Ask an Atheist

[Arsenios]

"Thank-you...
You have affirmed your cognitive disconnect between your being an atheist and your understanding of human dignity... eg You think they are fundamentally unrelated..."

Being an atheist means not believing in a god. That is it. Trying to draw a connection between an absence of belief in something and an unrelated topic is a non sequitur.

IF AND ONLY IF they are indeed unrelated...

Atheism IS a world-view...
It views existence as uncreated...
It DOES have repurcussions on one's view of human nature, and human dignity is a feature of human nature...

"So next question: Do you know any well known atheists who are great advocates of human dignity?"

Nope, because I don't care about the topic and have not looked for any such people or subjects.

Then my much earlier question about human dignity - eg Do you see it as simply an annoying non-essential? - is now answered in the affirmative?? Thank-you...

But the denial of the existence of God IS a world-view, of necessity...

Incorrect. My atheism only tells you I don't hold a theistic worldview. It does not inform you of my naturalist worldview.

That is why I asked you about human dignity, and how you justify it if you do, and why you do not justify it if you don't...

Why is it important to you for my world-view to be defined by my atheism?

I majored in Philosophy at SDSU...

Understandings are all inter-related...

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

I was raised in the Steve Young to Jerry Rice era of 49ers history. One can't deny the power of Montana, but Young will always be my favorite 49ers QB.

Good - For a minute there I thought you were denying you were a 49ers fan...
Because you said it did not mean you had a 49ers world-view...
But you are die-hard for Joe and Steve...

So you are OK!

Phwew!

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

I think we stopped in West Yellowstone back in 1961, but that is the only town in Montana I have ever visited. Definitely NOT the city of Joe.
I think it was called Ismay back then.

Do you remember the name of the motel you stayed in while in West Yellowstone?

Was it the Hadley's? I can't think of the name...

I used to fish Yellowstone Lake from there... And the Gibbon and Firehole rivers... In 1961...

Arsenios

 

[TBDude65]

IF AND ONLY IF they are indeed unrelated...

Atheism IS a world-view...
It views existence as uncreated...
It DOES have repurcussions on one's view of human nature, and human dignity is a feature of human nature...



Then my much earlier question about human dignity - eg Do you see it as simply an annoying non-essential? - is now answered in the affirmative?? Thank-you...



That is why I asked you about human dignity, and how you justify it if you do, and why you do not justify it if you don't...



I majored in Philosophy at SDSU...

Understandings are all inter-related...

Arsenios

Atheism = absence of theistic worldview

It literally means nothing else. So you are (still) making assumptions about my worldview instead of actually asking what it is. (Philosophical naturalism and Secular Humanism)

 

[Dave-W]

Do you remember the name of the motel you stayed in while in West Yellowstone?

I was 6 years old then. Not sure I ever knew the name.

 

[Arsenios]

I think we stopped in West Yellowstone back in 1961, but that is the only town in Montana I have ever visited. Definitely NOT the city of Joe.
I think it was called Ismay back then.

Mormon Country!

A.

 

[Arsenios]

I was 6 years old then. Not sure I ever knew the name.

I was 16...

Went a tad sweet on their daughter, Linda...

She was 15...

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

Atheism = absence of theistic worldview

Yes - It is one of the -ISM's without God - There are many... Its opposite is theism...

It literally means nothing else.

It means that you are restricted to natural causation and death...

So you are (still) making assumptions about my worldview instead of actually asking what it is.

Well, let's be fair here - I did ask about your view of human dignity...

(Philosophical naturalism and Secular Humanism)

Pretty much garden variety, as Hannibal would say!

So let's try this question:

Do YOU HAVE human dignity?

Arsenios

 

[Belk]

Yes - It is one of the -ISM's without God - There are many... Its opposite is theism...



It means that you are restricted to natural causation and death...

There are supernatural ideas that do not involve gods.

 

[Arsenios]

There are supernatural ideas that do not involve gods.

Care to elaborate?

I mean, can you name and give a brief on a few?

Christianity, btw, at least historical Christianity, is not supernatural, but instead is supra-natural...
Which makes it all about the 'supra', and not about the natural...
Super-natural is all about the natural being at the beck and call of the 'super' natural 'powers'...
eg The goal of the latter is natural...

Arsenios

 

[Belk]

Care to elaborate?

I mean, can you name and give a brief on a few?

You can't think of any supernatural beliefs that do not involve gods? How about faeries? Gnomes? Trolls? Ghosts? Simply because an atheist does not believe in gods does not mean they can't be religious. Buddhists, for example, can be religious atheists (Not all are I have heard). Atheists are in no way required to hold certain beliefs. The only thing all atheists have in common is a lack of beliefs in gods.

Christianity, btw, at least historical Christianity, is not supernatural, but instead is supra-natural...
Which makes it all about the 'supra', and not about the natural...
Super-natural is all about the natural being at the beck and call of the 'super' natural 'powers'...
eg The goal of the latter is natural...

