12 and Revelation 20:9 are speaking of the same events, what you stated here makes too much sense to simply ignore. Plus we have to keep in mind that Revelation 20:4 proves the 42 month reign of the beast is already fulfilled and in the past when the thousand years expire. satan's little season follows the thousand years. The 42 month reign of the beast can't fit during satan's little season though. Therefore Amil can't be the correct position based on that alone. The 42 month reign of the beast has to end with the 2nd coming. It would have to occur during satan's little season in order for Amil to be the correct position. Totally impossible according to Revelation 20:4.

 

[Erik Nelson]

Even though there is perhaps a possibility that Zechariah 14:12 and Revelation 20:9 are speaking of the same events, what you stated here makes too much sense to simply ignore. Plus we have to keep in mind that Revelation 20:4 proves the 42 month reign of the beast is already fulfilled and in the past when the thousand years expire. satan's little season follows the thousand years. The 42 month reign of the beast can't fit during satan's little season though. Therefore Amil can't be the correct position based on that alone. The 42 month reign of the beast has to end with the 2nd coming. It would have to occur during satan's little season in order for Amil to be the correct position. Totally impossible according to Revelation 20:4.

Zechariah 12:3 also

42 months ends with Parousia, which may be distinct from final full fledged 2C ?

 

[parousia70]

What will the "fire from Heaven" (Revelation 20:9) look like ?

I't probably looks a lot like what David testified took place when He Defeated Saul:

2 Samuel 22
“Then the earth shook and trembled;
The foundations of heaven quaked and were shaken,
Because He was angry.
9 Smoke went up from His nostrils,
And devouring fire from His mouth;
Coals were kindled by it.
10 He bowed the heavens also, and came down
With darkness under His feet.
11 He rode upon a cherub, and flew;
And He was seen upon the wings of the wind.
12 He made darkness canopies around Him,
Dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.
13 From the brightness before Him
Coals of fire were kindled.

14 “The Lord thundered from heaven,
And the Most High uttered His voice.
15 He sent out arrows and scattered them;
Lightning bolts, and He vanquished them.
16 Then the channels of the sea were seen,
The foundations of the world were uncovered,
At the rebuke of the Lord,
At the blast of the breath of His nostrils.

 

[BABerean2]

Revelation 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

The beloved city is obviously referring to Jerusalem, but in what sense though?

Which Jerusalem?

Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Heb 12:22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

.

 

[ewq1938]

If I am at least going to try and be intellectually honest about it, I can see it maybe fitting the following.

Zechariah 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

I would of course need to abandon Premil if it is indeed the same events, the fact this verse would be proving that Amils are correct that the thousand years precede the 2nd coming, not follow it instead. Out of curiosity then, do any Amils connect Revelation 20:9 with that of Zechariah 14:12? And if yes, I would be interested to to hear more about their thinking on this.

That isn't what happens at the second coming.

That passage matches what happens after the thousand years:

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Clearly not the second coming. The second coming and the slaughter is in Rev 19 and no fire is used and no one is at Jerusalem.

 

[DavidPT]

That isn't what happens at the second coming.

That passage matches what happens after the thousand years:

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Clearly not the second coming. The second coming and the slaughter is in Rev 19 and no fire is used and no one is at Jerusalem.

Unless I totally misunderstood you somewhere along the way, why would you think Zechariah 14:12 happens after the thousand years after Christ's return? That doesn't square with Zechariah 14:16 then.

Zechariah 14:16 And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem---in order for there to be some left of the nations which came against Jerusalem that has to obviously mean something happened to some of the ones who came against Jerusalem but are not left as well. What could have possibly happened to them then? The following for one.

Zechariah 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

This happens first followed by what happens in verse 16. Verse 16 is what occurs once Christ returns. Verse 16 occurs during the thousand years then. That places Zechariah 14:12 before the thousand years, and not during it nor after it instead. But if you still insist Zechariah 14:12 is after the thousand years you then need to abandon Premil and embrace Amil, because if Zechariah 14:12 is after the thousand years, that's Amil not Premil, proven by the fact Zechariah 14:12 has to precede Zechariah 14:16, and that Zechariah 14:16 is meaning once Christ has initially returned.

 

[ewq1938]

Unless I totally misunderstood you somewhere along the way, why would you think Zechariah 14:12 happens after the thousand years after Christ's return? That doesn't square with Zechariah 14:16 then.

I was just comparing it to known second coming passages in the NT. Fire isn't used against the enemy at the second coming.

 

[DavidPT]

I was just comparing it to known second coming passages in the NT. Fire isn't used against the enemy at the second coming.

Actually though, there is no fire even mentioned in Zechariah 14:12. The text calls it a plague. So maybe it involves fire, maybe it doesn't. If it's the same event as Revelation 20:9 then it obviously involves fire. But if it's not the same event, it doesn't have to necessarily involve fire then since the verse itself doesn't tell us that one way or the other. But regardless of any of that, Zechariah 14:12 still has to be fulfilled prior to Zechariah 14:16 in order to make any logical sense out of Zechariah 14:16.

 

[DavidPT]

Something just came to mind.

Zechariah 14:12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

This could simply be the fulfillment of the following. Don't know why I didn't think of this earlier.

Revelation 19:21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

Now it doesn't have to involve fire, thus doesn't need to involve Revelation 20:9.