Arsenios

What? You realize that super and supra are synonyms in most cases?

 

[Arsenios]

What? You realize that super- and supra- are synonyms in most cases?

Not in this one...

The super- is imposed on the natural for the sake of controlling the natural...
And the natural is mortal and ends in death...
Hence incantations for the sake of worldly outcomes...

The supra- is above the natural and the natural is for the sake of the attainment of the supra-...
So that this whole life that leads to death is for the sake of the Kingdom of Heaven, or Life...

They are very different in this usage, even though both are "above" the natural...

Arsenios

 

[Arsenios]

You can't think of any supernatural beliefs that do not involve gods?

I did not wish to assume what you meant...

How about faeries? Gnomes? Trolls? Ghosts?

The invisibles! Seen only by those who have the 'gift' of their perception...

The imaginative creatures of folk-lore...

Got it - Thank-you...

Simply because an atheist does not believe in gods does not mean they can't be religious. Buddhists, for example, can be religious atheists (Not all are I have heard). Atheists are in no way required to hold certain beliefs. The only thing all atheists have in common is a lack of beliefs in gods.

Do they all share a common definition of "gods"?

Could you please provide a definition?

Thaank-you...

Arsenios

 

[Belk]

Not in this one...

The super- is imposed on the natural for the sake of controlling the natural...
And the natural is mortal and ends in death...
Hence incantations for the sake of worldly outcomes...

The supra- is above the natural and the natural is for the sake of the attainment of the supra-...
So that this whole life that leads to death is for the sake of the Kingdom of Heaven, or Life...

They are very different in this usage, even though both are "above" the natural...

Arsenios

Cool story bro.

 

[Belk]

I did not wish to assume what you meant...



The invisibles! Seen only by those who have the 'gift' of their perception...

The imaginative creatures of folk-lore...

Got it - Thank-you...

Sure thing.

Do they all share a common definition of "gods"?

I have no way of knowing .

Could you please provide a definition?

Thaank-you...

Arsenios

Sure.

Definition of GOD

 

[Arsenios]

Sure thing.


I have no way of knowing .



Sure.

Definition of GOD

OK...

A.

 

[Non sequitur]

IF AND ONLY IF they are indeed unrelated...

Atheism IS a world-view...
It views existence as uncreated...
It DOES have repurcussions on one's view of human nature, and human dignity is a feature of human nature...

World-view - a particular philosophy of life

If I say I don't believe in dragons, you can't say that speaks to my philosophy on life.

Being an atheist does not inherently have (or immediately create) a world-view.

 

[Ana the Ist]

IF AND ONLY IF they are indeed unrelated...

Atheism IS a world-view...

It's not actually.

It views existence as uncreated...

It doesn't actually...it has no position on the topic.

It DOES have repurcussions on one's view of human nature, and human dignity is a feature of human nature...

So is artistic expression...but I doubt that has anything to do with atheism either.

Then my much earlier question about human dignity - eg Do you see it as simply an annoying non-essential? - is now answered in the affirmative?? Thank-you...



That is why I asked you about human dignity, and how you justify it if you do, and why you do not justify it if you don't...

Why would he, or anyone, need to "justify" human dignity?

I majored in Philosophy at SDSU...

Understandings are all inter-related...

Arsenios

Did you finish your degree? Cuz I'm having a tough time seeing how your understanding of mathematics and your understanding of your feelings toward your mother are inter-related.

 

[Arsenios]

It's [atheism] not actually [a world view].

Sorry, it simply cannot be otherwise...

It [atheism] doesn't actually [view existence as uncreated]...

it has no position on the topic.

Sorry, it cannot avoid a position...

So is artistic expression [a feature of human nature]...
but I doubt that has anything to do with atheism either.

Atheists and Christians have very different artistic expression...

Why would he, or anyone, need to "justify" human dignity?

Because it is so vastly denied worldwide...

Did you finish your degree?

Discarded it, actually...

Cuz I'm having a tough time seeing how your understanding of mathematics and your understanding of your feelings toward your mother are inter-related.

Both have their basis in human nature...

Arsenios

 

[Ana the Ist]

Sorry, it simply cannot be otherwise...

Sure it can...your lack of belief in Zeus isn't a world-view. It's just a disbelief in claims of Zeus's existence.

Sorry, it cannot avoid a position...

It does...the fact that you don't believe Vishnu created the world doesn't inform your beliefs about how the world came to be.

Atheists and Christians have very different artistic expression...

In your entirely subjective opinion.

Because it is so vastly denied worldwide...

I'm not sure what you mean by that...I think most people agree that it's a real concept.

Regardless of that though, I don't see why the OP or anyone else would need to justify what other people do/believe worldwide.

Discarded it, actually...

Ahhh...destroyed the evidence huh? How very christian of you lol.

Both have their basis in human nature...

Arsenios

So do all aspects of human nature...but that doesn't mean they have any effect upon each other.

Also, I don't think I'd say mathematics has a basis in human nature...even if no humans existed anymore, 1+1=2.